Spotting enemy planes

[Xyperion]

Hi guys, 

 

I was wondering, how do you guys find out from a distance (1km+) whether the plane is a friendly or an enemy? I always have a hard time finding out, so I have to enable the icons for a second or two just to see whether I'm chasing an ally or an enemy. If I try to spot them without the icons, I have to literally fly 200 meters near them just to spot the insignia of their faction. Whenever I try to play without the icons, often I shoot at friendly planes before realizing (poor guys never saw it coming)... Before someone jumps on me, I'm playing SP only (for now, but i guess this is good for my future online teammates  ). I've always wanted to try multiplayer, but I'm afraid, because icons are not enabled. With ww1 planes spotting is so much easier...

[40plus]

For me, as a beginner, I park myself above friendly or unfriendly AAA and see if they get shot at or not LOL.

I fly in VR and it's damn near impossible for me to ID a plane until I'm half way up its tailpipe.

[blitze]

If they shoot at you - assume they are unfriendly although friendly fire incidents do occur.

 

In career, they will be called out to you over comms.  In Multiplay, take note of where you are and direction relation to front line and then what they are doing.  Always fly in curves and assume that they are hostile until you have them close up and can Id them.  There are colour variances you can pick up on and if you are lucky - you might make out their general profile at over 1+km

 

At 5km - forget it and just assume the worst.

 

At least in Multiplay you can TS or chat with your side to find out if friendlies are in the area but you have to use the map grid system for that.

[RedKestrel]

10 minutes ago, Xyperion said:

Hi guys, 

 

I was wondering, how do you guys find out from a distance (1km+) whether the plane is a friendly or an enemy? I always have a hard time finding out, so I have to enable the icons for a second or two just to see whether I'm chasing an ally or an enemy. If I try to spot them without the icons, I have to literally fly 200 meters near them just to spot the insignia of their faction. Whenever I try to play without the icons, often I shoot at friendly planes before realizing (poor guys never saw it coming)... Before someone jumps on me, I'm playing SP only (for now, but i guess this is good for my future online teammates  ). I've always wanted to try multiplayer, but I'm afraid, because icons are not enabled. With ww1 planes spotting is so much easier...

There's a few good guides out there on spotting - check out the angle off charts in this thread, which give you multiple angles on the aircraft. 

Also check out Finkeren`s Guide to aircraft ID, which is a great resource for rapid ID. I think its unfinished but has a lot of planes in it already.

In general, plane ID at a distance comes through practice. I can tell from quite a distance if planes are soviet or Axis because of general characteristics, but its still difficult (as it was in real life). Don't be afraid to use the zoom function to ID contacts! Here are my rules of thumb:

Silhouettes: Axis plane silhouettes are generally skinnier, sharper, and more squared off - they give a 'knifey' impression to me. 109s have a very skinny fueselage and thinner wings with a straight leading edge and a curved trailing edge. FW-190s have a very stubby nose and wings that makes them look distinctly T shaped, with squared off wings. The long-nosed D9s are the same but with a longer nose sticking above the T. Yaks, I-16s, MiGs and La-5s/LaGG-3s have broader, rounder, more triangular shaped wings with chunkier fuselages. La-5s and I-16s look particularly chubby because of the Radial engines. Spitfires have broad, elliptical wings that appear almost oversized to the fuselage. P-47s are big, with wide wings with a straight leading edge and a curved rear edge, their large nose is distinctive because of a radial engine. P-39s have a similar wing shape but are more t-shaped with a longer nose coming out the front. P40s look like 109s a bit but the wings are broader and have a little dihedral to them (tilted up at the tips). Its also a much bigger fighter in general.

For two engines, Pe-2s and 110s get confused alot because of the double vertical stabilizers, remember that the 110 has a shorter nose on it, and has sharply square wings and a skinny fuselage like the 109. Ju-88s and He-111s are easy to tell apart from Pe-2s because of the single tail, and the A20 has once again that T shape with a nose that sticks out in front of the wings almost as far as the tail does behind it, which is very different from other bombers and distinctive.

Stukas are big, have wings much like a P-40 but the fixed landing gear is a dead giveaway.

In general, ID at long range is easiest if you can see the wing planform, so if you're not sure try to maneuver to get a view of that. I can tell the difference from the side sometimes but a lot of the time I'm confused as well.

Study the guides, memorize the silhouettes, and if you're unsure don't shoot. You'll be surprised how quick you pick it up if you stop relying on icons and focus. Good practice would be to take a bunch of friendly and enemy planes up in the QMB, give them no ammo, and try to keep track of all of them and which ones are friendly or enemy. Vary the situation with yourself at higher or lower alt than the enemy. Note to yourself what you think the planes are. Record a track of doing this, then replay the track with icons on to see if you got it right. 
 

[69th_Mobile_BBQ]

To add to Pe-2 vs. 110 identification:  The Pe-2 has a rounded cockpit and a slight upward "V" to the tail when looking at it from straight-on 6.  The 110 has a square-ish cockpit and the tail is straight across.  

[Yogiflight]

If you are in fear of shooting down friendly players in MP, just fly for the other side, then you don't have to worry about that.

Joke aside, what RedKestrel pointed out, Finkeren's easy ID-guide. You have it a lot easier, if you can recognize the aircraft types. And the best, if you additionally know their strengths and weaknessess.

[LuftManu]

For me, the best way to spot enemy planes is to know where I can spot them and look there. At the best case you have some AA or allied/enemy tracers to tell you but SA is the best thing here.

 

Look at objectives, posible routes, near enemy AF towards the front... 

 

About ID, you need to know what you are looking instead to look for what you know. With this I mean that if you see something behave like a 109 you have to guess it's a 109 and viceversa. Always take it as an unknow unless you can confirm it! and act accordingly!

 

The key is invest time on it, you will end up knowing what is that after being shot down multiple times, we all start like that.

Are you flying in VR?

Edited June 4, 2019 by LF_Gallahad

[LLv44_Damixu]

It is true, this is ridiculously difficult to spot and track any target in this sim.

This sim does not take in account of human eyes capability to find and focus automatically to moving targets.
That's why the spotting the targets are way over difficult here.

I would like to see something along the line of WW2Online's implementation of human eye's capabability to distinguish detailed targets upon focusing to general target's direction long enough. This would actually simulate quite nicely human eye's capability spot and depict to 2D display what we see (or on VR headsets).

 

[Xyperion]

9 minutes ago, LF_Gallahad said:

Are you flying in VR?

No, I'm using Track IR.

 

Thanks for the tips everyone! You truly are the best. Additionally, I found a memrise game in one of the threads linked above. (https://www.memrise.com/course/2205705/il-2-airplane-recognition-v1-by-brzi_joe/1/garden/learn/#) It's a pretty fun way to learn those silhouettes.

[CountZero]

untill it comes less then ~2km from you you basicly cant be sure what it is, beyond that distance your just doing best guess based on his behavior, alt, position and info from coms ifr your on it.

 

[Xyperion]

4 minutes ago, 77.CountZero said:

untill it comes less then ~2km from you you basicly cant be sure what it is, beyond that distance your just doing best guess based on his behavior, alt, position and info from coms ifr your on it.

 

Does this mean that in SP it will be impossible to recognize the plane from 2km+? I doubt that the AI will fly to the strength of their planes.

[CountZero]

i would guess yes, but you can just use icons and outside views in SP no one cares (in SP i play with icons, aim assist, outside view ... all on, and in mp i just play on servers without icons and all that stff...)

Edited June 4, 2019 by 77.CountZero

[RedKestrel]

23 hours ago, Xyperion said:

Does this mean that in SP it will be impossible to recognize the plane from 2km+? I doubt that the AI will fly to the strength of their planes.

In some cases yes, but with practice and good use of zoom it is definitely possible to ID planes out past 2 km. It is also possible to fly within 1 km and not be sure in, for example, a head-on or side view situation where you don't have many hints of what to go on. So much depends on angle and features that you can see. But there are identifiable features that are visible much farther out than 2k on most planes, even the fighter-sized ones. If you spot a contact, use zoom and try and maneuver to get a better idea of the shape if you can. Probably no one can ID planes reliably out at the render bubble unless they have some kind of crazy vision and resolution, but I think in good conditions ID out to 5 km is possible. 

Honestly, if your goal is to reliably spot and ID planes with icons off, using icons in SP may be slowing down your learning process. You're missing an opportunity to train your eyes for motion and the way the game renders contacts. I found the only way to get better at spotting was to move compeltely away from icons and let myself adjust.
 

[Guest deleted@134347]

try to use this shaders based mod. It's advertised for VR, but I believe it works on monitors as well. You can get a x10 zoom on objects. Your mileage will vary since it may require tweaking of the config values, etc...

 

 

[BlackBadger]

On 6/4/2019 at 8:49 PM, LLv44_Damixu said:

It is true, this is ridiculously difficult to spot and track any target in this sim.

This sim does not take in account of human eyes capability to find and focus automatically to moving targets.
That's why the spotting the targets are way over difficult here.

I would like to see something along the line of WW2Online's implementation of human eye's capabability to distinguish detailed targets upon focusing to general target's direction long enough. This would actually simulate quite nicely human eye's capability spot and depict to 2D display what we see (or on VR headsets).

 

 

I find it very difficult. I noticed a lot of people have been recommending to lower to gamma which is arbitrary and the end effect will always depend on your monitor calibration. I found that reshade offers a similar gamma setting but is bit more detailed/flexible so ended up using that. Even then I rely more on the clarity and sharpness filter more then gamma, at least it helps to bring out contours without making the rest of the game too dark. 

 

But I would really like to know if the spotting will be revisited by the devs in the future. It's playable as it is, just not as good as it could be. Imho better spotting would bring the game (MP especially) experience up a great deal. Right now, I seem to do a lot of flying around with 0 action.   On occasion, I will move from 3km down to attack a ground target and suddenly I see what seems like 5-6 contacts that must have been there all along swirling around near the ground. 

 

EDIT: The other thing that could improve spotting and also ID'ing is to allow the player to zoom 10-15% further than what the current zoom level. 

Edited June 10, 2019 by hnbdgr

[SharpeXB]

This is the best thing they could do to improve visibility  

 

[BlackBadger]

Interesting technology - now I think I'll need a high refresh rate hdr monitor soon

 

But realistically It will be years before enough people own a monitor like that. In the meantime is a software solution in the pipeline or on a list of priorities?

[Velxra]

1 hour ago, SharpeXB said:

This is the best thing they could do to improve visibility  

 

A very informative thread, thanks for sharing. You made some great points and insights!

[II./SG.1-MarkWilhelmsson]

Tweaking graphics is what helped me along with 3D Migoto mod for VR. I can spot now right at the edge of the draw distance and can also ID exactly what plane it is 9 out of 10 times. I dont ID by markings at all, I ID by shape and sometimes by colour.

In addition to graphics settings, your flight pattern helps as well. It is much easier to spot things when your closure rate to that object is higher. Also, don't look around; find an area to focus on and stare at it. Looking at a stationary object wherein your closure rate is the same as your own speed will enable you to see objects with a different closure rate with your aircraft out of your peripheral vision with ease. Set up your flight plan so that you are flying perpendicular to possible ingress/egress vectors of enemy aircraft. Also, it is easy to spot aircraft over water; if your enemy needs to fly over a river to reach a target, try loitering there and watching the water. These practices are why i can fly at 3K+ and spot aircraft on the deck easily still.

Edited June 10, 2019 by 1/LG1-MarkWilhelmsson