Visibility of remote contacts ? after your multiplayer experience (expert no icons )

[AX2]

???

[oneeyeddog]

Very good. The white background helps a lot.

[AX2]

I'll have to train my eyes ??

I play CloD, RoF and il2 1946+ MoD

In those 3 Flight sims, I can clearly differentiate between friends and foes.  ( No icons settings )

In BoS I must use the zoom maybe all time , B&Z is difficult, because for me is very difficult tell if they are friends or foes.

I want to know what others think

 

 

Thanks for your answer oneeyeddog . 

Edited March 22, 2014 by Mustang

[Charlo-VRde]

So far I do find it harder distinguishing friend from foe fighters in BOS than in ROF or CloD. Time will tell if that changes with more BOS experience.

 

Charlo

[6S.Manu]

So far I do find it harder distinguishing friend from foe fighters in BOS than in ROF or CloD. Time will tell if that changes with more BOS experience.

 

Charlo

 

This. It's impossible to me to ID the contacts: I know they're are there and are easily trackable, but they are all the same to me.

 

Of course being this mission mostly a great furball, this problem is worse.

[NastyDog]

After a cople of try,s today ,spotting to find plane,s is verry nice ....like oneeyedog say the white background helps a lot ...

only have the same problem like you if it,s enemy or friendly ...aready a copple time,s i dont pull triker because think it,s friendly plane  

[AX2]

This. It's impossible to me to ID the contacts

 

 

only have the same problem like you if it,s enemy or friendly ...

Exactly that.

[oneeyeddog]

You Gentlemen are right. Spotting targets at distance was easy, Identifying them was difficult. For what its worth, I looked for the squared off wing, the crosses or the yellow nose of the 109. 

[Sokol1]

In those 3 Flight sims, I can clearly differentiate between friends and foes.  ( No icons settings )

In BoS I must use the zoom maybe all time , B&Z is difficult, because for me is very difficult tell if they are friends or foes.

See "dots" is easy ~6/7 Km.

 

IMO - Bad idea these "poles" under icons.. icons from track, the server dont allow.

 

Recognize what they are - even under 1 km - is difficult, the option is play with ZOOM as you say - what restricts your FOV and is not properly easy during a "furball".

 

IMO - Your pool question is improperly worded - should be "identify friendly or foe is difficult?

 

Visibility of contacts was been discussed "to death".

 

Sokol1

Edited March 22, 2014 by Sokol1

[GiConti]

I have a hard time seeing anything past 2km. I have to be on top of them to tell if they are friend or foe.

 

[coldViPer]

You Gentlemen are right. Spotting targets at distance was easy, Identifying them was difficult. For what its worth, I looked for the squared off wing, the crosses or the yellow nose of the 109. 

 

Exactly this helps me a lot, no difficulties to identify. And from behind it's easier, BF-109 have two radiators, LaGG "one" 

 

edit: oh and visibility is Very good 

Edited March 23, 2014 by coldViPer

[334th_L0C0]

I try to be a nice guy when I can...

 

Next compare will cost $5... Or maybe a click of the green arrow at the bottom right of this post ..

 

 

 

 

[Dave]

I'm not sure exactly what you are asking.

 

I have high resolution monitors so I do see detailed silhouettes at reasonable distances. In terms of differentiating friend from foe the game seems satisfyingly realistic to my eyes. At first they all look the same. But after a while you easily recognise aircraft by their planforms, and a little later you can differentiate their profiles easily enough.

 

I don't use zoom at all. I hate the whole idea of zoom and IFF icons. They turn a game of stalking and tactical pre-planning into an arcade shooter IMHO. There shouldn't even be an option to enable them.

[Dave]

You Gentlemen are right. Spotting targets at distance was easy, Identifying them was difficult. For what its worth, I looked for the squared off wing, the crosses or the yellow nose of the 109. 

Exactly. This was the reality. The guy with the best eyesight had a huge advantage.

 

I use the same things to tell them apart as oneeyeddog.

In planform the 109 wing seems to have higher aspect and a more squared-off appearance. The Lagg has more rounded form and has much wider chord at the wing root.

In profile it is harder but the belly radiator and lower cowl look distinctly different. In planform the Luftwaffe crosses should be clear mid wing. Inverted, the red stars against the sky blue belly stand out on the Lagg.

In profile the yellow nose stands out on the 109.

 

The Lagg also APPEARS to have slightly more dihedral when viewed from behind slightly off tail in a turn (even though it doesn't in reality). I suspect this might be an illusion created by the wider wing root of the Lagg when viewed from this angle.

 

If the only view I've had of a contact is 180 AOT I don't shoot. In this case I turn gently away (gain horizontal separation) from what would otherwise be a head-on pass at the merge and set up for a hard reversal or zoom climb as soon as I see any planform or colour.

Edited March 24, 2014 by Dave

[6S.Manu]

I try to be a nice guy when I can...

I think color and markings should be useful to recognize a plane as much as the shape.

 

Ingame, in my experience, all I see is a black/grey shape: the only way to ID it is by zooming but most of the times I lose the contact while pressing the zoom key.

Edited March 24, 2014 by 6S.Manu

[334th_L0C0]

Well the skins can change and I'm not going to create 30 more images just to show what colour they are. That! ...would be $20 . If both happen to be wearing white, what will you do then?

 

Perhaps you can use a slider on your stick for zooming? I use a slider on my throttle to zoom in/out. If you don't have a slider, maybe a button? Just an idea.

[Gort]

I like the way it looks. It's realistic, in real life, all you see is dark silhouettes until you are very close with the sun over your shoulder. We could often tell that a bogey wasn't one of ours because it was small, or wasn't smoking, or didn't have any of the friendly wing planforms. These WWII airplanes are pretty close, so you pick the trailer and close with your finger on the trigger until you are sure. All part of the fighter business. I think it's a refreshing approach to depicting air to air combat.

 

What is driving me nuts is my Trackir settings. When I try to look up, I'm looking through the bottom of my bifocals and can't see crap. Also a lot of jumpiness in general. Still have a lot of sorting to figure out.

 

The visuals are great. Maybe increase the range of seeing a dot, but these airplanes are relatively small and are difficult to see. I haven't noticed if shadows are very distinct, because that is how you often pick up aircraft at low altitude, you see their shadows. 

Edited March 24, 2014 by Victory205

[6S.Manu]

Well the skins can change and I'm not going to create 30 more images just to show what colour they are. That! ...would be $20 . If both happen to be wearing white, what will you do then?

 

Perhaps you can use a slider on your stick for zooming? I use a slider on my throttle to zoom in/out. If you don't have a slider, maybe a button? Just an idea.

 

  

 

In that case I would search for the markings: in the old IL2 we used to make training missions with the same plane for both the teams as the skins and the markings were enough recognizable even from distance.

 

Infact in IL2 1946 whose markings were separated from the skin, so the rendering engine could effectively sharpen them (a Russian plane would have a bright red pixel overlay on the wings). In Bos it's not possible as the markings are part of the skin.

 

I use to map the zoom function on the slider of my x52, but I really don't like to have constantly the need to zoom in and out. A plane should be always recognizable at the real distance.

Edited March 24, 2014 by 6S.Manu

[AX2]

 

, but I really don't like to have constantly the need to zoom in and out. A plane should be always recognizable at the real distance.

 

+1 

The problem of target identification exist for many users, When I flew I saw a many  reports of friendly fire penalty. 

I think a least 1000 players was connected to multiplayer, But here are only 30-40 votes. for now..

I remove the antialiasing, I must admit the ID situation improved slightly.

[334th_L0C0]

Manu... I was just trying to help. Go by the paint or markings then.

[6S.Manu]

Manu... I was just trying to help. Go by the paint or markings then.

 

I know.    (Kudos given)

Edited March 25, 2014 by 6S.Manu

[Phant0m]

I didn't have any problem with identification (using default FOV). Depending, obviously, on distance and the attitude of the aircraft in relation to mine. I look mostly at the rear empennage and the wings to tell the difference between these two very similar aircraft.

 

For most of us, this weekend was the very first time we needed to determine friend or foe - can't really expect to master it in such a short period of time. Unfortunately, if you want to be able to identify aircraft at realistic distances you either need icons or judicious use of zoom - this will continue to be the case till technology makes significant improvements.

 

Personally, I prefer zoom rather than icons

[SYN_Mike77]

I use the hat switch for zoom.  Full right zooms in, full left zooms out.  Full up starts the engine.  Full down is the blip switch...oh wait, wrong game!

 

And I bought a second pair of glasses for the computer.  No bifocals, just had them set the lense to what was right for my eyes at about 2 feet.  The only problem is when I forget and walk away with the wrong glasses! 

 

I too have problems telling friend from foe, I suspect that will get better with practice.

[Gort]

It was easy this week- the 109 was the aircraft behind hosing away; the Lagg was the one in front being ventilated.

Edited March 25, 2014 by Victory205

[NastyDog]

And I bought a second pair of glasses for the computer. 

 

 

I dont want it , only i think i need my first pair of glasses to

[I/JG27_Rollo]

To me, contacts were quite easy to spot (below the horizon - against the sky it's more difficult) and with a little zooming could be identified very well.

[9./JG52Ziegler]

So far I do find it harder distinguishing friend from foe fighters in BOS than in ROF or CloD. Time will tell if that changes with more BOS experience.

 

Charlo

Same with me, I have to get very close and zoom in to ID contacts. The contacts themselves are easy enough to see, it's just the ID.  Clouds are very realistic and tough down low!

[Matt]

+1 

The problem of target identification exist for many users, When I flew I saw a many  reports of friendly fire penalty.  

I'm pretty sure there would be friendly fire even if one team would only have B-17 and the other Cessnas.

 

I did not participate in MP yet (might take a look tonight, if it's still running), but i have no problem IDing the specific planetypes in SP. Of course it sometimes requires "zooming-in", but the maximum FOV setting, which i guess a lot of the players are using most of the time, is quite wide.

[JimTM]

The key for me is the more rectangular 109 horizontal stabilizer versus the "moth-like" stabilizer on the Lagg. Then I look for the wing shapes. I'm starting to pick up more subtle clues as I practice.

[VR-DriftaholiC]

It's good but could be better

[Dave]

What is driving me nuts is my Trackir settings. When I try to look up, I'm looking through the bottom of my bifocals and can't see crap. Also a lot of jumpiness in general.

Do you mean your view with TIR seems to occasionally skip around? Try adjusting camera sensitivity (can't remember off hand what the label is). It has particular trouble if you are backlit at all or near a window.

Edited March 26, 2014 by Dave

[Emgy]

 

When I flew I saw a many  reports of friendly fire penalty. 

People are being careless .

 

 

What is driving me nuts is my Trackir settings. When I try to look up, I'm looking through the bottom of my bifocals and can't see crap. Also a lot of jumpiness in general. Still have a lot of sorting to figure out.

For the jumpiness, try the Camera Smoothness setting.

Edited March 26, 2014 by Calvamos

[Matt]

After flying a good bit of MP now, i think it's perfect the way it is.

 

I also witnessed some friendly fire incidents, but i don't think visibility was the reason for that.

 

Also in general the friendly fire penalty message seems to get triggered during collisions with enemies. So that message alone doesn't say much.

[Gort]

Well heck, my trackir camera went tango uniform and isn't being detected. Tried reloading drivers, rebooting, different USB ports, all the recommended tricks. Just ordered another one.

 

Flying expert servers without one is challenging. I hope padlock is a standalone option in the future.

[9./JG52Ziegler]

9./JG54_EZ   Thanks for posting the silhouettes and shapes comparison.  Very helpful for me to differentiate contacts once I see these and get a few hours under my belt in the MP.  S!