Developer Diary 223 - Discussion

[Blitzen]

18 minutes ago, Jason_Williams said:

 

Do you know the layout of over 100 airfields from 75 years ago?? If so hand over the data please.

 

Jason

I can't say for certain on the layouts of German airfields late in the War, that's for sure but I can say in general .they tended to look a little beat up around the edges....?

Edited May 20, 2019 by Blitzen
missplelling

[HagarTheHorrible]

Jet airfield construction

[LukeFF]

On 5/19/2019 at 1:12 PM, -IRRE-Therion said:

Yes, and they apparently don't even know how some of the airfields looked like back in 1944/45 - and this in the middle of the project

Bodenplatte! What a great research! I really don't understand...

 

As Jason has said up above, finding accurate info about all of these airfields isn't always easy. Many of the German airfields were cut out of plowed fields and, after war, were very quickly returned to agricultural use - with so much thorough German efficiency that one would be hard-pressed to know there ever was an airfield at the location in question. But, thankfully, there have been a number of works in recent years that have helped clear things up, so I am sure that the community will be very happy with the map in its completed form.

[Panthera]

On 5/19/2019 at 1:27 AM, AndyJWest said:

According to this website https://www.ww2aerialreconstudies.com/jets.html Me 262s (and Arado Ar 234s) needed 1800 - 2000 metre runways. The ones on existing maps are about I000 m, I think, so it is going to be a struggle.  And I can't see any obvious way for the developers to come up with a temporary 'fix' that wouldn't involve either modifying an existing map or bodging the Me 262 FM. Maybe we should wait and see though, since I'm sure the developers are aware of the issue. 

 

Just to be clear, the normal take off & landing run for a Me262A1 was between 1,140 - 1,325 meters on concrete, and 1,325 - 1,600 meters on grass.  

 

1,800 to 2,000 m runways were needed for safety, if for example an engine failed during take off.

[sevenless]

1 hour ago, LukeFF said:

 

As Jason has said up above, finding accurate info about all of these airfields isn't always easy. Many of the German airfields were cut out of plowed fields and, after war, were very quickly returned to agricultural use - with so much thorough German efficiency that one would be hard-pressed to know there ever was an airfield at the location in question. But, thankfully, there have been a number of works in recent years that have helped clear things up, so I am sure that the community will be very happy with the map in its completed form.

 

I´m more than confident that with available Infos and support from the community you guys will come up with more than appropriate layouts for most of those old airfields. So far 1C/777 never let us down and overdelivered in all they did. I am really looking forward to the map and I am living and working right in the middle of those old battlegrounds crossing the hochwald gap right in front of me almost daily. 

[Falcon41]

I fully agree, it’s time to give credit to the developers of this GAME as to the overwhelming accuracy regarding aircraft, ground elements, etc.  Also let’s not forget it is a GAME and not a substitute for history.  The developers have demonstrated a great deal of fidelity to historic events and objects, so let’s support them in all they’ve done.

[-TBC-AeroAce]

The British Archives or the RAF (not sure which one) released for public viewing 1000s of recon pictures from Europe that are bound to show the layout of airfields for BOBP. I guess the question is how they are organised as it is would take an age to search through them.

[Uufflakke]

On 5/20/2019 at 8:53 PM, Jason_Williams said:

 

Do you know the layout of over 100 airfields from 75 years ago?? If so hand over the data please.

 

But thanks to Luke and David we have A LOT more info, I just hope we can utilize it all.

Jason

 

Maybe this link to 33 Dutch airfields during WWII is useful.

Including aerial photos and maps.

https://www.defensie.nl/onderwerpen/vliegvelden-tijdens-de-tweede-wereldoorlog/vliegveldenoverzicht?trefwoord=&jaar-van=1940&jaar-tot=1945

 

Some photos do have the option to download them in higher resolution.

For instance this one of Fliegerhost Venlo. With 2 Bf-110 planes at the lower part of the image.

 

[INVADER_WARHAWK]

21 hours ago, Falcon41 said:

I fully agree, it’s time to give credit to the developers of this GAME as to the overwhelming accuracy regarding aircraft, ground elements, etc.  Also let’s not forget it is a GAME and not a substitute for history.  The developers have demonstrated a great deal of fidelity to historic events and objects, so let’s support them in all they’ve done.

I agree , but I would replace the word GAME with the term combat flight simulator , because if IL 2 isn't a combat flight simulator , then this term is useless .

[357th_Dog]

3 hours ago, INVADER_WARHAWK said:

I agree , but I would replace the word GAME with the term combat flight simulator , because if IL 2 isn't a combat flight simulator , then this term is useless .

It's a video game in the genre of flight simulators. 

Feel better?

 

[LukeFF]

14 hours ago, AeroAce said:

The British Archives or the RAF (not sure which one) released for public viewing 1000s of recon pictures from Europe that are bound to show the layout of airfields for BOBP. I guess the question is how they are organised as it is would take an age to search through them.

 

I know the site you are referring to, and yes, it has proven to be very useful. Not the easiest site to navigate, but the photos we have found have proven to be very helpful. 

 

11 hours ago, Uufflakke said:

Maybe this link to 33 Dutch airfields during WWII is useful.

Including aerial photos and maps.

 

Already have everything we need from there, yes. ? It's arguably the best single resource for Dutch wartime airfield info. 

Edited May 22, 2019 by LukeFF

[Cybermat47]

12 hours ago, INVADER_WARHAWK said:

I agree , but I would replace the word GAME with the term combat flight simulator , because if IL 2 isn't a combat flight simulator , then this term is useless .

 

Combat flight simulators are video games, though, with the exception of those used to train actual combat pilots. 

Edited May 23, 2019 by [Pb]Cybermat47

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

Il2 is clearly a combat flight simulator. It simulates a great many things related to WWII air combat. It’s not a systems simulator if that’s what people are getting on about but it’s never pretended to be that either. Other sims model some things better, IL2 models other things better. For me and most on these forums IL2 BoX strikes a balance very well and plays the right chord. YMMV.

[TheFace]

262 is cool and all, but need the rest of the allied airframes more at this point IMO.  This is the last German AC while the allies are missing the P51, Tempest and P38.  Personally I would have prioritized at the very least the P51 to be released prior to the 262.  I have basically been taking a break until we have the P51 or the P38...

Take that with a grain of salt as the 262 is the least compelling AC for my personal tastes in the BoBP module.  I understand many people want it and it looks to be a very good simulation of the plane.

[Harlequin]

I just did a quick google about the british library photo archive mentioned above and I found this:

 

https://ncap.org.uk/

 

Haven't checked costs etc yet but might prove a useful resource.

[Jade_Monkey]

2 hours ago, TheFace said:

262 is cool and all, but need the rest of the allied airframes more at this point IMO.  This is the last German AC while the allies are missing the P51, Tempest and P38.  Personally I would have prioritized at the very least the P51 to be released prior to the 262.  I have basically been taking a break until we have the P51 or the P38...

 

That's simply not how any of this works. You ship out modules based on what can be built best and fastest without delaying the entire project. Not based on what would be nice to have.

[TheFace]

1 hour ago, Jade_Monkey said:

 

That's simply not how any of this works. You ship out modules based on what can be built best and fastest without delaying the entire project. Not based on what would be nice to have.

 

Well they did state that additional work would need to be done for the 262 in the simulation, so it's surprising it's before a chunk of other AC.  From many of the previous diaries the 262 is the tougest one for them.  Of course any of the devs can pipe in and correct that if I am wrong.

 

Yes it seems kind of like poor planning to have all of one side of the aircraft done and only half of the other side of the AC.  I lead a production team, and this is just not how I would personally plan the manpower to work on the project.

 

I also said "take this with a grain of salt" as it's biased because I just don't care about the 262.

Edited May 23, 2019 by TheFace

[Jade_Monkey]

1 hour ago, TheFace said:

 

Well they did state that additional work would need to be done for the 262 in the simulation, so it's surprising it's before a chunk of other AC.  From many of the previous diaries the 262 is the tougest one for them.  Of course any of the devs can pipe in and correct that if I am wrong.

 

Yes it seems kind of like poor planning to have all of one side of the aircraft done and only half of the other side of the AC.  I lead a production team, and this is just not how I would personally plan the manpower to work on the project.

 

I also said "take this with a grain of salt" as it's biased because I just don't care about the 262.

 

What seems obvious is that the new 109s and 190s share a lot of common components with existing planes (external as well as interior gauges and textures), so developing the exteriors and cockpits should be low hanging fruit and makes sense to get them out of the way.

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

The 262 is the heavy lifting as far as AC go. It makes sense it was among the first started. That it’s coming out early means their research and development went well. The P-51 is due roughly in July. Not to worried about it overall. Typhoon was a research nightmare and I suspect the P-38 is pretty complex as well. Timelines, overall, seem reasonable. I’m hyped for the P-51 so I feel your pain, just not your angst. (That’s a stronger term than I’m looking for. I’ll amend it later.)

[Daff]

Mustang won the war, should been in first, 262 didn't do squat

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

What? It bombed Pearl Harbor didn’t it?!?

 

Edit - stupid phone

Edited May 25, 2019 by II/JG17_HerrMurf
Stupid Phone

[Soilworker]

13 hours ago, TheFace said:

 

Well they did state that additional work would need to be done for the 262 in the simulation, so it's surprising it's before a chunk of other AC.  From many of the previous diaries the 262 is the tougest one for them.  Of course any of the devs can pipe in and correct that if I am wrong.

 

Yes it seems kind of like poor planning to have all of one side of the aircraft done and only half of the other side of the AC.  I lead a production team, and this is just not how I would personally plan the manpower to work on the project.

 

I also said "take this with a grain of salt" as it's biased because I just don't care about the 262.

 

I've said it before and I'll say it again: It's Early Access, be happy you get anything at all, if you have a problem with it wait for the official release. 

[danielprates]

On 5/22/2019 at 5:38 AM, AeroAce said:

The British Archives or the RAF (not sure which one) released for public viewing 1000s of recon pictures from Europe that are bound to show the layout of airfields for BOBP. I guess the question is how they are organised as it is would take an age to search through them.

 

Indeed that exists, it has been posted here somewhere, some 6 months ago. I've been looking all over for it!

 

To my taste, and considering that so many other things are more important to be depicted with precision, I dont't mind airports that are "more or less" like the historical ones. It is enough for our needs. What I WOULD mind are aircraft that are more or less like the historical ones. So clearly the devs have got their priories straight.

Edited May 24, 2019 by danielprates

[Uufflakke]

On 5/22/2019 at 10:38 AM, AeroAce said:

The British Archives or the RAF (not sure which one) released for public viewing 1000s of recon pictures from Europe that are bound to show the layout of airfields for BOBP. I guess the question is how they are organised as it is would take an age to search through them.

 

Not so difficult.

On this site the RAF images are organised.

https://originals.dotkadata.com/#!1&jaar[]=1940&jaar[]=1945

 

I've already selected timeframe 1940-1945.

Click on red button 'Zoek op de map'  and scroll the area you need, zoom in on the map and click red button 'Zoek in dit gebied'.

Then results show up.

 

[deckerrunner]

Im not saying eneythink, but a year 5 mouths and 24 days later and still waiting??

 

[kendo]

12 hours ago, II/JG17_HerrMurf said:

What? It bombed Pearl Harbot didn’t it?!?

 Who is this 'Pearl Harbot' you speak of, and where was she when she was bombed?

[LuftManu]

2 hours ago, deckerrunner said:

Im not saying eneythink, but a year 5 mouths and 24 days later and still waiting??

 

Sir, I think you clicked on the wrong forums

[40plus]

2 hours ago, deckerrunner said:

Im not saying eneythink, but a year 5 mouths and 24 days later and still waiting??

 

 

I think it's trying to communicate

[deckerrunner]

1 hour ago, LF_Gallahad said:

Sir, I think you clicked on the wrong forums

your probley right ,they do good work and a lot of it too,just need to be put in to the game ive been waiting for that all ,~

 

[=GW=seaflanker819]

2. This forum is provided by 1C-777 Ltd. as a courtesy and its usage is a privilege and 1C-777 Ltd. reserves the right to ban any member temporarily or permanently for any reason at any time. Any penalties listed below for violations of the rules are guidelines only and forum administration may take additional action if they feel it is warranted. Use of the forum is not connected to usage of the game and access to this forum is not guaranteed to users as a consequence of purchasing the game.

 

 

Edited May 25, 2019 by SYN_Haashashin

[Diggun]

Wasn't that last DD interesting?!?

[kitsunelegend]

Will those refuel and rearming trucks and vehicles be player controlled? Or AI controlled? Tbh it would be hella cool to run repair and rearm trucks to damaged team mates in multiplayer. For example, getting a call about a crash landed stuka or Spitfire that landed in a field, and driving out to their location to perform repairs on them so they can get back to flying and survive. Could be really fun!

 

Also, has there been any new news regarding the Li-2/C-47? I'd buy that beautiful aircraft in a heartbeat and never stop flying it ❤️

 

Other wise, I'm pumped to get to fly the 262! Only other time I've ever flown one in a video game is WT, and you know the quality of their flight models. (ei, terribad) So I'm really looking forward for this one! Its gonna be one interesting plane to fly! =D

[planesyplanesy]

On 5/17/2019 at 6:19 PM, Han said:

 

Full news - here is a full text and visual materials

Hi team

I just wondered when we are actually going to see the Bodenplatte map?

It was mentioned way back in March this year along with B-25, P-38. P-51, Me 262 and Hawker Tempest but still we dont see anything happening soon?

I purchased Bodenplatte a good while ago and feel that I haven't received what I paid for.

I appreciate that your marketing style is we enable you to develop expansion of the franchise by purchasing up front but feel that the time frames are too long.

May I suggest you do not 'advise' us of 'new content' until you have a better idea of a realistic time frame. 

£80.00 is a lot of money to fork out without actually seeing any merchandise apart from a few aircraft.

In my humble opinion I feel the work load put on the programmers and developers is too much and sporadic.

At present we have Tank Crew and Flying Circus as well all being thrown into the mix and this has to be a major cause of delay.

I appreciate fellow gamer's all have different likes and dislikes but feel your announcements for new product would be best received when they are actually imminent for release.

 

Please regards these comments as constructive and not derogatory.

 

Kind regards,

 

Planesy

 

[Dakpilot]

From what I see BOBP is progressing at the same speed as the three previous modules (BoS/BoM/Bok) , Tank crew and FC do not seem to be delaying anything compared to past history (and I understand they are being done by different outsourced teams) 

 

Cheers, Dakpilot 

[BraveSirRobin]

2 hours ago, planesyplanesy said:

 

I purchased Bodenplatte a good while ago and feel that I haven't received what I paid for.

 

 

It’s early access.  So you got exactly what you paid for.  If you’re not happy with that, wait until the game is released next time.  Problem solved.

[planesyplanesy]

Hey guys

Thanks for all your comments which is genuinely appreciated. It wasn't my intention to touch a nerve here just to make an observation. As far as 'early access' is concerned.....early access to what?

All I have seen so far is more aircraft available. No. I'm not missing the point just feel that a few more aircraft to placate the punter after a number of months of.....no access is  a bit disappointing that's all. I suppose its because we are all especially looking forward to a completely new campaign it gets a bit frustrating. Well. for me anyway.

 

Best regards to all.

 

Planesy.

 

 

 

 

[Zooropa_Fly]

BSR's right Planesy, you did get what you paid for. I don't think anything was mis-advertised.

 

I do however also agree with you, your points of view don't necessarily contradict each other.

WW2 expansions maybe aren't so bad done the way they are - at least contemporary environments and objects already exist.

FC however (my main reason for getting into GB's) isn't how I'd have done things from a marketing point of view.. not that I'm claiming to be a marketing specialist.

I've probably not had a go a FC for over a couple of weeks, and it somehow feels 'old' already.. and the map's not even out yet.

When it eventually gets officially released I'm not sure it's going to have the impact it could have had, but hopefully I'm wrong.

 

S!

[BraveSirRobin]

18 minutes ago, planesyplanesy said:

No. I'm not missing the point

 

 

Yes, you are.  Don’t get early access next time and you won’t be frustrated.

[IckyATLAS]

24 minutes ago, planesyplanesy said:

I suppose its because we are all especially looking forward to a completely new campaign it gets a bit frustrating. Well. for me anyway.

 

 

 

 

 

This is how I see things, but this is a personal point of view. Getting an early access means to contribute in two ways to the game development effort:

 

- The first one is in terms of money, which helps financing the whole stuff and we hope securing the chances that the new campaign will be developed to the end and released. 

 

- The second one is to help debugging or improving the game during its development. It gives us the opportunity to try and comment. The devs and Jason may consider our comments, our requests for improvement and bug descriptions, or not, that is left to them but at least we can give our experience feed-back, which is surely globally useful.

 

What is there for us then? Instead of waiting for one or two years until the new campaign is delivered, we can put our hands on the new campaign as it goes in small chunks here and there. A plane here a map there etc. I find this very exciting and keeps my interest high. At the same time the game improves its quality. What can we ask more? I would be very frustrated to have nothing for months or years not knowing if and what I will finally get in the end. Having early access is exactly the opposite for me, it is a frustration killer.

 

Let's take the case of COD or CLOD. We waited for years (many years), and we got here and there more or less regularly news and comments from Oleg about how exceptional things would be. And I was really extremely frustrated, because the incredible things were piling up but no release. Every time things were delayed, but we were told new exceptional improvements. But no early access. So you could not test the game, and there was no way to know the reality of the things we were told. Finally the game was released and the rest is history I will not come back on that. The approach that Jason has taken with the early access is excellent, and it is the right way to go. There is not much competition at this level of game quality, and for this type of game. Let's be happy and not frustrated about all that Jason and his team have achieved up to now.