Banking and stall speed.

[SCG_motoadve]

On the second landing in this video, you can hear the stall warning going off as soon as I start the bank to the right to get to the landing zone.

Stall warning goes off because the stall speed has increased with the bank angle.

This is just banking, I am not pulling on the yoke at all, I just let it drop, nose down,  would be very dangerous to pul at those speeds , do not want to increase the angle of attack.

I  pull just before the touch down.

 

 

Edited March 20, 2019 by II./JG77_motoadve

[AndyJWest]

How does the stall warning sensor work? Doesn't it operate if a given angle of attack is exceeded? And if it doesn't what is it sensing?

[SCG_motoadve]

The kind of stall warning the Cessna 182 has , its a Lift detector.

The lift detector does not react during normal airflow over the wing. When the angle of attack increases such as during an approach to a stall, disrupted airflow raises the tab and that sounds the electronic buzzer.

 

Angle of attack indicator is a much better tool, its over the glareshield, you can see in this video at the end  how slow I can land the warbird using this instrument, it does not care for weight or temperature, just measures the angle of attack of the wing, which always stalls at the same angle.

 

 

[unreasonable]

29 minutes ago, II./JG77_motoadve said:

On the second landing in this video, you can hear the stall warning going off as soon as I start the bank to the right to get to the landing zone.

Stall warning goes off because the stall speed has increased with the bank angle.

This is just banking, I am not pulling on the yoke at all, I just let it drop, nose down,  would be very dangerous to pul at those speeds , do not want to increase the angle of attack.

I  pull just before the touch down.

 

 

 

You may not have been pulling but you were turning, so you had increased your Gs.  Just banking the plane gives the lift vector a horizontal component that is turning the plane; if you bank and do not want to turn at all you would have to push the stick forwards a little.  

[SCG_motoadve]

1 minute ago, unreasonable said:

 

You may not have been pulling but you were turning, so you had increased your Gs.  Just banking the plane gives the lift vector a horizontal component that is turning the plane; if you bank and do not want to turn at all you would have to push the stick forwards a little.  

Nose will drop on its own if you just bank and not pull.

Gs were not increased, if you dont pull on the yoke or stick Gs actually are less, you are offloading the wing.

[AndyJWest]

II./JG77_motoadve, in your first post you said "you can hear the stall warning going off as soon as I start the bank".  In your second, in reply to my question, you said that "When the angle of attack increases such as during an approach to a stall, disrupted airflow raises the tab and that sounds the electronic buzzer". Since the stall warning went off in the video, the angle of attack must then have increased, I'd have thought. You may not have deliberately pulled, but something clearly led to the buzzer sounding.

[SCG_motoadve]

I see where the confusion lies, are just the terms used.

Banking in the pilots world is actually referring to turning with a certain degree of bank we just dont bank and do nothing (hardly ever, there are some instances though, when flying at the edge) , this is why the confusion here.

If you just bank and dont pull , nose drops, and yes if you just bank and dont pull you wont stall, stall speed wont increase.

 

The stall  tab is like a mini tiny slat, senses the air pressure, at cruise or most speeds is depressed by the air pushing into it, when it reaches certain amount of decrease air pressure goes off.

Can be by pulling, or turning , or banking, inverted any attitude,can be at high speed too on high speed stalls.

 

As bank angle increases you have to increase angle of attack to keep level flight, this is why I dont pull in this turn, I dont want to increase AoA , I am already very slow, instead add a very small amount of power.(but the trim is all the way back)

You have to be aware this is flying on the edge, in this particular case plane is going very close to stall speed already, and just banking and a bit of power is enough to set the stall warning alarm, this is why I used it as an example.

 

The component of lift its being given by power and trim, although I am not pulling, all this landings are with full trim aft, this is why it is sensed by the stall warning.

 

The stall warning is not as accurate as an Angle of attack indicator, which is why I equipped both planes with that instrument. (warbird has no stall warning).

[AndyJWest]

If the stall tab isn't accurate, you can't really state that it went off just because of the bank angle, rather than any increase in angle of attack, so your video doesn't really prove much one way or another.

[SCG_motoadve]

Its not innacurate , but the AoA indicator its a lot more accurate.

Video proves banking increases the stall speed, which is what started all this conversation, in the other thread when someone was saying the Dora will stall at 220KPH in a turn with full flaps and gear down.

[AndyJWest]

Sorry, but no. The video doesn't prove anything. There are far too many unknowns. And it isn't even clear what you are trying to prove anyway.

 

As for Doras stalling at 220 KPH, like any other aircraft, the wing can stall at any speed, since it is AOA not speed that causes the stall (at least until you approach the transonic region, but that isn't relevant here).  At slow speeds, tight turns (particularly tight uncoordinated turns) may cause one wing to stall before the other, which is one more reason why tight turns on finals are risky,

 

[SCG_motoadve]

 

32 minutes ago, AndyJWest said:

Sorry, but no. The video doesn't prove anything. There are far too many unknowns. And it isn't even clear what you are trying to prove anyway.

 

As for Doras stalling at 220 KPH, like any other aircraft, the wing can stall at any speed, since it is AOA not speed that causes the stall (at least until you approach the transonic region, but that isn't relevant here).  At slow speeds, tight turns (particularly tight uncoordinated turns) may cause one wing to stall before the other, which is one more reason why tight turns on finals are risky,

 

Whatever.

Enough time talking about this, time to fly (real planes).