What is the meaning of flares in Career missions?

[DarkWolf29]

I've been playing in career mode and I notice flares coming from different places. Is there some guide to what they mean? Or do they mean nothing and are just eye candy?

 

For example the airfield tends to fire two flares when we take off and when I approach the field coming home, two more are fired. Are those just signals clearing me to takeoff and land? Or do the flares drift with the wind and they are trying to show me wind direction?

 

One time I was flying home low and flew over a friendly artillery position and a single flare went up as I passed. Were they signalling they were friendly?

 

I'm curious as what these various uses of flares mean.

 

DW

[DarkWolf29]

Oops, I think I put this in the wrong section.

 

DW

[EpeeNoire]

someone once posted this here, some of them seem to apply also for this sim:

 

from personal experience I can confirm that single green is fired when you can proceed take-off or landing and single red means that there is an enemy aircraft close to the airfield you are trying to take-off or land.

Edited January 6, 2019 by EpeeNoire

[Feathered_IV]

I think in Career mode; twelve flares means prepare to take off, and a further twelve after that means take off now.

[unreasonable]

2 hours ago, Feathered_IV said:

I think in Career mode; twelve flares means prepare to take off, and a further twelve after that means take off now.

 

Playing career mode Moscow for the Germans you can see why they never took the city: all the rail capacity was taken up with wagons loaded with flares.

[Solmyr]

Also, why do we as flight leader fire a flare when asking our buddies to land ? (In addition it's a bit immersive killer as the flare is fired without openning the canopy and pretty fast). Why not just use the radio ? Because of some broken radio possibility ?

[DarkWolf29]

Ah, so they are different colors too. I wasn't sure in the mission if I was seeing different colors.

 

Twelve flares?! I haven't seen that many.

 

DW

[danielprates]

I often wonder how frequent the use of flares really was, on the ground and during flight. I mean, the presence of flare-pistol ports and so many known flare pistol models seems to indicate it was a frequent thing, but in-game it is used in all flights and in all stages of the flight.... 

[EpeeNoire]

On 1/6/2019 at 4:59 PM, Solmyr said:

Also, why do we as flight leader fire a flare when asking our buddies to land ? (In addition it's a bit immersive killer as the flare is fired without openning the canopy and pretty fast). Why not just use the radio ? Because of some broken radio possibility ?

because not all planes had a radio equipped, which is especially true for early stages of the war.

regarding the flares being shot from the plane w/o opening the canopy, all I can say is that at least in german planes this actually is possible by simply using the flare gun port to the right which is to be seen here (in a bf 109, but other planes feature it as well)

 

 

what this really is though is only a literal hole that fits precisely the muzzle of the flare gun

Edited January 8, 2019 by EpeeNoire

[Feathered_IV]

3 hours ago, EpeeNoire said:

because not all planes had a radio equipped, which is especially true for early stages of the war.

regarding the flares being shot from the plane w/o opening the canopy, all I can say is that at least in german planes this actually is possible by simply using the flare gun port to the right which is to be seen here (in a bf 109, but other planes feature it as well)

 

 

what this really is though is only a literal hole that fits precisely the muzzle of the flare gun

 

You're probably right.  It's certainly a difficult location for a relief tube.

[Elem]

1 minute ago, Feathered_IV said:

 

You're probably right.  It's certainly a difficult location for a relief tube.

And waaay too small for that!

[Solmyr]

2 hours ago, Elem said:

And waaay too small for that!

 

Conceited !! ?

 

6 hours ago, EpeeNoire said:

because not all planes had a radio equipped, which is especially true for early stages of the war.

 

My MiG-3 is supposed to be, as I heard and speak to my squad buddies.

 

6 hours ago, EpeeNoire said:

regarding the flares being shot from the plane w/o opening the canopy, all I can say is that at least in german planes this actually is possible by simply using the flare gun port to the right which is to be seen here (in a bf 109, but other planes feature it as well)

 

Interestning. I didn't spot such a thing in the said plane, but will check that.

Edited January 8, 2019 by Solmyr

[1Sascha]

4 hours ago, Feathered_IV said:

You're probably right.  It's certainly a difficult location for a relief tube.

 

From the K-4's manual:

 

Item 45 "Halterung für Leuchtpistole" (mount for flare-gun).

 

Also from the manual:

4.: A single barrel flare gun is provided for communication with the ground. It is to be inserted into the mount on the right hand side of the dashboard. Flares are carried by the pilot in his flying suit.

 

 

S.

[Cpt_Cool]

5 hours ago, Feathered_IV said:

 

You're probably right.  It's certainly a difficult location for a relief tube.

 

5 hours ago, Elem said:

And waaay too small for that!

 

No you are supposed to remain seated, fly one handed, and take careful aim.

[-TBC-AeroAce]

1 hour ago, Cpt_Cool said:

 

 

No you are supposed to remain seated, fly one handed, and take careful aim.

 

Pull the right amount of sideways negative g to get a goal without even having to hold and aim.

Edited January 8, 2019 by AeroAce

[EpeeNoire]

now this went in a weird direction...

which doesnt mean I dont like it, I really just didnt see this coming

Edited January 8, 2019 by EpeeNoire

[Feathered_IV]

That's what people on the ground said. 

[unreasonable]

I thought the hole was Galland's cigar lighter. But sometimes a hole is just a hole.  

[=FEW=fernando11]

About not using radio.

Maybe it's because you dont whant every enemy listening on your frecuency  to know when you are taking off/landing? In reality they used a lot of flares, and smoke, of diferent colours to comunicate with other planes and ground troops.

[-332FG-Gordon200]

Smoke grenades were used in Vietnam by ground troops to signal Huey pilots incoming to a landing zone.

I remember purple was for wounded; yellow was 'all clear' etc.

[1Sascha]

8 hours ago, Gordon200 said:

Smoke grenades were used in Vietnam by ground troops

Still being used like that to this day.

 

 

A-10 drinking game: Take a drink every time someone mentions smoke in this video.

[Solmyr]

On 1/9/2019 at 3:03 AM, =FEW=fernando11 said:

About not using radio.

Maybe it's because you dont whant every enemy listening on your frecuency  to know when you are taking off/landing? In reality they used a lot of flares, and smoke, of diferent colours to comunicate with other planes and ground troops.

 

But in the game we are radio spammed by AIs about to land. ?

[Gambit21]

On 1/8/2019 at 6:51 PM, Gordon200 said:

Smoke grenades were used in Vietnam by ground troops to signal Huey pilots incoming to a landing zone.

I remember purple was for wounded; yellow was 'all clear' etc.

 

Smoke shells were used extensively in WWII  by forward ground controllers embedded with the 3rd Armored, 5th armored etc to mark targets for the fighter bomber. Jugs, P-38’s etc.

 

In fact they’ve recently added colored smoke to the editor...I’ll be making extensive use of it in the next campaign.

[56RAF_Roblex]

Watch any WW2 war film about flying and you will see that even though the RAF & USAF had good radios they still used flares a lot on the airfield.

[Sublime]

As far as I can tell theres no rhyme or reason to it at all.

It seems to be just eye candy and a way of grabbing attention.

Of course you could use it in MP by telling ppl what flares will mean what.

Itd be cool in game if they had a daily flare colors for every briefing. It could just be randomized and be a note in briefings - if you see red flares this means this.  Or if youre doing ground attack green flares will mean friendly troops.

As it is now you see them on take off, often approaching to land, and when you link up with bomber formations often.  However I cannot find any correlation between the colors and whats going on just that theyre firing flares.

Id add to Roblexs comment that in WW2 radios between fighters and ground wouldnt work unless the ground troops had special radios. The only AF Im aware that did this was the US and Brits im 44/45 experimenting by putting actual pilots on the ground as FACs often in a tank with VHF and UHF radios..  This was pretty revolutionary at the time.

In game we.re seeing the East Front (lower altitudes, more tsctically oriented) and flares were heavily heavily used. Especially for ground troops to try to communicate to fighters.  Itd be nice if now for example a ground unit being attacked would shoot some red flares off if they saw friendly (or any) planes flying by to try to call in help.. Etc

[LukeFF]

One use of flares that you see in career mode is friendly ground units near the front lines firing them off. This is to let you know they are friendly. 

[Gambit21]

3 hours ago, Sublime said:

The only AF Im aware that did this was the US and Brits im 44/45 experimenting by putting actual pilots on the ground as FACs often in a tank with VHF and UHF radios..  This was pretty revolutionary at the time.

 

Yep - but went beyond experimentation and was standard practice in the theater late in the war. They’d talk their buddies into the target, direct smoke shells etc.

 

I’m working on this functionality now with radio calls etc.

[Sublime]

9 minutes ago, Gambit21 said:

 

Yep - but went beyond experimentation and was standard practice in the theater late in the war. They’d talk their buddies into the target, direct smoke shells etc.

 

I’m working on this functionality now with radio calls etc.

Yes. A really good source is Doublers Closing With the Enemy. While it covers ground tactics more it does mention the practice and indeed it does seem to have become common for tank columns to have flying cover for on call CAS by the Op Cobra timeframe and beyond.

[seafireliv]

On 1/5/2019 at 10:18 PM, DarkWolf29 said:

I've been playing in career mode and I notice flares coming from different places. Is there some guide to what they mean? Or do they mean nothing and are just eye candy?

 

For example the airfield tends to fire two flares when we take off and when I approach the field coming home, two more are fired. Are those just signals clearing me to takeoff and land? Or do the flares drift with the wind and they are trying to show me wind direction?

 

One time I was flying home low and flew over a friendly artillery position and a single flare went up as I passed. Were they signalling they were friendly?

 

I'm curious as what these various uses of flares mean.

 

DW

 

1. From the airfield- To indicate the correct airfield to land on (and help you find it).

2. Over contested territory - To tell you that they`re friendly and don`t shoot or drop bombs on them!

 

I love the flares- Helps you realise that they`re  people down there who want to live and you to land safely.

Edited April 15, 2019 by seafireliv

[dburne]

Flares?

And here all along I thought they were Roman Candles...

 

 

[Tapi]

On 1/8/2019 at 9:09 AM, EpeeNoire said:

because not all planes had a radio equipped, which is especially true for early stages of the war.

regarding the flares being shot from the plane w/o opening the canopy, all I can say is that at least in german planes this actually is possible by simply using the flare gun port to the right which is to be seen here (in a bf 109, but other planes feature it as well)

 

 

what this really is though is only a literal hole that fits precisely the muzzle of the flare gun

 

In the game the Bf 109's holes for firing flares are without a cover (you can see through them). I have always asked myself if it is correct - there had to be considerable draught in the cockpit... ?

[EpeeNoire]

3 hours ago, Tapi said:

 

In the game the Bf 109's holes for firing flares are without a cover (you can see through them). I have always asked myself if it is correct - there had to be considerable draught in the cockpit... ?

I dont think they ever had a cover, to be honest. and with such a small hole, I doubt there will be much draught since the rest of the cockpit should be relatively tight aswell, so there is a "puffer of air" pressing against this hole

[Art-J]

a) The hole is flush with the external fuselage skin, so without a ram intake (like the one for supercharger) there would be no wind blowing into the pit. Actually...

b) ... there might even be a bit of a suction created by lower static pressure caused by airflow outside, as neatly demonstrated on this infamous video:

 

[Tapi]

Thx guys for the explanation!

Just tried to find some photos how it looks from the outside: