HDR and SSAO on contacts visibility

[69th_Panp]

On 10/22/2018 at 11:57 AM, =TBAS=Sshadow14 said:

right side Reshade with smaa Ultra preset.

=TBAS=Sshadow14

 

Where can I get the ultra preset?

[=TBAS=Sshadow14]

SweetFX has several SMAA 'presets' you can use; Low, Medium, High and Ultra.

The numbers for the Ultra preset are -

#define SMAA_THRESHOLD 0.05
#define SMAA_MAX_SEARCH_STEPS 32
#define SMAA_MAX_SEARCH_STEPS_DIAG 16
#define SMAA_CORNER_ROUNDING 25

The numbers for the Low preset are -

#define SMAA_THRESHOLD 0.15
#define SMAA_MAX_SEARCH_STEPS 4
#define SMAA_MAX_SEARCH_STEPS_DIAG 0
#define SMAA_CORNER_ROUNDING 100

But i would set CORNER ROUNDING 0
(it makes text ingame look wonko)

Edited October 26, 2018 by =TBAS=Sshadow14

[69th_Panp]

ah I see you are using sweet Fx  instead of Reshade.

Any specific reason why you use the older sweet fx  versus the newer reshade?

[1PL-Husar-1Esk]

On 10/22/2018 at 6:57 PM, =TBAS=Sshadow14 said:

Have you tried SMAA
SMAA with Reshade helps a lot

SMAA Nearest neighbour blurring adds more pixels, more pixels means easier to spot.
Ingame MSAA Remove extra pixels to smooth an image afaik.

Pic below - there is a big difference in the parked planes visibility if you cant see them then its not the games fault. ?
Left side normal ingame with msaa x2. right side Reshade with smaa Ultra preset.



 

When I trurn off ingame AA - game is crashing to desktop while using reshade version 3.4.1. With AA in game on it's fine. Have a clue why?

[=TBAS=Sshadow14]

sorry no idea never had any sort of crash or issues with reshade..

well ingame anti A and smaa are not compatible so if you are trying to run both ingame will stop SMAA from working then if its crashing when smaa is working maybe there is a damaged file or typo in smaa config file as its only crashing once you disable ingame aa and smaa kicks in

On 10/27/2018 at 4:27 AM, Panp said:

ah I see you are using sweet Fx  instead of Reshade.

Any specific reason why you use the older sweet fx  versus the newer reshade?

No i am using Reshade i just got the max preset numbers from sweetfx age as i knew where they were and easier to find in a hurry they are the same tho
0.05
32,
16,

[Drifter28]

 

On 10/26/2018 at 1:14 AM, hrafnkolbrandr said:

You're reying on a version of a HUD, sitting in your lazy chair at home.  Everybody has the same mk1 eyeball, but everybody has a different setup that it's looking at.  Unlike real life.

 

[edited]

 

I'm glad at least one person understands - none of them are particularly realistic, least of all the pixel hunt and turning off ambient occlusion and blurry filtering (the same rubbish you see in all online games and they don't pretend it's about 'realism')  - the only question is how best do you simulate it.

 

So what I'd like to see is something like a visual cue that simulates your ability to pick up movement with your naked eye. Something like an intermittent pulse, glint or heightened outline that generates the desired visibility, but isn't jarring in the manner of a red arrow. They could make it look quite nice and semi transparent these days with pixel shaders, but it requires some thinking about how you advance the genre other than make better and better flight models.

 

A number of full flight model servers in the IL2 days kept limited icons at a certain range, much more enjoyable and felt far more natural imo.

 

Edited November 11, 2018 by SYN_Haashashin
unnecesary remarks

[Zooropa_Fly]

I have no idea why anyone who plays without icons would have any interest in objecting to a better / less obtrusive icons system for those that prefer to use them ?

As I believe, there are more offline players than MP ones, as such this feature can't be framed solely in a MP context. In any case non-icon MP servers wouldn't be affected (pending consumer choice of course).

 

Icons was the subject of my recent feedback, as I think it's the major thing that could be improved to make the game more enjoyable for a large number of participants. Exactly the same goes for RoF, my true love ?.

[SharpeXB]

On 10/29/2018 at 4:26 AM, Drifter82 said:

So what I'd like to see is something like a visual cue that simulates your ability to pick up movement with your naked eye.

The sim already has that feature. Look with your eyes for planes moving on your screen.  ?

[EAF19_Marsh]

Quote

The sim already has that feature. Look with your eyes for planes moving on your screen

 

If you have ever flown an actual aircraft by yourself in a traffic pattern then you would understand that the ability to discern moving objects in this sim - with or without VR - is far below that of the actual human eye when it comes to spotting other aircraft.

 

This is a discussion thread. I would suggest that you dismount you high horse and think for s second before replying with such misplaced arrogance and generally vindictive tone.

[SharpeXB]

10 hours ago, EAF19_Marsh said:

 

If you have ever flown an actual aircraft by yourself in a traffic pattern then you would understand that the ability to discern moving objects in this sim - with or without VR - is far below that of the actual human eye when it comes to spotting other aircraft.

 

This is a discussion thread. I would suggest that you dismount you high horse and think for s second before replying with such misplaced arrogance and generally vindictive tone.

Pardon my weariness. This is the most tired subject discussed in flight sims. There is no solution for this that’s not worse than the problem. 

[Guest deleted@134347]

11 hours ago, EAF19_Marsh said:

 

If you have ever flown an actual aircraft by yourself in a traffic pattern then you would understand that the ability to discern moving objects in this sim - with or without VR - is far below that of the actual human eye when it comes to spotting other aircraft.

 

This is a discussion thread. I would suggest that you dismount you high horse and think for s second before replying with such misplaced arrogance and generally vindictive tone.

 

tone/shade recognition is the bane of any PC game. However, there were a study done that points towards a better object recognition if you spend enough time with the game. Obviously, it's not a 'solution' per se but ... well.. you make your own conclusions..

 

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/science/2009/03/news-video-games-vision-correction-sight-medicine/

 

[EAF19_Marsh]

5 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

Pardon my weariness. This is the most tired subject discussed in flight sims. There is no solution for this that’s not worse than the problem. 

 

Sure, understood. Issue of brief sentences without tone of voice.

 

Quote

...better object recognition if you spend enough time with the game

 

Last week I had a sudden improvement in spotting while wearing my Oculus (still far worse than with TrackIR), which I presume is down to my brain adjusting over time. Still wish there were a third way.

Edited November 12, 2018 by EAF19_Marsh

[Drifter28]

15 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

Pardon my weariness. This is the most tired subject discussed in flight sims. There is no solution for this that’s not worse than the problem. 

 

What about the compromise I suggested in the post you responded to? I thought your post was funny - but you did read what you responded to didn't you?

 

So far the only compromises that have been tried are no visual aids and visual aids which are jarring letters on the screen.

 

I reckon the pilot diaper grognards seek authenticity more than you seek realism, and would adapt very quickly to a system where the visibility of a target was accentuated without entirely suspending your disbelief.

 

I mean, they'd have to be dragged kicking and screaming to it, but once they're there would probably really like it.

 

The ridiculous thing is that nothing has been attempted as an alternative - nothing in a decade - and your assumption is it can't be improved. When no one's even tried to in the first place...

[SharpeXB]

31 minutes ago, Drifter82 said:

 

What about the compromise I suggested in the post you responded to? I thought your post was funny - but you did read what you responded to didn't you?

 

So far the only compromises that have been tried are no visual aids and visual aids which are jarring letters on the screen.

 

I reckon the pilot diaper grognards seek authenticity more than you seek realism, and would adapt very quickly to a system where the visibility of a target was accentuated without entirely suspending your disbelief.

 

I mean, they'd have to be dragged kicking and screaming to it, but once they're there would probably really like it.

 

The ridiculous thing is that nothing has been attempted as an alternative - nothing in a decade - and your assumption is it can't be improved. When no one's even tried to in the first place...

If 1CGS wants to add settings to adjust the icons, fine. But there’s no such thing as a “realistic” icon and players would never be able to agree what setting to use in MP that’s fair for everyone so the only thing they can agree on is to just switch them off. Probably the reason that IL-2 GB doesn’t have this feature compared to 1946 is that much less people use icons today with the prevalence of wide screen HD monitors. It’s a safe assumption the devs are reluctant to put work into features they know won’t get used. 

 

Here’s an idea. Instead of icons why not highlight the other aircraft in the way some FPS games do to your enemies. Like make them glow or have a highlighted boundary. You could still have to ID them by shape, or have setting to display aircraft type and range etc, but they’d be easier to see. Now such a feature would still be a game aid and deservedly switched off in “full real” or Expert. But it’s a suggestion for something less awkward than text and arrows. 

Maybe the above would appeal to some players, right now I’m playing Far Cry 5 which does that and it makes me nuts and want to switch it off ?

Edited November 12, 2018 by SharpeXB

[Drifter28]

30 minutes ago, SharpeXB said:

Here’s an idea. Instead of icons why not highlight the other aircraft in the way some FPS games do to your enemies. Like make them glow or have a highlighted boundary. You could still have to ID them by shape, or have setting to display aircraft type and range etc, but they’d be easier to see. Now such a feature would still be a game aid and deservedly switched off in “full real” or Expert. But it’s a suggestion for something less awkward than text and arrows. 

 

Sharpe, why don't you read the posts you are responding to. You go to all that effort for a funny retort but don't spend 15 seconds running your eyes over it.

 

This is exactly what I suggested originally. Heck it's even in the post you just quoted and you've just rephrased my own words and presented them to me as a new idea.

 

But instead of a constant glow to do the visual aid in a manner which better simulates the way your eye picks up motion, such as an intermittent pulsing of the aircraft outline. Or have the outline become stronger the more focus on it. Anything to avoid the distracting 'always on' vision thing that results with icons, and to maintain a suspension of disbelief.

 

There will always be the the guys who want to turn every part of the hud off because they think it's more realistic or whatever to approximate peering at a dial with track ir. What I reckon is that most of them are still at least partly human, don't enjoy squinting at pixels anymore than the rest of us and quite a few might adopt such a system as a better simulation of how we see.

[SharpeXB]

1 hour ago, Drifter82 said:

There will always be the the guys who want to turn every part of the hud off because they think it's more realistic or whatever 

The vast majority of people who buy sims like this today fall into that category. Although it would be posssible to add more gamey ways to help spot aircraft they likely wouldn’t get used enough to be worth the effort. The players who want that style are over on War Thunder. 

Edited November 12, 2018 by SharpeXB

[US63_SpadLivesMatter]

Yep.  All 50,000 of them at most given times.  ?

Edited November 13, 2018 by hrafnkolbrandr

[EAF19_Marsh]

The TF perspex effect - though possibly overdone - was an interesting effort for CloD. Some similar reflective approach for a/c is a middle way. If BoX has it, I personally have not really noticed it.

[Tag777]

Taking back to the post topic, when I use a gamma below 0.8 (let's say 0.6) is easier to spot planes against the sky but concerning the terrain, parts of the woods become very dark and is hard to spot aircraft with dark camouflages against the forest, so it would be better to turn HDR on?

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

FYI, none of this is supposed to be for VR, it's all monitors. As a matter of fact attempting to use sshadow's recommendations with VR breaks the software. It may be useful only for monitor players. 

[Tag777]

I do not have VR. 1920 x 1080 144 Hz gaming monitor.

[Oyster_KAI]

On 10/28/2018 at 8:00 PM, 307_Tomcat said:

When I trurn off ingame AA - game is crashing to desktop while using reshade version 3.4.1. With AA in game on it's fine. Have a clue why?

Tomcat,I have tried many times and many versions of  Reshade.

I found the 3.08 can turn off in game AA with no game crash,you can try 3.08

https://reshade.me/forum/general-discussion/294-reshade-repository-new-host

I prefer "Curves" with 0.3~0.5 setting,it's make graphic more realphoto like.

If too dark,you can try DPX or in game Gamma 1+.

Edited November 15, 2018 by Takuya_liang