How a single player enjoys multiplayer in BOX

[Nibbio]

Like many of you I have always preferred single player. I don't care about joining squads, communicating with other pilots and generally any kind of human interaction. My dream has always been a Falcon 4 style dynamic campaign that I could savor and enjoy in perfect solitude.

 

I suspect my dislike for multi is that I have absolutely no skills to show off, and actually after hundreds upon hundreds of hours of flight my competence is barely adequate with just a couple of russian planes. Or maybe I'm just a grumpy old misanthropist.

 

Anyway, BOX is a most wonderful combat flight simulator, alas almost empty of meaningful single player content, because of apparently insurmountable AI issues.

 

So, how can a single player enjoy it? The answer is simple: join a multiplayer game, AND JUST FORGET THAT THE OPPONENTS ARE HUMAN!

That's right, just make yourself believe they are just a super-duper new AI, who can even spout nonsense in chat while doing advanced CFM and engine management, and all this without a single precious cycle of your CPU going to waste ?

Just forget about all the silly etiquette of multiplayer combat flight sims, the salutes, the gallantry, the drama, just join a multiplayer game and enjoy shooting down (and being shot down) by the most advanced and unpredictable AI ever.

 

Just the other day a kind soul driving a 109 was busy peppering my Pe2 with mg and cannon fire, I was weaving all over trying to spoof his aim, all of a sudden I lost control of the plane and had to bail. He apologized profusely for ramming me Can you believe it? We shoot at each other with (simulated) mg and cannon but feel the need to apologize for ramming? This is madness... ?

 

So join a multiplayer server and wreak havoc on the enemy. Whatever you do, no one is going to judge you, and even if they did, what do you care? You will find nirvana.

[OrLoK]

agreed.

 

as long as I'm not hindering my team I tend to fly support missions and just do my thing.

 

obviously if one is in a competitive server it does help to use comms etc.

 

me? I'm an antisocial bugger.

[Thad]

Outstanding observation Nibbio and attitude. Great post. 

Edited September 24, 2018 by Thad

[BraveSirRobin]

I don’t understand why more people don’t do this.  It’s a little tough to fly solo in a fighter.  But for early war VVS bomber pilots it’s even relatively realistic 

[beresford]

I haven't got TeamSpeak either. But you don't have to be TOTALLY unsocial, you can use the chat box to request 'little friends' once you've climbed your bomber to altitude, or ask for somebody to clear vulchers from an airfield, or inform your team-mates that you have spotted a convoy. It can be good to say which target you are going for, nothing more annoying than to line up a perfect bombing run and see the target disappear from the map because someone else has got there first.

 

You might want to say that you are on landing approach at a given airfield as well, to prevent tears before bed-time.

Edited September 24, 2018 by beresford

[bush_wizard]

no thanks, not interested in mp.

[Herne]

When I started I must have randomly pressed I at some point which turns your icons off. This resulted in me trying to figure out what was going on in MP with no gps marker on the map. I actually thought this was normal and the same for everybody lol.
 

I would practice in bombers and I had enormous satisfaction when i reached my target (Took many more hours before I knew how to use the bombsite  properly though).

Much of my online time is solo. Flying in groups with comms is fun, but not necessary even if you are putting yourself at a disadvantage. It teaches you to try and pick your fights.  Win or lose, I always have fun.

 

Nibbio do you play Rogue System ? pretty sure I saw someone with your handle posting on the old RS forums.

Edited September 24, 2018 by =FEW=Herne

[Nibbio]

23 minutes ago, =FEW=Herne said:

Nibbio do you play Rogue System ? pretty sure I saw someone with your handle posting on the old RS forums.

 

Nope, must be another Italian bird of prey ?

I just checked out RS on Steam. Very interesting, will definitely keep an eye on it.

28 minutes ago, bush_wizard said:

no thanks, not interested in mp.

 

You are even grumpier than me ?

As you like, but you ARE missing out...

[bush_wizard]

8 minutes ago, Nibbio said:

 

Nope, must be another Italian bird of prey ?

I just checked out RS on Steam. Very interesting, will definitely keep an eye on it.

 

You are even grumpier than me ?

As you like, but you ARE missing out...

 

i'm not grumpy i just have no interest in mp.

 

really not that hard to understand.

[OrLoK]

11 minutes ago, bush_wizard said:

 

i'm not grumpy i just have no interest in mp.

 

really not that hard to understand.

I don't think anyone is trying to force you.

 

it's to your detriment imho but we don't mind. play anyway you wish

[Thad]

Wow! We can actually play this game anyway we desire? Is this a great life or what? 

[CIA_Yankee_]

Good OP. 

 

For all the claims of air quake, the fact of the matter is there are plenty of good servers out there that do as good a job of simulating the proper objective-based gameplay you get in single player. 

 

TAW is the most obvious example, or Coconut's expert, but even Wings is objectives driven and isn't a massive free for all. Granted, being a solo fighter pilot can be tough. Learn to fly with your head on a constant swivel, and accept that you will get bounced whenever your attention lapses. Conversely you'll get your own bounces in, and you will get plenty of opportunity to fly with allies even if you can't communicate with them (it's not like you can really coordinate with the AI anyway... and these allies are likely to be a lot more helpful  ).

 

 

[Adger]

I enjoyed reading your post Nibbio,I'm 99% of the time a SP simmer. I totally get your understanding and I saw no condescending or "telling" people what they should do unlike some posters on the forum. it might give some SP flyers a nudge to try it out.

The thing is though there's a hell of a lot of SP flyers that do just that SP. 

2 hours ago, Nibbio said:

So, how can a single player enjoy it? The answer is simple: join a multiplayer game, AND JUST FORGET THAT THE OPPONENTS ARE HUMAN!

 

They can't pal,why?? Because they Don't "enjoy" a multiplayer game so the answer isn't that simple. This sim to my understanding is touted as both a SP and MP sim. If it was MP only I wouldn't have touched it. That's not to say it's a bad sim,it certainly isn't..I love it I've tried MP and it's just not for me.

 

Anyway like I said I Personnally did enjoy your post and if there's a few SP players who want to take up your advice then..nice one. And I admire what Coconut and the other guys do to promote MP.

Regards Adger

[Lusekofte]

I started to do WW2 combat flight simulator for over 17 years ago, once old IL 2 came I stuck to it like glue until just a few years ago. 

I put myself in a theatre and situation I read about when flying. This game have ruined that state of mind for me. It seems never to come back either.

I don't fly public servers because majority there push E and throttle up for take off from ramp, eager to get to a hot spot and get shot down once more. I started to fly study simulators because of this. I am no longer capable to get in the mindset I need to fly. 

So you are wrong, there is many reasons for not go online.

Just some years ago it was plausible to get over 100 players to fly a campaign, it take just a couple to ruin that, and it never happened. Now this is impossible, it is always a group taking advantage and start boosting their kill rate instead of following their task. 

Edited September 24, 2018 by LuseKofte

[Herne]

Just now, LuseKofte said:

I started to do WW2 combat flight simulator for over 17 years ago, once old IL 2 came I stuck to it like glue until just a few years ago. 

I put myself in a theatre and situation I read about when flying. This game have ruined that state of mind for me. It seems never to come back either.

I don't fly public servers because majority there push E and throttle up for take off from ramp, eager to get to a hot spot and get shot down once more. I started to fly study simulators because of this. I am no longer capable to get in the mindset I need to fly. 

So you are wrong, there is many reasons for not go online.

 

I can recommend Knights Of The Air. A fairly new addition, but the server admins have done a nice job with making the airfields with a landing strip look Busy. Lots of obstacles, pretty much forcing you to use the taxi path and runway. 

It's pretty nice eye candy actually. Hangers filled with 109's with the engine covers open and stuff. Server admins are really friendly and welcoming.

[Nibbio]

18 minutes ago, LuseKofte said:

I started to do WW2 combat flight simulator for over 17 years ago, once old IL 2 came I stuck to it like glue until just a few years ago. 

I put myself in a theatre and situation I read about when flying. This game have ruined that state of mind for me. It seems never to come back either.

I don't fly public servers because majority there push E and throttle up for take off from ramp, eager to get to a hot spot and get shot down once more. I started to fly study simulators because of this. I am no longer capable to get in the mindset I need to fly. 

So you are wrong, there is many reasons for not go online.

Just some years ago it was plausible to get over 100 players to fly a campaign, it take just a couple to ruin that, and it never happened. Now this is impossible, it is always a group taking advantage and start boosting their kill rate instead of following their task. 

 

I fully understand. I was drawn to combat flight sims more than 20 years ago out of love for military history.

I just logged out of Coconut server. A ground battle for a section of the map was raging and the Russians were outnumbered, as it often happens. Also some very combative and well known 109 aces were online. I took off from an airfield out of the way with an Il2 with 8 large rockets and AP ammo. After less than 10 minutes I was over the ground battle, and was able to take 4 rocket launchers out of commission. All the time I was afraid some of the 109s would show up, so tried to be snappy about it...

Anyway my fears were unfounded, the "aces" were probably away hammering a nearby airfield. Proceeded to RTB, and found a lone 109 (an AI one, I mean real AI?) strafing the field. An allied fighter took off and brought it down, so I could land in peace... Isn't this good enough for a single player guy? I mean, even if they had shot me down, what's not to like about it? And it took 45 minutes in all.

 

I should also mention that the server runs a dynamic campaign, that damage is persistent, and that maybe my 45 minutes were well spent since my paltry efforts may have tipped the balance of the ground battle, leading to a Russian victory and expansion of Russian territory.

Edited September 24, 2018 by Nibbio

[Adger]

6 minutes ago, =FEW=Herne said:

 

I can recommend Knights Of The Air. A fairly new addition, but the server admins have done a nice job with making the airfields with a landing strip look Busy. Lots of obstacles, pretty much forcing you to use the taxi path and runway. 

It's pretty nice eye candy actually. Hangers filled with 109's with the engine covers open and stuff. Server admins are really friendly and welcoming.

 

You know Herne..between yours and Nibbio,s advice I might just try another MP session. Doesn't mean to say I'm happy with the current SP experience,I'd love it to become "better"

But Im more than willing to have a go at it. What harm could it do?  Cheers guys.

[Herne]

Just now, Adger said:

 

You know Herne..between yours and Nibbio,s advice I might just try another MP session. Doesn't mean to say I'm happy with the current SP experience,I'd love it to become "better"

But Im more than willing to have a go at it. What harm could it do?  Cheers guys.

 

Good on you mate, hope you have fun, let us know how it goes.

[Lusekofte]

1 hour ago, Nibbio said:

I just logged out of Coconut server.

 

I flown a lot with Coconut , and in his server. I know the work he is putting into it. Considering internet relationships for what it is , I regard him as a friend. There is a lot of likeminded people about , but I have simply dried out . I hope to gain momentum if PTO will surface, with a quick test flight on the Tempest , 262 and P 38. So do not mind me. If all hope was lost , I would not be here. I just say there is many more reasons for not liking MP than bad self confidence 

Edited September 24, 2018 by LuseKofte

[40plus]

I tried precisely this idea this past weekend. Got tired of quick missions and campaign so I clicked on the hated Multiplayer button.

 

My experience was not all bad. I played a single sorti on the Wings of Liberty server. Jumped into a 109F, flew over the Russian airbase at about 3000m and just circled it bobbing and weaving looking for something to play with.

 

What did I learn?

I absolutely suck as spotting and identifying planes. I play exclusively in VR (vive) and I can't tell a 109 from a smudge on my screen until I'm inside 300m or so. I pounced a few planes but they ran while I was zooming and squinting to try and figure out what they were. The only plane I could positively ID was the Yak that zoomed past my now burning plane.

 

Was it fun? Sure! I can see the allure but the skill barrier to entry is still too high for me. (Does anyone know of a server that is only VR pilots?)

Will I try it again? No, not for a while.

Going back into single player to work on spotting and ID'ing and yet again tune and retune the graphics settings to try and improve VR performance.

 

[CountZero]

14 minutes ago, pfrances said:

I tried precisely this idea this past weekend. Got tired of quick missions and campaign so I clicked on the hated Multiplayer button.

 

My experience was not all bad. I played a single sorti on the Wings of Liberty server. Jumped into a 109F, flew over the Russian airbase at about 3000m and just circled it bobbing and weaving looking for something to play with.

 

What did I learn?

I absolutely suck as spotting and identifying planes. I play exclusively in VR (vive) and I can't tell a 109 from a smudge on my screen until I'm inside 300m or so. I pounced a few planes but they ran while I was zooming and squinting to try and figure out what they were. The only plane I could positively ID was the Yak that zoomed past my now burning plane.

 

Was it fun? Sure! I can see the allure but the skill barrier to entry is still too high for me. (Does anyone know of a server that is only VR pilots?)

Will I try it again? No, not for a while.

Going back into single player to work on spotting and ID'ing and yet again tune and retune the graphics settings to try and improve VR performance.

 

 

I saw that sortie, i think flak got you before me and tm8 dived on you, we tought your Agni (he usealy camp over red bases).

For starter going to enemy airbase and staying there high is bad idea, 1st many veteran people will just ignore you if your high over base thinking your just there to be destraction as to mutch time is wasted to climb and fight you for nothing when protecting red targets is better option, and there is big chance that even if you attack guy over your own base flak will get kill so you again just waist ammo and time. 2nd flak is heavy over bases on WoL and will shoot you down at some point.

 

For starters, better just go over your own targets at 4-5km and wait for enemy fighter escort and attack them, later maybe even try attack bombers.

Or climb to 5-6km and go over enemy targets and dive on enemy fighters protecting them, they will usealy look down for axis bombers and will not see you coming.

 

Also i see some good players online with VR so there has to be way to inprove your spoting and recognising problems even in VR.

 

It takes time to get used to MP, its not just one day try or 1 week it will take months to understand where when and how, so dont give up and try it few more times, check other servers also.

 

My first online flight i shoot at frendly, crashed many times and so on, its just staying with it and doing what you wont to do in MP, even on simple fast food server like WoL you can play it how you wont and dont care about whats going on around you or you can go for objectives or what not. 

[SCG_motoadve]

 

 

The feeling of shooting down 1  or more opponents and getting back to base in one piece its very rewarding.

 

I tried to like the single player campiagn but was shooting down 4 to 6 planes per mission and that was totally unrealistic.

 

On the other hand COOP is fun too and its an in between.

[JonRedcorn]

Sounds like most of the people who hate mp are lacking any confidence in their abilities and are unsure they can fit in, the answer to that is clearly yes, there's a place for everyone online, I use to never touch multiplayer for the same reasons, once I did I haven't gone back. There isn't another comparable feeling you get to when you gun down your HUMAN opponent. It's the peak of enjoyment I've had out of flight simming, I can shoot down a 100 AI pilots and never even get a jolt of adrenaline, flying online that rush is there 24/7. It's really incredible.

 

I really can't wrap my head around why some people are so adamant about not trying it. Saying just because like bush wizard isn't an actual reason.

 

3 hours ago, bush_wizard said:

 

i'm not grumpy i just have no interest in mp.

 

really not that hard to understand.

It actually is since you've never once stated why you hate it so much. Saying you aren't interested isn't a reason.

Edited September 24, 2018 by 15th_JonRedcorn

[Cpt_Cool]

4 hours ago, bush_wizard said:

no thanks, not interested in mp.

 

Wait. Are you sure? I don't understand. I think you actually are interested in MP.

[40plus]

1 hour ago, 77.CountZero said:

 

I saw that sortie, i think flak got you before me and tm8 dived on you, we tought your Agni (he usealy camp over red bases).

For starter going to enemy airbase and staying there high is bad idea, 1st many veteran people will just ignore you if your high over base thinking your just there to be destraction as to mutch time is wasted to climb and fight you for nothing when protecting red targets is better option, and there is big chance that even if you attack guy over your own base flak will get kill so you again just waist ammo and time. 2nd flak is heavy over bases on WoL and will shoot you down at some point.

 

For starters, better just go over your own targets at 4-5km and wait for enemy fighter escort and attack them, later maybe even try attack bombers.

Or climb to 5-6km and go over enemy targets and dive on enemy fighters protecting them, they will usealy look down for axis bombers and will not see you coming.

 

Also i see some good players online with VR so there has to be way to inprove your spoting and recognising problems even in VR.

 

It takes time to get used to MP, its not just one day try or 1 week it will take months to understand where when and how, so dont give up and try it few more times, check other servers also.

 

My first online flight i shoot at frendly, crashed many times and so on, its just staying with it and doing what you wont to do in MP, even on simple fast food server like WoL you can play it how you wont and dont care about whats going on around you or you can go for objectives or what not. 

 

Ha! That's awesome that someone witnessed my bumble-farting around. I'll be the 1st to admit I had no idea what I was doing. Flak makes total sense as my engine was dying already from unknown damage when the Yak jumped me.

 

Thanks for your tips, I've give it another shot I'm sure.

[Guest deleted@83466]

bush-wizard, have you considered doing multiplayer?

[JonRedcorn]

8 minutes ago, pfrances said:

 

Ha! That's awesome that someone witnessed my bumble-farting around. I'll be the 1st to admit I had no idea what I was doing. Flak makes total sense as my engine was dying already from unknown damage when the Yak jumped me.

 

Thanks for your tips, I've give it another shot I'm sure.

The il2 has some interesting engine limits, if you didn't know, 2150 rpm at 1.2 ata I believe.

[40plus]

Just now, 15th_JonRedcorn said:

The il2 has some interesting engine limits, if you didn't know, 2150 rpm at 1.2 ata I believe.

 

Oh yeh I know, I was on top of my engine management. Thanks though.

[JonRedcorn]

Just now, pfrances said:

 

Oh yeh I know, I was on top of my engine management. Thanks though.

Apparently the german flak is far inferior to the russian flak, aha. ?

[Lusekofte]

1 hour ago, 15th_JonRedcorn said:

I use to never touch multiplayer for the same reasons, once I did I haven't gone back. There isn't another comparable feeling you get to when you gun down your HUMAN opponent.

 

Yes, this is what I mean. I am not in it for this. I am in it for historical reasons. Interest for WW2 aviation. Fighters are there to stop general purpose aircraft winning the war, flying anything else than general purpose aircraft is to me a waste of time and not of interest. You guys think all have the same goal as you, in fact for me this FPS attitude is like cancer for my interest in MP. And the way SP works today it is utterly waste of time except some scripted campaigns out there. And FnBf. So I wait for PTO , get a short boost reliving that era .

[CountZero]

I think that most players at start go towards enemy bases because you join MP and wont some action, so its normal to think best bet is go towards enemy base, but usealy to get in action fast on wol your best chance to meat enemy over objectives (either your or enemy) or betwen objective and base that has 3 dots (means most playes take of from it), usealy everything is going around thouse small parts on map on WoL around the targets, and short range of spoting in game will make it hard for starters to locate things outside of that.

[JonRedcorn]

10 minutes ago, LuseKofte said:

 

Yes, this is what I mean. I am not in it for this. I am in it for historical reasons. Interest for WW2 aviation. Fighters are there to stop general purpose aircraft winning the war, flying anything else than general purpose aircraft is to me a waste of time and not of interest. You guys think all have the same goal as you, in fact for me this FPS attitude is like cancer for my interest in MP. And the way SP works today it is utterly waste of time except some scripted campaigns out there. And FnBf. So I wait for PTO , get a short boost reliving that era .

This just isn't true, there is a reason I am flying a fighter, and that's to stop incoming ground attack craft, this all depends on the server as well. The TAW server is far more historically accurate with exactly what you are seeking. Standard aircraft on the patrol to stop advancing troops. I am not in it just for the kills my good sir. Do not mistake my comment.

11 minutes ago, 77.CountZero said:

I think that most players at start go towards enemy bases because you join MP and wont some action, so its normal to think best bet is go towards enemy base, but usealy to get in action fast on wol your best chance to meat enemy over objectives (either your or enemy) or betwen objective and base that has 3 dots (means most playes take of from it), usealy everything is going around thouse small parts on map on WoL around the targets, and short range of spoting in game will make it hard for starters to locate things outside of that.

You are a true dog zero, I see your name pop up in the kill log regularly! Do not be so humble!

[CountZero]

thnks but i falow thouse simple rules i recomended to him so its nothing extra only thing is i play online long time in flying games and basics regarding df servers in mp are same in all of them. 

[JonRedcorn]

1 hour ago, 77.CountZero said:

thnks but i falow thouse simple rules i recomended to him so its nothing extra only thing is i play online long time in flying games and basics regarding df servers in mp are same in all of them. 

No doubt I think a lot of people don't realize what those 3 dots mean, I know I didn't at first. I just took out 2 he111's was freaking amazing in VR in the yak-1b-127. I love that plane so much. Might be my favorite of the whole sim. I prefer axis planes too, she's just an absolute joy to fly. I'd pay serious money for a yak-3/yak-9.

[Poochnboo]

No one is worse than me. I mean, really....I have yet to shoot down a single airplane on line. Got close one time. One of the few times I flew Axis. Was chasing a guy over the water and he crashes. Like an idiot, I followed him right into the drink! I really suck. 

I'm a friggin' ace off line , though. Hell, I'm a regular killer! But it does get old when you know exactly what the enemy is going to do. He's going turn, that's it.

The attraction of on line play, is that you never know what the hell is going to happen. At least that's what the attraction is to me. And that's what makes me go back, even though I feel like a masochist. I'm reminded of a scene from one of my favorite films, "12 O'Clock High." Gregory Peck is giving the sorry, beat up, 918th Bomber Group a "pep talk." He tells them, "Forget about flying twenty five missions and going home! Consider yourselves already dead!"

So, I get on line and say, "What the hell...I'm gonna die," and go on anyway. Like the guys in the 918th, once you accept it, you're not scared anymore!

 

[Ehret]

1 hour ago, Poochnboo said:

No one is worse than me. I mean, really....I have yet to shoot down a single airplane on line. Got close one time. One of the few times I flew Axis. Was chasing a guy over the water and he crashes. Like an idiot, I followed him right into the drink! I really suck.

 

The water table can be homogeneous enough to deny any sense of distance. It even can go worse when you can (happened to me few times...) confuse it with the sky and just fly inverted not aware, completely, for several seconds.

Edited September 25, 2018 by Ehret

[Poochnboo]

Well....I just invalidated that whole post. An hour after writing that, I went on the WOL server, jumped into an LA-5, and got a 190. I finally busted my cherry. 

[CountZero]

12 hours ago, 15th_JonRedcorn said:

No doubt I think a lot of people don't realize what those 3 dots mean, I know I didn't at first. I just took out 2 he111's was freaking amazing in VR in the yak-1b-127. I love that plane so much. Might be my favorite of the whole sim. I prefer axis planes too, she's just an absolute joy to fly. I'd pay serious money for a yak-3/yak-9.

 

Yak-3 would be nice to have as collectable option

[bush_wizard]

16 hours ago, 15th_JonRedcorn said:

Sounds like most of the people who hate mp are lacking any confidence in their abilities and are unsure they can fit in, the answer to that is clearly yes, there's a place for everyone online, I use to never touch multiplayer for the same reasons, once I did I haven't gone back. There isn't another comparable feeling you get to when you gun down your HUMAN opponent. It's the peak of enjoyment I've had out of flight simming, I can shoot down a 100 AI pilots and never even get a jolt of adrenaline, flying online that rush is there 24/7. It's really incredible.

 

I really can't wrap my head around why some people are so adamant about not trying it. Saying just because like bush wizard isn't an actual reason.

 

It actually is since you've never once stated why you hate it so much. Saying you aren't interested isn't a reason.

 

actually, it is. having a preference, or a lack thereof, is entirely a reason. i'm not interested in comms, i'm not interested in not having the option to accelerate time, i'm not interested in signing up for or understanding the rules and regulations of somebody's online campaign system, i'm not interested in flying with people like you or others in this thread namely for the type of rude attitude youre displaying in this thread. i'm interested in sp and no amount of verbal jousting, semantics, abuse, bullying, condescension or anything else is going to change my preference in how I utilize the very little time I have for gaming.

 

if you don't understand simple preference, no long winded explanation is going to help you with that. that's on you brother

Edited September 25, 2018 by bush_wizard

[Zooropa_Fly]

Play as you wish Bush Wizard, it's your choice of course.

 

But some of your objections above aren't necissarily real issues : I've been flying RoF MP for 5+ years now and I've never used TS, as many don't ; I don't think accelerating time is ever a worry to anyone who plays online - it's not really needed there ; and there aren't really any great rules and regulations to abide by.

 

But the important thing is you get out of it what you want, it's only a game after all .