Noob questions about the 190 A-3

[MasserME262]

 

Hello,

 

Im looking for any advice, tip or "tricks" related on how to fly properly the 190 A-3.

This is the only plane Im flying, since I wanted to pick one and stick to it no matter what, so I can "master" it.

 

What Im looking for, is to fly it as perfectly as it can be done. 

Any manual, post, video, or whatever, gonna be helpful.

I already read "chuck's guides", and want to start practicing what its written there about the A3, but one of the things It doesnt say, is how to do a sustained climb... It just say how to take off properly. Also, I want to know how should I properly dive in a A3 (currently I just set throttle to 0-20%, do a half roll, and pull the stick), and of course, after the dive it comes the zoom-climb... I read about it in some forums but its not very clear yet to me... How should I "reclimb" after a dive? at which angle, throttle, etc? Now, all I do is to exit the dive smoothly, climb at maybe 30-45° and trim. Which works fine I think, but its not perfect.

 

Also, when flying with AI, I have the typical noob issue: cant fly beside them... they go faster than me, and, since I have been told that AI has exactly the same FM and engine than I, then what am I doing wrong? how to use the A3 as its best?

 

As you can see, I didnt mention anything about cowl flaps, engine-cooling... anything. So, as you all noticed, Im still noob at this plane, and need heavy advice.

 

Yes, I can fly, reach 5K altittude, look for an enemy and luckily enough, shot him down (cant do it easily yet, tho). But, how to do it better? What do I need to improve? What am I missing? What I need to stop doing?

 

Of course, even if I have the "definetly 190 A-3 manual", I will have to practice the flying itself, but at least I would know what to do and what not, while now Im just flying according the "how-I-Think 190 A-3 have to be flown maual" (lol).

 

Well, I think I have written a nice wall-text already, but its just I have many questions about this plane.

 

Thanks in regards.

[Finkeren]

The practical stuff:

 

1: Don’t worry about cooling in the A3, everything is automatic. If you experience overheating, which you will rarely do, increase airspeed and/or pull back on the throttle.

 

2: The tailwheel lock is engaged by pulling back on the stick and released again by centering the stick. Until you get this right, taxiing and take off will be really bothersome.

 

3: The flaps have three positions: Up, partially down and fully down. Fully down is strictly for landing, partially down is for taking off from small fields with a heavy load. Partially down can technically be used as combat flaps, but there is really no situation, where it would be useful to use them as such.

 

4: Due to the way the Kommandogerät works and the altitude at which the supercharger automatically shifts gears, the A3 has a performance gap around 2000-2500m altitude. Nothing you can do about this other than keeping it in mind when in combat.

 

5: Officially your engine limits is 30mins at combat power and 3mins at emergency power. However, I have found, that the emergency limit can safely be pushed to 5mins. During my testing I have never blown the engine before the 5min mark.

 

Combat tips:

 

1: Keep speed high, always. The Fw 190 is fast, especially at low alt, that’s its main asset. It also has arguably the best high-speed maneuverability of any fighter.

 

2: The A3 carries a large fuel load for such a small fighter. The fuel really weighs it down, and it only really starts becoming a great dogfighter around 60% fuel load or below. Don’t bring more fuel than you need.

 

3: The A3 can dogfight (which is not the same as turn fighting) but it requires technique and discipline. For starters it is better to rely on hit-and-run and ambush tactics.

 

4: The A3 has a very high wingloading, as such it does not hold its energy well in a turn and has a sudden and nasty accelerated stall. Spend some time in a “safe” environment learning its limits and quirks.

 

5: The A3 is a very good fighter, arguably the best 1942 fighter in the sim, but it relies heavily on its edge in performance, and as such it has serious trouble dealing with later high-performance allied fighters such as the La-5FN and the Spit Mk. IXe. 

 

6: The A3 only really starts to shine when working as part of a team. Find people to fly with, when you venture online, don’t go alone. 2 Fw 190s working together are worth 5 on their own.

 

7: Your strengths are: High top speed, good acceleration, excellent dive characteristics, heavy armament, superlative roll rate, great high-speed maneuverability, easy controls, pleasant flight characteristics (within the flight envelope), good field of vision(mostly), high versatility. 

 

Your disadvantages are: Poor energy retention, mediocre climb rate, vicious stall characteristics, poor low speed handling, obstructed view forward and down, performance gap at medium altitude.

 

Utilize your strengths and find ways arpund your weaknesses and you’ve got an excellent fighter.

 

[MasserME262]

31 minutes ago, Finkeren said:

The practical stuff:

 

1: Don’t worry about cooling in the A3, everything is automatic. If you experience overheating, which you will rarely do, increase airspeed and/or pull back on the throttle.

 

2: The tailwheel lock is engaged by pulling back on the stick and released again by centering the stick. Until you get this right, taxiing and take off will be really bothersome.

 

3: The flaps have three positions: Up, partially down and fully down. Fully down is strictly for landing, partially down is for taking off from small fields with a heavy load. Partially down can technically be used as combat flaps, but there is really no situation, where it would be useful to use them as such.

 

4: Due to the way the Kommandogerät works and the altitude at which the supercharger automatically shifts gears, the A3 has a performance gap around 2000-2500m altitude. Nothing you can do about this other than keeping it in mind when in combat.

 

5: Officially your engine limits is 30mins at combat power and 3mins at emergency power. However, I have found, that the emergency limit can safely be pushed to 5mins. During my testing I have never blown the engine before the 5min mark.

 

Combat tips:

 

1: Keep speed high, always. The Fw 190 is fast, especially at low alt, that’s its main asset. It also has arguably the best high-speed maneuverability of any fighter.

 

2: The A3 carries a large fuel load for such a small fighter. The fuel really weighs it down, and it only really starts becoming a great dogfighter around 60% fuel load or below. Don’t bring more fuel than you need.

 

3: The A3 can dogfight (which is not the same as turn fighting) but it requires technique and discipline. For starters it is better to rely on hit-and-run and ambush tactics.

 

4: The A3 has a very high wingloading, as such it does not hold its energy well in a turn and has a sudden and nasty accelerated stall. Spend some time in a “safe” environment learning its limits and quirks.

 

5: The A3 is a very good fighter, arguably the best 1942 fighter in the sim, but it relies heavily on its edge in performance, and as such it has serious trouble dealing with later high-performance allied fighters such as the La-5FN and the Spit Mk. IXe. 

 

6: The A3 only really starts to shine when working as part of a team. Find people to fly with, when you venture online, don’t go alone. 2 Fw 190s working together are worth 5 on their own.

 

7: Your strengths are: High top speed, good acceleration, excellent dive characteristics, heavy armament, superlative roll rate, great high-speed maneuverability, easy controls, pleasant flight characteristics (within the flight envelope), good field of vision(mostly), high versatility. 

 

Your disadvantages are: Poor energy retention, mediocre climb rate, vicious stall characteristics, poor low speed handling, obstructed view forward and down, performance gap at medium altitude.

 

Utilize your strengths and find ways arpund your weaknesses and you’ve got an excellent fighter.

 

Thank you so much for this mini-guide. I knew some of this "points", didnt know some others. 

 

However, Im waiting for more, specially "numbers" and specific throttle/RPM settings for climbing/diving and tips for the zoom after diving... From all what you said, (poor energy retention + mediocre climb rate = painful climbing after a dive), I guess the basic tactic would be: Fly fast, dive aim and shot, and after all that, dont climb, but keep flying leveled instead (at high speed by that moment), wait until you are far from enemies; then climb again to your previous altitude. Repeat. Would you recommend this? (Instead of climbing immediately after the dive)

Thanks.

[Quinte]

7 minutes ago, ME-BFMasserME262 said:

poor energy retention + mediocre climb rate = painful climbing after a dive

Energy retention is poor in a turn. When it comes to zoom climbs, it's outstanding.

 

7 minutes ago, ME-BFMasserME262 said:

Fly fast, dive aim and shot, and after all that, dont climb, but keep flying leveled instead (at high speed by that moment), wait until you are far from enemies; then climb again to your previous altitude. Repeat.

There is no magic recipe. No matter how hard you'll try to find one, there is none. If your target has rolled over for something approaching a split-S you may want to climb back up immediately, or set up a high yo-yo. Or maybe not, depending on whether you're sure to be clear or not. If your target has evaded in a horizontal break turn and has speed, then, indeed, create horizontal separation first, as you can be sure he'll try to turn back into you quite often.

Practice, practice, practice. And by practice, I mean, practice taking decisions and executing them, and asserting if they were good or bad decisions. Every situation will be different.

 

As for engine numbers, really the 190 is the one aircraft in which you don't have to care about anything. Apply as much power as you need. You don't need much to cruise once you're at 450 kph or so.

Edited August 23, 2018 by Quinte

[Bremspropeller]

The key to the 190 is flying it more like a real WW2 fighter:

One pass, haul ass.

 

Everything else is artifical dogfight-server BS anyway.

 

Can't agree on the "poor low speed handling" - it handles very nice, indeed. It's just not a "roll lift-vector on target and pull 'till he appears in your sights" type of airplane.

Just don't do funny things with the stick below 300kph and clean.

 

Edited August 23, 2018 by Bremspropeller

[MasserME262]

30 minutes ago, Quinte said:

As for engine numbers, really the 190 is the one aircraft in which you don't have to care about anything. Apply as much power as you need. You don't need much to cruise once you're at 450 kph or so.

Oh man, thats probably the most lovely thing of the A3. I guess you are very right on that.

 

18 minutes ago, Bremspropeller said:

Just don't do funny things with the stick below 300kph and clean.

 

Well, after a failed dive over an enemy who did a horizontal break, sometimes I cant avoid trying to follow him, assasinating all the energy I had, and starting a horizontal dodfighting at low speed, resulting (most of the time) in a hard situation to get out from, and a rekt 190. I definetly need to work on it and fix that.

Edited August 23, 2018 by ME-BFMasserME262

[JimTM]

Here's a couple of video sources to check out:

• How to operate the FW-190 A-3 (3 parts)
• How to Fw 190 A-3 - Il2: Battle of Stalingrad - Tutorial/Guide

Edited August 23, 2018 by JimTM

[Artunius]

1 hour ago, ME-BFMasserME262 said:

Thank you so much for this mini-guide. I knew some of this "points", didnt know some others. 

 

However, Im waiting for more, specially "numbers" and specific throttle/RPM settings for climbing/diving and tips for the zoom after diving... From all what you said, (poor energy retention + mediocre climb rate = painful climbing after a dive), I guess the basic tactic would be: Fly fast, dive aim and shot, and after all that, dont climb, but keep flying leveled instead (at high speed by that moment), wait until you are far from enemies; then climb again to your previous altitude. Repeat. Would you recommend this? (Instead of climbing immediately after the dive)

Thanks.

 

Just don't overthink it. Make mistakes and have fun. The 190 is really a one-dimensional BnZ fighter, but that is something it quite excels at. Don't be afraid to push the plane to its limits and do crazy stuff in practice, you have more than one life. Your gunnery is going to be the most important thing in the Butcher Bird. If you can kill your enemy in one pass, you don't even need to think about optimal climbing speed, as you'll have all day to climb. Most folks online in the sims I've played tend to play 190's pretty realistically and only enter fights that they know they can win, diving in from ungodly high altitudes, but I've seen some people do some crazy things with the aircraft once they master it.

 

I've always been more of a 109 guy myself, same principal applies there, but I like the wing slats.

[MasserME262]

5 minutes ago, Artunius said:

[...] but I like the wing slats.

Thats the reason the 109 been always my fav plane... But since tried the 190's diving and firepower, I can live without slats ?

 

About what you said of gunnery, I guess that's the key of the 190 after all, hitting the enemy planes while diving at superb speeds... its difficult as hell for me, buy I guess once I master that, then I can start doing crazy things like you said.

 

Thanks!

[JonRedcorn]

31 minutes ago, ME-BFMasserME262 said:

Thats the reason the 109 been always my fav plane... But since tried the 190's diving and firepower, I can live without slats ?

 

About what you said of gunnery, I guess that's the key of the 190 after all, hitting the enemy planes while diving at superb speeds... its difficult as hell for me, buy I guess once I master that, then I can start doing crazy things like you said.

 

Thanks!

The biggest tip I can give you is to stop chasing planes, BNZ and always pull out and regain advantage unless you are 100% certain you can get the kill, and I mean 100%, not 99% or 99.5%, 100%.

[Artunius]

13 minutes ago, 15th_JonRedcorn said:

The biggest tip I can give you is to stop chasing planes, BNZ and always pull out and regain advantage unless you are 100% certain you can get the kill, and I mean 100%, not 99% or 99.5%, 100%.

 

I always pulled out until I got snipped... err wait.

 

Jon is right, though. He's one of the smartest dudes on the forum from what I've seen the past couple weeks of being back.

 

The science of the gunnery is where it really counts. Anticipating where your opponent is gonna be, deflection angles, etc. You essentially dive in ahead of your opponent by assuming what direction he's heading. In VR I feel like I'm having to relearn how to shoot again, so I'm going to be toiling around in SP for a while until I relearn it. 

 

My first real combat flight sim when I was a kid was Red Baron 3D. When I moved into WW2, I had a lot of turnfighting bad habits, still do sometimes. Which is fine I guess, if you like flying Spitfires and being in a defensive situation 90% of the time. BnZ tactics all day if you wanna survive and play realistically.

Edited August 23, 2018 by Artunius

[sevenless]

Take speed of the A3/A5 to your advantage. Always dive on your target. If he breaks, pull up, gain altitude, preserve your energy and go for another pass on him. Don´t let yourself get dragged into turn fighting, you will loose. You need discipline and patience to do this, but once you see the merit you rule 'em all.

[JonRedcorn]

1 hour ago, Artunius said:

 

I always pulled out until I got snipped... err wait.

 

Jon is right, though. He's one of the smartest dudes on the forum from what I've seen the past couple weeks of being back.

 

The science of the gunnery is where it really counts. Anticipating where your opponent is gonna be, deflection angles, etc. You essentially dive in ahead of your opponent by assuming what direction he's heading. In VR I feel like I'm having to relearn how to shoot again, so I'm going to be toiling around in SP for a while until I relearn it. 

 

My first real combat flight sim when I was a kid was Red Baron 3D. When I moved into WW2, I had a lot of turnfighting bad habits, still do sometimes. Which is fine I guess, if you like flying Spitfires and being in a defensive situation 90% of the time. BnZ tactics all day if you wanna survive and play realistically.

Those are truly kind words. Appreciate it.

[[CPT]Crunch]

The electric flap first position is an excellent combat flap, very fast deployment.  Best used only at speeds above 400Kph, higher the better.  With nose down and flap there isn't a Spit, Yak, or La FN that can escape by turning, it allows wonderful snapshots and still retains enough energy to escape if needed.  Flap on, pull, shoot, flap off.

[Dr_Molem]

Stay around 550 km/h IAS with full power and you'll be able to cut any bandit's turn with ease or follow them for enough time to shoot them down 5 times.

[CrazyDuck]

Interestingly enough nobody yet mentioned the tactic which the 190 really shines in - and that is drag'n'bag. 

 

While tangling with pesky maneouverable russian birds 1v1 might be challenging, Fw 190 really starts to shine in "many vs many" environment. Why? Because of two assets: Speed, and Firepower. There is no other fighter in the sim with such a brutal combination of these two stats. If dogfighting a Yak-1 1v1 in an A3 at the treetop level is tangling with death, take for example 4 vs 4 at some 3km altitude. A3s (with competent pilots who know what they are doing) are going to toy with helpless Yaks (regardless of pilot skill) and mop the floor with them in no time. Even SpitVs are gonna have a tough time vs A3s in such a setup.

 

Going online (dogfight servers), team up with somebody, and keep cleaning each other's (not own!) tails.

 

 

 

Edited August 24, 2018 by CrazyDuck

[Tomsk]

31 minutes ago, CrazyDuck said:

Interestingly enough nobody yet mentioned the tactic which the 190 really shines in - and that is drag'n'bag. 

 

Very much agree. Fast planes with great high-speed handling and good weapons like the FW 190 (and the P-47 and P-51) tend to really excel when used with teamwork. Drag'n'bag, bracketing, tag-team Boom-and-zoom, and general separation tactics and so on are all fantastic ways to use it.

 

As a solo plane IMO it's biggest strengths are that if you stay fast, and you've got a km or two underneath you then you are basically safe in most situations. Dive for the deck at full power, and almost nothing will catch you. Anything that can get close is going to have a really hard time winning against a FW 190 in a 500kph+ rolling scissors, the FW 190 is just too strong at those kinds of high-speed manoeuvres. Offensively stay fast, and make slashing or BnZ type attacks. It is possible to dogfight with it, mostly by exploiting the insane roll rate, but I wouldn't particularly recommend it to beginners. Indeed, I tend to disfavour dogfighting in general as even if you win it depletes energy quickly and leaves you incredibly vulnerable to being low, slow and seriously outnumbered. Do not be low and slow in a FW 190, it doesn't have a lot of options in that scenario.

 

If you are low and slow, and can't outrun someone behind you then your best best is going to be to try and win a scissors. It's pretty hard to do well, and so don't expect to survive if your opponent knows what he is doing, but it works occasionally. Sometimes you can win it out right, but most often I've generally managed to create a space where I could disengage from the fight.

Edited August 24, 2018 by Tomsk

[MasserME262]

Thanks for the input guys, I think I will fly with someone next time I join the game, never do it before. The reason I never flew with someone else, its because I feel like it would be annoying (for both of us), to fly in a formation, keeps your mate in sight, IDK, but I guess you understand me. I mean, I guess its more difficult to fly with someone because of the situational awareness that you should have to do so, which I still dont have (and the lack of head tracking makes it a little more difficult), and finally because you loss that "freedom" you have when you fly alone (I could be entirely wrong on this, but thats how I see it)

 

About the flaps, I never thought I would use them at all (except when taking off and landing, where I always use them), in a 190, no matter the speed. Gonna try that as well next time I get into that 190 :).

 

Thanks!

Edited August 24, 2018 by ME-BFMasserME262

[purK]

18 hours ago, Finkeren said:

3: The flaps have three positions: Up, partially down and fully down. Fully down is strictly for landing, partially down is for taking off from small fields with a heavy load. Partially down can technically be used as combat flaps, but there is really no situation, where it would be useful to use them as such.

 

The 190s flaps have a similar effect to that of the Yaks when fully extended, rediculous amounts of lift. If you find yourself trapped in a situation where regaining energy is not an option, by all means you should be using full flaps in the 190.

[Legioneod]

2 hours ago, ME-BFMasserME262 said:

Thanks for the input guys, I think I will fly with someone next time I join the game, never do it before. The reason I never flew with someone else, its because I feel like it would be annoying (for both of us), to fly in a formation, keeps your mate in sight, IDK, but I guess you understand me. I mean, I guess its more difficult to fly with someone because of the situational awareness that you should have to do so, which I still dont have (and the lack of head tracking makes it a little more difficult), and finally because you loss that "freedom" you have when you fly alone (I could be entirely wrong on this, but thats how I see it)

 

About the flaps, I never thought I would use them at all (except when taking off and landing, where I always use them), in a 190, no matter the speed. Gonna try that as well next time I get into that 190 :).

 

Thanks!

Flying with a wingman is both easier and harder. It's hard because you have to keep an eye on your wingman and stick with him, at the same time you can watch each others backs and help each other in times of need.

 

I find I get more kills flying solo, but I usually stay alive longer with a wingman. A wingman can get you killed so be careful on who you fly with, I've gotten my friends killed and they've gotten me killed plenty of times, but thats usually because we always back each other up even if it means dying. 

Edited August 24, 2018 by Legioneod

[CountZero]

4 minutes ago, Legioneod said:

Flying with a wingman is both easier and harder. It's hard because you have to keep an eye on your wingman and stick with him, at the same time you can watch each others backs and help each other in times of need.

 

I find I get more kills flying solo, but I usually stay alive longer with a wingman. A wingman can get you killed so be careful on who you fly with, I've gotten my friends killed and they've gotten me killed plenty of times, but thats usually because we always back each other up even if it means dying. 

 

good points i see it same way, and with time you learn that when your wingman makes mistake its better just to leve him get shoot down and run away to save your skin, atlast thats how i do it all time ?

[=X51=VC_]

This has been an excellent thread, I've been absorbing good advice as the A-3 is a plane I own and in principle enjoy, but don't take out as often as I'd like and am always looking to improve with. I think generally I'm too easily dragged into dogfights which is very bad for this plane. Having said that, I did get away the other day with some fairly aggressive repeat attacks on a La-5, keeping him off-balance until eventually enough shells connected.

 

One thing you need to get very good at with this plane is deflection shooting and the turn-cutting technique where you turn in low, then level out and pull up, firing as they cross your sights. This is because forward visibility is bad generally, and over the nose visibility is basically non-existent, so just following a turn and pulling lead leaves you firing blind.

[[CPT]Crunch]

One tactical maneuver it can do very well, at low level high speed, pitch up slightly a few degrees, roll inverted let gravity start dropping the nose and start pulling.  When your nose starts pointing toward the ground, chop throttle a bit and combat flap and really pull.  As your nose passes back safely above the ground, slap in full throttle and raise flap.  Whatever was following you either slams into the dirt trying to follow, or gets a belly and snout full of lead.

 

You'll have to figure out through trial and error your minimum safe altitude to work it.

[MasserME262]

26 minutes ago, [CPT]Crunch said:

One tactical maneuver it can do very well, at low level high speed, pitch up slightly a few degrees, roll inverted let gravity start dropping the nose and start pulling.  When your nose starts pointing toward the ground, chop throttle a bit and combat flap and really pull.  As your nose passes back safely above the ground, slap in full throttle and raise flap.  Whatever was following you either slams into the dirt trying to follow, or gets a belly and snout full of lead.

 

You'll have to figure out through trial and error your minimum safe altitude to work it.

my [edited] capability of understanding english doesnt allow me to understand well. A video would be really appreciated.

[Guest deleted@134347]

1 hour ago, ME-BFMasserME262 said:

my [edited] capability of understanding english doesnt allow me to understand well. A video would be really appreciated.

 

 

Edited August 24, 2018 by moosya

[MasserME262]

17 minutes ago, moosya said:

 

 

lol what a master, thanks man, got it!

[-TBC-AeroAce]

21 hours ago, moosya said:

 

 

 

It is funny how the plane pics get better as the sequence goes on. As for that move with a 190 HELL NO.

Edited August 25, 2018 by AeroAce

[Dr_Molem]

21 minutes ago, AeroAce said:

 

It is funny how the plane pics get better as the sequence goes on. As for that move with a 190 HELL NO.

 

Tbh it's a maneuver that often allows you to reengage.

[Willy__]

Against decent pilots that maneuver will get you at most a headon situation, which is not good for any of the parties, btw.

[Guest deleted@134347]

1 hour ago, Dr_Molem said:

 

Tbh it's a maneuver that often allows you to reengage.

 

yup, I think that's the idea.. I guess on TAW if you're being chased by a la5 fn and he's slowly gaining on you then you can face the guy and play chicken...