BOO Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 Hello, these been quite some wailing and gnashing of teeth recently over the revoking of keys. 777 have acted quickly and fairly. Whilst some posters seemed to be in denial that they had anything to do with the situation they found themselves in, others were much more circumspect. Reponses from the community were equally varied. Its was, quote correctly pointed out in a now locked thread (no reason given for the locking and no reason I could see for locking it) that, going forward, education about the grey market is key. Not only would this help inform potential newcomers and help them to void issue down the line, but it would also restrict the avenues of excuses used by those who simple fall into the smart ass bracket. In my limited exposure to the gaming market (sims only in the main) only DCS currently displays any clear warnings. Im sure 777 will do the same but I wonder if we, as an active community couldn't do more to assist and help rather than leaving it solely to the devs. In my job I deal with the criminal side of fraud, scams and money laundering. Ive pointed out elsewhere that the grey market is a ready source of income streams for organised crime so ill not repeat it here. Suffice to say that whilst the devs and the un-informed punter are victims, their loss and suffering is nothing compared to the ultimate damage done by the vast river of hurt all those little income steams feed directly and indirectly into. Anyhow - my thoughts A single page locked thread be created that succinctly summarises and points out the risks of the Grey Market. The community pool it talents to create an eye catching graphic that links to this page for each community member to download and put in their sig Posters of you tube videos could also put link on their videos to the page The main on line reviewers/video tutorial posters could link to that page in their work The same you tubers produce a 30 sec video about the grey market Most of this stuff is a one time thing that them just sits there requiring little ongoing effort on anyone's part. Whilst it wont cover all bases it could highlight the issue more widely and more noticeably than just a message on a store page that wont be visited until after the initial grey market purchase. Just thoughts. 1 1 1
[PFR]Sarpalaxan Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 They are not Short Videos but you could definitivley link to some of Jim Sterling's Videos.
Velxra Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 (edited) I don't understand the hesitation of people wanting to do something like this. I think it's a great idea and something 1C and 777 should most definitely take part in creating. Edited July 23, 2018 by Geronimo553
unreasonable Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 No! Jason has made his decision, a statesmanlike and merciful one IMHO, I would have sent out death squads. Now that he is even more aware of how this issue can bite not only his P&L but also his PR, he will come up with a workable policy to deal with it. Users trying to help are just likely to stir things up and make things worse. If you want to help the team, buy the product legit and tell your friends to do likewise. Leave the rest to Jason.
Mughug Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 Suggestion: Where one enters a key in the 'Key Activation' section of their account why not update the 'Enter the key (For keys purchased through Steam or other Digital Retailers)' message to make it clear what retailers are authorized and keys from other sources can/will be revoked?
BOO Posted July 24, 2018 Author Posted July 24, 2018 20 hours ago, unreasonable said: No! Jason has made his decision, a statesmanlike and merciful one IMHO, I would have sent out death squads. Now that he is even more aware of how this issue can bite not only his P&L but also his PR, he will come up with a workable policy to deal with it. Users trying to help are just likely to stir things up and make things worse. If you want to help the team, buy the product legit and tell your friends to do likewise. Leave the rest to Jason. Totally respect your opinion Unreasonable. It was just a thought. My intentions were as much about highlighting the wider damage grey markets support than just the gaming sector and the damage to smaller devs and perhaps let the community take some role in assisting 777 and JW in their efforts (support not substitution). Telling your friends is good but many people wont get to interact with anyhow else in this community until they've made a purchase and not everyone will go to the official sources before buying the game. Many will never interact. You Tube, forums and 3rd party review site are as much likely to be the source of information than the store page. That said, I absolutely agree that nothing should be done half cocked. Something like this should be done with the involvement and permission of 777 and JW. Its the only way it could effectively link in and support their official efforts. Without that leadership and control I completely agree that it could become a negative thing. As for users trying to help. I'll take that too but it seems that its more often those slagging off peoples mistakes, name calling and calling for hell fire that are doing the damage. I don't see how a pretty benign, non judgmental, factual approach to education spread wider would hurt anything. That's why I suggested a locked thread. One where people cant white knight, take moral high grounds or debate (either side of the argument). Thanks for reading and contributing. Regards BOO 1 1
DetCord12B Posted July 24, 2018 Posted July 24, 2018 Quote Could the Community do something to highlight the problems with the Grey Markets? No. Grey markets exist and will continue to do so. Piracy has been around since the first program showed up on a floppy disk. The only difference is that these sites make it seem legit. It's typically, the vast majority of the time that is, rampant piracy. It's key gens and rips and pilferage and OltG/info collation. G2A exists. CDKeys exists. ARD exists. They all do, and there is nothing you or I can do to stop the practice.
BOO Posted July 24, 2018 Author Posted July 24, 2018 23 minutes ago, DetCord12B said: No. Grey markets exist and will continue to do so. Piracy has been around since the first program showed up on a floppy disk. The only difference is that these sites make it seem legit. It's typically, the vast majority of the time that is, rampant piracy. It's key gens and rips and pilferage and OltG/info collation. G2A exists. CDKeys exists. ARD exists. They all do, and there is nothing you or I can do to stop the practice. I still don't see how highlighting this fact hurts in any way. Its hardly a huge effort. Burglary has also existed since the dawn of time. So has scamming. Should I not bother going to work today and sack off telling people how to reduce the risks to them? 1 1
bigmike20vt Posted July 24, 2018 Posted July 24, 2018 Hi 1st off massive respect to the devs for replacing keys which they never intended to go out anyway. I will raise my hands I bought one from what I now know was a dodgy site. I wont do this again and any future purchases i will go direct from the devs... The reason I bought it however was that I was convinced at the legitimacy of ..... I wont name them here incase it breaks the rules ...... but of the site because A place I visit very regularly and IS considered a legitimate AV forum has started advertising them. imo part of the blame has to go to so called "respected" forums advertising these dodgy companies. Of course since my purchase threads have been created about this site, and deactivated keys, but AVforums still use them as an advertising revenue stream. I consider myself educated now, however so long as these sellers continue to get advertising space on legitimate sites then the problem will not be solved :( 1
Jason_Williams Posted July 24, 2018 Posted July 24, 2018 Guys, Please. I don’t like discussions on this topic in the forum. Let us handle it please. I realize you are trying to help, but it just eventually devolves into arguments. Please let’s just keep talking about the actual product. Thanks. Jason 1 1
Velxra Posted July 24, 2018 Posted July 24, 2018 (edited) Yes, because having open discussions during stress and tensions between opposed parties has never provided discernment or eased tension. It worked great for the British! Until the American revolution, which stemmed directly from limited communications between the two lands. Edited July 24, 2018 by Geronimo553
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