Repainting aircraft in WW2

[dkoor]

 

Were there any particular techniques or chemicals that were used when aircraft was being repainted?

For instance it comes with some normal camo then it needs to be repainted in order to apply winter white...

Did they take care about removing old paint, how they did that etc. ?

[Rjel]

I've watched a documentary that featured Bud Anderson telling how his ground crew used 100 octane avgas to remove the camo from his P-51. This after Anderson made an offhand comment to his crew after a mission about seeing some snow on the continent. He had tears in his eyes saying they had been up all night getting it removed before his mission the next day. Their hands were raw from the gas. Pretty amazing story. 

[AndyJWest]

As far as the Luftwaffe and VVS goes, I think the winter white was usually applied over the existing camo. From photo's it seems not to be very hard-wearing paint, which may have helped get it off again. 

 

 

[dkoor]

Paint on paint... bet those airframes haven't been really hot after couple of seasons... depending on layer thickness, but I bet it added quite bit of weight and distorted clean aerodynamic lines too...

[Trooper117]

Most aircraft never had a 'long life' I suspect... shot down, RTB shot up and then scrapped and used for spares. Crashed in enemy territory or simply never found etc, etc...

[senseispcc]

Most nation applied the first camo at the factories with paint pistols (air driven) then at the front most nations did use brushes but those far from the front used also compressed air to paint all layers. Winter camo included. the USA where a special case because at a certain date they decided that all combat planes should be painted "silver" but many squadrons did remove this silver paint to win some weight and so also some speed. 

But Always paint ws stripe before another coat was painted over, only the winter paint was a axception, but never forget that 10 kilograms of paint on a 3ton plane is of not much importance.

[-TBC-AeroAce]

I have a book with lots of picture of people painting the white and black invasion lines and boy they were often very messy and not straight at all. It would make any good scale modeler cry.

[Finkeren]

On 6/10/2018 at 5:26 PM, dkoor said:

Paint on paint... bet those airframes haven't been really hot after couple of seasons... depending on layer thickness, but I bet it added quite bit of weight and distorted clean aerodynamic lines too...

 

Very few airframes would have seen active  duty beyond the first couple of seasons. Turnover was extreme in squadrons going into combat, and that goes for every air force. 

 

I once did a calculation for the Bf 109 based on production numbers and the number of available aircraft at any given point during the war and reached the conclusion, that the average Bf 109 lasted 6 weeks in active duty before it was either shot down, otherwise destroyed, scrapped or pulled back for a complete overhaul. 

 

There were exceptions of course. A famous example being Galchenko’s pre-war LaGG-3 series 2, which he flew in combat continously for almost 2 years, during which time the aircraft was repainted and refitted numerous times, eventually losing every trace of its original markings and left only his teademark cat-and-mouse insignia. In this case the new layers of paint were simply slapped on top of the existing ones.

 

[dkoor]

2 hours ago, Finkeren said:

 

Very few airframes would have seen active  duty beyond the first couple of seasons. Turnover was extreme in squadrons going into combat, and that goes for every air force. 

 

I once did a calculation for the Bf 109 based on production numbers and the number of available aircraft at any given point during the war and reached the conclusion, that the average Bf 109 lasted 6 weeks in active duty before it was either shot down, otherwise destroyed, scrapped or pulled back for a complete overhaul. 

 

There were exceptions of course. A famous example being Galchenko’s pre-war LaGG-3 series 2, which he flew in combat continously for almost 2 years, during which time the aircraft was repainted and refitted numerous times, eventually losing every trace of its original markings and left only his teademark cat-and-mouse insignia. In this case the new layers of paint were simply slapped on top of the existing ones.

 

Hehe I remember that LaGG-3 from the old Sturmo... also have LaGG & LA aces of WW2 book where that aircraft is featured.

 

Anyhow I didn't think that combat aircraft lasted much on the frontlines, but I figured if it lasted several months it could have been painted once and repainted at least 2 times if those months included 2 season changes... 6 weeks of active duty is just insanely low life duration...

[Trooper117]

Silver paint?... er, no...

[Wolfram-Harms]

I thought the US aircraft were later just left unpainted, polished aluminium?

 

As for the Luftwaffe: they also did airbrush/spray painting on their airfields.

They had hand-pulled mobile compressors with 2 metal wheels for that purpose.

Still searching for a picture...

 

 

 

Edited June 11, 2018 by Wolfram-Harms

[Rjel]

 

The seams on the P-51 wings were puttied then painted over with a silver paint. I doubt that was maintained in the the field.

[Gambit21]

8th Air Force crews were nothing if not meticulous, but I’m not sure about that one Rjel.

 

Some of the wing panels were left natural aluminum too. I have a drawing showing which ones.

[Rjel]

7 minutes ago, Gambit21 said:

8th Air Force crews were nothing if not meticulous, but I’m not sure about that one Rjel.

 

Some of the wing panels were left natural aluminum too. I have a drawing showing which ones.

I absolutely agree. But looking at a lot of pictures of P-51s in the ETO, most of those in NMF don't appear to be painted silver, at least to me.

[Gambit21]

The difference would be subtle once weathered a bit, especially in a black and white photo. Also for all I know it wasn’t maintained as you say.

[Feathered_IV]

I recall reading that the Luftwaffe received water soluble paint for winter which would be applied directly over the existing scheme.  It wore off quite fast.

 

US aircraft like the P-51 were natural metal on the fuselage, but contrary to popular belief had the wings puttied and sanded smooth then sealed with a silver paint.  An exception were early models of p-51 which arrived in olive drab and were stripped down in the field.  These had the rivets and seams visible.

 

Then there's the Japanese.  It's interesting to note how very careful they were to avoid getting field applied paint on their control surfaces in case it effected the aircraft's handling.

[Tyberan]

1 hour ago, Feathered_IV said:

I recall reading that the Luftwaffe received water soluble paint for winter which would be applied directly over the existing scheme.  It wore off quite fast.

 

US aircraft like the P-51 were natural metal on the fuselage, but contrary to popular belief had the wings puttied and sanded smooth then sealed with a silver paint.  An exception were early models of p-51 which arrived in olive drab and were stripped down in the field.  These had the rivets and seams visible.

 

Then there's the Japanese.  It's interesting to note how very careful they were to avoid getting field applied paint on their control surfaces in case it effected the aircraft's handling.

 

3sqn raaf had P51’s in Europe, the first to get the k model I think. Anyway if anyone is interested there is great article on their paint schemes  here

 

http://www.3squadron.org.au/subpages/Mustangs/3 Sqn P-51K P5.htm

 

To confirm Feathered  first paragraph of page 5 mentions the silver painted wings and unpainted fuse and tails. 

Edited June 12, 2018 by Tyberan

[LLv34_Temuri]

On 6/10/2018 at 5:02 PM, dkoor said:

 

Were there any particular techniques or chemicals that were used when aircraft was being repainted?

"Just slap some paint over it" seems to have been the technique for repainting this lend lease Airacobra: