P-51D Interesting characteristic

[TexasWarbird]

With the endless amounts of meticulous details implemented in IL2 BOX. <--(That description still far understated). I came across an interesting P-51 characteristic while listening to a suggested video at work today. Now mind - I'm no P-51 expert, I've never flown one, let alone been in one. But apparently the gun ports start to whistle when the air frame is put under certain conditions. 

Mentioned in the video the ports whistle when
1.) The start of a loop with high air speed.
2.) High angle of attack @ low speeds.

I noticed the sound team did great work with the recent releases and with the P-51D soon to hit the drawing boards. I'm wondering if this badass feature is one that's being looked at to be added. 

Is it even possible? (Source video in spoiler - Sample sound below)

Spoiler

 

 

 

Edited June 4, 2018 by TexasWarbird

[[N.O.G.F]_Cathal_Brugha]

17 minutes ago, TexasWarbird said:

while listening to a suggested video at work today.

 

Workin' hard or hardly workin'!

 

Seriously, though, that would be nice to have.

 

[-SF-Disarray]

That is an interesting sound, for sure. Kind of haunting. I wonder if other planes with guns similarly situated in the wings make that sound? Like the P-40 and so on.

 

The sound makes sense though. It's like blowing across the top of an open bottle I imagine.

[-TBC-AeroAce]

The 109 external sound is done well but to me, the spit merlin sounds nothing like the real thing. So it might be a bit hit or miss whether they get it right. 

[Danziger]

I thought Hellcats and Corsairs did the same thing?

[TexasWarbird]

14 minutes ago, BorysVorobyov said:

I thought Hellcats and Corsairs did the same thing?

That it did, I'm wondering how difficult it'd be to add something in like this. (Factoring in the conditions needed to trigger that sound). No other simulators I know have covered this sound in detail. I'm worried it'll be to difficult to model. With how unique and badass it is. ? Though it'd be a shame not to try! Begs the question. Is it even possible?

Spoiler

 

 

Edited June 4, 2018 by TexasWarbird

[-SF-Disarray]

I'd imagine if it is reliably predictable it can be modeled in game. I would think it would be a simple "if/than" affair. Getting clean audio of that sound alone may be tricky.

[Diggun]

Shouldn't be that hard. From the office at least it would be a constant tone- and all your gun barrels are the same length so it would be 6 tones at the same pitch. Resonant frequency innit. The reason it sounds all jazzy from the outside is due to doppler effect, but the devs seem to have that kind of thing sorted - witness the p39's prop shaft whine... 

[TexasWarbird]

1 hour ago, Disarray said:

I'd imagine if it is reliably predictable it can be modeled in game. I would think it would be a simple "if/than" affair. Getting clean audio of that sound alone may be tricky.

If added on-top of the already excellent modeling done, this detail in my opinion would sure excel this aircraft model firmly and far above it's competitors.
 

Spoiler

-Lookin at you DCS ?, Which we've already done far better when it came to the Spitfire IXe and the BF109

 

Edited June 4, 2018 by TexasWarbird

[DD_fruitbat]

Regarding the 51 whine, its my favourite sound at airshows, that and griffons (3rd was the i can only describe as agricultural sounding i16, a few years back ). 

 

Looking forward to hearing them both again at legends next month.

 

A few years ago the horseman performed at legends in their mustangs, 3 of them pulling high g in formation is a sound to behold.

Edited June 4, 2018 by DD_fruitbat

[dkoor]

7 minutes ago, DD_fruitbat said:

Regarding the 51 whine,

Hands down, I most likely win at that one;

 

Nothing quite like black humour from the old days...

Edited June 4, 2018 by dkoor

[Art-J]

DCS Mustang has it, and that's not an exceptionally sophisticated sim in the sound engine department, so emulating such an effect is not a rocket science and should be possible in BoX too. But, as AeroAce pointed out, sounds in BoX are a hit&miss affair so we can expect anything.

 

P. S. - IIRC, it were the oil radiators that did the similar sound on Corsair.

[Jade_Monkey]

3 hours ago, 19//Rekt said:

 

I know that Wildcats do

 

 

 

What an ugly bastard. The whole thing, but especially the landing gear.

 

Interestingly i find the P47 absolutely stunning although i recognize there are some visual similarities between the two.

[ShamrockOneFive]

It's certainly a unique sound feature. It doesn't happen every time a Mustang does a flypast, however, as I've seen dozens of flypasts and heard it only once or twice. If they do it, I would hope that its based on whatever causes this effect so as not to be constant but always to be cool

[HBPencil]

4 hours ago, TexasWarbird said:

while listening to a suggested video at work today

 

 

I do the same while at work, I have my headphones on and youtube running in the background and I sometimes listen to either warbird vids (Griffon sounds the best imo) or Group B rally cars (Audi Quattro sounds effing awesome).

Some good examples of aircraft having a whine/whistle are a MkI Spit with the 'periscope' style of mirror and the CAC Boomerang whose cannons act like flutes.

[TexasWarbird]

5 hours ago, TexasWarbird said:

Factoring in the conditions needed to trigger that sound

 

1 hour ago, ShamrockOneFive said:

It's certainly a unique sound feature. It doesn't happen every time a Mustang does a flypast, however, as I've seen dozens of flypasts and heard it only once or twice. If they do it, I would hope that its based on whatever causes this effect so as not to be constant but always to be cool

That is true, I hope that it is triggered with the closest replication as possible - Including the conditions needed to cause that sound. I don't fully understand the conditions, I just hope it is not so difficult that it's cut out.  Even if it is, I'd can understand - I can't imagine it'd be easy. Although I'm not hard to please, I'd like to believe any attempt the devs makes at it would come out great.

Edited June 5, 2018 by TexasWarbird

[Lemon]

very similar sound from 2 other very different devices  lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ZU95a3eLP8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bID5QB74Vjk

 

[-LUCKY-ThanksSkeletor]

4 hours ago, Jade_Monkey said:

 

What an ugly bastard. The whole thing, but especially the landing gear.

 

Interestingly i find the P47 absolutely stunning although i recognize there are some visual similarities between the two.

 

How dare you...the ugly is why i love her 

[Gambit21]

7 hours ago, BorysVorobyov said:

I thought Hellcats and Corsairs did the same thing?

 

Yep

[Field-Ops]

The corsair was named the whistling death by the Japanese for the same audio effect.

[69th_chuter]

The inboard guns are recessed slightly and use a thin-walled blast tube that protrudes about 5/16th of an inch from the wing which would likely be the source of this noise.

 

And there's no evidence anyone but the Vought PR department called the Corsair "Whistling Death". 

[7.GShAP/Silas]

2 hours ago, Field-Ops said:

The corsair was named the whistling death by the Japanese for the same audio effect.

 

I thought this was a myth dreamt up by the Americans.

[Field-Ops]

16 minutes ago, 7.GShAP/Silas said:

 

I thought this was a myth dreamt up by the Americans.

Perhaps but it sounded cool.

 

Either way, Corsair does it too.

[Tyberan]

I think its the gun ports. The CAC-13 boomerang does the same thing as the gun ports site slightly higher on the leading edge. 

 

CAC-13 boomerang with whistle

 

 

1:26 has the whistle. 

 

 

Also the recent P-51 crash in england the pilot mentions that at a certain AoA and speed the guns will whistle preempting a stall. 

Edited June 5, 2018 by Tyberan

[D3adCZE]

That P51 whistle sounds alot like a R2D2.

[Cpt_Cool]

19 hours ago, HBPencil said:

Group B rally cars

 

Group B was insane

[TexasWarbird]

12 hours ago, Tyberan said:

I think its the gun ports. The CAC-13 boomerang does the same thing as the gun ports site slightly higher on the leading edge. 

After taking a look at some more air show videos, I have to agree. Also I think the reason it's more prominent on some P-51's versus others at air shows - has to do with if they're actually carrying real 50 .cal's, or phony place holders.

Edited June 5, 2018 by TexasWarbird

[Gambit21]

14 hours ago, chuter said:

The inboard guns are recessed slightly and use a thin-walled blast tube that protrudes about 5/16th of an inch from the wing which would likely be the source of this noise.

 

And there's no evidence anyone but the Vought PR department called the Corsair "Whistling Death". 

 

Hellcat makes the same noise.

[TexasWarbird]

Another piece of information I found,was that this sound was also attempted to be simulated with A2A for FSX. (Unmodded) 

 

[Gambit21]

I found the sound from the Hellcat a bit more subtle, but it could be because that Mustang in the video is flying faster, and making a higher G turn than the Hellcats are permitted to do where I go to watch them.

[[CPT]Crunch]

Japanese referred to Corsairs as, "Sikorsky's". 

[novicebutdeadly]

On 6/5/2018 at 7:19 AM, dkoor said:

Hands down, I most likely win at that one;

 

Nothing quite like black humour from the old days...

Shouldn't there be a swooping Peregrine falcon (bf109) in this image to complete the picture???

[bzc3lk]

On 6/5/2018 at 3:40 AM, Disarray said:

That is an interesting sound, for sure. Kind of haunting. I wonder if other planes with guns similarly situated in the wings make that sound? Like the P-40 and so on. 

 

 

 

 

[[DBS]Browning]

My understanding was that this is caused by empty gun recesses and does not happen when guns are installed. 

Does anyone know better?

[=621=Samikatz]

6 hours ago, bzc3lk said:

 

 

 

If we ever get a South East Asian battle the Boomerang would make a lovely collector's aircraft

[RedKestrel]

9 hours ago, novicebutdeadly said:

Shouldn't there be a swooping Peregrine falcon (bf109) in this image to complete the picture???

The 109 is 7000m above, waiting...

[Gambit21]

2 hours ago, Browning29th said:

My understanding was that this is caused by empty gun recesses and does not happen when guns are installed. 

Does anyone know better?

 

The Hellcat whistles with guns installed.

[-TBC-AeroAce]

3 hours ago, Browning29th said:

My understanding was that this is caused by empty gun recesses and does not happen when guns are installed. 

Does anyone know better?

 

There is a doc on Netflix called"Plane Resurrection or Restoration" where they said that originally for their Mustang they capped of the gun ports to protect the airframe but in flight testing it didn't sound right so the put the mgs back in to correct it.

Edited June 6, 2018 by AeroAce

[[TWB]Sauerkraut-]

This "gunport" whistle occurs whenever the air flow is at some sort of angle to the gunport (rather than flowing straight into the gunport), such as in High AoA or a sideslip. (Which is why it whistles when he starts the loop).

 

This occurs on many different aircraft, as already mentioned above.

[-TBC-AeroAce]

@itsthatguy

 

As far as I can remember from going to airshows the whistle is there constantly but i might be wrong. The air flow will not be straight into the ports even when straight and level as the fuselage and wing will be curling the airflow presenting it at a slight angle to test ports. Of course the effect will magnify when at a actual slip angle.