La5 vs 5FN ??

[MigSu]

 Hello 

 What is all the advantages of the FN vs regular La5 just speed and what else? Because from the 1rst time try the La5FM immediately i noticed the difference in the FM and yes the regular  La5 is much more agile at least in pitching, it feels lighter and more nimble than the mighty FN.

 So i ask to my self, what is the real advantage i have? i mean here i now in real life there were no doubt about.   

 

 Any coment about guys?

 Thanks, Regards

Edited June 3, 2018 by MigSu

[[TWB]Sauerkraut-]

Well, there is the obvious redesigned cockpit w/ substantially visibility, which I'm assuming is the reason for the different flight characteristics, as I don't think there are that many other differences in the air frame.

[Ehret]

The FN has much stronger nominal power and longer (10m!) powerful boost. It is not just for speed - climb and acceleration are superb, too. Besides, backward visibility is much improved which was a weak point of previous versions. I think the FN frame itself is a little more robust - I could go faster in dives even if for a minute amount. The rest is about the same... at least in my subjective experience.

 

The thing is the FN performs on the level footing with opposition and you don't have to count every second of remaining boost just to stay alive.

Edited June 3, 2018 by Ehret

[ShamrockOneFive]

Faster speed, faster climb, better turn rate, better visibility to the rear, and lower weight. It's all around better than the La-5 Series 8. Of course that's because it starts to appear on the frontlines over a year after

[MigSu]

And what about the weight? 

9 minutes ago, ShamrockOneFive said:

Faster speed, faster climb, better turn rate, better visibility to the rear, and lower weight. It's all around better than the La-5 Series 8. Of course that's because it starts to appear on the frontlines over a year after

Exactly , why it is feels lighter the regular Serie 8??

Edited June 3, 2018 by MigSu

[RavN_Alienzo]

FN spins like a cat in a washing machinne. He's also faster than previous version. 

[ShamrockOneFive]

4 minutes ago, MigSu said:

And what about the weight? 

Exactly , why it is feels lighter than regular one??

 

Are you saying the La-5 feels lighter than the La-5FN? Because the FN is slightly lighter by over 50kg while also adding power.

 

La-5 Series 8

Standard weight: 3353 kg

Maximum takeoff weight: 3593 kg

 

La-5FN Series 2

Standard weight: 3305 kg

Maximum takeoff weight: 3544 kg

[MigSu]

4 minutes ago, ShamrockOneFive said:

 

Are you saying the La-5 feels lighter than the La-5FN? Because the FN is slightly lighter by over 50kg while also adding power.

 

La-5 Series 8

Standard weight: 3353 kg

Maximum takeoff weight: 3593 kg

 

La-5FN Series 2

Standard weight: 3305 kg

Maximum takeoff weight: 3544 kg

Yes, sorry correct my mistake.

 

 My point is that, why (La-5 Series8 )  feels lighter than (La5FN)
 

Edited June 3, 2018 by MigSu

[Ehret]

51 minutes ago, MigSu said:

 My point is that, why (La-5 Series8 )  feels lighter than (La5FN)

 

The FN lost the pilot controllable aileron trim so maybe that's why?

 

 

[Bilbo_Baggins]

4 hours ago, MigSu said:

And what about the weight? 

Exactly , why it is feels lighter the regular Serie 8??

 

La5FN is the fastest rolling airframe in the game throughout the whole speed spectrum. The ailerons are almost too good to be true.

 

Elevator behavior is slightly differenct- this is probably what you are feeling. However, the machine is better in all facets of performance, not to mention excellent rear view visibility.

Edited June 3, 2018 by Mcdaddy

[HR_Zunzun]

6 hours ago, MigSu said:

 Hello 

 What is all the advantages of the FN vs regular La5 just speed and what else? Because from the 1rst time try the La5FM immediately i noticed the difference in the FM and yes the regular  La5 is much more agile at least in pitching, it feels lighter and more nimble than the mighty FN.

 So i ask to my self, what is the real advantage i have? i mean here i now in real life there were no doubt about.   

 

 Any coment about guys?

 Thanks, Regards

 

I got the same impression. FN pitch authority is probably the worst of the available fighters.

Regular la5 has a good pitch authority that can be put to good use in slicing attacks. Although it loose its edge when the speed drops. Still, I feel more confident in mixing up with the la5 compared to the fn.

FN is a tremendous performer but I suspect is mainly due to the huge difference in available power compared to its current opposition. Once confronted with a more modern foe (let's say a g14)I suspect it will have a much more difficult experience.

It is bit striking the difference in elevator behavior between the two different la5as, as far as I know no remarkable change was done in that system.

In the fn is extremely difficult to black out above 400kph. Above 500kph is almost impossible.

The increased roll rate, in my opinion, only make it worse. It is very unbalanced If bounced, you may find yourself spinning madly without really getting out of the way.

In 1vs1 the fn is restricted to just hit and run tactics but, as I said before, the current edge in available power is so big with the 43 planeset that one can be very successful with it.

 

[CrazyDuck]

7 hours ago, MigSu said:

Because from the 1rst time try the La5FM immediately i noticed the difference in the FM and yes the regular  La5 is much more agile at least in pitching, it feels lighter and more nimble than the mighty FN.

 

This really shouldn't be the case. The two planes are very close aerodynamically (same mass and mass distribution - if we overlook the negligible difference in mass of the engines, different cockpit design and metal wing spars instead of wooden), so both should behave virtually identically at the same engine power output.

 

Roll rate was influenced by improved angles of aileron deflection (not symmetrical up/down as on La-5 and 5F anymore), so it's not surprising we see a difference/improvement there. 

[seafireliv]

How something `feels` is often very different to what`s actually happening.

[MigSu]

3 hours ago, seafireliv said:

How something `feels` is often very different to what`s actually happening.

i'd love to be wrong about it.

5 hours ago, HR_Zunzun said:

 

I got the same impression. FN pitch authority is probably the worst of the available fighters.

Regular la5 has a good pitch authority that can be put to good use in slicing attacks. Although it loose its edge when the speed drops. Still, I feel more confident in mixing up with the la5 compared to the fn.

Exactly, is in some cases impossible to face some new fighters in close/fast situation like frontal when the enemy is crossing under me, something i used to do with the Regular La5, but ok tried with another plane like P40 (just for example) and yes aggressive Pitching down is better than FN.

 

[VesseL]

I  feel the same, La-5 .8 is better turner than FN.

 

ed. Yes its funny coz i dont understand why. And only my feelings, Im not saying la5 8 is better it just feel that way.

Edited June 3, 2018 by VesseL

[ShamrockOneFive]

It's not...Even if you do feel that way

[VesseL]

But i could beat the FN in turnfight  with the 8 right now, if I could clone myself.

[Ehret]

9 hours ago, HR_Zunzun said:

FN is a tremendous performer but I suspect is mainly due to the huge difference in available power compared to its current opposition. Once confronted with a more modern foe (let's say a g14)I suspect it will have a much more difficult experience.

 

Not if the driver in the FN is patient - just wait +10m when both planes will run out of the boost time. Then the G14 will be toast, because the FN has much more performance when on continuous power.

 

 

[HandyNasty]

1 hour ago, Ehret said:

 

Not if the driver in the FN is patient - just wait +10m when both planes will run out of the boost time. Then the G14 will be toast, because the FN has much more performance when on continuous power.

You think a dogfight (aka close quarter fight) lasts 10 minutes?

If it is a more prolonged fight with disengagements, what makes you think both the FN and G14 would boost continuously ?

 

[Ehret]

31 minutes ago, =FSB=HandyNasty said:

You think a dogfight (aka close quarter fight) lasts 10 minutes?

If it is a more prolonged fight with disengagements, what makes you think both the FN and G14 would boost continuously ?

 

To gain a favorable position - if you will not boost in the G14 will get screwed and fast. Then we have chases and those can last minutes, easily.

[purK]

The La5 Series 8/F will turn better than the FN above 400km/h - Only if the FN pilot isn't using positive elevator trim. ?

[HR_Zunzun]

3 hours ago, Krupinskii said:

The La5 Series 8/F will turn better than the FN above 400km/h - Only if the FN pilot isn't using positive elevator trim. ?

Well you have to use positive trim heavily to match the s8 and that makes aiming very difficult appart from the fact that you loose all you pitch negative ability (for manoeuvring and aiming).

It is very simple to prove. In quick mission dive from 3000-4000m with idle engine. Once you get 600kph apply full elevator and see the difference. The s8 will black out while the fn won´t (same trim for both).

I do not know which one is correct. Maybe both, but is surprising such difference unless there was a big change in elevator design. Also why they wanted to make it worst (at least in the sim).

[MigSu]

1 hour ago, HR_Zunzun said:

Also why they wanted to make it worst (at least in the sim).

I am thinking that option (for some balancing (remember the reaction after the announce of that plane), because why would that plane be designed like that? that is the reason why i just opened this topic.

Edited June 4, 2018 by MigSu

[-TBC-AeroAce]

Why do you guys keep referring to the spit as La. There is only one fighter.

[seafireliv]

Looking forward to the LA5fn,,, eventually.

[senseispcc]

The La5-FN is a beast. A great interceptor. It does have big guns, a lot of power in his engines, acrobatics are no problems for this aircrafts, I find it very resistant to ennemy hits, the visibility of the pilot is very good, it keep it Energy very well.

Now what I find not so good, it is not easy to use in strafing missions (I tend to hit the ground with it), the amound of ammo is a little to little or not enough ammo.

Yes, not perfect but great! 

For the moment the best interceptor in the game. 

[Blackhawk_FR]

Your "feelings" are right. 

FN does have an heavier elevator than s8, especially at high speed.

 

Even at low-speed dogfight, it's way easier (to me) to fight a FN with 109.

[ShamrockOneFive]

20 hours ago, MigSu said:

I am thinking that option (for some balancing (remember the reaction after the announce of that plane), because why would that plane be designed like that? that is the reason why i just opened this topic.

 

This is a sim. They don't do balancing of aircraft stats.

 

Maybe there's a critical difference in the elevator. I don't know. It's interesting to me that its the second IL-2 sim to possibly treat the elevator differently on the La-5/La-5F than on the La-5FN.

[D3adCZE]

On 6/3/2018 at 9:05 PM, Ehret said:

 

Not if the driver in the FN is patient - just wait +10m when both planes will run out of the boost time. Then the G14 will be toast, because the FN has much more performance when on continuous power.

 

 

My experience says otherwise. La5FN slows down much worse than any 109 and with G14's enormous acceleration, forcing an overshoot by using superior slow/medium(below 500kph) tail controls authority is piece of cake, and getting Ivan into the gunsight is truly an easy task.

[Ehret]

6 minutes ago, CSAF-D3adCZE said:

My experience says otherwise. La5FN slows down much worse than any 109 and with G14's enormous acceleration, forcing an overshoot by using superior slow/medium(below 500kph) tail controls authority is piece of cake, and getting Ivan into the gunsight is truly an easy task.

 

I mean situation where both planes (the G14 and the FN) run out of boosts and have to manage only on a nominal, or a combat power at best. Then the difference in performance between them is not trivial.

Edited June 5, 2018 by Ehret

[D3adCZE]

1 minute ago, Ehret said:

 

I mean situation where both planes (the G14 and the FN) run out of boosts and have to manage only on a nominal, or a combat power at best. Then the difference in performance between them is not trivial.

You forget that G14 has 30 minutes of MW50, 3 10 minute long bursts with 5 minute break between them. With proper engine management during the fight, by the time the G14 runs out of the MW50 the La5FN is with overstressed engine on continuous power or a pancake on the ground. Moreover fighting for more than 10 minutes without changing throttle is highly unlikely even by inexperienced pilots standards. That extends the boost time at least twofold. By that time the fight is at alt of 5km where La5FN loses it's power and is an easy target. 

Finally, if you fight 1 opponent for more than 10 minutes, your situational awareness is down to such level, than any incoming bandit can kill you easily, no matter which plane are you flying.

 

In the end, everything boils down to the pilot skill. 

[Ehret]

18 minutes ago, CSAF-D3adCZE said:

Finally, if you fight 1 opponent for more than 10 minutes, your situational awareness is down to such level, than any incoming bandit can kill you easily, no matter which plane are you flying.

 

In the end, everything boils down to the pilot skill. 

 

There other tactic types than short-term high intensity dog-fights. Chases, shallow climbs and dives, circling from some distance trying to gain better position - all depend on the fighter's endurance and don't degrade awareness that much.

Edited June 5, 2018 by Ehret

[D3adCZE]

1 minute ago, Ehret said:

 

There other tactic types than short-term high intensity dog-fights. Chases, shallow climbs and dives, circling from some distance trying to gain better position - all depend on the fighter's endurance and don't degrade awareness that much.

1) See La5FN moving into position to attack

2) Climb to 5km

3) ???

4) Profit

[Ehret]

2 minutes ago, CSAF-D3adCZE said:

1) See La5FN moving into position to attack

2) Climb to 5km

3) ???

4) Profit

 

3) The FN will disengage in shallow dive running on the continuous power. If chased aggressively will drag the G14 to allies and the lower altitude. If still followed then reverse and re-engage on saved boost. If not - reset and start patrolling again.

 

or

 

3) The confident driver of the FN will climb one km higher, where second super-charger gear has peak and try to engage the G14 head on.