What will IL-2 look like a decade from now?

[falle96]

Open thread. Where do you think the sim will be 10 years down the line?

 

With luck, by then we'll have a new generation of IL-2 simulators, but as people still play the original game so many years later, one can only hope that the same will apply here. What do you think the game will look like that far into the future, including possible mods developed as the years tick by.

 

Personally, I'd love a career mode with the longevity of some of the modded dynamic careers from the original sim combined with the day-by-day simulation of the current game (ie, modded maps mixed with the official ones so you can do a grand campaign as, say, a Luftwaffe pilot starting in Spain, 1936 and ending in Berlin, 1945).

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

Would look like VR in 4k @90fps for most people by that time.

 

Once you got a headset, you'll never go back. 

[falle96]

Just now, SCG_Fenris_Wolf said:

Would look like VR in 4k @90fps for most people by that time.

 

Once you got a headset, you'll never go back. 

I am tempted to look into getting a VR headset, but at the same time I wear glasses and I'm not sure if the two mix all too well...

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

Contacts. Or the laser

[falle96]

Oof, I hope not the laser. I've had corrective eye surgery in the past, it wasn't pleasant.

 

I suppose I really should start looking into contacts. I hear they're great once you're used to them, but I think I'm understandably wary about putting something on my eye. I mean, having a VR headset would certainly make it worth it, yeah?

[Lusekofte]

8 minutes ago, SCG_Fenris_Wolf said:

Once you got a headset, you'll never go back. 

 

Sorry mac, not true. I once again tried to jump the VR train, and once again I simply do not see the hype. I simply find a well buildt pit much more immersive. I hope one day VR will live up to its reputation. 

I be happy of it is still around in 10 years

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

Definitely, in regards to VR. But get ones from a real optician, who measures shape size and strength precisely, don't buy cheap online or in the super. I also got eyes lasered last year, now enjoying 20 20 purrfect vision. Even the cats look more furry than before. It's amazing. If I had to pick now I'd even trade my car for it. It's just that good. 

 

@Lusekofte if the settings are not right, it's difficult. If they are, it's great. And there are a million things to set wrong. It's not exactly consumer friendly. 

Edited March 25, 2018 by SCG_Fenris_Wolf

[falle96]

Just now, 216th_LuseKofte said:

Sorry mac, not true. I once again tried to jump the VR train, and once again I simply do not see the hype. I simply find a well buildt pit much more immersive. I hope one day VR will live up to its reputation. 

I be happy of it is still around in 10 years

I'm curious, what does your pit look like?

 

I don't have the money now to even dream of putting something like that together (I'm scraping together funds for a proper HOTAS and TrackIR), but I love seeing what people put together, especially the guys who design true-to-life cockpits.

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

Yea me too. Show it

[Danziger]

In a decade? We will be past WW2 and Korea and be flying Huns, Thuds and Balalaikas in IL*2 Battle over Vietnam.

[falle96]

1 minute ago, BorysVorobyov said:

In a decade? We will be past WW2 and Korea and be flying Huns, Thuds and Balalaikas in IL*2 Battle over Vietnam.

Not gonna lie, flying the F4 has been something I've wanted to do in a sim for a long time.

[Ribbon]

In few years we'll have perfectly polished engine in il2 and running it in VR with 4k per eye locked on 90fps.

All that while flying somewhere over Pacific searching ship convoys and carriers 

[falle96]

Just now, EAF_Ribbon said:

In few years we'll have perfectly polished engine in il2 and running it in VR with 4k per eye locked on 90fps.

All that while flying somewhere over Pacific searching ship convoys and carriers 

Do you wager the PBY Catalina will be the Allied exclusive plane for the first Pacific expansion?

 

Oh, speaking of, there's a mission they could add to career mode should that plane get added - CSAR. Pretty sure the PBY was tasked with that kind of mission in real life.

 

(does Career mode have a recon mission already, or do you think that will get added in time as well?)

[Ribbon]

11 minutes ago, FarflungWanderer said:

Do you wager the PBY Catalina will be the Allied exclusive plane for the first Pacific expansion?

 

Oh, speaking of, there's a mission they could add to career mode should that plane get added - CSAR. Pretty sure the PBY was tasked with that kind of mission in real life.

 

(does Career mode have a recon mission already, or do you think that will get added in time as well?)

Didn't get that far into career but so far there wasn't, there were some pretty active discussions about it so i'm sure it will be implemented eventually.

 

Oh Catalina yes i hope she'll be there, one of the biggest tasks in PTO was find enemy carriers and ship convoys so i see it as crucial plane for that expansion.

Smoking cigar and flying Cathy above vast sea peeking between clouds in hope to spot ship trails

Edited March 26, 2018 by EAF_Ribbon

[=EXPEND=Tripwire]

1 hour ago, FarflungWanderer said:

I am tempted to look into getting a VR headset, but at the same time I wear glasses and I'm not sure if the two mix all too well...

Glasses work perfectly fine in the HTC vive. Slots cut out of the foam to accept frames and an adjustable screen position.

[falle96]

10 minutes ago, =EXPEND=Tripwire said:

Glasses work perfectly fine in the HTC vive. Slots cut out of the foam to accept frames and an adjustable screen position.

Oh, interesting, I'll have to keep that in mind. For now, though, I think TrackIR will do. It's a safe choice, but it works well.

[Legioneod]

Well I'd hope it have all the aircraft of 1946 and more.

 

But these are some of the things I hope to see in 10 years.

 

Updated Visual Damage model (something similar to cliffs of Dover damage visuals. + better smoke and fluid effects. The current fluid effect with rain are excellent now they just need to do that with oil on the canopy. I'd also like to see various smoke/leak sizes and rates instead of just one size of smoke.

 

Updated Engine Damage Model, something thats more dynamic and not so hardset on strict limits, something more fluid and realistic.

 

More Western Europe Expansions, The normandy invasion or sometime in early 1943-44 would be nice that way we have a nice range of aircraft form the time period.

(P-47 Razorback or P-51 B/C anyone?)

 

Increased Visual Range of Aircraft. 

 

Tech to support Heavy Bombers

 

Support for decals on your aircraft without having to have a custom skin (Victory Marks, Squadron Marks, Nose Art, etc.)

 

Not sure what else to add but it would be a dream come true if any of this is added in the future.

 

Edited March 26, 2018 by Legioneod

[1_Robert_]

Landing a Corsair on a carrier in VR with perfect graphics. The waves crashing below you, water splashing on the front screen, LSO waiving the flag on the deck. 

[Rolling_Thunder]

3 hours ago, FarflungWanderer said:

I am tempted to look into getting a VR headset, but at the same time I wear glasses and I'm not sure if the two mix all too well...

I wear reading glasses under my vive, they mix. 

I'm hoping in 10 years every theatre of ww2 will be covered with multiple maps from both devs and the community. That computing power will enable large formations of heavies to bomb the Reich and the battlefields below become a living dynamic environment.

[falle96]

50 minutes ago, Rolling_Thunder said:

I wear reading glasses under my vive, they mix. 

I'm hoping in 10 years every theatre of ww2 will be covered with multiple maps from both devs and the community. That computing power will enable large formations of heavies to bomb the Reich and the battlefields below become a living dynamic environment.

Good info, thanks.

 

Certainly, this gen of sims has more potential than anything in history. I look forward to seeing it realized.

[C130castrum8]

2 hours ago, 1_Robert_ said:

Landing a Corsair on a carrier in VR with perfect graphics. The waves crashing below you, water splashing on the front screen, LSO waiving the flag on the deck. 

Same but in a Zero.

[1_Robert_]

2 hours ago, castrum8 said:

Same but in a Zero.

^This too!

[dburne]

10 hours ago, FarflungWanderer said:

I am tempted to look into getting a VR headset, but at the same time I wear glasses and I'm not sure if the two mix all too well...

 

There are also a couple of companies that do prescription glasses specifically to fit in the VR headsets.

They get some positive press over on the Oculus forums.

 

 

[56RAF_Roblex]

I don't have VR and probably won't be buying it for a few years yet, for financial reasons if nothing else,  but I still think that in 10 years there will be as many people using VR in BoX as currently use TrackIR/Opentrack etc.   ie it will be pretty much compulsory though not everyone will use it in the same way that currently some people still use hat views.

 

Almost everyone with VR will also use haptic gloves to operate the clickable cockpit.

 

There will be a  Pacific planeset of course and probably including Aircraft Carriers.

 

There will be a B17 despite there being no LW alternative.

 

BoX may have taken over Battle Of Britain and North Africa in the same way as it is currently taking over RoF.

 

Tanks and ground warfare may have been improved and become an equal part of the online battles.

 

IJN pilots will be complaining that the Zero was unbeatable in WW2 no matter how badly it was flown yet sometimes they get shot down in the game.  Something needs to be fixed!   :-)

Edited March 26, 2018 by 56RAF_Roblex

[ATA_Vasilij]

11 hours ago, SCG_Fenris_Wolf said:

Would look like VR in 4k @90fps for most people by that time.

 

Once you got a headset, you'll never go back. 

 

- And with extended field of view, that the world around you will be without borders on the sides. Image absolutely smooth and clear.

- 3D world will be already almost like in the reality. 

- PC performance in 10x times higher or more.

 

I guess The IL2 BOS, DCS and other sims, like Xplane, MFS, etc... will all use one 3D world. One joined FM, weather system, etc. And you can join in whatever you wish, you will fly in civil plane to transport people, you will fly in fighter to attack enemy, you will fly in rescue helicopter to safe the injury, .... and everything connected and influenced.

So you will fly with your flight group of Sukhoi Su33 to cover the area against enemies and on the way you will meet Airbus on its regular line from Prague to the London, controled by those pilots who fly now MFS, .... if you tune their frequencies, you will hear live ATC from current Vatsim, etc...

Maps will be separated just by the year of action.

39-45 WW2 and Yaks against BF

2028 PAK FA T50 against F22.... 

 

Of course it will be already a time when you neednt go to the job, because you are getting uncodintional basic income and all your time you can spend depending your wish. 

Some of us fly the virtual Simulator, some of us are working on the real airfields and in hangars we replicate the Yak1b, Lagg3 and fly on real airplanes. There are resources, there are drawings, so just to take people and time to put it together.

 

And all of us will remember the times when people played on their 2d monitors, and you will ask yourself, how could they manage it? Exactly as we ask now how could the people exist without internet few years ago ? :D

[Herne]

[J2_Trupobaw]

Most likely, like this:

 

 

[Lensman]

Errrrrr ...

 

Edited March 26, 2018 by Lensman

[[I./JG62]steppa]

I guess the AI could be very powerfull by then, so maybe the Messercrash comet09 s will be a thing of the past.

 

The beginning of electronic warefare in the nightskies over england and germany; the air filled with countermeasures; inserting myself in bomberstreams, hunting down hundreds of Viermot bombers with my radar operator; powered by water, methanol, Nox and coal with Rheinmetalls finest on my fingertips is were i will spend most of my flight time in il-2 in ten years.

 

Maybe we even get something for a 46´ish scenario. (Would do the same to 177 streams while defending scotland in my spit with more boost than engine)

 

1 hour ago, 3.IAP_Vasilij said:

 you neednt go to the job, because you are getting uncodintional basic income

your word in gods ear! Let the robots do all the work and let us humans enjoy ourselfs on this beautifull world.

[scrapmetal]

12 hours ago, =EXPEND=Tripwire said:

Glasses work perfectly fine in the HTC vive. Slots cut out of the foam to accept frames and an adjustable screen position.

It's even supposed to be easier for glasses with the Vive Pro.

[Wolferl_1791]

14 hours ago, FarflungWanderer said:

I am tempted to look into getting a VR headset, but at the same time I wear glasses and I'm not sure if the two mix all too well...

Why not? I have miopic astigmatism of L -1 and R -0.75. I use glasses all the time. But I don't need them in VR, because you're not actually looking at a distant object, but a very close one. The brain does the rest. However, if I did need glasses, the Vive has notches on the side for normal glasses to go through and plenty of space before the lens, which can be increased by about 1-2 cm more. I used them in the beginning a few times to stop my long eyelashes from touching the Vive lenses and making them dirty.

 

 

 

[falle96]

From what everyone's been saying, the HTC Vive is certainly an attractive option. I'm still not sure if I should take it (at a whopping $500 US) over the TrackIR (a considerable but still cheaper $250 US according to the TrackIR website, the price is now $150 US, but I believe it was once higher for a TrackIR 5. Perhaps there's a sale on..?).

[dburne]

Just now, FarflungWanderer said:

From what everyone's been saying, the HTC Vive is certainly an attractive option. I'm still not sure if I should take it (at a whopping $500 US) over the TrackIR (a considerable but still cheaper $250 US according to the TrackIR website, the price is now $150 US, but I believe it was once higher for a TrackIR 5. Perhaps there's a sale on..?).

 

I would suggest current generation Rift over first generation Vive especially for what we do.

It is cheaper and works quite well with IL-2. It will also likely have a sale beginning around the 28th of this month. ( 2 year anniversary).

If other games that maybe require large room scale setup, Vive would have a little advantage.

[falle96]

1 minute ago, dburne said:

 

I would suggest current generation Rift over first generation Vive especially for what we do.

It is cheaper and works quite well with IL-2. It will also likely have a sale beginning around the 28th of this month. ( 2 year anniversary).

If other games that maybe require large room scale setup, Vive would have a little advantage.

Ah, good to know. I doubt I'd have the money for it either. I wasn't planning on making a purchase until the summer.

[scrapmetal]

We'll have hand and finger tracking, including haptics, for all controls. 16k VR @240fps and infinite contrast ratio (good for those dark nights). Dynamic weather simulation system. Imagine clouds 10 years hence! If we're really lucky, we may even get telemetry for motion platforms.

[Toxin1]

17 hours ago, raaaid said:

well correct me if im wrong:

 

when looking at vr youre looking at screens right in front of your eyes

 

its so close vr devices even use reading lenses

 

so if youre shortsighted what you want is take off your glasses for vr for you see much better that way

With VR headsets, the lenses provide the optics of normal 20/20 vision, so if you need glasses either for nearsighted or farsighted correction, you will need your glasses or contact lenses to see things close or far away in the VR headset as well.

[Lensman]

4 hours ago, dburne said:

 

I would suggest current generation Rift over first generation Vive especially for what we do.

It is cheaper and works quite well with IL-2. It will also likely have a sale beginning around the 28th of this month. ( 2 year anniversary).

If other games that maybe require large room scale setup, Vive would have a little advantage.

 

I agree. Unless you want the extra resolution of the new VIVE (and have the PC to drive it) then for IL-2 the Rift is better because it is FAR more comfortable to wear for extended periods of time.

[variable]

Smell-o-vision.

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

200 people on a server, 4k ground and aircraft textures, 4000 ground objects on a map, fully animated airfields, integrated comms, AI smart enough to fly formation and cover your six and that chick flying in your lap that was so important it made it into some other game.......

[coconut]

The future of IL-2 will be decided by technological development (hardware and software), user base evolution and trends.

 

Technological development

CPUs won't be getting significantly faster. GPUs will, and will also be capable of executing more complex shaders, allowing for e.g. real-time ray-tracing. Integration between CPU and GPU will have improved, i.e. exchange of information between CPU and GPU will be such that maybe they'll be able to share memory. High-resolution VR will be available.

Internet bandwidth will increase, but ping will remain the same. Memory technology is an area when we can look forward to big advances. Some predict that the difference between RAM and static storage will be gone.

 

Trends

There are advances that will be possible in theory, and yet might not see success on the market. Joysticks with force feedback is an example. We used to have those, then they disappeared. Whether they make a come back depends on the evolution of the market. PC gaming will remain threatened by other forms of computing and entertainment. Maybe we'll have portable devices (such as phones, consoles) that are about as powerful as today's PCs, and that will be enough to threaten the PC-on-a-desktop even more than today. On the other hand, PC gaming appears to have made a comeback these last years, so who knows. I think that portable wireless VR may threaten that.

Economical development of Russia will have a major effect on the game's development. I wonder if today's combination of highly-skilled developers and relatively low wages isn't what's keeping this niche alive. Would it be possible to fund development of this game with Western-level salaries? If the quality and cost of living rise, so will the cost of the game's development. Revenues would however also rise, so hopefully things would even out. If things go to hell between the West and Russia, we won't be worrying about the state of the game much, hopefully we won't get to experience that.

 

User base evolution

The current player base will get older, possibly moving on to other forms of enjoyment. I doubt future young generations will keep the same interest for WWII-era flight combat. Those who remain will be the hardcore players, and they will spend most of their time on the forums arguing about details, under- and over-modelling of performance (I'm half-joking on this last part). On the other hand, there is a big potential with the Asian player base, but it's unclear if they can be captured. I'm not sure if the fighting in the air over China around WWII is very popular there. On the other hand Asians seem very open to Western culture, probably more so than Westerners towards Asian history and culture, and maybe adoption is not a problem. Of course Korea and Vietnam could spark interest, but it's not really WWII any more.

 

Effects on IL-2

Visual effects will keep improving. More resolution, both on screen and in VR. I'd expect VR to have gained enough resolution that it might out-compete flat screens. I mean, is there any reason to go (much) beyond 4K? VR should might be achieving similar resolutions by then. And I don't just mean in number of pixels, but in pixels per degree.

Improvement in GPUs capability and integration with CPUs will allow for new breath-taking atmospheric effects. Clouds will be finally virtually indistinguishable from their real-life counterparts. The terrain mesh will be smooth, Kuban's mountains (although already nice today) will have no popping triangles and no pyramid-like edges. Thick glass panels will be rendered using real-time ray-traced refraction.

The increase in rendering quality will put bigger strain on the art teams, who will be pushed to model more details. This has been a challenge since games moved from 2d to 3d, and will remain so.

The limits of CPUs will keep the number of AIs to a "similar" level as today. Although one can expect a move to multi-core AI in the game, this will at best open the door to 8 times more planes... which isn't bad. I'm sure many will still lament the lack of large bomber formations. AI itself might have improved, but primarily as the result of the devs spending time on its development. For many players, it will still "suck", because AIs can't be humans.

Improvements in bandwidth and its availability will open the possibility to have about 200 players per server, maybe. Cool, but not so vastly different from today, I would say.

We (well, some of us) will have high quality force-feedback joysticks, and they will be expensive, because produced in small quantities.

 

TLDR: Essentially the same game, but better looking.

 

PS: I wonder if a large number of players with competence reaching employment age or having their kids leave home wouldn't open the possibility for an enthusiast-based competing project running on a 3rd-party 3D engine, e.g. a future version of Unity or Unreal. In ten years time the software tools might be available. Without the focus of a professional team it might not be real competition, on the other hand I can't help notice the relatively high density of highly skilled people in the community and the genre in general. With time and no need for heavy funding, it could achieve something comparable to what this team is doing today. Realistically, ten years might be too short. Give it 20 years, and it's a possibility. Another 20 years and the makers would definitely "retire", leaving a work of art played only by a small decreasing player base. A poetic thought for you.