Yak 1 under fire 20 mm

[II./JG27_Rich]

It really takes some hits. Not as tough as the Lagg but I think the pilot could still eject.

 

Edited January 5, 2014 by II./JG27_Rich

[Bussard_x]

Looking at this you could say this is very good simulated in BOS.

The smoke and the big parts shot of, as is the fuel system catching fire. Aircraft is put out of action in seconds.

[II./JG27_Rich]

I agree. All we need is the big old half track and the guys riding on the back of the 109 hehehe

Edited January 5, 2014 by II./JG27_Rich

[FuriousMeow]

The best part is that not all kills require bullets to separate wings or destroy engines immediately. Tonight I attacked several LaGGs, and watched after passes as parts fell away well after my rounds had met the target. Even diving down on one LaGG after a few passes I watched parts fall away - horizontal stabilizer, a wheel and a flap section, before even opening fire that was damaged on a previous pass.

 

I watched a LaGG spin out of control after it's rudder fell away when I was tailing it prior to me even shooting it again.

 

Anyone who thinks that BoS isn't innovative apparently doesn't know what that word means, this damage model is well beyond the "oh boy wheels fell out because I damaged hydraulics!" stuff that so many praise.

Edited January 5, 2014 by FuriousMeow

[BeastyBaiter]

Indeed, it's a good evolution of what was done in RoF. It is genuinely something different from what other games like IL/FB/PF, CloD, WT and DCS have done.

[ShamrockOneFive]

The best part is that not all kills require bullets to separate wings or destroy engines immediately. Tonight I attacked several LaGGs, and watched after passes as parts fell away well after my rounds had met the target. Even diving down on one LaGG after a few passes I watched parts fall away - horizontal stabilizer, a wheel and a flap section, before even opening fire that was damaged on a previous pass.

 

I watched a LaGG spin out of control after it's rudder fell away when I was tailing it prior to me even shooting it again.

 

Anyone who thinks that BoS isn't innovative apparently doesn't know what that word means, this damage model is well beyond the "oh boy wheels fell out because I damaged hydraulics!" stuff that so many praise.

Indeed, it's a fairly new level of destruction for the WWII flight sim world. It's great to see the wings slowly deform before falling off, pieces disintegrating post battle... very impressive stuff!

[=RvE=Windmills]

What was this series called again?

[II./JG27_Rich]

What was this series called again?

"Achive of War"

Edited January 5, 2014 by II./JG27_Rich

[6./ZG26_Emil]

The best part is that not all kills require bullets to separate wings or destroy engines immediately. Tonight I attacked several LaGGs, and watched after passes as parts fell away well after my rounds had met the target. Even diving down on one LaGG after a few passes I watched parts fall away - horizontal stabilizer, a wheel and a flap section, before even opening fire that was damaged on a previous pass.

 

I watched a LaGG spin out of control after it's rudder fell away when I was tailing it prior to me even shooting it again.

 

Anyone who thinks that BoS isn't innovative apparently doesn't know what that word means, this damage model is well beyond the "oh boy wheels fell out because I damaged hydraulics!" stuff that so many praise.

 

Yeh this is what has impressed me so far as well. Every time I get hits on a LaGG I'm craning my neck to see the effects, it will take a long time to get bored of those damage effects.

[III/JG11_Tiger]

The best part is that not all kills require bullets to separate wings or destroy engines immediately. Tonight I attacked several LaGGs, and watched after passes as parts fell away well after my rounds had met the target. Even diving down on one LaGG after a few passes I watched parts fall away - horizontal stabilizer, a wheel and a flap section, before even opening fire that was damaged on a previous pass.

 

I watched a LaGG spin out of control after it's rudder fell away when I was tailing it prior to me even shooting it again.

 

Anyone who thinks that BoS isn't innovative apparently doesn't know what that word means, this damage model is well beyond the "oh boy wheels fell out because I damaged hydraulics!" stuff that so many praise.

This is also well modeled in ROF, where you take damage and fly around okay until you over stress the damaged part and bang your wing or aileron, etc. is gone.

Edited January 5, 2014 by III/JG11_Tiger

[dburne]

This is also well modeled in ROF, where you take damage and fly around okay until you over stress the damaged part and bang your wing or aileron, etc. is gone.

 

Indeed, the damage model is very nice in ROF and undoubtedly will be in BOS.

[Voidhunger]

What I´m missing are the flashes of the bullets impact on the aircraft (now they are behind the aicraft and I hope they will corect this) and smaller parts of the airframe (wood or metal) flying off after the 20mm gun impact.

[GAVCA/Jambock__28]

What I´m missing are the flashes of the bullets impact on the aircraft (now they are behind the aicraft and I hope they will corect this) and smaller parts of the airframe (wood or metal) flying off after the 20mm gun impact.

 

I agree, and for me the video shows much less smoke than is shown in BoS. Big parts fall away (like ailerons, undercarriage, flaps, etc.) is not much realist for me since the construction plane is much more solid than in a WWI plane (I do not remember seeing examples in guncam movies, maybe I am wrong but not remember). I think this should be a provisional approach to be improved after.

 

DM in RoF is fantastic, but the standard approach of the damage is not suitable for an aircraft of WWII.

Edited January 5, 2014 by GAVCAViJambock__28

[FuriousMeow]

I agree, and for me the video shows much less smoke than is shown in BoS. Big parts fall away (like ailerons, undercarriage, flaps, etc.) is not much realist for me since the construction plane is much more solid than in a WWI plane (I do not remember seeing examples in guncam movies, maybe I am wrong but not remember). I think this should be a provisional approach to be improved after.

 

DM in RoF is fantastic, but the standard approach of the damage is not suitable for an aircraft of WWII.

 

 

And you'd be wrong. The construction might be "solid" (again, wrong - WWII planes were metal skeletal structures with very thin aluminium covering) but once damaged, they fall away. Of course there are footnotes such as the Mosquito which was wood skeletal structure with monocoque covering. Oh, and the majority of control surfaces in WWII aircraft were metal skeletal but doped fabric.

 

It's very suitable for WWII aircraft, and is the best approach to damage ever done for any WWII sim ever.

[Gunsmith86]

Big parts fall away (like ailerons, undercarriage, flaps, etc.) is not much realist for me since the construction plane is much more solid than in a WWI plane (I do not remember seeing examples in guncam movies, maybe I am wrong but not remember). I think this should be a provisional approach to be improved after.

 

DM in RoF is fantastic, but the standard approach of the damage is not suitable for an aircraft of WWII.

It is realistic you must compare it with the increase in firepower at that time.

 

 

WW1: 7.92x57 AP round 11.5g Muzzle Energy 3360 Joule

WW2: 20x82 AP round 115g Muzzle Energy 29000 Joule

 

That is more the 8.5 times the firepower of WW1!

 

MK 101 and MK 103 rounds have HE rounds with 433g and Muzzle Energy of 138500 Joule!

Edited January 5, 2014 by Gunsmith86

[FuriousMeow]

Also, not to mention guncam footage shows what exactly? A few seconds of footage, when the trigger is depressed. Using guncam footage as evidence of anything is worthless. It won't show the aircraft through it's entire flight, just the few seconds it was shot at and it isn't very clear.

 

Guncam footage has yielded the shaky wiggly tracer display so many believe is accurate, except those who have fired tracer rounds and know that the wiggles don't exist. Guncam footage is nice, and cool to watch - but it's not accurate with the tracer effect and certainly does not depict the entire demise of the aircraft.

[GAVCA/Jambock__28]

And you'd be wrong. The construction might be "solid" (again, wrong - WWII planes were metal skeletal structures with very thin aluminium covering) but once damaged, they fall away. Of course there are footnotes such as the Mosquito which was wood skeletal structure with monocoque covering. Oh, and the majority of control surfaces in WWII aircraft were metal skeletal but doped fabric.

 

It's very suitable for WWII aircraft, and is the best approach to damage ever done for any WWII sim ever.

 

Yes, damaged pieces, after sometime falling away is someting reasonable to see, but in my short (I admit)  experience  with BoS I saw entire parts fall away (see at 5:35 min) instantly:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WBxJCVUy9dc#t=337

 

But as I said I think this is an initial approach, which more intermediate stages of damage will be added. For now, the damage modeling is limited to a structure that always breaks in the same places. The tail, for example, as in the following films:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KI_l7SlADKQ

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6a0zPPcPlCI

 

I do not think the tail of the Bf come loose with this frequency, there are several photos of wreckage where it is intact. But, again, I think that more conditions are added to the model for that part actually breaks.

[FuriousMeow]

Yes, damaged pieces, after sometime falling away is someting reasonable to see, but in my short (I admit)  experience  with BoS I saw entire parts fall away (see at 5:35 min) instantly:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WBxJCVUy9dc#t=337

 

But as I said I think this is an initial approach, which more intermediate stages of damage will be added. For now, the damage modeling is limited to a structure that always breaks in the same places. The tail, for example, as in the following films:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KI_l7SlADKQ

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6a0zPPcPlCI

 

I do not think the tail of the Bf come loose with this frequency, there are several photos of wreckage where it is intact. But, again, I think that more conditions are added to the model for that part actually breaks.

 

First video: What? I saw nothing fall away instantly. However, indeed - parts should fall away instantly if damaged. It's evident in gun cam footage, it's evident if you take a model airplane out and shoot it with airsoft pellets. It's even evident that damaged parts will fall away much later after the damage has been inflicted due to stress or simple further wear that unhinges it further.

 

Second two videos: Well, parts have breaking points and they will always be the same until you can produce a system that can replicate nature. Which, as of today, is far into the future. So there are fixed points areas of damage and fixed points of failure.

 

But of course, it's the 109 that is the main point of conjecture. It is the most structurally sound and toughest aircraft ever. The <insert non-109/190> is not nearly as tough.

[CreepiJim]

As with terminal ballistics on the ground, every hit has an instant effect. This effect might not affect the plane instantly, though.

 

What I mean is quite simple: The impact itself of a gun creates an entry hole and possibly an exit hole. The projectile itself will cause damage on its way through the aircraft and, if a special round, might detonate, ignite or tumble through the different parts. That will cause instant and long-term damage. An apparent "kill shot" might take time to work in favour for the shooter. As it has been said before, the aircraft might need to take a tight turn and the wing breaks off. And I heard aircraft react kind of bitchy to loose and/or missing wings.

 

This is not a 20mm but still the wing is not shot off:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZoLLDi-M3fk

 

Every shot might show different results as an explosion is not quite the same each and every time. Same goes for mere penetrating shots with AP rounds. Each round will tumble differently and cause a different damage...or none at all besides acceleration holes in the enemy aircraft.

[OBT-Psycho]

I was amazed yesterday as I was flying around in a Lagg.

 

I got the edge over the first 109 and had a couple lucky shots. It went down in flames, thank to the 23mm canon. 

 

Then I proceed to Dogfight Zone B to meet my second opponent. I gave everything I could, but could not avoid to end up with empty ammo for canon. so I quickly grew a pair and finally end up in the tail of the 'schmitt, opened fire with the few ammo left.

 

I could swear I saw a couple of hits on the left wing, but the guy was still flying.  I decided to stay in his tail to see what he would do. I know in the old Il-2 AI kind of knew when you were out of ammo and changed his way of flying. In this situation he would have climbed in circle, totally out of reach for me.

 

So I tried to stay behind him, and he tried to slightly shake me off. but nothing so brutal you would do in his situation. I wonder what will be his next move, as he didn't seemed threatened by my presence. AND THERE IT GOES! left edge of the plane bent and then slowly flew pass my canopy, leaving a plane spining deadly down to ground.

 

it was a wonderful moment. I can't stop to see this image slowly in my mind, just like a slow flashback in a movie

 

what is important is how well damage model is. and even then, we had good fun with AI but a little christmas elf told me that multiplayer is right around the corner...so again a new way to find out more about how to obliterate planes and make part raining down on Winterish russian plain

[LLv34_Flanker]

S!

 

 Checked that video. The Yak caught by the looks of it around 4-5 20mm hits and caught fire on right wing where fuel tank is located, could be seen the flame erupting in last seconds of the clip. Sure fits in with the combat reports I've read that Yak's caught fire very frequently due their "flimsier" contruction compared to La-5 or LagG-3 for example. 

[GAVCA/Jambock__28]

First video: What? I saw nothing fall away instantly. However, indeed - parts should fall away instantly if damaged. It's evident in gun cam footage, it's evident if you take a model airplane out and shoot it with airsoft pellets. It's even evident that damaged parts will fall away much later after the damage has been inflicted due to stress or simple further wear that unhinges it further.

 

Second two videos: Well, parts have breaking points and they will always be the same until you can produce a system that can replicate nature. Which, as of today, is far into the future. So there are fixed points areas of damage and fixed points of failure.

 

But of course, it's the 109 that is the main point of conjecture. It is the most structurally sound and toughest aircraft ever. The <insert non-109/190> is not nearly as tough.

 

From the 5:20 is better, after the shot I did a take of the Bf: is possible to see the entire right undercarriage falling (At first I thought it was the pilot jumping)... Ok, it is possible that such an important part as this fall under fire of only two .50? Maybe, but I found it odd... 

 

Well,  the damage model is not yet finished. I believe that in the future this piece will not fall, or just get stuck there. Locked or defective parts may prove worse than a missing piece.. The worst effect that can have a shot in a elevator, for example, is leaving it locked in position, preventing the nose up or down...

[ITAF_Rani]

Waoo at point 3.05..when plane is under the fire..it seems like in Bos..

The developers made a very good work on simulate the clouds of dust rised after the plane has been hit...

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

Nice find. Looks like a LaGG-3 to me at 1:28 though.