TWC_Ace Posted March 19, 2018 Posted March 19, 2018 (edited) Seriously. Crosswinds, BRD and Slaw pedals are all top notch and expensive. Midranged would be Saitek Pro flight, CH pro and thrustmasters T flight pedals. CH and T flight are too narrow super uncomfortable (specially thrustmasters), saiteks are so-so. All of those more or less not so much durable (t flight being a super trash in that area). I used to have Simped vario usb pedals which were great mid range pedals (durable for its price, comfortable and precise). Mr Hoffman did a great job and his son too untill he stopped with production. Due to health issues I sold them but I recovered and Im in the "business" again. So, with what we casual simmers (or the ppl who deosnt live in rich part of the world) are left with? Nothing.... I wish my croatian fellow, belarussian and russian do a mid range pedals not just top notch ones...for us with slimmer pockets....I wonder if that would be possible... One example of a good "best buy" mid range flight gear would be joystick Gladiator MK2 non pro.....T16000M is nice but Glad is much much better IMHO Edited March 19, 2018 by blackram 1
TWC_Ace Posted March 19, 2018 Author Posted March 19, 2018 (edited) Yeah I forgot them....curently they are unavailable for EU on VKB EU store. What was the price for MK4 as now the price isnt there? Though I heard they are working a bit differently than others. And they are pretty noisy unless you reverse a center cam (centre detend will be removed then). Edited March 19, 2018 by blackram
dburne Posted March 19, 2018 Posted March 19, 2018 5 minutes ago, blackram said: Yeah I forgot them....curently they are unavailable for EU on VKB EU store. What was the price for MK4 as now the price isnt there? Though I heard they are working a bit differently than others. I really have no idea, have not followed them on pedals all that closely, seems like they used to be readily available. Just thought it might be another option for you. Personally I have the MFG's and love them.
TWC_Ace Posted March 19, 2018 Author Posted March 19, 2018 (edited) MFG ofcourse are high end pedals. And such is the price. EDIT: VKB was around 250 euros so it is also a top range price product... Edited March 19, 2018 by blackram
Warpig Posted March 19, 2018 Posted March 19, 2018 I own the T-Rudder MkIII's. They are a very accurate and durable piece of equipment. Realize that the T-Rudder is designed for use with a desk more than they are designed for a simpit. Because of this design, they lack a brake axis, but the design does work great with a rolling chair and desk. That's why I chose this product over the others. The only con I find with the T-Rudders, is that prolonged use puts a lot of pressure on your knees. I have to be mindful not to keep my feet on the pedals when in level flight, just so my knees don't get wrecked.
Sokol1 Posted March 19, 2018 Posted March 19, 2018 (edited) Le'ts divide the pedals market (based on Amazon.com or manufacturer price) LOW COST Tm TFRP ~$90.00 CH PRO Pedal ~ $120.00 MIDDLE COST Logitech G (Saitek) PRO ~$167.00 VKB T-Rudder ~$ 215.00 - $240 (depends where buy and add + shipping, taxes) Not sure if still in production, but BRD used do make a uniaxial pedal for around $200.00 (less in kit for for Russian market). HIGH COST (> $300+) The mentioned MFG, BRD 3 axes, SLAW I am satisfied* with T-Rudder (Mk.II) and find funny the "drama" that some make about "toe brakes", as if brake (and ground taxi) are the most important ting in flight games - some include have bough cheap models just because this feature. * Probable if own a 3 axes pedal have shelved then - like did with my previous Tm RCS and CH PRO, because if not "bolted" on floor this models tends to "dance twist". Edited March 19, 2018 by Sokol1
WWGriphos Posted March 19, 2018 Posted March 19, 2018 I've had CH Pro pedals for well over a decade. They are bombproof. There is nothing uncomfortable about them. They do have a sharp center detent, which I don't like. But there is absolutely no noise on the axes after all these years of very hard use! Also, you can't get into the air if you can't taxi to the runway. Toe brakes are important, particularly when other ways of braking in the real planes are unavailable to us.
dburne Posted March 19, 2018 Posted March 19, 2018 2 minutes ago, WWGriphos said: I've had CH Pro pedals for well over a decade. They are bombproof. There is nothing uncomfortable about them. They do have a sharp center detent, which I don't like. But there is absolutely no noise on the axes after all these years of very hard use! Also, you can't get into the air if you can't taxi to the runway. Toe brakes are important, particularly when other ways of braking in the real planes are unavailable to us. Not a thing wrong with toe brakes, personally I love having the two extra axis on my pedals. 1
TWC_Ace Posted March 19, 2018 Author Posted March 19, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Sokol1 said: Le'ts divide the pedals market (based on Amazon.com or manufacturer price) LOW COST Tm TFRP ~$90.00 CH PRO Pedal ~ $120.00 MIDDLE COST Logitech G (Saitek) PRO ~$167.00 VKB T-Rudder ~$ 215.00 - $240 (depends where buy and add + shipping, taxes) Not sure if still in production, but BRD used do make a uniaxial pedal for around $200.00 (less in kit for for Russian market). HIGH COST (> $300+) The mentioned MFG, BRD 3 axes, SLAW I am satisfied* with T-Rudder (Mk.II) and find funny the "drama" that some make about "toe brakes", as if brake (and ground taxi) are the most important ting in flight games - some include have bough cheap models just because this feature. * Probable if own a 3 axes pedal have shelved then - like did with my previous Tm RCS and CH PRO, because if not "bolted" on floor this models tends to "dance twist". This is what im talking about. A good mid range pedals would be Simped vario (discontinued lomg ago). I think i bought them for 200$. Sweet spot midrange price. I wonder why VKB or one of the smaller manufacturers (BRD, MCG, SLAW) doesnt produce such midrange pedals for 180-200$. Those would sell like mad since they cost like inferior saiteks.... One good example with joystick is Gladiator non pro. For that price a super offer. Nowhere to find such product with pedals. Edited March 19, 2018 by blackram 1
Grey*Ghost Posted March 20, 2018 Posted March 20, 2018 (edited) 18 hours ago, blackram said: Seriously. Crosswinds, BRD and Slaw pedals are all top notch and expensive. Midranged would be Saitek Pro flight, CH pro and thrustmasters T flight pedals. CH and T flight are too narrow super uncomfortable (specially thrustmasters), saiteks are so-so. All of those more or less not so much durable (t flight being a super trash in that area). I used to have Simped vario usb pedals which were great mid range pedals (durable for its price, comfortable and precise). Mr Hoffman did a great job and his son too untill he stopped with production. Due to health issues I sold them but I recovered and Im in the "business" again. So, with what we casual simmers (or the ppl who deosnt live in rich part of the world) are left with? Nothing.... I wish my croatian fellow, belarussian and russian do a mid range pedals not just top notch ones...for us with slimmer pockets....I wonder if that would be possible... One example of a good "best buy" mid range flight gear would be joystick Gladiator MK2 non pro.....T16000M is nice but Glad is much much better IMHO Hi, i had the same issue. I was looking for a good pair of pedals for over a year. In the end, I saved up some money and got me the MFG Crosswinds and never looked back. Fantastic pedals and well worth the money and time needed for saving! :-D I’d say get the pedals you really want and don’t go for a compromise you will eventually never like. Best Boomer Edited March 20, 2018 by JagdFalke_B00MER Typo
TWC_Ace Posted March 20, 2018 Author Posted March 20, 2018 (edited) I dont want to sound rude, my friend. Its kinda easier to save when average salary in your country is 5x bigger than in mine. I will see what I will do. Maybe I can find some used pedals. Edited March 20, 2018 by blackram 1
ruby_monkey Posted March 20, 2018 Posted March 20, 2018 I'd suggest that you avoid the Thrustmaster TFRP unless you're comfortable with having your feet so close together that they practically touch; but consider a CH Pro (perhaps used off eBay - they may be primitive but they last forever) to tide you over for a year or two while you save for the MFG you really need. Pedals like the Crosswind may be bloody expensive but they will be the last pedals you'll ever need to buy.
Archie Posted March 20, 2018 Posted March 20, 2018 I used my CH pedals for over a decade, and they were as good as new the day I gave them away to a squadmate. I'm hoping my Crosswinds last at least as long, which makes them quite a good investment over the long term.
Grey*Ghost Posted March 20, 2018 Posted March 20, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, blackram said: I dont want to sound rude, my friend. Its kinda easier to save when average salary in your country is 5x bigger than in mine. I will see what I will do. Maybe I can find some used pedals. Hey no problem, no offence taken. I just wanted to point out that it might be worth the wait for the right pair of pedals, even when you can get them used. I used my keyboard for rudder input for soooo long....always gave me extra thrills when landing. :-D Hope you can find something that’s right for you. Best Boomer Edited March 20, 2018 by JagdFalke_B00MER
TWC_Ace Posted March 20, 2018 Author Posted March 20, 2018 1 hour ago, ruby_monkey said: Pedals like the Crosswind may be bloody expensive but they will be the last pedals you'll ever need to buy. This is very true. I know it. I regret I sold Simped vario pro 2 yrs ago when I thought Im done with simming (health issues).
Sokol1 Posted March 20, 2018 Posted March 20, 2018 OK that Crosswinds or Slaw's is a must to have... but not everyone can own a Ferrari. Difficult the market will see a rudder pedal set with at least T-Rudder quality but costing less. VPC initial teaser of rudder pedals looks a single axis version, what could cost less and will have T-Rudder as competition, but "jet" virpilots are pressuring for a more costly 3 axis version - who will need compete in Crosswind, Slaw, BRD's market.
US103_Baer Posted March 29, 2018 Posted March 29, 2018 (edited) I have Thrustmaster's TFRP. The complaints that they're uncomfortably narrow are way overblown. The same people who say that would likely have no issue with a set of car SIM pedals that are even narrower! The OP is correct that there isnt a decent midrange pedal option and I think Thrustmaster has missed an opportunity. TFRP might be a good partner for T-Flight sticks, but they're not at T16000m level. The problem I have with TFRP is that they use pots, not hall sensors, as the t16000m does, to great effect. As a result I get spikey input - not great for yaw control! The pedals themselves also stick slightly in operation with feet and aren't super smooth. It's not bad, but just enough to annoy and require heavy S curves in response setup. So, Thrustmaster, make an 'R16000p' - use hall sensor on the yaw axis, pots on toe brakes, and a superior smooth slide action. Edited March 29, 2018 by PaulLMF
seafireliv Posted March 29, 2018 Posted March 29, 2018 On 19/03/2018 at 9:45 PM, WWGriphos said: I've had CH Pro pedals for well over a decade. They are bombproof. There is nothing uncomfortable about them. They do have a sharp center detent, which I don't like. But there is absolutely no noise on the axes after all these years of very hard use! Also, you can't get into the air if you can't taxi to the runway. Toe brakes are important, particularly when other ways of braking in the real planes are unavailable to us. Same. No problems with my CH Pro. Tough and does the job. Can`t see how they`re uncomfortable.
SCG_Fenris_Wolf Posted March 29, 2018 Posted March 29, 2018 (edited) If anyone wants to buy Saitek Pro Flight Combat Pedals in perfect condition (center detent removed to get accuracy around 0) in Germany/Europe for a bargain price, PM me. (I upgraded to BRD-F3 pedals). Edited March 29, 2018 by SCG_Fenris_Wolf
blitze Posted April 4, 2018 Posted April 4, 2018 The BRD's might seem pricey but when looking into pricing for rudder pedals in general without going second hand, they are not much more than anything else out there on the market. The product quality though is night and day compared to most offerings by commercial controller companies.
TWC_Ace Posted April 4, 2018 Author Posted April 4, 2018 BRD, MFG Crosswind and VKB MK4 are all great pedals. At the end I decided to save for a pair. Still didnt decide which one to choose. BRDs are overall great, MFGs maybe the most comfortable and superprecise but I dont like how the heels arent resting on the floor (something I really liked with simpeds) and VKBs are full metal but kinda odd. Apparently it isnt easy to rest a foot on them since its very easy to press them and to make unattended inputs...
Sokol1 Posted April 4, 2018 Posted April 4, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, blackram said: Apparently it isnt easy to rest a foot on them since its very easy to press them and to make unattended inputs... Is not, only toes weight are above the rudder bar. Most of foots weight are above heel pads. If an guy are using the with all foot above the rudder bar are doing the wrong thing, in that way is very uncomfortable and impair the rudder control. Is moot say that MFG are more precise than BRD or VKB or Slaw or vice versa - all are in same league in this matter and all offer more resolution than humans foots can handle. The pedals that mix well the features you want is BRD pedals. Edited April 4, 2018 by Sokol1 1
TWC_Ace Posted April 5, 2018 Author Posted April 5, 2018 (edited) 12 hours ago, Sokol1 said: Is not, only toes weight are above the rudder bar. Most of foots weight are above heel pads. If an guy are using the with all foot above the rudder bar are doing the wrong thing, in that way is very uncomfortable and impair the rudder control. Is moot say that MFG are more precise than BRD or VKB or Slaw or vice versa - all are in same league in this matter and all offer more resolution than humans foots can handle. The pedals that mix well the features you want is BRD pedals. Yep but BRD is even more expensive than VKB or MFG.... But here is the "basic" model which is around 240 EUR (with VAT). BTW I still think MFG will be the best choice for me since Milan is from my country and I dont need to pay for VAT and shipping is less. Also he said he will make different footrests so the heel can be on the floor ("combat style") and that will be appliable on his current model of the pedals. Well once i Save for pedals it will be a hard choice but sweet one: BRD, VKB or MFG. Edited April 5, 2018 by blackram 1
dburne Posted April 5, 2018 Posted April 5, 2018 57 minutes ago, blackram said: Yep but BRD is even more expensive than VKB or MFG.... But here is the "basic" model which is around 240 EUR (with VAT). BTW I still think MFG will be the best choice for me since Milan is from my country and I dont need to pay for VAT and shipping is less. Also he said he will make different footrests so the heel can be on the floor ("combat style") and that will be appliable on his current model of the pedals. Well once i Save for pedals it will be a hard choice but sweet one: BRD, VKB or MFG. The MFG's are awesome pedals, I certainly love mine. Milan has been talking about the combat style footrests for some time now, guess he just continues to remain busy with the pedal production. I would certainly give them a go if he did. I came from using Saitek Combat Pedals, and it was a bit of an adjustment going to the MFG's where my heel was not on the floor - but I very quickly adjusted. 1
Sokol1 Posted April 5, 2018 Posted April 5, 2018 (edited) 7 hours ago, blackram said: But here is the "basic" model which is around 240 EUR (with VAT). Curious, here is listed in kit form for 5.600 rubles. Electronics (controller/sensor) add 3.850. http://avia-sim.ru/forum/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=906 Edited April 5, 2018 by Sokol1
PatrickAWlson Posted April 7, 2018 Posted April 7, 2018 I upgraded my stick and throttle a few months ago but I still have my decade old CH pedals. Definitely not the best but still pretty god for the price, and a huge step above keyboard or twist rudders. Maybe Santa Claus will bring me a nice VKB set this year (I have their stick and can't say enough good things about it). So what's my point ... if you only have $120 and you know you're not going to be able to shell out anything more any time soon, CH is a good buy. If you think you can save up and swing it, then wait and do better.
TWC_Ace Posted April 7, 2018 Author Posted April 7, 2018 (edited) 27 minutes ago, PatrickAWlson said: I upgraded my stick and throttle a few months ago but I still have my decade old CH pedals. Definitely not the best but still pretty god for the price, and a huge step above keyboard or twist rudders. Maybe Santa Claus will bring me a nice VKB set this year (I have their stick and can't say enough good things about it). So what's my point ... if you only have $120 and you know you're not going to be able to shell out anything more any time soon, CH is a good buy. If you think you can save up and swing it, then wait and do better. I was lucky becasue a good soul from my squad will borrow his old CH pedals (he bought VKBs) so I will have time to save for some high end pedals. Edited April 7, 2018 by blackram
blitze Posted April 8, 2018 Posted April 8, 2018 13 hours ago, blackram said: I was lucky becasue a good soul from my squad will borrow his old CH pedals (he bought VKBs) so I will have time to save for some high end pedals. Good Stuff. A good temporary fix and a rewarding outcome once savings are achieved and the pedals you want can be purchased.
TWC_Ace Posted April 8, 2018 Author Posted April 8, 2018 The thing is, in a long run, buying high end pedals is a better solution in many ways.
Marrond Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 On 29/03/2018 at 6:04 AM, PaulLMF said: I have Thrustmaster's TFRP. The complaints that they're uncomfortably narrow are way overblown. The same people who say that would likely have no issue with a set of car SIM pedals that are even narrower! The OP is correct that there isnt a decent midrange pedal option and I think Thrustmaster has missed an opportunity. TFRP might be a good partner for T-Flight sticks, but they're not at T16000m level. The problem I have with TFRP is that they use pots, not hall sensors, as the t16000m does, to great effect. As a result I get spikey input - not great for yaw control! The pedals themselves also stick slightly in operation with feet and aren't super smooth. It's not bad, but just enough to annoy and require heavy S curves in response setup. So, Thrustmaster, make an 'R16000p' - use hall sensor on the yaw axis, pots on toe brakes, and a superior smooth slide action. Difference between driving pedals and these is that you're moving only your feet and not whole legs when driving so narrowness is not a big problem. It's pretty uncomfortable for flight simming. Not to mention it's impossible to get your stick in between your legs with these. Yeah pots TM used are dirt cheap, pedals are wonky out of the box. That and the center indent make for horrible experience as if squishing your balls wasn't bad enough already. IDK it's possible with their current design - buttery smooth linear rails alone are 30euro for ONE. They would need to drop this silly nonsense and embrace true and tested solutions instead.
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