Thoughts on the P39...

[Guest deleted@134347]

what becomes extremely noticeable is the affect of any level of compromise on the wing surfaces. Be it a small bullet whole or a 20cm2 rip. The aircraft dramatically loses speed and any advanced maneuverability.

[Venturi]

The gear covers like to fly off at the least little hit on the wings, even from the upper surfaces, too. Once this happens the bird is barely controllable.

[Porkins]

I recently took the Cobra up against Expert level AI 109's and FW's. It was here that I found the P-39 to really show its shortcomings. The biggest issue I had was air speed. The German planes could pretty much engage and disengage me at will. They were constantly able to simply fly away from me in a dogfight. I shot down 2 of them, but in both cases the 2 had already been hit by friendly aircraft and were trailing smoke. Other than that I could hardly get in range of any of the German planes. 

 

I imagine that for a dogfight you might have the best luck stripping out the 30 cals. Less armament, but even without them the Cobra still has pretty good armament. 

[Guest deleted@134347]

46 minutes ago, Venturi said:

The gear covers like to fly off at the least little hit on the wings, even from the upper surfaces, too. Once this happens the bird is barely controllable.

 

interesting, I never paid attention to this fact, will see if that's truly the case... I think it's the only machine in the game that behaves like this. It's still somewhat controllable but very unstable and completely noncompetitive.

[Ehret]

12 minutes ago, Porkins said:

I recently took the Cobra up against Expert level AI 109's and FW's. It was here that I found the P-39 to really show its shortcomings. The biggest issue I had was air speed. The German planes could pretty much engage and disengage me at will. They were constantly able to simply fly away from me in a dogfight. I shot down 2 of them, but in both cases the 2 had already been hit by friendly aircraft and were trailing smoke. Other than that I could hardly get in range of any of the German planes.

 

Set the water radiator to 60%, the oil to 45%, rpm to 3000, mix to 100% and fly coordinated. Keep throttle between 85-100% and only 190 A-5 (and La-5FN but you will not be facing those) will be faster in level flight. You will be limited to 2-5m, thought, so proceed carefully. Long chases after climbing 109s are a very bad idea - just disengage, re-climb and attack from an advantageous position.

[56RAF_Roblex]

36 minutes ago, Porkins said:

I recently took the Cobra up against Expert level AI 109's and FW's. It was here that I found the P-39 to really show its shortcomings. The biggest issue I had was air speed. The German planes could pretty much engage and disengage me at will. They were constantly able to simply fly away from me in a dogfight. I shot down 2 of them, but in both cases the 2 had already been hit by friendly aircraft and were trailing smoke. Other than that I could hardly get in range of any of the German planes. 

 

I imagine that for a dogfight you might have the best luck stripping out the 30 cals. Less armament, but even without them the Cobra still has pretty good armament. 

 

I am a terrible dogfighter but I tried it with 'Ace' level 109s and had no trouble.  Not because I am a better pilot but because I found the AI was still not flying to its strengths.  They kept trying to out turn me in high speed turns and shallow descending turns and the P-39 is quite capable at those.  When they did go vertical all they succeeded in doing was presenting themselves as an easy target.  Actually that last point applies to humans too.  I estimate that at least 85% of all my fighter kills have been because a 109 or 190 tried to zoom climb when I was higher or had more E.    109 pilots need to learn that the 109s phenomenal climb is best done at an angle and when your enemy is co-alt with equal or lower E.

[TP_Sparky]

6 hours ago, Tag777 said:

I found that Pokryshkin's tactic suited well for the plane. ...dive into two FW-190s ...at high speed ...very short range a burst of the 37 mm and the .50 MGs completely wrecked them. But you have to climb fast after it and your time window for firing is very short. If you miss there are no second chance. I never use the .30 MGs.

 

Spot on, just as the Soviets taught. However it's delightful to see the 37mm literally blow the tail section off of your target.  Instead of white smoke or black smoke or a wing breaking off the main body of the enemy fighter can be literally blown to pieces with The Gun.  Or a friendly flight leader that you misidentify as an Me in a career mission, not that I'd know about that. 

 

MIXTURE SETTING TIP - 66% TO GET AUTOMATIC MIXTURE CONTROL (I THINK)

 

One of the great guys who fly with the Tangmere Pilots told me to set mixture at 66% which set the automixture feature.  I haven't confirmed that but the Tangmere Pilots are very knowledgeable and before that sage advice I continually got "adjust mixture" messages that seldom went off regardless of my fiddling.  I also had engine failures despite ample fuel, and prop RPM, manifold pressure, etc. all in continuous limits and all coolers open.  

 

After I set the mixture at 66% I had no more problems with engine failure since I keep careful watch on RPM, etc.

 

Thought that might help someone like me who didn't know that tip.

 

And a tip of the hat to Tangmere Pilots!

Edited April 2, 2018 by TP_Sparky

[=362nd_FS=RoflSeal]

Mixture settings, like with the P-40, MiG-3 and Spitfire are in employed over a range. You don't have to hit exact 66%, range for auto rich is IIRC 50-85%.

[Porkins]

4 hours ago, 56RAF_Roblex said:

 

I am a terrible dogfighter but I tried it with 'Ace' level 109s and had no trouble.  Not because I am a better pilot but because I found the AI was still not flying to its strengths.  They kept trying to out turn me in high speed turns and shallow descending turns and the P-39 is quite capable at those.  When they did go vertical all they succeeded in doing was presenting themselves as an easy target.  Actually that last point applies to humans too.  I estimate that at least 85% of all my fighter kills have been because a 109 or 190 tried to zoom climb when I was higher or had more E.    109 pilots need to learn that the 109s phenomenal climb is best done at an angle and when your enemy is co-alt with equal or lower E.

It's entirely likely you are a better pilot than I am. 

 

I'll have to try it again. That particular fight was a strange one. I just might have been unlucky in terms of getting engagements. The 109's and FW's were not turn fighting at all (at least not with me). 

[Nic727]

I agree that P39 is a very difficult aircraft.

 

first of all, is there a real takeoff mode in the game? I only get continuous, combat and emergency mode. I’m taking off in combat mode.

 

finally, it’s a very slow plane. Can’t keep up other planes, so I think it’s an aircraft good for surprise attack on bombers, but as a fighter against BF109 or FW190, it’s very difficult. I was able to go at 16k ft with the P39, but climbing after that is almost impossible since you are going too slow.

 

To resume my experience:

 

+ Good against bombers

+ Good to climb to cloud level

+ Great view

+ Good control

+ Good canons

 

- Fighter vs Fighter

- Slow aircraft

[CanadaOne]

I like the plane, but I'd like it more if I could ditch the mirror.

[Legioneod]

8 minutes ago, CanadaOne said:

I like the plane, but I'd like it more if I could ditch the mirror.

While the mirror isn't the best I do like it, I wouldn't be able to see clearly without it. Visibility in the P-39 is horrible imo, but you are correct, an option to remove the mirror would be nice.

[CanadaOne]

19 minutes ago, Legioneod said:

While the mirror isn't the best I do like it, I wouldn't be able to see clearly without it. Visibility in the P-39 is horrible imo, but you are correct, an option to remove the mirror would be nice.

 

It's just that the cockpit in the P-39 is so delicious, and the mirror just looks like a big blob up top. I find it kills the esthetics of an otherwise beautifully rendered interior.

Edited October 31, 2018 by CanadaOne

[GridiroN]

1 minute ago, CanadaOne said:

 

It's just that the cockpit in the P-39 is so delicious, and the mirror just looks like a big blob up top. I find it kills the esthetics of an otherwise beautifully rendered interior.

 

Do you not play on max graphics because this seems like an odd take to me, but I' dunderstand it if you're playing with low quality mirrors. 

[CanadaOne]

4 minutes ago, GridiroN said:

 

Do you not play on max graphics because this seems like an odd take to me, but I' dunderstand it if you're playing with low quality mirrors. 

 

I'm pretty sure I have everything maxed at 1080p, but sometimes I lower the shadow quality to medium and view distance to 100-ish if my PC is feeling tired and not holding around 60fps.

 

I'll double check.

11 minutes ago, GridiroN said:

 

Do you not play on max graphics because this seems like an odd take to me, but I' dunderstand it if you're playing with low quality mirrors. 

 

 

Fortunately God made me very handsome, 'cause He didn't make me very bright.

 

I turned the mirror quality up.

 

 

 

 

 

Thank you.

[Georgio]

The P39 is a great aircraft, probably my favourite on the Russian side, keep that speed up and you'll be fine, the combined guns shred anything in seconds which is the name of the game in my book.

[Ehret]

11 hours ago, CanadaOne said:

I turned the mirror quality up.

 

There is a trick with the mirror in the P-39... Set it to "simple" in graphics options and check what you can (not) see through it, now.

 

12 hours ago, Nic727 said:

finally, it’s a very slow plane. Can’t keep up other planes, so I think it’s an aircraft good for surprise attack on bombers, but as a fighter against BF109 or FW190, it’s very difficult. I was able to go at 16k ft with the P39, but climbing after that is almost impossible since you are going too slow.

 

Please look for posts about settings for the Airacobra. It's one of the fastest planes in the BoX, currently. You need set few things for this, thought. The radiators has to be "flush" - the so called 60/45 setting. (60% for water radiator, 45% for the oil radiator) Flying close to the P-39' critical altitude will help, too - you gain +100hp at around 3000m due the high supercharger throttling loses when lower. Of course, there are some limitations - the boost timer is a pesky thing and you have to count minutes when on combat/WEP power.

Edited October 31, 2018 by Ehret

[Nic727]

3 hours ago, Ehret said:

 

There is a trick with the mirror in the P-39... Set it to "simple" in graphics options and check what you can (not) see through it, now.

 

 

Please look for posts about settings for the Airacobra. It's one of the fastest planes in the BoX, currently. You need set few things for this, thought. The radiators has to be "flush" - the so called 60/45 setting. (60% for water radiator, 45% for the oil radiator) Flying close to the P-39' critical altitude will help, too - you gain +100hp at around 3000m due the high supercharger throttling loses when lower. Of course, there are some limitations - the boost timer is a pesky thing and you have to count minutes when on combat/WEP power.

Thx for the tips. Not really explained like that in the in-game description.

 

I only know that with other planes, opened radiator make you go slower, so I’m always keeping it minimal.

Edited October 31, 2018 by Nic727

[ironk79]

After flying exclusivly axis planes and having bought Kuban a few weeks ago, i decided to take the p39 for a spin. Long Story short, what a difference this plane is.

Rollrate and turnrate are fun. Its quite easy get it to spin out of controll and recovery is harder. Not sure about the engine, need more time to get to know all the tricks and settiing.

Armament is deadly and plenty, the 30cal rips through enemies like a buzzsaw, the 37mm feels like squashing flies with a hammer. Looking forward flying more with this little toy.

[II./JG77_Manu*]

One more aircraft that gets seriously hampered by the current engine limit implementation. If it would have really behaved like this, i am pretty sure many Russians wouldn't have prefered the P39 over many Russian models up to 1945. 

[A_radek]

Is it me or do the cannon shells have a tendency to fail detonation upon impact? As if every second round was ap.

[Tag777]

4 hours ago, SvAF/F16_radek said:

Is it me or do the cannon shells have a tendency to fail detonation upon impact? As if every second round was ap.

I already posted this in the Bugs Section but so far no response from Devs.

[A_radek]

Tag777 Did you test this in any way? I haven't, really just a hunch, but if it actually is a bug it's also a rather serious handicap to tote around an already slow firing 37mm cannon and then have every other shell malfunction.

[Jade_Monkey]

Is it me or the P39 is very sensitive to pitch inputs and wobbles a lot? I've never flown a real one but it looks a bit unrealistic to me how it responds to sudden pitch inputs.

[Willy__]

Just now, Jade_Monkey said:

Is it me or the P39 is very sensitive to pitch inputs and wobbles a lot? I've never flown a real one but it looks a bit unrealistic to me how it responds to sudden pitch inputs.

 

It resembles the 109 in that regard: fly it fast enough and it will be a very stable platform, let the speed drop and that sh%$ will wobble all over the place.

[Ehret]

9 hours ago, II./JG77_Manu* said:

One more aircraft that gets seriously hampered by the current engine limit implementation. If it would have really behaved like this, i am pretty sure many Russians wouldn't have prefered the P39 over many Russian models up to 1945. 

 

I have some hints which could ease woes...

 

Try to drag engagements to around 3000m - it's where throttling losses are gone and the V-1710 gains 100hp. By a coincidence that is especially useful against 190s as they exhibit serious power loss at 2.5-3km.

Some extra boost time can be gained by switching between combat and emergency settings. Looks like they have individual timers but still interlocked somewhat.

5m of rest is enough to regain a good portion of the boost time. I'm not sure how long is needed for a full reset; 10m maybe?

Running at emergency power with 66% mixture gives slightly better performance at cost of extra heat.

Winter is the best friend of the Airacobra; might be a placebo but it feels like the engine power is more competitive at the deck. The useful altitude is extended by a nice amount, too. You can run the flush radiator setting (60/45) nonstop in a cold weather.

RPM at 94-95% increases top speed slightly when on the deck.

Edited November 6, 2018 by Ehret

[ACG_Smokejumper]

On 3/17/2018 at 7:06 PM, BlitzPig_EL said:

 

I wish the convergence setting could be set separately from the machine guns.

 

*sigh*

 

  I agree or at least have horizontal and vertical separate.

[Tag777]

13 hours ago, SvAF/F16_radek said:

Tag777 Did you test this in any way? I haven't, really just a hunch, but if it actually is a bug it's also a rather serious handicap to tote around an already slow firing 37mm cannon and then have every other shell malfunction.

Well, historical references (Pokryshkin, Rechkalov, Evgenyi Marinsky) indicate that a single hit with the 37 mm on a fighter was enough to destroy it. On a Stuka, 2 or 3, maximum. The other night I was in WoL and got on a Stuka's tail, almost at point blank range and I needed 7 shots of the 37 mm to destroy it.

Edited November 6, 2018 by Tag777

[ShamrockOneFive]

49 minutes ago, Tag777 said:

Well, historical references (Pokryshkin, Rechkalov, Evgenyi Marinsky) indicate that a single hit with the 37 mm on a fighter was enough to destroy it. On a Stuka, 2 or 3, maximum. The other night I was in WoL and got on a Stuka's tail, almost at point blank range and I needed 7 shots of the 37 mm to destroy it.

 

The problem with multiplayer is that not all bullets are going to count. FPS players refer to this as "dusting" but whatever you call it, it affects single fire big damage weapons disproportionately from rapid fire lower damage weapons.

 

If you want to do weapons testing you'll need to do it offline.

 

There's also the matter of what constitutes destroyed. I can take a Stuka down with a single 37mm hit (I prefer targeting the wingroot rather than the tail) but it doesn't mean that the plane has exploded into a giant fireball necessarily. Just that it's a wrecked airplane and destined to crash. Some would keep firing but I'm content to move on usually.

[ironk79]

1 hour ago, Tag777 said:

Well, historical references (Pokryshkin, Rechkalov, Evgenyi Marinsky) indicate that a single hit with the 37 mm on a fighter was enough to destroy it. On a Stuka, 2 or 3, maximum. The other night I was in WoL and got on a Stuka's tail, almost at point blank range and I needed 7 shots of the 37 mm to destroy it.

in career stukas fell like flies after a single hit.

20 hours ago, SvAF/F16_radek said:

Is it me or do the cannon shells have a tendency to fail detonation upon impact? As if every second round was ap.

had observed this too, but they still dealt the damage, breaking the plane completly. looked more like the explosion animation was missing.

[Tag777]

55 minutes ago, ShamrockOneFive said:

 

The problem with multiplayer is that not all bullets are going to count. FPS players refer to this as "dusting" but whatever you call it, it affects single fire big damage weapons disproportionately from rapid fire lower damage weapons.

 

If you want to do weapons testing you'll need to do it offline.

 

There's also the matter of what constitutes destroyed. I can take a Stuka down with a single 37mm hit (I prefer targeting the wingroot rather than the tail) but it doesn't mean that the plane has exploded into a giant fireball necessarily. Just that it's a wrecked airplane and destined to crash. Some would keep firing but I'm content to move on usually.

I did the testing offline also. The gun effect on a plane variates ramdonly. Some times you can take down a fighter with a single hit (wing fell off, fuselage broken in two or whatever) and sometimes don't (one time a 109 needed 3 shots, wing area). Ju-52 behaves like a sponge sometimes, absorbing 7 or 8 shells and continues flying like nothing happens, nor smoke even and sometimes split in two with a single hit in the same zone.

[CrazyDuck]

I'd like her more with a 20 mm or even a .50 cal in a nose. Can't hit a proverbial broad side of a barn, let alone anything flying and maneouvering with that potato launcher. 

 

 

[Ehret]

15 minutes ago, CrazyDuck said:

I'd like her more with a 20 mm or even a .50 cal in a nose. Can't hit a proverbial broad side of a barn, let alone anything flying and maneouvering with that potato launcher.

 

Not always It's that bad... shells looks like flying potatoes but it's not hard to hit a target within 300-400m range if it's flying straight. Many enemies don't realize that and just don't evade. I have found the 37mm M4 works pretty good on torpedo-boats and such. Often they blow just after one strafing run and few hits. The 20mm would be a better option, thought. For me the worst con is only 400 rounds for the twin 0.50 cals. Few moments of firing and you are out of ammo; irritating as hell considering that in the practice they are the Airacobra major armament.

[A_radek]

24 minutes ago, Tag777 said:

I did the testing offline also. The gun effect on a plane variates ramdonly. Some times you can take down a fighter with a single hit (wing fell off, fuselage broken in two or whatever) and sometimes don't (one time a 109 needed 3 shots, wing area). Ju-52 behaves like a sponge sometimes, absorbing 7 or 8 shells and continues flying like nothing happens, nor smoke even and sometimes split in two with a single hit in the same zone.

That's in line with the very unscientific:ish feeling I had. While it sometimes can rip a wing straight off a 109, a 110 I remember particularly well seemed to soak up several direct hits to fuselage and proceeded to return home. Armor just didn't seem a likely reason there. All in all I'm just trying to find a reason for why the cobra feels like it lacks bite. My own aim aside.

[Willy__]

You guys are just too used to the marvelous russian wonder weapons, thats all. Compare it to the bredas and you see what devastation is like. 

[A_radek]

I'm one of those weird ones that enjoy the game as a whole rather than exclusively stick to one "side". Still biased though as the 39 is an all time darling of mine.

Edited November 6, 2018 by SvAF/F16_radek

[Jade_Monkey]

1 hour ago, Tag777 said:

Well, historical references (Pokryshkin, Rechkalov, Evgenyi Marinsky) indicate that a single hit with the 37 mm on a fighter was enough to destroy it. On a Stuka, 2 or 3, maximum. The other night I was in WoL and got on a Stuka's tail, almost at point blank range and I needed 7 shots of the 37 mm to destroy it.

 

Also, shooting from the enemy's 6 is the worst angle to kill them.

[69TD_Hajo_Garlic]

On 3/18/2018 at 6:02 AM, Luftschiff said:

I hit a AAA installation from 4.8km away last night.

How?  I had a soviet 37mm spawn in 500m (probably less) in front of me guns blazing yesterday when I was looking right at it when I was going for flak at an airfield I attacked in the previous sortie with a stuka and a sc1800.  I have a capable rig (gtx 1080), can spot planes easily but this is the 2nd time this month aaa spawned in when I was looking right at it.  I mess with my settings but acheive no effect on ground targets spawning in front of me.  Sorry to derail.  

 

 

In the 39 I reccomend step climbing and not shooting the 37 dead 6 at the tail,  a little angle and the cannon does wonders.

[Luftschiff]

4 hours ago, 69TD_Joeasyrida said:

How?  I had a soviet 37mm spawn in 500m (probably less) in front of me guns blazing yesterday when I was looking right at it when I was going for flak at an airfield I attacked in the previous sortie with a stuka and a sc1800.  I have a capable rig (gtx 1080), can spot planes easily but this is the 2nd time this month aaa spawned in when I was looking right at it.  I mess with my settings but acheive no effect on ground targets spawning in front of me.  Sorry to derail.  

 

 

In the 39 I reccomend step climbing and not shooting the 37 dead 6 at the tail,  a little angle and the cannon does wonders.

 

Well it happened like a year ago now, I posted that in march - but if memory serves it was on an MP server with icons on, it was very full in the days following the release. It was also firing at me at the time. 500m seems like a worryingly low draw distance, but I know tanks behave much the same for me. Finding tank columns is an exercise in futility when they lod out at twenty paces as though they expect me to duel them with pistols at dawn...

[69TD_Hajo_Garlic]

1 minute ago, Luftschiff said:

 

Well it happened like a year ago now, I posted that in march - but if memory serves it was on an MP server with icons on, it was very full in the days following the release. It was also firing at me at the time. 500m seems like a worryingly low draw distance, but I know tanks behave much the same for me. Finding tank columns is an exercise in futility when they lod out at twenty paces as though they expect me to duel them with pistols at dawn...

Maybe markers had something to do with it.  I'll have to try to record it happening.  I knew the rough location from my last sortie and it was unpleasant to not be able to react.  I can usually find trains and columns easily, my problem seems isolated to anti aircraft artillery.