La-5FN - impressions?

[CrazyDuck]

Hi chaps and chapettes,

 

After all the overheated puffery about the monstrosity named La-5FN even before the BOK was released, I'm kinda surprised there is no La-5FN dedicated topic yet. Here's my first, purely subjective impression.

 

La-5FN is a speed and climb demon (at low altitudes at least) no question, as it should be, to be frank. However, it is not really the top notch unbeatable dogfighter. A well flown G-2 or G-6 should be able to outfight it, especially in low speed high AoA knife fight. Seems like now the tables turned, it will be the Reds to run for their life with their FNs from 109s! Which might not be so easy for red pilots due to La-5FN frustratingly low never exceed velocity. 

 

We shouldn't forget that the La-5FN was in great part an answer to the "Fw 190 problem" (just like Yak-1B was an answer to "109F problem") - and these were mostly used as JaBos, dropping their bombs and running back home avoiding dogfighting. La-5FNs were the first red fighters to be able to consistently hunt them down and force them to fight.

 

And it seems to me that this is precisely what this sim appears to reflect!  Hats off to the devs, what else to say. 

 

[Jade_Monkey]

All i can say ia that i hate flying the La5 but the FN was very nice.

[EAF19_Marsh]

I taxied out to the runway, turned on the heat and thought '****!'; it has a lot of excess power but remains very easy to fly. Not tried it in a fight yet or the VNE (or any other V) but it seems like low-level bad news for any pilot caught at a disadvantage

[Voidhunger]

La5 is my favorite VVS fighter and I fly it almost exclusively when I play as VVS.

FN variant is icing on the cake. Its also best looking VVS plane for me.

[ATA_Vasilij]

I have never felt "how it is" to get closer and closer Bf, or FW in climbing... and yesterday I experienced this for the first time. Yes it was quite good, and nice feeling. 

I think I will get used to very soon.

 

La5FN is a killer and enormously danger plane. But more killls I got yesterday in an old nasty Lagg3. But La is beautiful and will be happy if few of them will be always somewhere around me. Just to be sure, no one of german cowards could escape. lol

 

 

[CrazyDuck]

48 minutes ago, 3.IAP_Vasilij said:

La5FN is a killer and enormously danger plane. But more killls I got yesterday in an old nasty Lagg3.

 

Yeah, my feeling precesely. (I assume you were flying a dogfighting, action server)

Yak-1 and Lagg-3 appear more potent close-in dogfighters. La-5FN however takes the cake with its tremendous speed and climb - and this is always more important than maneuverability in my book. 

[ATA_Vasilij]

Yes dogfighting. 

[Blackhawk_FR]

1 hour ago, 3.IAP_Vasilij said:

Just to be sure, no one of german cowards could escape. lol

 

... lol 

Well in my case, if I run away "like a coward" with a La5FN on my tail, it's just to take him away from the hot zone (and his friends), and then be able to kill him without being disturb 

 

 

To me I find it's difficult to aim correctly, due to: 

- the unsight visibility

- the super roll rate against heavy elevator

Otherwise, it's a great aircraft, pleasant to fly and fight with.

Edited March 15, 2018 by F/JG300_Faucon

[Max_Damage]

It is ahead of its opposition by 1 year or something. Its like a dora. That below 3000 of course.

 

Some tests: altitude gained after max speed horizontal flight at deck.

f4,g2 ~1400-1450m

g4 emergency ~ 1550m

a5 emergency ~ 1500-1550m

la5fn ~1700m or 1800m i dont remember.

 

However it cant outscissor or turnfight against a me109. If it comes to that you better out vertical the me109 after draining its speed in turns and do a hammerhead. The weapons are also slightly subpar IMO. I liked 2xUBS and shvak or 2xmg131 and mg151 better.

 

Also WEP drains fuel very quickly. There s no point in flying without a full tank.

Edited March 15, 2018 by Max_Damage

[Flitgun]

In the 20 minutes I've flown in it the FN seems much more stable and forgiving than was the previous 5/5F. By that I mean the FN's character seems much less likely to stall and one does not have to fly it on the knife edge that one does with the 5/5F. 

[Finkeren]

At first I thought that it was perhaps a little “too good” and would lead to loads of complaints from lufties, but after getting seal-clubbed in it for an hour by a pair of competent pilots - one 190 and one 109 - I have reached the conclusion, that it at best levels the playing field. The better pilot/team will have the upper hand.

[56RAF_Roblex]

 

I saw a speed table today that showed the LA5FN with Boost matching, and in places exceeding,  the 190-A5 from about 3500m downwards (and the Boosted LA-5  not being that much slower until 2000m )  but then below 800m the boosted FN actually slows down so by sea level it is 10kmh slower than the A5.  If that is true then the  usual wisdom of 'get it on the deck' no longer applies and you should try to stay at about 800m for best speed.

 

 

Edited March 15, 2018 by 56RAF_Roblex

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

4 hours ago, 3.IAP_Vasilij said:

 no one of german cowards could escape. lol

 

 

 

I prefer the term "Tactical Retreat!"

 

 

[Nightrise]

The FN is brutally fast and climbs like a rocket. a competent pilot is gonna wipe the floor in the thing. 

[Cpt_Siddy]

Remind me, how long can the A-5 hold the emergency power again? 

[Bilbo_Baggins]

9 hours ago, 56RAF_Roblex said:

 

I saw a speed table today that showed the LA5FN with Boost matching, and in places exceeding,  the 190-A5 from about 3500m downwards (and the Boosted LA-5  not being that much slower until 2000m )  but then below 800m the boosted FN actually slows down so by sea level it is 10kmh slower than the A5.  If that is true then the  usual wisdom of 'get it on the deck' no longer applies and you should try to stay at about 800m for best speed.

 

 

 

Not true. An LA5FN is not 10kmh slower than a AT. In fact it holds a formidable 585kmh on the deck. 

[rolikiraly]

13 hours ago, Finkeren said:

At first I thought that it was perhaps a little “too good” and would lead to loads of complaints from lufties, but after getting seal-clubbed in it for an hour by a pair of competent pilots - one 190 and one 109 - I have reached the conclusion, that it at best levels the playing field. The better pilot/team will have the upper hand.

 

Were you alone in the fight? Sorry but if it was 1v2 against competent pilots and you lost, it doesn't mean the plane is not superior. I'm no expert by any means but i'm under the impression so far that 2v1 is not a good way to judge the performance of an aircraft.

[Panthera]

I can for the life of me not hit 585 on the deck, what am I doing wrong here folks? 

[CrazyDuck]

12 minutes ago, rolikiraly said:

 

Were you alone in the fight? Sorry but if it was 1v2 against competent pilots and you lost, it doesn't mean the plane is not superior. I'm no expert by any means but i'm under the impression so far that 2v1 is not a good way to judge the performance of an aircraft.

 

I'm far from being a highly skilled dogfighter (flying ground attackers most of the time), but I got the impression that even in 1v1 G2 or even G6 is slightly better in a any kind of dogfighting - if 109 pilot manages to lure the FN pilot into a slow scissoring/turning fight, FN will be at a noticeable disadvantage. Of course FN is faster and appears to be faster climbing, but close in dogfighting? I dunno, wouldn't be my first pick - I'd rather take a Yak-1B for this kind of job.

 

[Finkeren]

26 minutes ago, rolikiraly said:

 

Were you alone in the fight? Sorry but if it was 1v2 against competent pilots and you lost, it doesn't mean the plane is not superior. I'm no expert by any means but i'm under the impression so far that 2v1 is not a good way to judge the performance of an aircraft.

 

Most of the time I was flying with a dude in a Yak-1b, also it was not always the two of them together.

 

I would say, that in most of the cases the tactical situation was fairly even. A couple times I even got the jump on one of them and still lost.

[Bilbo_Baggins]

2 hours ago, Panthera said:

I can for the life of me not hit 585 on the deck, what am I doing wrong here folks? 

 

Close outlet cowls. 

[Panthera]

1 minute ago, Mcdaddy said:

 

Close outlet cowls. 

 

Completely? I tried running a 40/40% mix of inlet & outlet, that only gave me 547 km/h

 

Edited March 16, 2018 by Panthera

[Finkeren]

2 hours ago, Panthera said:

I can for the life of me not hit 585 on the deck, what am I doing wrong here folks? 

 

I got it to 580 km/h on the Autumn map.

 

[Panthera]

1 minute ago, Finkeren said:

 

I got it to 580 km/h on the Autumn map.

 

 

 Would help to say with what settings

Edited March 16, 2018 by Panthera

[ShamrockOneFive]

First impressions of the La-5FN is that this is a very very good fighter but its turn is not as good as I had thought it might be. The Yak's are still better turn fighters as the La-5FN seems to bleed speed... More slowly than the La-5 to be sure but still notable. Better to fly this fast (which it is) and surprise the enemy. If you need to turn it can but don't do that for a while.

[Finkeren]

1 minute ago, Panthera said:

 

 Would help to say with what settings

Throttle 100%

Rpm 100%

Cowl inlet 5%

Cowl outlet 0%

Oil radiator 10%

 

Running hot, but no overheating.

Just now, ShamrockOneFive said:

First impressions of the La-5FN is that this is a very very good fighter but its turn is not as good as I had thought it might be. The Yak's are still better turn fighters as the La-5FN seems to bleed speed... More slowly than the La-5 to be sure but still notable. Better to fly this fast (which it is) and surprise the enemy. If you need to turn it can but don't do that for a while.

According to the specs the La-5's sustained turn rate is the same as the Bf 109G6, so a decent turner, but no more than that. The slats allows you to pull a lot of angles, but at the cost a great energy loss.

 

All seems to be as I'd expect.

[ShamrockOneFive]

3 minutes ago, Finkeren said:

Throttle 100%

Rpm 100%

Cowl inlet 5%

Cowl outlet 0%

Oil radiator 10%

 

Running hot, but no overheating.

According to the specs the La-5's sustained turn rate is the same as the Bf 109G6, so a decent turner, but no more than that. The slats allows you to pull a lot of angles, but at the cost a great energy loss.

 

All seems to be as I'd expect.

 

Precisely! Seems like the advantages/disadvantages are very well modeled and this aircraft will reward pilots who fly it well and pilots who don't will find themselves low, slow, and in a lot of trouble. No uber fighter here.

[Panthera]

7 minutes ago, Finkeren said:

Throttle 100%

Rpm 100%

Cowl inlet 5%

Cowl outlet 0%

Oil radiator 10%

 

Running hot, but no overheating.

According to the specs the La-5's sustained turn rate is the same as the Bf 109G6, so a decent turner, but no more than that. The slats allows you to pull a lot of angles, but at the cost a great energy loss.

 

All seems to be as I'd expect.

 

 

Alright, I was trying to avoid the overheat warning. How does your setting work for fighting?

 

I found 40/40  outlet & inlet, and 60 oil cooler works well for dogfighting. What is your experience?

[Finkeren]

1 minute ago, Panthera said:

 

 

Alright, I was trying to avoid the overheat warning. How does your setting work for fighting?

 

I found 40/40  outlet & inlet, and 60 oil cooler works well for dogfighting. What is your experience?

 

My settings in that test are unusable for combat. The engine would overheat immediately as soon as your speed drops and cooling becomes less efficient.

 

For combat (or really any situation) I always fly with oil cooler and cowl inlet fully open (their combined impact on speed is less than 10km/h and then regulate cylinder head temperature with the outlet flaps - usually 20-30% works for combat, 60-70% for long climbs and for cooling down after combat.

 

I only close everything during long dives at idle throttle to prevent overcooling.

 

 

[SJ_Butcher]

15 hours ago, Finkeren said:

At first I thought that it was perhaps a little “too good” and would lead to loads of complaints from lufties, but after getting seal-clubbed in it for an hour by a pair of competent pilots - one 190 and one 109 - I have reached the conclusion, that it at best levels the playing field. The better pilot/team will have the upper hand.

 

I don't care if the plane is uber as long is historical accurate, for balanced games we have warthunder

[Finkeren]

7 minutes ago, SJ_Butcher said:

 

I don't care if the plane is uber as long is historical accurate, for balanced games we have warthunder

Obviously I agree, but it might reduce my personal enjoyment of flying the FN in MP if getting kills in it felt completely effortless.

[SJ_Butcher]

1 minute ago, Finkeren said:

Obviously I agree, but it might reduce my personal enjoyment of flying the FN in MP if getting kills in it felt completely effortless.

 

it will never be effortless, the plane is fast but a turd maneuvering and slow acceleration compared with 109 or 190, 109 kills him maneuvering pretty easily and running climbing too

[Finkeren]

I disagree about the accelleration. The FN accellerated pretty darned well in my experience.

[Panthera]

14 minutes ago, Finkeren said:

 

My settings in that test are unusable for combat. The engine would overheat immediately as soon as your speed drops and cooling becomes less efficient.

 

For combat (or really any situation) I always fly with oil cooler and cowl inlet fully open (their combined impact on speed is less than 10km/h and then regulate cylinder head temperature with the outlet flaps - usually 20-30% works for combat, 60-70% for long climbs and for cooling down after combat.

 

I only close everything during long dives at idle throttle to prevent overcooling.

 

 

 

Thank you, I will try these settings when I take it out again tonight

[216th_Jordan]

I said it before, it isn't the beast people make it to. An airplane's performance is more than raw numbers. G6 lacks in that regard but ohh its a beast with good capabilities.

 

People are just too much comparing this sim with old Il-2 and failing to see old Il-2s deficiencies or taking them for real.

[88.IAP_Victor]

I did my first flight on WoL yesterday eveneing. The plane ist good, i liked to fly it and killed an 190. It runs good, it climbs good at low altitude. I had a good aim on a 109 in my sights and a to view on the other 109 just 20 meters behind me ;-)

[ATA_Vasilij]

Yayay.... I fought with 5FN against G6 and after the scissors, where G6 was better, I pulled the throttle to run away. AND I was faster and were going further and further from G6 LOL, I never had such experience, I didnt know what to do at this moment. It was sooo weird

 

[CrazyDuck]

Let's not forget we're only discussing the FN on the deck. 

 

How's the FN up at, say, 3.000 m altitude? Or higher, like 6.000 m, a 109 safe heaven? Remains competitive?

[Cpt_Siddy]

2 hours ago, Panthera said:

 

Completely? I tried running a 40/40% mix of inlet & outlet, that only gave me 547 km/h

 

 

 

Why would you not open inlets to 100%? Is there some reason for that? As far as i know, there is no air drag benefits to keep them close. 

Edited March 16, 2018 by Cpt_Siddy

[-=PHX=-SuperEtendard]

1 hour ago, Finkeren said:

Throttle 100%

Rpm 100%

Cowl inlet 5%

Cowl outlet 0%

Oil radiator 10%

I  managed 582 km/h with almost same settings as you, but cowl inlet full open. It gives more cooling and in theory it would cause less drag (as you are not forcing air to move away from the nose)