P-47 rocket armament

[angus26]

I was wondering, on the p-47, are there any positives of the m8 rockets over the later HVAR rockets? And in the BoB time-frame, will we be seeing the introduction of HVARs or would we still see the m8 rockets used? 

(Below are some images of the different rockets) 

[69th_chuter]

The advantage of the M10 (and M8) is that it was in use when the HVAR was not yet available.  Once the HVAR reached the front lines there really was no reason to continue with the M10 as the HVAR was faster (1300 fps vs 865 fps) making it more accurate and it had greater lethality (armor: 1.75 in vs 1 in;  reinforced concrete: 3 ft vs 1 ft).  After launch the HVAR mounts weighed 16 lbs (16 mounts for 8 rockets) with low drag vs the bazooka launch system weighing 200 lbs with those six tubes hanging in the breeze.

 

Bazookas were definitely used right up to the end by some units but HVARs became available after D-Day to only select units and I'm not sure how fast availability ramped up and what units got them first or who was using them in Jan '45.  A long-winded "I have no idea" - lol.  Want to see the new shift knob I got for my BRZ?

[angus26]

13 hours ago, chuter said:

The advantage of the M10 (and M8) is that it was in use when the HVAR was not yet available.  Once the HVAR reached the front lines there really was no reason to continue with the M10 as the HVAR was faster (1300 fps vs 865 fps) making it more accurate and it had greater lethality (armor: 1.75 in vs 1 in;  reinforced concrete: 3 ft vs 1 ft).  After launch the HVAR mounts weighed 16 lbs (16 mounts for 8 rockets) with low drag vs the bazooka launch system weighing 200 lbs with those six tubes hanging in the breeze.

 

Bazookas were definitely used right up to the end by some units but HVARs became available after D-Day to only select units and I'm not sure how fast availability ramped up and what units got them first or who was using them in Jan '45.  A long-winded "I have no idea" - lol.  Want to see the new shift knob I got for my BRZ?

Were the m10 rocket launchers more accurate?I mean sure lower velocity, but a long tube to travel through, that has gotta do something right?

[Finkeren]

24 minutes ago, angus26 said:

Were the m10 rocket launchers more accurate?I mean sure lower velocity, but a long tube to travel through, that has gotta do something right?

 

A long barrel pretty much does nothing to stabilize a projectile unless it is tight fitting and rifled. Both the M10 and the HVAR are fin-stabilized, which does pretty much the same thing as rifling (and the same as the fletching on an arrow) it makes the projectile spin along its axis which keeps it stable in flight.

[CrazyDuck]

13 hours ago, chuter said:

the bazooka launch system weighing 200 lbs with those six tubes hanging in the breeze.

 

Could those be jettisoned once empty? They appear awfully draggy indeed.

[angus26]

22 minutes ago, CrazyDuck said:

 

Could those be jettisoned once empty? They appear awfully draggy indeed.

I am pretty sure they wouldn't be jettisoned, considering that it was a re-loadable rocket launcher

[Eicio]

19 minutes ago, CrazyDuck said:

 

Could those be jettisoned once empty? They appear awfully draggy indeed.

 

I don't think so, at this time nothing could really be jettisoned. I guess that you could've drop your bombs unarmed but the only case of dedicated armament jettisoned in WWII I know of is the 75mm of the hs 129 that could be dropped if it really was necessary.

[CrazyDuck]

Just now, angus26 said:

I am pretty sure they wouldn't be jettisoned, considering that it was a re-loadable rocket launcher

 

Yeah, I'd assume you'd bring them back for reuse if possible, but could the pilot jettison them in emergency?

 

For example the Hs 129 could jettison the entire 75 mm cannon in need.

[CrazyDuck]

5 minutes ago, Eicio said:

 

I don't think so, at this time nothing could really be jettisoned. I guess that you could've drop your bombs unarmed but the only case of dedicated armament jettisoned in WWII I know of is the 75mm of the hs 129 that could be dropped if it really was necessary.

 

Uh, sounds terrible having to drag these empty, draggy tubes around being jumped by a gaggle of wurgers!

[Eicio]

3 minutes ago, CrazyDuck said:

 

Uh, sounds terrible having to drag these empty, draggy tubes around being jumped by a gaggle of wurgers!

 

That still exist nowadays, think of the vikhr for russians planes. That's not that bad when your primary role is CAS. As a jug you're still fast and if you have those M8 you're not supposed to engage ennemy fighters anyway.

 

For an  exemple take you're future p38: the m8 won't be such a trouble since even without you won't have a chance on a duel.

[JtD]

Between P-51D, P-47D and P-38L, the P-38 should still be the best dogfighter of the three. With propwash modelled as strongly as it is, we should finally be able to see good turning performance for the P-38 in a game. In particular in comparison with the P-47D, the P-38L should be better in turn, climb and roll, while being as fast. Of course, it all heavily depends on engine models and boosts, which we don't know yet.

[Farky]

10 hours ago, CrazyDuck said:

 

Could those be jettisoned once empty? They appear awfully draggy indeed.

 

Yes.

PILOT TRAINING MANUAL FOR THE THUNDERBOLT P-47 (AAF Manual No. 50-5), page 82 : "The tubes are made of steel or thin plastic material and may be jettisoned either before or after the rockets have been fired."

And pilots did that , I have some Daily Operations Reports from 350th FG (based in Italy at that time) and in box "Explosive Jettisoned" are sometimes rockets M8 including launcher. Reasons for jettisoned rockets in reports varies - "Due weather", "Mechanical failure", "Flak damage to a/c" or "for better strafing".

[angus26]

3 hours ago, Farky said:

 

Yes.

PILOT TRAINING MANUAL FOR THE THUNDERBOLT P-47 (AAF Manual No. 50-5), page 82 : "The tubes are made of steel or thin plastic material and may be jettisoned either before or after the rockets have been fired."

And pilots did that , I have some Daily Operations Reports from 350th FG (based in Italy at that time) and in box "Explosive Jettisoned" are sometimes rockets M8 including launcher. Reasons for jettisoned rockets in reports varies - "Due weather", "Mechanical failure", "Flak damage to a/c" or "for better strafing".

So they were only jettisoned for emergencies?

[Farky]

Yes, it looks like they usually bring rocket launchers back to base.

[Gambit21]

Yes - installing ordinance of any kind represented labor on the part of the ground crew. In fact more than one Jug crew chief requested that external fuel tanks not be dropped either unless absolutely necessary.

[-EAGLE-Shifter]

Yes,  was jettisoned for emergencies.

how ditched to water with rockets,  or bombs? For this critical situations and i think for dogfight is 100% better jettisoned all. 

Edited November 30, 2018 by OREL_Shifty

[MiloMorai]

On ‎3‎/‎10‎/‎2018 at 8:06 PM, Eicio said:

 

I don't think so, at this time nothing could really be jettisoned. I guess that you could've drop your bombs unarmed but the only case of dedicated armament jettisoned in WWII I know of is the 75mm of the hs 129 that could be dropped if it really was necessary.

 

The 210mm launchers used by the Germans (Fw190, Me110) could be jettisoned..

[-EAGLE-Shifter]

In the game LSft+D to jettisoned rocket lunchers.

 

Edited December 1, 2018 by OREL_Shifty

[Sgtslick952]

Relative Noobie to iL2.

How can I equip the P47 with rockets? Seems like the default loadout is guns and bombs.

At least in Campaign mode. I’m currently playing the Huertgen Forest campaign and I can see where the loadout is “locked”.

if I’m doing a Quick Mission in the P47 can I equip it with rockets depending on the mission type?

[Aapje]

You can only switch the loadout for a campaign if the campaign designer decided to let you do that.