A20 Flying Tank?

[SCG_CoolWhip]

Hi Guys, Just a thought I've been thinking about alot lately, while I had time in the process of trying to take down a PE-2/IL2.

What do you guys think, How hard will it be to take down the A20?? Will it be another flying tank for the Russians?

[Gambit21]

The IL2 is the flying tank, not the Peshka.

[Finkeren]

Well, the A-20 did have a reputation as a tough and sturdy aircraft. It also has radial engines protected from behind by long nacelles. 

 

I think it’s going to be a tough nut to crack.

[BlitzPig_EL]

I won't even try to predict how damage resistant it will be.

 

It's still just a thin skinned aluminum monocoque aircraft after all.

[[APAF]VR_Spartan85]

1 hour ago, Finkeren said:

Well, the A-20 did have a reputation as a tough and sturdy aircraft. It also has radial engines protected from behind by long nacelles. 

 

I think it’s going to be a tough nut to crack.

Frontal attack taking out the pilot directly or few pot shots to an engine spinner, I would say is the best bet.. tail and lower gunner look pretty serious..

[Ehret]

The A20 may have only 2 50 cals in the front but with a proper sight, so going h2h will not be risk free. The fuselage is high so deflection shots from sides should be relatively safe and not too hard. The major A20 defense is speed, thought - already faster that the P40 in level flight and what it will be in shallow dive?

[Dutchvdm]

I was under the impression that the early A-20’s wherr not accepted by the USAAF because lack of armor and self sealkng tanks. 

 

Grt M

[Dutchvdm]

Here is the snippit:

 

”The Douglas A-20B was the first version of the Havoc to be produced in large numbers for the USAAF, but it lacked self-sealing fuel tanks and did not have enough armour. In October 1940 Douglas received an order for 999 A-20Bs, all of which were produced at their Long Beach factory. The A-20B resembled the  French DB-7A, having the same square edged glass panels in the nose. The lack of self-sealing fuel tanks meant that the A-20B was not really suited for front line combat duties, although 665 were sent to the Soviet Union under lend-lease. Eight more went to the US Navy as the  BD-2.”

[Trooper117]

Flying tank... Not a chance.

The later versions with a shed load of ordnance in the nose could pack a punch, but that was still vulnerable.

You want a tank, stick with the IL2...

[Ehret]

Just now, Trooper117 said:

You want a tank, stick with the IL2...

 

And speed and altitude in case of the A20 - now it's clear why she flies so well for a bomber. (and why Soviets got A20s...)

Edited March 8, 2018 by Ehret

[Eicio]

37 minutes ago, Ehret said:

 

And speed and altitude in case of the A20 - now it's clear why she flies so well for a bomber. (and why Soviets got A20s...)

 

Except that soviet pilots didn't fly at high altitudes especially the bombers.

 

I believe that it'll be fly like a "blitz-bomber".

 

And anyway flying high would not be a so great idea when 109s are around.

[Godspeed]

Bit off topic but does the A20 come with option for Ball Turret?

UTK-1 Turret or 2 M2 Browning

Edited March 8, 2018 by Godspeed
Reasons

[Eicio]

Defensive armament:

Top: 12.7mm machine gun ANM2 .50, 390 rounds, 850 rounds per minute

Belly: 7.92mm machine gun ANM2 .30, 600 rounds, 1150 rounds per minute

 

But there is no turret option.

The defensive armament of the a20 will probably geave people another reason to fly it low.

[Godspeed]

Okay Thanks

 

Im pretty sure i will enjoy A-20 because it has some shared aspects of Bf-110.

From low level bombing missions in mind and lovely armament for pilot even not that great as 110 but not so far either.

 

Pe-2 is also lot of enjoyment too but i think its very painful to fly with one engine.

Also would be great to have Pe-3 what is more of plane to my taste. ( Maybe someday they will make it happen )

 

Heavy Fighters are my home and A-20 most likely be my fafourites even its not really heavy fighter but i will certainly try/use it as such.

 

[BlitzPig_EL]

The engines on the A20 should be more resistant to ground fire than the Pe2 or Bf110, being air cooled and not having any radiators or glycol to worry about.

[Poochnboo]

"its not really heavy fighter but i will certainly try/use it as such."

 

 Hoo boy! I wouldn't do that, if I was you. It's a bomber. It's big and heavy and can't maneuver. And it's no flying tank. You're going to die....a lot. Want a twin engined fighter cause you like the gunner back there? Better stay in your '110. 

[Ehret]

The A20 has only slightly lower power-loading than the 110-G2, when both are in combat/emergency settings. The P40 is slower in level flight at some altitudes than the A20. Still, she isn't a fighter, but some fighter's tactics may apply.

[Herne]

I think I've heard talk about a 4G limitation before bad stuff starts happening. If you are going to try and throw this heavy beast around the sky like a fighter. I think you will probably need to take care

[Godspeed]

Pe-2 can be used as fighter when situation needs im sure A-20 can be used aswell.

Mostly my targets are in ground but i have many times attacked HE-111 along the flight with great results.

 

There is many cases that i have dropped my bombs but the AI is still in work in process and i have started to "escort" them with Pe-2 against fighters.

Many kills there too.

 

You people might be suprised what A-20 can do when your bomb load is gone and little bit fuel aswell.

 

Dont judge about others opinion without trying to see what they are after without some historical knowledge.

Everheard of P-70 Nighthawk ? I bet you guys dont well USAAF did think differently than you guys maybe you should have been there to lead them with your wisdom.

 

https://www.militaryfactory.com/aircraft/detail.asp?aircraft_id=1214 Some info but most likely you knew all this already

There was few kills scored with P-70 but nothing spectacular but there was a time for it in history.

 

Like i said earlier it would be nice to have Pe-3.

 

 

 

Edited March 12, 2018 by Godspeed

[216th_Jordan]

12 hours ago, =FEW=Herne said:

I think I've heard talk about a 4G limitation before bad stuff starts happening. If you are going to try and throw this heavy beast around the sky like a fighter. I think you will probably need to take care

 

Oh SNAP! The wing!

[Poochnboo]

18 hours ago, Godspeed said:

Mostly my targets are in ground but i have many times attacked HE-111 along the flight with great results.

    Ah, well, if you're talking about going after bombers, sure. If you want to do that, it's too bad we aren't getting the solid nosed G models. Packed with guns. When I heard it said that someone wants to use the A-20 as a fighter I'm thinking he wants to dogfight in it!

   The P-70, though, wasn't the best of night fighters, really. I'm sure some of those guys flying it were glad to see it go when the P-61 came along.

[Godspeed]

As expected A-20B can fight back when situation needs.

It can make pretty tight turns too.

 

Pretty nimble bomber i like it very mutch.

Im sure i will start VVS career soon with it.

 

Pe-2 is fine machine too but i like A-20 more now.

 

 

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

I’ve had no difficulties downing the A20 with the G6. Her gunners are not nearly so fearsome as they were in ‘46.  She is hardy but hardly armored either. Fairly maneuverable but not compared to an actual fighter. Fun to fly? Yes! Used as a fighter? Hardly. Remember, the Pe2 was designed as a heavy fighter then repurposed as a bomber. Using the A20 as such will be a difficult proposition to say the least.

[Godspeed]

16 minutes ago, II/JG17_HerrMurf said:

I’ve had no difficulties downing the A20 with the G6. Her gunners are not nearly so fearsome as they were in ‘46.  She is hardy but hardly armored either. Fairly maneuverable but not compared to an actual fighter. Fun to fly? Yes! Used as a fighter? Hardly. Remember, the Pe2 was designed as a heavy fighter then repurposed as a bomber. Using the A20 as such will be a difficult proposition to say the least.

 

Yes and USA designed A-20 bomber to be a night fighter known as P-70.

It was not mutch of success but least they knew that the project has some potential.

Here is some pretty rare video material:

 

 

Edited March 21, 2018 by Godspeed

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

Flying in the dark of night, straight and level, with radar, against aircraft with no countermeasures is vastly different than engaging daylight fighters. Good luck.

[Max_Damage]

The A20 is pretty bad. The fuel tanks are not fire protected. And the engines are HUGE  and easily hit/damaged/destroyed/set afire.

Edited March 21, 2018 by Max_Damage

[Eicio]

It's really nice to fly but the worst thing isn't the armor, it's the rear gunner, if a plane is in your 6 you can't engage him, and the ammo magazine is terrible by the way.

 

So it's close to have no defensive capabilities while the pe-2 and Il-2 are really dangerous for everything.

[LLv24_SukkaVR]

They are indeed easy to shoot down. Pe-2 is a lot more dangerous to attack since it has wider field of fire, doesnt have to reload all the time because it uses single ammo belt instead of those ridiculously small ammo boxes (50 rounds per box?) and your tail doesnt obstruct your firing. But what i really like about A-20 is the speed and agility.

[LukeFF]

4 hours ago, NahkaSukka said:

(50 rounds per box?)

 

30 

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

21 minutes ago, LukeFF said:

 

30 

 

Wow, that’s crazy. Even the M-60D, disintegrating link, box I learned on was 250. UH-1’s and UH-60’s.

 

edit: might have been 200. It’s been a while.....