If I buy "Bodenplatte"....?

[Hauksbee]

If I buy "Battle of Bodenplatte" (and I probably will) and if I fly the Me-262 (how could I not?) will there be bombers worthy of it? Or will I only be able to chase down fighters?

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

The A-20 and Pe-2 were both still employed from the East so you'll have something to run after, and there will be an AI B-25 for the West.

[ShamrockOneFive]

The B-25 would be the largest bomber to attack with the Me262 at this point.

 

I can see myself flying the Me262 more as a "Schnellbomber" (assuming that modification is available) more than fighter.

[MrNoice]

in my opinion the Me262 will be useless without the 4 engine bombers.. the p51s and specially Tempest will destroy it easy and itself cant maneuver well and one bullet in the turbines and it will burn/explode.. so ...

Edited December 17, 2017 by KG_S_MrFies

[Lusekofte]

The B-25 would be the largest bomber to attack with the Me262 at this point.

 

I can see myself flying the Me262 more as a "Schnellbomber" (assuming that modification is available) more than fighter.

In fact this is the only service it was involved in when it came to Bodenplatte , if we get a fighter version , it will not be quite correct. Like the G 1 version we got in BOS , IL 2 42 with 37 mm cannons. These things have not been of importance earlier in this program , so I see no reason for not getting both versions. I probably gonna fly it oncce, just to see how it act in this gameengine myself. 

[Luftschiff]

one bullet in the turbines and it will burn/explode.. so ...

 

Ah, just like the existing German fighters! 

[Lusekofte]

Not quite, Its weakness was mostly fragile nature of jet engine. As long as the engine is not imbedded in fueltanks like modern fighters it should not easily catch fire caused by bullets. You can in many ways compare these engines with Jet liners and A 10 . However not having the metal needed for making engines last longer than 10 hours flight time. It means it will not be much of a challange for anything hitting it. The fire that did occure was more the mixture of air , fuel and heat making it prone to catch fire if throttled up recklessly when starting to taxi or flame out during flight , like when attacked while landing , they really could not accellerate 

[PatrickAWlson]

Me262 will be the ultimate one pass and run aircraft.  100MPH faster than the competition but unable to maneuver with any opposing fighter.  In MP, especially without icons, it will be deadly.  Oddly enough it is SP where it will be crippled because the AI sees all.  

 

It should still be fun against medium bombers.  Historically it was used against them (Galland was shot down after an attack on US mediums).  Then you can experience the joy of repeated attacks on the bomber formation while the escorts cannot catch you.

[US63_SpadLivesMatter]

Have fun with those Pe2 gunners...

[Gambit21]

in my opinion the Me262 will be useless without the 4 engine bombers.. the p51s and specially Tempest will destroy it easy and itself cant maneuver well and one bullet in the turbines and it will burn/explode.. so ...

No other aircraft can catch it unless it's landing or taking off.

Edited December 17, 2017 by Gambit21

[Mitthrawnuruodo]

I do not understand the claims that 262 will be useless. 

 

Not only is it very fast, but it also has perhaps the best cannons. If bomb modifications are available, it will be one of the most versatile aircraft. 

 

Make a high-speed dash to the target area, drop bombs, then obliterate any air contacts that aren't paying attention during your flight home. 

[MrNoice]

well... we will see how the mk 108 will work ^^ and I guess it will be really really fragile and tempest can catch up with it

[Gambit21]

Eh no.

[US63_SpadLivesMatter]

Did the me262 intercept bombers and ground attackers at 12 meters off the ground?

 

Because if the game we have is any indication, that is where they will need to do it.

[Finkeren]

well... we will see how the mk 108 will work ^^ and I guess it will be really really fragile and tempest can catch up with it

Come on. This is getting tiresome.

[Dakpilot]

Tiresome and boring

 

Cheers, Dakpilot

[Gambit21]

Tiresome and boring

 

Cheers, Dakpilot

...and juvenile.

[TheBlackPenguin]

well... we will see how the mk 108 will work ^^ and I guess it will be really really fragile and tempest can catch up with it

 

There is an account of such, but only because he kept it within sight as it kept getting further and further away and eventually caught up to it as it slowed down (to land most likely), the pilot actually, perhaps recklessly flew into Germany alone to shoot it down. this was during the time the Luftwaffe were using 262's to drop anti-personnel mines over Allied airfields.The account is in the video Tempest at War.

 

Anyway, this is about the 262, I am sure we're all at least going to give it a go . Kind of a shame we won't be seeing the Meteor, it's just on the cusp of this, but its numbers were low and they weren't allowed to fly over enemy territory.

[CanadaOne]

No other aircraft can catch it unless it's landing or taking off.

 

And I hope that means we'll get some big ass concrete airfields. If we're lucky, they will be available in the QMB as populated airfields. That would be great!

[Lusekofte]

Have fun with those Pe2 gunners...

 

I think this will be a hot theme actually when the time comes

I do not understand the claims that 262 will be useless. 

 

Not only is it very fast, but it also has perhaps the best cannons. If bomb modifications are available, it will be one of the most versatile aircraft. 

 

Make a high-speed dash to the target area, drop bombs, then obliterate any air contacts that aren't paying attention during your flight home. 

I think you got two kind of people here, 

1 think it is a yberplane and will rule the sky

2 think it will be utter rubbish

 

Expirience in this game tells me it will be a deadly plane for smart patient pilots (not me) a coffin for unpatient ones(me) and it will be dived on by Tempest and P 51, and it will be shot down the moment someone loose speed. And people will complain

[Mitthrawnuruodo]

Can anyone comment on the accuracy of the 262 flight models in 1946 and perhaps War Thunder?

[Lusekofte]

I read a lot of anecdotes about the 262 , and in my opinion the 262 was well modeled in old IL 2 taking the game engine and damage model into account. It bleeded energy where it supposed to. The only thing IL 2 did not take was the flame out that could happened if you throttled up to fast in flight. It did catch fire if you did it starting taxiing , but that was only a risk and not a rule in my understanding, but in IL 2 it did always For warthunder I do not know, I guess the FM is a bit more arcadish than it should

[sniperton]

...and juvenile.

Don't tell me we're old farts  

Better young than dead

[Feathered_IV]

If you’re a multiplayer type you won’t see the B-25, so the Pe-2 and A-20 will be the biggest target you get.

On the brighter side, it’s very unlikely however that the 262 will be widely available in MP servers in order to maintain an artificial balance, so the lack of appropriate targets should rarely be an issue.

[Gambit21]

If you’re a multiplayer type you won’t see the B-25, so the Pe-2 and A-20 will be the biggest target you get.

 

How do you figure?

I used AI B-17's in 1946 all the time in my CoOp missions.

One side defends them, the other side tries to shoot them down.

[ShamrockOneFive]

If you’re a multiplayer type you won’t see the B-25, so the Pe-2 and A-20 will be the biggest target you get.

On the brighter side, it’s very unlikely however that the 262 will be widely available in MP servers in order to maintain an artificial balance, so the lack of appropriate targets should rarely be an issue.

 

I wouldn't say that necessarily. Especially with co-op missions where we're more likely to see AI planes... we'll definitely see the B-25. Also, I hold out some hope that it will be a flyable someday. Jason at least mused at the idea long term (though he made no promises of course).

[Feathered_IV]

Why bud? You see a 262 on your 6 and all you have to do is to turn hard. The slow Ass Cannons and the high speed of the plane do the rest, then the 262 has to make a turn which radius is bigger than france to make another run on you. 

 

Its not the evading, but rather the difficulty in getting a shot at them that sees opposing players campaigning for their removal.  I rarely saw the 262 available in public servers in Oleg's Il-2 in any numbers or without significant handicaps so as to make them unviable.

 

How do you figure?

I used AI B-17's in 1946 all the time in my CoOp missions.

One side defends them, the other side tries to shoot them down.

 

I was thinking of regular multiplayer servers.  Personally I like to see AI aircraft, but BoS struggles to put AI aircraft into the air in MP and there are a very vocal group who are dead set against them. 

[VeryOldMan]

in my opinion the Me262 will be useless without the 4 engine bombers.. the p51s and specially Tempest will destroy it easy and itself cant maneuver well and one bullet in the turbines and it will burn/explode.. so ...

Unly if the 262 pilots are horrible.

 

Making  passes, specially as a bomber at speeds very high  will make nearly impossible to  intercept them away from the bases unless the 262 pilots get too cocky and make approaches in  wrong angles.

[Tomsk]

Expirience in this game tells me it will be a deadly plane for smart patient pilots (not me) a coffin for unpatient ones(me) and it will be dived on by Tempest and P 51, and it will be shot down the moment someone loose speed. And people will complain

 

This in my opinion. Well flown it will be essentially untouchable, but virtually all the kills made in it will be against an unaware enemy: one pass haul ass style. Of course, most air kills in WWII were of made against an unaware enemy.

 

But yes, I'm sure plenty of people will think it's totally uber and try to turn fight in it .. and they'll find out the hard way that it's not good at that.

 

Personally I think it'll be quite a fun SP / Coop plane, although as PatrickAWilson points out it might have trouble with the all-seeing AI (I wish that would get fixed!). However, in MP I expect it to be severely restricted or outright disallowed on most servers ... since it's essentially impossible to balance for.

Edited December 18, 2017 by Tomsk

[Hauksbee]

in my opinion the Me262 will be useless without the 4 engine bombers.. the p51s and specially Tempest will destroy it easy and itself cant maneuver well and one bullet in the turbines and it will burn/explode.. so ...

I agree. This is how I feel about it.

[Mac_Messer]

Why bud? You see a 262 on your 6 and all you have to do is to turn hard. The slow Ass Cannons and the high speed of the plane do the rest, then the 262 has to make a turn which radius is bigger than france to make another run on you. 

You are getting it wrong. The plane is for fast flying through the enemy crowd, plowing through it so to speak. All it takes is one hit. It really is a very easy plane for the veterans but since scrubs love to fly it, well, not often do you see a veteran using it as it should be used.

[1_Robert_]

I'm curious what the non-combat loss rate was for the 262 and how that compared to the other fighter aircraft in the war. The aircraft just seemed way too finicky and delicate (engine). Even in the above video, that looked like a decent touchdown and yet again, another fire. Modeling that correctly would be awfully frustrating for a game. Quick takeoff and...I'm on fire. Nice 2 kill sortie and just need to land...and another fire. 

[1_Robert_]

It didn't have a huge non combat lose rate.  

Thanks for the response. Yes I wondered if it was as bad as it seemed or if maybe I was just reading about the few instances and it just seemed a bigger problem than reality. 

[LukeFF]

While 262s were on their attack runs on enemies, they have never been shot down in that phase, only when they were about to land or already caught by the well known airfield strafers.

 

Never? That was hardly the case in reality. The death of Walter Nowotny is one such case.

 

I think they will "nerf" it. Because it would make a huge unbalance on the server to have a squadron of Me262 guys that know what to do.

 

Oh look, another person predicting doom and gloom. 

Edited December 18, 2017 by LukeFF

[PatrickAWlson]

Never? That was hardly the case in reality. The death of Walter Nowotny is one such case.

 

 

Oh look, another person predicting doom and gloom. 

 

I thought Nowotny was shot down as he was approaching his base.  Could be wrong on that.  I know that Galland was shot down after a run on a group of B25s and not on approach.  

 

Anyhow, Nowotny and Galland are two examples of very good pilots shot down in the 262.  The 262 was a great plane, but like every other plane in WWII it was not invincible. 

[Feathered_IV]

That's right. Novotony was killed while preparing to land. I don't think it's doom and gloom to suggest that the availability of the 262 will be strictly limited on multiplayer servers. That's just how it goes.

[LukeFF]

I thought Nowotny was shot down as he was approaching his base.  Could be wrong on that.  I know that Galland was shot down after a run on a group of B25s and not on approach.  

 

Anyhow, Nowotny and Galland are two examples of very good pilots shot down in the 262.  The 262 was a great plane, but like every other plane in WWII it was not invincible. 

 

While it is not certain exactly how Nowontny's 262 caught fire, the information in Axel Urbanke's book on III./JG 54 (who covered the 262s of Kdo Nowotny) points to Nowotny's plane catching fire some time after engaging in combat with P-51s and heavy bombers and diving through the clouds before impacting the ground. Combat reports from American pilots who were chasing Nowotny's 262 state that, without warning, it suddenly rolled and dived in. Lieutenant Stevens, who claimed a 262 in that area, was likely the one who had previously scored hits on his plane, as he did claim a 262 shot down that day.

 

There isn't anything there that suggests Nowotny was on landing approach.

Edited December 19, 2017 by LukeFF

[PatrickAWlson]

While it is not certain exactly how Nowontny's 262 caught fire, the information in Axel Urbanke's book on III./JG 54 (who covered the 262s of Kdo Nowotny) points to Nowotny's plane catching fire some time after engaging in combat with P-51s and heavy bombers and diving through the clouds before impacting the ground. Combat reports from American pilots who were chasing Nowotny's 262 state that, without warning, it suddenly rolled and dived in. Lieutenant Stevens, who claimed a 262 in that area, was likely the one who had previously scored hits on his plane, as he did claim a 262 shot down that day.

 

There isn't anything there that suggests Nowotny was on landing approach.

 

Galland (First and the Last) states that he heard Nowotny coming in.  Nowotny's plane was then seen to plunge vertically out of the clouds and into the ground.  The stories are not entirely inconsistent.  Maybe Nowotny was already damaged an injured when he was trying to RTB - don't know.  He did crash near his base.

[SCG_Space_Ghost]

Galland (First and the Last) states that he heard Nowotny coming in.  Nowotny's plane was then seen to plunge vertically out of the clouds and into the ground.  The stories are not entirely inconsistent.  Maybe Nowotny was already damaged an injured when he was trying to RTB - don't know.  He did crash near his base.

 

Take everything Galland says with a hefty dose of salt.

 

Galland himself had a hefty dose of salt.

[6./ZG26_Gielow]