Rearm

[DarkwingDuck]

Hi, Incluides the upcoming update Rearm, Refuel and Repair ?

[Asgar]

no

[DarkwingDuck]

OK, Thanks

[Jade_Monkey]

Yawn

[Finkeren]

Nope, Fortunately there are no such plans at the moment.

[Custard]

Don't see the appeal of this oft requested feature tbh, it's not particularly realistic and I can think of about a million things that are better uses of the devs limited resources.

Edited December 7, 2017 by Custard

[Finkeren]

Don't see the appeal of this oft requested feature tbh, it's not particularly realistic and I can think of about a million things that are better uses of the devs limited resources.

It’s one of those things that people have gotten used to in WT and have internalized, without actually considering how little sense it makes.

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

It has its applications, but not in the scale of maps and missions in Il-2. I've had to use refueling very often in DCS during a ground-attack campaign.

 

The Su-25 has very short legs so the 180km trip from Sochi to Krasnodar plus ten minutes working on targets and dodging all kinds of anti-aircraft contraptions usually leaves you running on fumes most of the time (had more fuel starvation incidents than I'd like to admit). That leaves three alternatives - trade ordinance for external fuel tanks, reduce time over target (and thus combat efficiency) to spend less fuel, or make a stopover in one of the nearby airports (Maykop, Novorossiysk or Gelendzhik) to top up the tanks on the way home. I usually opt for the latter.

 

It's a very zen thing to crawl out of hell, take stock of the damage, climb out to 4000m and gently cruise to Maykop with an eye on the fuel gauge. Landing is done the standard way, followed by taxi to the dispersal area, shutting down the engines and waiting until they've fully stopped. As you wait for that, and then the five or more minutes it takes for the ground crew to refuel the aircraft, it's nice to think about the engagement that just happened and make any notes for future ones on the long way home. That adds a lot to the experience.

 

Within Il-2 however I can't see the application of it because most targets are well within reach of aircraft's range, it's more of a end-user problem that everyone thinks they need to take the bare minimum fuel to fly there and back.

[DarkwingDuck]

I m working on a smal SP mission, its a little for training with varios Targetareas and Targets for The PE.

With PE i can load 10 x 100kg, 4 x 250kg or 2 x 500kg bombs.  When my bombs gona, the mission is finish, but, not all targets are destroyed.

For this im find it good you can reload and start the new for kill the other targets, and its a good feeling start the new.

But its equal, when we not have this  feature, it was only a  qestion.

 

And, no, im not flying WT, flying DCS and BOS.

Edited December 7, 2017 by DarkwingDuck

[sinned]

This is a good feature to have for sp as well as mp. Dynamic campaign sp missions will bring more immersion from rearm, refuel a d repair.

[Finkeren]

This is a good feature to have for sp as well as mp. Dynamic campaign sp missions will bring more immersion from rearm, refuel a d repair.

 

How so? Rearming/refueling virtually never happened with the pilot sitting in the cockpit, and repairs certainly didn't.

 

Such a feature would be an immersion breaker for me.

[Eicio]

It’s one of those things that people have gotten used to in WT and have internalized, without actually considering how little sense it makes.

 

This doesn't come from WT but from DCS and it makes sense, it's nice to be able to refuel and rearm after a mission to go for another round right after. It's more immersive than land, exit and spawn in another plane in multiplayer and it also means that you're able to continue to fly in SP while now you have to end the mission in some way when you're out of ammo/payload/fuel.

 

It doesn't break the fourth wall if you prefer. (even if it's not realistic to repair your in 5 minutes it gratifys you for a successful landing after beeing badly hit, so this kind of features add much to a sim and are not pointless at all).

[Rolling_Thunder]

The only benefit to this, i see, is in the current system folk are penalised when the server or your team is full and once you land you may not be able to fly again for the side you just flew for. Having to switch sides results in a time penalty.

Other than that I see no benefit to sitting in a cockpit waiting a couple of minutes for a process that irl took hours and in the case of some repairs days.

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

How so? Rearming/refueling virtually never happened with the pilot sitting in the cockpit, and repairs certainly didn't.

 

Such a feature would be an immersion breaker for me.

Almost. Night bombers used to rearm and refuel very quickly between sorties, often with the crew aboard.

[Eicio]

Wether you prefer to rearm or to spawn in another aircraft it's unrealistic, some just think it's more immersive and gratifying to stay in the plane as much as possible. If you don't see the benefits of it you probably never touched dcs.

The possibility to rearm\refuel\repair (let's call it RRR) and clickable cockpits make you feel "closer" to your plane, that's what immersion is for don't you think ?

 

Ps: I know the dev have much to do and I don't say that these features should be on top of the list, I'm just saying that it'd be a nice addition at some point.

[6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann]

IRL this would happen: The Pilot would have to land and Taxi to Parking, lead by a Ground Crew Member.

The Pilot would then shut off the Engine, Logs his Flight, get out of the Plane, undress and take a Piss, or a No.2, then proceed to the HQ, where he debriefs with the Commanding Officer and writes his after Action Report. 

He is then briefed for the next Mission, has another Coffee, takes a quick Piss before going to Parking. His Mechanic at that Point is most likely still fuellling and the Gals are feeding the Ammo Belts in. 

The Pilot makes a quick Walk around to check for any damage that would make his Plane unsafe to fly, together with the Mechanic. 

The find a Bullethole in the Aileron, which means the Aircraft has to stay in Over Night. 

So the next Morning the Mechanic has repaired the Aileron Damage, also replaced a tire that had Shrapnel Damage and the our Pilot once again heads to the HQ for a new Briefing and 10 Minutes later gets dressed, makes a new Walkaround, gets in, Buckles up and proceeds though his Checklist, starts the engine and Proceeds to a new Flight. 

 

So, rearm and refuel in only 12 Hours. But of course, without Damage, it would have been 30 Minutes. 

Edited December 7, 2017 by 6./ZG26_Klaus-Mann

[marklar]

How so? Rearming/refueling virtually never happened with the pilot sitting in the cockpit...

 

What do you mean virtually? It happened many times in real life, especially during WW2. Please read the book "Red Star Against The Swastika: The Story of a Soviet Pilot over the Eastern Front" where Vasily Emelianenko describes how he had to fly several sorties a day and he was all the time in the cockpit during refueling/rearming.

 

Two quotes from the book:

 

 

On 26 June five squadrons lined up along the edge of the airfield evenly spaced. The pilots were sitting in the cockpits waiting for the refuellers to fill the tanks up to the top.

 

After some time a kind of conveyer-belt was formed in the air. Some groups were taking off, while others were already landing. They were refuelled, loaded with new bombs, and went off again. It was just like a giant conveyer-belt, made up of Shturmovik squads in the air...

Edited December 7, 2017 by marklar

[purK]

"No rearming because it's not realistic..."

 

Sure, but landing your plane (the last of which available btw) only to have it stolen by another player before you get to hit the Start button again, that's realistic, right?

 

[Eicio]

IRL this would happen: The Pilot would have to land and Taxi to Parking, lead by a Ground Crew Member.

The Pilot would then shut off the Engine, Logs his Flight, get out of the Plane, undress and take a Piss, or a No.2, then proceed to the HQ, where he debriefs with the Commanding Officer and writes his after Action Report. 

He is then briefed for the next Mission, has another Coffee, takes a quick Piss before going to Parking. His Mechanic at that Point is most likely still fuellling and the Gals are feeding the Ammo Belts in. 

The Pilot makes a quick Walk around to check for any damage that would make his Plane unsafe to fly, together with the Mechanic. 

The find a Bullethole in the Aileron, which means the Aircraft has to stay in Over Night. 

So the next Morning the Mechanic has repaired the Aileron Damage, also replaced a tire that had Shrapnel Damage and the our Pilot once again heads to the HQ for a new Briefing and 10 Minutes later gets dressed, makes a new Walkaround, gets in, Buckles up and proceeds though his Checklist, starts the engine and Proceeds to a new Flight. 

 

So, rearm and refuel in only 12 Hours. But of course, without Damage, it would have been 30 Minutes.

 

But the pilot wouldn't fly his plane behind a computer screen like you do.

[Rolling_Thunder]

I want historical accuracy in respect to A and B. Not so much for C and definately not for D.

C'mon folk.

Here's an idea make fuel, ammo and aircraft a resource. If the supply lines are cut or the fuel depot at the airfield is bombed you land you cant fly again during the MP session. You cant log back in until a new mission starts. Same thing for getting shot down.

[BM357_TinMan]

This would be funny if not for the fact that it highlights certain very unpleasant aspects of the community on this forum

[216th_Jordan]

I like it and would like to see it ingame. Its still up to mission designers to include it.

I don't understand why people are against it, same with wonderwoman view, its just an option, if you don't like it, simply don't use it. Stuff like this only gets done when more important stuff is done anyways..

[Ribbon]

I would like to see this feature some day in BoX!

[Royal_Flight]

This doesn't come from WT but from DCS and it makes sense, it's nice to be able to refuel and rearm after a mission to go for another round right after. It's more immersive than land, exit and spawn in another plane in multiplayer and it also means that you're able to continue to fly in SP while now you have to end the mission in some way when you're out of ammo/payload/fuel.

 

It doesn't break the fourth wall if you prefer. (even if it's not realistic to repair your in 5 minutes it gratifys you for a successful landing after beeing badly hit, so this kind of features add much to a sim and are not pointless at all).

This.

 

This would be funny if not for the fact that it highlights certain very unpleasant aspects of the community on this forum

Yeah, you're not wrong. Some users feel entitled to try to derail threads that don't interest them. Clearly they don't realise that this growing community isn't served by this sort of smug, self-congratulatory elitism.

Things get discussed more than once. That's likely to be the case as the sim matures, and as new members join the community they can discuss things that interest them. Better this than bumping old threads because more discussions with new people can add more nuance.

 

On the subject of pointless repetition that adds nothing of value, I've seen that gif a number of times now and it's never been amusing.

[Wulf]

IRL this would happen: The Pilot would have to land and Taxi to Parking, lead by a Ground Crew Member.

The Pilot would then shut off the Engine, Logs his Flight, get out of the Plane, undress and take a Piss, or a No.2, then proceed to the HQ, where he debriefs with the Commanding Officer and writes his after Action Report. 

He is then briefed for the next Mission, has another Coffee, takes a quick Piss before going to Parking. His Mechanic at that Point is most likely still fuellling and the Gals are feeding the Ammo Belts in. 

The Pilot makes a quick Walk around to check for any damage that would make his Plane unsafe to fly, together with the Mechanic. 

The find a Bullethole in the Aileron, which means the Aircraft has to stay in Over Night. 

So the next Morning the Mechanic has repaired the Aileron Damage, also replaced a tire that had Shrapnel Damage and the our Pilot once again heads to the HQ for a new Briefing and 10 Minutes later gets dressed, makes a new Walkaround, gets in, Buckles up and proceeds though his Checklist, starts the engine and Proceeds to a new Flight. 

 

So, rearm and refuel in only 12 Hours. But of course, without Damage, it would have been 30 Minutes. 

 

 

You forgot the chain-smoking and the 20 minutes spent in the crapper throwing-up.

[Boaty-McBoatface]

No rearm, repair and refuel please.

 

Land the bloody machine and get a new one for petty's sake. 

Edited December 10, 2017 by boaty_McBoatface

[Sunde]

 

This would be funny if not for the fact that it highlights certain very unpleasant aspects of the community on this forum

Yup, the same "small" part of it. They never fail to add absolutely nothing to a thread, but that seems alright by them.
  
I'd like to see some sort of rearm/refuel/repair, it works in DCS and i think it adds more immersion than seeing your aircraft vanish in thin air, only to have it reappear, or worse despawn in a perfectly fine aircraft, which then proceeds to get taken before you can spawn back in. Rearming would be a better alternative imo. 
Not a priority tho, the devs have bigger fish to fry atm, i'd wager. 
 
 

Edited December 11, 2017 by [5SFG]Sunde

[OrLoK]

I like it and would like to see it ingame. Its still up to mission designers to include it.

I don't understand why people are against it, same with wonderwoman view, its just an option, if you don't like it, simply don't use it. Stuff like this only gets done when more important stuff is done anyways..

agreed

[6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann]

My Compromise would be this:

 

Have designated Re-Spawn Areas, basically parking, where you have to manouver your aircraft into a parking position to Finish that Flight, De-Spawn the Aircraft, your Client remembers that position and on your next Spawn will spawn you in exactly that Spot again. 

[Custard]

I don't think anyone is explicitly 'against' the feature. We just think it's a waste of the devs time when so many other important coding tasks are scheduled.

Edited December 11, 2017 by Custard

[Dakpilot]

The recent (October) 6 page thread only quietened down last month, in suggestions, the poll is still active and near the top of the list with 3 pages of discussion.. How many active threads are really needed

 

Cheers, Dakpilot

[Dakpilot]

Ah! So this justifies intentionally derailing a thread? We should probably put that in the forum rule list. You know, in the highly unlikely event that some new player gets on the forum in two months, and somehow misses this thread.   

Cheers dakpilot

 

It is already in the rules..

 

Rule 9

 

How many concurrent open threads do you really need on one subject?

 

Cheers, Dakpilot

[Sunde]

It is already in the rules..

 

Rule 9

 

How many concurrent open threads do you really need on one subject?

 

Cheers, Dakpilot

Let me help you... 

Rule 9 states - Willful duplication of topics and excessive branching of topics is prohibited.

This thread fits none of those. Otherwise please prove how OP is "willingly" creating dublications of other threads. Obviously he had not seen the other thread, neither had i tbh. I dont check that part of the forum very much. 

 

Topics that needlessly duplicate other discussions may be closed without notice and subsequently removed.

Perhaps the mod should just have stuck with this part and deleted the thread, rather than acting as he did.

 

At least we'v learnt that rule 15 clearly does not need to be followed, as we have a moderator blatantly disregarding it. One could have hoped for more...

Edited December 12, 2017 by [5SFG]Sunde

[Vig]

I don't post much because aviation game forums are generally toxic.  A few people gain influence and all of them and their wannabes follow the leader in any discussion.  The RoF forum had many wonderful, helpful, knowledgeable people but even they would generally stay out of it when some poor new guy inadvertently started a turf war and was consequently abused by the influential forum royalty.  Human nature, I guess.

 

That said, I recall reading accounts of Eastern Front actions where Stukas flew a short distance from base, bombed, landed, rearmed, and repeated.  Hans Ulrich Rudel described an instance in which he was flying his eighth mission of the day and landed to pick up a downed crew from his unit, adding that he had already picked up seven downed crews that day in the course of prior missions.  I don't know whether this would have been his final mission of the day because his Stuka got stuck in deep snow and he was forced to escape on foot.  He must have been pretty busy with eight bomb runs and eight rescues, and I would be surprised if he didn't sometimes just stay in the cockpit while the blackbirds loaded the bombs.I have often thought that it would be interesting to play that sort of "endurance run" mission; still, I don't particularly care whether rearming and refueling is added as a feature, but it does not seem to me to be an unreasonable request for an intrinsically immersion-killing feature.

Edited December 12, 2017 by Vig

[Bearcat]

Gents I have cleaned up this thread. If your post is not here anymore please do not repost a similar comment. This is a discussion that has been had for nearly two decades.. that i know of... Some want it  some don't..neither side is "right" or "wrong" ... If you have nothing to contribute to the discussion then please move  along.. there are other threads that may interest you more. 

[6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann]

I don't post much because aviation game forums are generally toxic.  A few people gain influence and all of them and their wannabes follow the leader in any discussion.  The RoF forum had many wonderful, helpful, knowledgeable people but even they would generally stay out of it when some poor new guy inadvertently started a turf war and was consequently abused by the influential forum royalty.  Human nature, I guess.

 

That said, I recall reading accounts of Eastern Front actions where Stukas flew a short distance from base, bombed, landed, rearmed, and repeated.  Hans Ulrich Rudel described an instance in which he was flying his eighth mission of the day and landed to pick up a downed crew from his unit, adding that he had already picked up seven downed crews that day in the course of prior missions.  I don't know whether this would have been his final mission of the day because his Stuka got stuck in deep snow and he was forced to escape on foot.  He must have been pretty busy with eight bomb runs and eight rescues, and I would be surprised if he didn't sometimes just stay in the cockpit while the blackbirds loaded the bombs.I have often thought that it would be interesting to play that sort of "endurance run" mission; still, I don't particularly care whether rearming and refueling is added as a feature, but it does not seem to me to be an unreasonable request for an intrinsically immersion-killing feature.

Well, the Forums are lively and people argue passionately. And it gets heated, but if you want to see true toxicity you have to go elsewhere, take War Thunder Forums for example. 

This here is no comparison and the most civilized Gaming Forum I know that isn't boring. 

 

I just don't know how practical this kind of Rearm and Refuel is in SP and MP. 

[ACG_Smokejumper]

I'd like to see the ability to rearm a fully functional aircraft. I see no reason why not either. It would fit in with certain scenerios or just the mission servers which would reward realistic game play for limited aircraft.

 

There are already many compromises between realistic and game play.

 

Trim reset in Russian fighters.

No clickable cockpit

Zoom feature

Respawning instead of dead is dead

 

I could go on and on with examples.

I'd love to see a reward for realistic game play in which a player gets to keep his aircraft because he or she flew smart and with caution expending their ammunition while also getting home in one piece. 

 

I've already heard people say I'm bailing out who cares it's Wings. Go get another aircraft. That is their choice and I don't begrudge it. I'd just like to fly differently and be able to rearm and refuel.

Edited December 20, 2017 by 7./JG26_Smokejumper

[Te_Pille]

This feature is a must. I am impressed with the comments saying that is less important or not at all. What is important, do refly...? Let’s be more serious.

[Finkeren]

This feature is a must. I am impressed with the comments saying that is less important or not at all. What is important, do refly...? Let’s be more serious.

Yes please, let’s be more serious: What, precisely, will this feature add to the current game play?

[=RvE=Windmills]

Ability to land aircraft from a back base on a front base for rearm, not losing a limited plane after coming back from a sortie, frontline airfields purely for RR.

 

Gameplay wise it added plenty to 1946 servers when it became available. Even in DCS right now it's a big feature in continuous campaigns like blue flag.