STATS: Half a kill or a whole kill??

[Haza]

Gents,

 

I'm sure we have been all there, shooting at an aircraft, watching him smoke and perhaps even catch fire and then somebody else appears and decides to help you.  However, having spent the time working the enemy over you are not credited with a kill but the guy who helped you at the end gets the credit. 

 

Therefore, although I see on one server the damage is shown as a % with the player with the most % getting the whole kill, is there a way for stats to reflect a kill as a % rather than whole, so at least it perhaps is a little bit more worthwhile tracking an aircraft down so at least you get awarded say 1/2 a kill or something like that as per the BoB film?

 

I now understand why some players just sit on my 6 and will not give up until I have bailed, died or crashed!?

 

Regards

 

 

[InProgress]

In my opinion stats destroy game, people will do anything just for number on scoreboard, they will chase you back to your base just to get score and don't care about being shot down because there is no stat showing how many times you were downed only deaths.

 

I would rather see it as score for doing something, 2 score for kill, 1 for damage or assist, 20 for returning to base.

 

What I can see now are people attacking af with no hope going back to their own af, not even fuel to go back. Many people do stupid things just because number on scoreboard..

[Aap]

it perhaps is a little bit more worthwhile tracking an aircraft down so at least you get awarded say 1/2 a kill or something like that as per the BoB film

Stats give you "Assisted" kill, if you have done enough damage, though I don't know what is the exact criteria for it. But kill stealing is an unfortubate habit online indeed.

 

don't care about being shot down because there is no stat showing how many times you were downed only deaths

Actually the stats also show how many planes you have lost, how many bailouts, how many deaths and how many times captured.

 

I would rather see it as score for doing something, 2 score for kill, 1 for damage or assist, 20 for returning to base.

There is similar logic in scoring already. You get 100 points for shooting down a plane (and various points for various ground targets), 20 points for assisted kill. If you land back on friendly airfield, the score is doubled. If get killed, you lose all your score, if you bail, you lose 50% of your score, if you crash land, you lose 20% of your score. I just think that people care more about their kill counts than point scores.

Edited October 11, 2017 by II./JG77_Kemp

[US63_SpadLivesMatter]

I tend to agree with InProgress' feeling toward stats.

 

However, they're in the game already. Being able to credit half kills would be a nice feature; especially for those times somebody just happens to get the final blow on a crippled enemy.

 

That said, I could take it or leave it. I'm not one to be capable of racking up enough victories for it to matter anyways.

Edited October 11, 2017 by hrafnkolbrandr

[Inkophile]

There is similar logic in scoring already. You get 100 points for shooting down a plane (and various points for various ground targets), 20 points for assisted kill. If you land bac on friendly airfield, the score is doubled. If get killed, you lose all your score, if you bail, you lose 50% of your score, if you crash land, you lose 20% of your score. I just think that people care more about their kill counts than point scores.

 

So basically the game should only show score (which updates only after finishing the flight, be it through death/crash/bail-out or successful landing), and preferably hide everything else :D

 

Would also stop the "ghosting" in the air, where you can see what dude gets air kills or ground kills before there's even a warning about that a position is under attack (assuming kill messages are off on the server), which right now is a pretty dumb but almost necessary thing to do, because otherwise you've automatically given yourself the short end of the stick.

Edited October 11, 2017 by Inkoslav

[InProgress]

There are on website, I am talking about game, and my point was to combine it all where you have lets say 20 for landing, 1 for kill, you have 21 points but there is no info about what you got it for. Only you know it.

 

Like in game called darkest hour, you have points for kills but it's just 1, you have 5 for resupply mg, 10 for capping objectives. So you may kill 10 people but guy who actually was being useful for team and attacked objective, resupplied mg will be on top with 15 points while camper gets 10 and is on bottom.

 

Someone flying online with 3 kills looks pro, so what he lost 10 planes, got nice score and no one see this bad 10 lost planes on server. If someone who shot down enemy plane with range of for example 1km from friendly bomber gets bonus points for escort, like 5, looks better and is rewarding than hunting easy kills while your team is losing bombers and objectives.

 

I know it does not look sim like, but people are into scores so it would be better to adapt than ignore. I am pretty sure if player would be rewarded for kills as escort, over objectives etc it would make them do it and not wonder around to suicide strife enemy af. Returning to base should also be handsomely rewarded to encourage people doing it. There is no consequences of losing plane, you even get reward with wat faster spawn and back to action.

 

This topic even proves it, this guy wants to be rewarded with score, knowledge that HE shot it down and got more damage on enemy is not satisfying to him.

Edited October 11, 2017 by InProgress

[Inkophile]

 

 

I know it does not look sim like, but people are into scores so it would be better to adapt than ignore. I am pretty sure if player would be rewarded for kills as escort, over objectives etc it would make them do it and not wonder around to suicide strife enemy af. Returning to base should also be handsomely rewarded to encourage people doing it. There is no consequences of losing plane, you even get reward with wat faster spawn and back to action.

 

This is a REALLY important part. People are after all much more prone to do what they are rewarded for, and if they don't feel rewarded for what they do they'll be less likely to do it. Sure, some guys might actually fly CAP for an entire battle and barely spot a plane, but they covered what they were supposed to cover and thus successfully did their job. If they can feel gratification for that it's good, but for many (I presume "most") that's not enough, at least outside of the more hardcore simmers.

 

The way a game rewards actions is defining for how that game is played. I think for example War Thunder is a shining example, where being a good teamplayer rewards you basically nothing, and being a flag-capturing and brutal killing-machine gives you everything, even if that guy covering the flank that no one attacks on that entire battle is doing a fantastic job for the team. In IL-2 our score doesn't matter aside from stroking our e-penis, but in War Thunder you must get those Research Points and Silver Lions or you might as well give up playing the game. Especially without SL you can't even afford to use and upgrade your current vehicles, even less actually getting new ones. Thus the game punishes teamwork and "doing the job", and rewards being a kill-crazy maniac.

 

I'd love if the scoring system in IL-2 didn't do the same, but at the moment that is exactly what it does: It rewards kill-hunting and punishes doing one's job. Completely the opposite of what a simulator should.

 

And sure, IRL pilots were rewarded based on kills, but they also had to survive to get those rewards, and number of sorties counted highly as well. You won't get to a decent number of sorties if you keep getting shot down, especially since the war apparatus might not even afford supplying your kamikaze-brain with new planes; they need people who can bring the planes back and not people who only can bring enemies down but never bring their own machines back.

 

I'd argue that a decent scoring-system is one of the essential foundations of a sim at all, if the sim includes one to begin with. Either completely omit the scoring system, or make it into something that suits this game rather than Counter-Strike or Call of Duty.

[A_radek]

In my opinion stats destroy game, people will do anything just for number on scoreboard, they will chase you back to your base just to get score and don't care about being shot down because there is no stat showing how many times you were downed only deaths.

 

I would rather see it as score for doing something, 2 score for kill, 1 for damage or assist, 20 for returning to base.

 

What I can see now are people attacking af with no hope going back to their own af, not even fuel to go back. Many people do stupid things just because number on scoreboard..

I understand the reasons people frown at stats. But consider them an important part of online gameplay. I admire those taking a Lagg up against swarms of 109's and scoring kills, they deserve the scoreboard recognition. And in my experience the surprising part is that those same pilots are often also the one's promoting team coordination and trying to achieve the main objectives. Not as popular belief would have it just stathunters stealing kills or spawncamping some poor sod. 

 

I suppose it's just more difficult to recognize there are proper aces online, as that would mean accepting one's own comparable skill level, and much easier to brand them as cheating/killstealing stathunters. Those few that really are collecting kills by kill stealing, well, they can have those, it's ok.

 

[56RAF_Roblex]

I think kills should go to whoever first caused 'disabling' damage.   For example if you riddle the enemy with bullet holes, even remove ailerons etc., but then someone else comes in and smokes his engine or sets him on fire then they get the kill.  If nobody else attacks it, or just does more minor damage, and it crashes later then you get the kill. Perhaps this can be done on a something similar to a 'percentage damage' basis if greater percentage is given to pilot wounds and engine damage. 

 

This is more like real life. If you expend all your ammo on a target that flies away, even if it is leaking fuel or hydraulic fluid,  then you don't claim a kill.  If you see your enemy dive away belching black smoke then you you leave him and look for the next threat.   When my squad played CLoD then as soon as an enemy was too damaged to get back to France we left it and moved on.  Perhaps some time later an other pilot saw a streaming enemy trying to get home and 'Stole' the kill but I am OK with that. 

One simple rule that could be applied (in concert with other more detailed rules) is that once a plane is streaming black smoke the kill has been allocated so there is no need to carry on the attack (unless he is still a threat)  and anyone killing a plane that is streaming black smoke is just wasting ammo.  It is clear to all.   Obviously such a rule needs adjusting for multi-engine aircraft.

 

If it gets home and lands on an airfield without being written off or killing the pilot then it should not be counted as a kill - it annoys me when I use great skill to get home and land with no elevators and one aileron only for someone to get a kill. This game even gives someone a kill if your fuel runs out a second before you wheels touch the runway.

 

EDIT: While I was typing,  a couple of people argued for greater rewards for staying alive , getting home etc.   I fully agree. I have always felt this way.  Even getting back to friendly territory before ditching or bailing should be rewarded.

Edited October 11, 2017 by 56RAF_Roblex

[Lensman]

You know there were 'stats' in reality, yes?

All airforces used the kill statistics of their combat pilots for media publicity and propoganda purposes. 'Ace in a day' etc etc.

That led to fierce competition between pilots to get the highest score.

Therefore, what is different here?

[InProgress]

You know there were 'stats' in reality, yes?

All airforces used the kill statistics of their combat pilots for media publicity and propoganda purposes. 'Ace in a day' etc etc.

That led to fierce competition between pilots to get the highest score.

Therefore, what is different here?

yes but not for price of mission or objective. If you talk to me and not about steal killing, but still, if you waste time, ammo and life of others just to focus or/and shoot near friendly to attack his target the only reward you will get is heavy beating from your squad.

 

Can't imagine pilots leaving bombers to hunt enemy bombers going home and then 10min later all your bombers you were suppose to escort burn. Doubt anyone would reward you.

[Inkophile]

 

 

Can't imagine pilots leaving bombers to hunt enemy bombers going home and then 10min later all your bombers you were suppose to escort burn. Doubt anyone would reward you.

 

Yeah, if anything it'd be refusal of orders, abandonment of one's post and similar offenses, leading at least to being grounded, at worst to a firing squad.

[56RAF_Roblex]

 

 

  Can't imagine pilots leaving bombers to hunt enemy bombers going home and then 10min later all your bombers you were suppose to escort burn. Doubt anyone would reward you.

 

Wasn't that why the Tuskagee  squadron was liked by the bombers? Unlike most escorts, the Tuskagee pilots stayed with the bombers instead of abandoning them to go looking for glory whenever there were enemy fighters in sight.   There were complaints from LW bomber pilots as well that the 109 escort peeled off and were never seen again once they saw a chance to get kills so the bombers were defenseless if there was a second group of fighers waiting further on.

[ITAF_Cymao]

The real problem is that in BoS the multiplayer is poor, we can only have dogserver.
We have only targets to destroy, but aircrafts  haven't assignments (like escort bombers) that give a score if they are done effectively!
How were the coops in lendary IL-2 of Oleg Maddox.
As far as stats should count and report only the airkill or groundkill done without dying, when you die all your stats should go back to 0 not just the air-streak.
Maybe then there would be a more realistic approach to combat.

 

S!
 

[sniperton]

In SP campaigns kills are only credited when mission objective is fulfilled. In MP it could be adjusted the following way:

100% penalty when player died (no kills credited at all);

75% penalty when player is captured (1/4 kill credited for each);

50% penalty when player jumped over friendly territory (1/2 kill credited for each; this is a penalty for abandoning the aircraft);

25% penalty when crash-landed in friendly territory (3/4 kill credited for each; this is a penalty for critically damaging the aircraft);

0% penalty when player landed at any friendly airfield (all kills credited).

Just my 2 cents...

[A_radek]

As far as stats should count and report only the airkill or groundkill done without dying, when you die all your stats should go back to 0 not just the air-streak.

Maybe then there would be a more realistic approach to combat.

 

S!

 

 

I fully agree. I have always felt this way.  Even getting back to friendly territory before ditching or bailing should be rewarded.

 

Taw already does this. You guys should give it a try when it's up and running again. Wol will be wol

[Inkophile]

In SP campaigns kills are only credited when mission objective is fulfilled. In MP it could be adjusted the following way:

100% penalty when player died (no kills credited at all);

75% penalty when player is captured (1/4 kill credited for each);

50% penalty when player jumped over friendly territory (1/2 kill credited for each; this is a penalty for abandoning the aircraft);

25% penalty when crash-landed in friendly territory (3/4 kill credited for each; this is a penalty for critically damaging the aircraft);

0% penalty when player landed at any friendly airfield (all kills credited).

Just my 2 cents...

 

Simple and well-motivating. I like it!

[=EXPEND=Tripwire]

In SP campaigns kills are only credited when mission objective is fulfilled. In MP it could be adjusted the following way:

100% penalty when player died (no kills credited at all);

75% penalty when player is captured (1/4 kill credited for each);

50% penalty when player jumped over friendly territory (1/2 kill credited for each; this is a penalty for abandoning the aircraft);

25% penalty when crash-landed in friendly territory (3/4 kill credited for each; this is a penalty for critically damaging the aircraft);

0% penalty when player landed at any friendly airfield (all kills credited).

Just my 2 cents...

 

WOL stats are not far from this already?

 

Penalties are as follows - 

100% for death

100% for capture

50% for bailed

20% for ditched on friendly side

0% for crash landing and completely wrecking your plane on a friendly runway, shot to hell and unable to land safely or just through error.

 

Or are you concerned about the ingame <TAB> score/stats?

 

For what its worth, IMO - kill stealing is shooting at a plane that is on fire, or about to impact with the ground in a shot up and unrecoverable stall. There was no purpose shooting the plane other than to take the points and waste ammo. I'm more than happy for someone else to assist with the destruction of the enemy prior to that point with one exception - shoulder shooting as it carries too great a risk of collision or friendly fire.

 

If someone comes in at a different angle for a clean snap shot kill thats ok by me. Too often Luftwaffe planes are overwhelmed due to the time to kill being too high against a manoeuvring Russian plane, and enemy support arriving. With other pilots on TS, often there is communication about the situation of the fight. If it is clear that the friend is in an advantageous position or the enemy is already damaged or there is little risk of the fight reversing and no other enemy planes in the vicinity - then the fight is left alone and others just watch the friendlies six as he finishes the kill.

[SeaW0lf]

(...) And in my experience the surprising part is that those same pilots are often also the one's promoting team coordination and trying to achieve the main objectives. Not as popular belief would have it just stathunters stealing kills or spawncamping some poor sod. 

 

I suppose it's just more difficult to recognize there are proper aces online, as that would mean accepting one's own comparable skill level, and much easier to brand them as cheating/killstealing stathunters. Those few that really are collecting kills by kill stealing, well, they can have those, it's ok.

 

Totally agree. People are short sighted in this a lot.

 

In SP campaigns kills are only credited when mission objective is fulfilled. In MP it could be adjusted the following way:

100% penalty when player died (no kills credited at all);

75% penalty when player is captured (1/4 kill credited for each);

50% penalty when player jumped over friendly territory (1/2 kill credited for each; this is a penalty for abandoning the aircraft);

25% penalty when crash-landed in friendly territory (3/4 kill credited for each; this is a penalty for critically damaging the aircraft);

0% penalty when player landed at any friendly airfield (all kills credited).

Just my 2 cents...

 

The stats should not take any kills from a pilot who landed / crash landed or bailed over friendly territory. It makes no sense, especially historically. Even if hypothetically the pilot becomes maimed and unable to fly again, he will take his / her kills to the end. Otherwise you are trying to fix one thing and breaking another and being bias towards who track their kills.

 

Kills are kills. Some people work a lot for them with training and practicing, sometimes for years, to come to a point to earn a kill or to have a good kill ratio. They should be left alone unless the pilot is shot down over enemy territory (*edit -- or killed no matter where).

 

There are other ways to improve the stats without being arbitrary, historically incorrect and bias. And it is arcadish to take portions of a kill for a bailout or crash land. The stats ideally should foment players to have a more historical game play, not the other way around.

Edited October 11, 2017 by SeaW0lf

[FTC_Riksen]

TAW rewards pilots for staying alive. The problem is that most players only fly WoL and lose the perspective of what's outside WoL realm. If you enjoy team play, coordination, being rewarded for staying alive, your own hangar of planes instead of having crazy players wasting all the planes of ur airfield, and better pilots, then join TAW. At least there you dont see players staying on someones 6 o clock when they are being fired at lol

[Inkophile]

One problem with TAW is that it only has 50% uptime, but the system there is pretty good - yeah.

[Guest deleted@30725]

Stats only serve to fuel a players own ego.

[-TBC-AeroAce]

This is defo something that needs to be addresses but has been forgotten about. And for those whom say we should live in a magical point void world just come on really?

 

The way it is ATM only creates big clown wagons where everyone is trying to land the last shot. I am so sick of taking my time to climb with an inferior ac to get in a good position, find a 109 to fight with, drag him down and start to dominate the fight. The other friendlys in the area see this plane and all lose any advantage they may have had to land the last hit instead of doing something useful like coveringfor the inevitable new enemy that is about to fly down and pick off everyone in the clown wagon.

 

I am getting to the point where I feel because I have invested so much time trying to drag them down and play smart that I'm going to be darned if I'm going to let some clown wagoner jump in and steal the kill. What is worse is the shoulder shooting FFS!!!!

 

I'm not sure what the solution should be but something should be done to reward people for better team work and maybe getting the first hit not the last. Possibly a multiplier that gives the person a heavier weight on the initial damage done compared to the last as it is often the first hit that determines what the enemy will do.

 

For example

If (first hit damage %)*(a multiplier bonus for getting the first hit) is bigger than (finishing hit % by other player) then initial player gets a kill second gets assist

 

If the left is smaller than the right then second player to hit gets the kill and initial gets the assist

 

And if aproximatly equal they share the kill

 

Now if the is a third or forth to do damage then the odds will increase more in favor of the initial player to do damage which seems fair to me as I said it is often the first one to do damage that really is dictating the actions of the enemy.

 

I think giving the weight to the initial player that inflicts damage will encourage people to cover more because they will think ow actually I'm not likely to get that kill I will look for a fresh target hence it will improve team work!

 

Sorry for the long rant I hope it makes since to some people and for them people at say why get hung up about scores ..... It is a game and we need a way to score at also promotes good/realistic behavior. It is just a question of good game design.

[SeaW0lf]

It is a game and we need a way to score at also promotes good/realistic behavior. It is just a question of good game design.

 

I agree. Otherwise we would all be doing recreational flying / sightseeing at FSX and there would be no reason for Il-2 to exist. If we have guns, bombs and competition to see who shots down / bomb whom first, we need stats. The better they can get to replicate historical behavior to a certain extent the merrier, but we need them.

[Boaty-McBoatface]

Stats only serve to fuel a players own ego.

This.

 

Stats are the reason for so much bitterness and ego tripping.

 

Honestly it just beggars belief that of all niches, we have this many individuals drawn to a historical flight simulation to stroke their egos and play 'look at me'.

Edited October 11, 2017 by Boaty_McBoatFace

[NO_SQDeriku777]

One problem with TAW is that it only has 50% uptime, but the system there is pretty good - yeah.

Another problem with TAW is that people that don't own BOS AND BOM (and soon Kuban) can't play through all phases of the campaign. It's a shame since the people just learning the game who have not gone all-in just experience the game through the lens of WOL

[Inkophile]

This.

 

Stats are the reason for so much bitterness and ego tripping.

 

Honestly it just beggars belief that of all niches, we have this many individuals drawn to a historical flight simulation to stroke their egos and play 'look at me'.

 

Or we can just accept the fact that people achieve gratification in different ways, even if they have flight simulators as the common denominator? Egos can be tripped by a lot of things outside of game stats, and saying that people have to enjoy sims for the sake of "historical reenactment" or "authentic air combat" (with all that it includes) is like saying people have to love white rice to enjoy Japanese food. It just doesn't add up or make sense.

[US63_SpadLivesMatter]

What I would *love* is a career mode which could somehow be synced to track your multiplayer sorties.

[56RAF_Roblex]

Stats only serve to fuel a players own ego.

 

I need something to work towards otherwise it becomes pointless.  If you have a server without stats then you may as well have a server with indestructible planes and ground targets. You've proved you can hit them, why do you need the ego massage of seeing them destroyed?    Other than the fact that I don't like stats that reward suicidal play,  I would not care if the stats vanished at the end of the map and there was no permanent or monthly public stats table. This is pretty much what we have when we play a special event or how it used to be when IL2-46 had co-op games. You could say 'Well done guys. We managed to destroy the target &  take down 5 of them and only lose one of us.'  then we could forget all the results and think about the next mission.  Yes some servers just show what you have achieved that session and don't have an external stats table but they tend to be the ones that concentrate on showing how many kills everyone has achieved regardless of how many deaths or losses they had.   Give us 'in -session' stats showing air kills and ground kills but rank them by a points system heavily biased towards getting home alive or at least crash landing in friendly territory with no score if you die and much reduced score for bailing in enemy territory etc.      The external stats system used by most servers claims to reward good flying but pays little attention to how many times you died or lost your aircraft so you  can move yourself up the ranks by ramming enemies and bailing out.

[Aap]

I think that the current website stats system is quite okay. Instead of removing kills or other things from stats, could add a couple of other stat categories, like "enemy planes damaged", "staying alive streak", "returned to base while wounded" etc. 

If there was a "WoL without stats" and a competing mirror server "WoL with stats", which do you think would be more popular? Basically stats give feedback to virtual pilots on how they are doing in various areas, while a general score would just put pilots in order from best to worst, based on some criteria which the pilot may agree on disagree on, and which we already have anyway.

 

Comparing to sports, it is like saying that, let's remove all the stats from basketball, because we don't care who is scoring the baskets, who is blocking shots, who is a good 3-point shooter or who has a good +/- stat. Let's just have one formula that somehow determines a "score" for every player. There are formulas like that (efficiency rating or PER rating), but it could still be interesting to know how a player is a good or bad free throw shooter or how many times he turns the ball over etc. And there will always be "hidden areas" in game that will not show up on stat boards.

Edited October 12, 2017 by II./JG77_Kemp

[Rolling_Thunder]

You know there were 'stats' in reality, yes?

All airforces used the kill statistics of their combat pilots for media publicity and propoganda purposes. 'Ace in a day' etc etc.

That led to fierce competition between pilots to get the highest score.

Therefore, what is different here?

Life and death. I find it hard to believe a real life squadron would line up behind one enemy all firing away trying to get the kill not caring if their squadron comrades get in the way.

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

At least in the Soviet units the very opposite happened. Since morale of younger pilots was a very important thing, experienced pilots generally looked for ways to boost that.

 

Common practices included reporting reporting kills they got as their wingmen's (for example, group of four goes up and each flight leader bags two, but they report as if each pilot shot down one) and when in absolute advantage positions like 2 vs 1 against an unskilled enemy they would let the newbie park on the enemy's six and try to shoot it down while the leader covered them a few meters above and behind to intervene should anything go wrong. Often the greenhorn wasted all ammo without hitting scratch so the boss would just go in, finish the job and write a 1/2 shared victory each.

[curiousGamblerr]

Life and death. I find it hard to believe a real life squadron would line up behind one enemy all firing away trying to get the kill not caring if their squadron comrades get in the way.

 

Last night on Wings I was told to "get over it" and called a "nerd" when I complained about the swarm of tunnel vision fighters chasing a crashing 111 I had already brewed up nicely. I was told that, "it happened in real life" and I shouldn't complain.

 

As we all know, Wings of Liberty is an intellectual hotbed where all players are focused on historical immersion, so I guess that settles it- just get over it! 

 

(Now, where's my sarcasm emoji...)

 

PS Interesting stuff Lucas, if you have any reads on that in English I would be interested!

[A_radek]

Heh, considering this sim attracts those that score a little higher on the aspergers scale than your average joe, calling someone else a nerd here is sort of..

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

Nothing I can think of concretely, Gambler. A lot of it is available in German though if yours is up to scratch

[[CPT]CptJackSparrow]

 

As we all know, Wings of Liberty is an intellectual hotbed

I now have coffee all over my radiation badge.

[BuzzU]

As long as the plane goes down i'm satisfied. I could care less who gets the credit.

[US63_SpadLivesMatter]

Last night on Wings I was told to "get over it" and called a "nerd" when I complained about the swarm of tunnel vision fighters chasing a crashing 111 I had already brewed up nicely. I was told that, "it happened in real life" and I shouldn't complain.

 

As we all know, Wings of Liberty is an intellectual hotbed where all players are focused on historical immersion, so I guess that settles it- just get over it!

 

(Now, where's my sarcasm emoji...)

 

PS Interesting stuff Lucas, if you have any reads on that in English I would be interested!

Last night I had a guy chase me all the way to the end of the map.

 

Finally ended up turning around and shooting him down. He disconnected after.

[BuzzU]

Why did you wait so long?

[Guest deleted@30725]

Heh, considering this sim attracts those that score a little higher on the aspergers scale than your average joe, calling someone else a nerd here is sort of..

 

Just a regular plane geek.

Last night on Wings I was told to "get over it" and called a "nerd" when I complained about the swarm of tunnel vision fighters chasing a crashing 111 I had already brewed up nicely. I was told that, "it happened in real life" and I shouldn't complain.

 

I wonder... sounds like a frivolous waste of ammunition to me to do that for real.