FW190 Taxing two wheel technique

[Fern]

If anyone read the book, "Luftwaffe Fighter Ace" by Norbert Hannig, you may recall him speaking about one of the pilots taxing the 190 on two wheels to quickly get off the field or runway to avoid attacks. I thought there was a picture of a 190 being taxied this way. I'd would provide a picture, but the link to the book pdf no longer works.

 

So I tried this myself in-game and this task seems impossible to accomplish. Has anyone had any luck with this type of taxing in the 190? 

 

If this isnt possible, this leads me to question the CG or engine power of the 190. 

[ZachariasX]

If anyone read the book, "Luftwaffe Fighter Ace" by Norbert Hannig, you may recall him speaking about one of the pilots taxing the 190 on two wheels to quickly get off the field or runway to avoid attacks. I thought there was a picture of a 190 being taxied this way. I'd would provide a picture, but the link to the book pdf no longer works.

 

So I tried this myself in-game and this task seems impossible to accomplish. Has anyone had any luck with this type of taxing in the 190? 

 

If this isnt possible, this leads me to question the CG or engine power of the 190.

 

Just go faster.

[Finkeren]

Basically you can do this with any plane with toe brakes, but it is difficult and highly dangerous.

[ZachariasX]

Look, you just don't do that. Not even with a Piper Cub. (I should really like to see that pic, but I strongly doubt that guys was taxiing.)

 

 

 

Basically you can do this with any plane with toe brakes, but it is difficult and highly dangerous.

If you do that, you better not return to that airfield. You'd spray the whole area behind you with pebbles and dirt. Besides, your brakes (even the German ones) wouldn't stay long with you.

[Fern]

Nevermind, I was wrong. I found it.

 

" Walter had another little habit. After touching down in a normal three-pointer he would give a dab on the brakes - just enough to raise the tail back up in the air - add a touch of throttle, and drive his aircraft back across the field to dispersal like a car. Those of us landing in his wake, who taxied in the normal manner, weaving slightly to be able to see ahead, would then be chided tongue-in-cheek for our tardiness. This was to have unforeseen consequences for me not long afterwards. "

[curiousGamblerr]

I always wondered about this since reading that. If anyone pulls it off in game I will be very impressed!

[19//Moach]

I don't think our "nerfed brakes" have enough grip to properly pull that off... 

 

even though they increased braking power for all planes in .012,  they still left it as just enough to keep the plane rolling unchecked and help control taxiing 

 

it's still not possible to do things such as locking the wheels to a skid, or nose over on engine power alone

 

 

seems devs made a decision to scale down brakes.  I suppose for the sake of those who don't have the hardware facilities for assigning axes to them.

 

that makes it possible to hold down the "button" without fear of locking up or digging a trench with your prop - it's kind of a "compromise ABS" of sorts, to overcome joystick limitations such as would cause excessive (and improper) pressure on the brakes

Edited October 10, 2017 by 19//Moach

[ZachariasX]

I also think it was a good idea to tone down the brakes. Keep in mind, in the real world, these brakes usually faded very quickly (and often to an uneven degree). This is also something not acceptable to most of the player base of a combat sim. So we don‘t have it.

[Blutaar]

I would like to have an ABS option for the breaks under the difficulty settings. Just to be able to use the breaks like in RL or in every half decent racing game. The breaks are a total joke in this game, sorry to say that.

[ZachariasX]

ABS would just help you flipping your aircraft over much faster. And in-game, the breaks are useful for all practical purposes. They even make itr possible to me mapped on a key or button instead of an axis. Conceptually, I find the devs made a good choice.

 

"Real brakes" would be more interesting if we had persistent damage on aircraft, such as A2A Simulation has with their Accusim planes for FSX etc. But if you do that, you are focussing on different aspects of "the game". Aspects, that are mainly a cost but not an asset to BoX.

[Fern]

Not to be a smart ass, but if they can "tone down" the brake system, can they "tone down" the pitch wobble some more? Three years into this game and I have yet to find a good setting for my joystick (Extreme 3D Pro).

 

 

Back to the brakes, I would like to see an ABS option like Ishtaru said. I'd be afraid I would'nt be able to customize my pedals like my joystick though...

[Finkeren]

Not to be a smart ass, but if they can "tone down" the brake system, can they "tone down" the pitch wobble some more? Three years into this game and I have yet to find a good setting for my joystick (Extreme 3D Pro).

 

If they made the planes any more stable, they'd be on rails.

 

Are you sure it isn't time to get a better stick?

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

Not to be a smart ass, but if they can "tone down" the brake system, can they "tone down" the pitch wobble some more? Three years into this game and I have yet to find a good setting for my joystick (Extreme 3D Pro).

 

 

Back to the brakes, I would like to see an ABS option like Ishtaru said. I'd be afraid I would'nt be able to customize my pedals like my joystick though...

Sorry mate, but it really might be time for a better joystick. That's your problem there mate.

 

You can also reduce sensitivity to be nonlinear.

[FTC_Riksen]

I tried the joystick you have before and it is just impossible to fly with it (at least for me). I would strongly recommend u to get at least a Saitek. It will be a game changer for u for sure

[=TBAS=Sshadow14]

you mean like this..

Nope i tried it in all planes about 20-60 mins each plane type trying varying configs and weights to get tail up.
Only was possible in He-111
 

[Guest deleted@50488]

I would be glad if I could see an update to the ground physics making the efficiency of the tail surfaces & / or the propwash effects correctly tuned

 

I simply don't like the permament need for right rudder while taxiing any of the Bf109s, even less can't imagine it in just two wheels ...

 

IRL, pilot's have to push the stick fwd and use brake for tighter turns, and at normal taxi speeds / power settings, the rudder is permanently used in all directions to keep the aircraft straight along it's taxiing path... This is not possible at all in IL-2 ...

 

I've read a lot of pilot reports, the last one recently published in the Aeroplane magazine. But youtubes also show very clearly how during taxi the pilot keeps waving when needed his rudder both ways, creating moment... There's no permanent right rudder input, even with the tailwheel locked in IL2.... 

 

OTOH, takeoff even at full rated power on the 109s are so piece of cake that one can even unlock the tailwheel right from teh beginning of the takeoff run, and don't care to use brakes ( ??? )

 

I don't think this is plausible, and I hope it get's addressed sometime in the future when they get some time to look at these details - which mean a lot for me...

 

IMO it is probably caused by an overdone calculation of the effects of propwash on the tail surfaces, and their efficiency... 

Edited October 28, 2017 by jcomm

[DD_Arthur]

Nope i tried it in all planes about 20-60 mins each plane type trying varying configs and weights to get tail up.

Only was possible in He-111

 

 

Helps to get off the runway/taxiway and into the dirt.  For 109E select 10% fuel and 90% down elevator trim.

 

I didn't know you could do it with the HE111.  Will give it a go

[Willy__]

To be fair, you are not actually taxing, you are just lifting the tail while standing in the same place....   

[=TBAS=Sshadow14]

you can't do that anymore as runway/dirt/grass all same surface friction it seems.

you should just have to hold brakes. (wheels should not slide or roll under full power - just like many ww2 planes, but here they do)
Then just a little down elevator and add power.


https://youtu.be/0zDo7hkmCNY?t=1m8s
 

Edited October 28, 2017 by =TBAS=Sshadow14

[DD_Arthur]

you can't do that anymore as runway/dirt/grass all same surface friction it seems.

 

you should just have to hold brakes. (wheels should not slide or roll under full power - just like many ww2 planes, but here they do)

Then just a little down elevator and add power.

 

 

Don't seem to have any trouble this evening.

 

 

Got the Heinkel to do it too!

 

[=TBAS=Sshadow14]

ahh yeah thats not what i meant its all good :D

and 111 will do it on any map or surface. except front rivers
 

[ZachariasX]

If you took off that, you expect you brakes still being functional when you land? I mean, with a Piper Cub, that works well. But a 109? Must be rather interesting, having it stand on two wheels with full power, when suddlenly brakes give up.

 

I doubt players would accept break performance strictly according to 1940 standards...

[Blutaar]

If we accept strict engine limitations, why not do the same for breaks...

 

Imagine you have 10 sec of breaking and after that you lose your breaks completely lol. (im just kidding)

[=TBAS=Sshadow14]

They already much weaker than real plane brakes.
But they will do, if we had proper brakes everyone would be nose planting planes after touchdown

[=TBAS=Sshadow14]

This is what OP meant?

Specially see how it allows me to easily steering around spawning in 109.

[ZachariasX]

If we accept strict engine limitations, why not do the same for breaks...

 

Imagine you have 10 sec of breaking and after that you lose your breaks completely lol. (im just kidding)

Depending on how you treat your aircraft and the type, this could in fact be realistic. Once you cook your brakes, they are gone.

[EAF_Starfire]

ABS would just help you flipping your aircraft over much faster. And in-game, the breaks are useful for all practical purposes. They even make itr possible to me mapped on a key or button instead of an axis. Conceptually, I find the devs made a good choice.

 

 

Nose overs where an EAF signature in the old IL2. In BOX we seldom see this syndrome :-)