Let's talk about the G6

[6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann]

Those bulges are for the larger protruding breech blocks. 

 

Just ignore him. Fiddy-cals or 13mm, whatever you want to call 'em, who gives a flying toss? I do wonder how that cartridge will go up against the Russian 12.7mm, which is ferocious and has an even bigger cartridge than the USA .50BMG. 

Rather Poorly. The 13mm is focussed on firing HEFI Rounds at a high rate of fire and low weight. The MG131 is very light and very fast, but Ballistics are bad and Armor Penetration Poor. 

[Boaty-McBoatface]

Rather Poorly. The 13mm is focussed on firing HEFI Rounds at a high rate of fire and low weight. The MG131 is very light and very fast, but Ballistics are bad and Armor Penetration Poor.

Interesting, cheers for that. Also 900rpm vs 1000rpm of Russian 12.7 won't do it any favours

Edited October 9, 2017 by Boaty_McBoatFace

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

Just ignore them Klaus, they clearly don't appreciate the informative posts you made. Their routine of thinking is a bit too sloppy (means imprecise) I guess.

 

 

That said, I wonder how the 30mm will perform. It has been my favourite gun in other simulators, and I cannot wait for IL-2 BoX to feature it in the G-6's nose.

[BlackSix]

Please, help us to find more info about Bf 109 G-6 in BOK

https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/31649-bok-and-bf-109-g-6/

[xvii-Dietrich]

While looking for something else, I found this photograph:

 

 

The caption for the photo was "Uusi Me 109 G6 ja uusi ohjaaja"   (= New Me 109 G6 and new pilot)

[LLv24_Zami]

While looking for something else, I found this photograph:

 

The caption for the photo was "Uusi Me 109 G6 ja uusi ohjaaja"   (= New Me 109 G6 and new pilot)

Nyt tuli ennennäkemätön kuva! No mutta jatketaan englannilla 

 

Where is this taken?

[Jocko]

Question for the 109 experts:   What is the correct angle of the landing gear on the G6?   All of the 109's we have in game have an almost 90 degree angle relative to the wings (from a side view).  In photographs of the R/L aircraft I have seen this always on the 109E and maybe some 109F's but never on the 109G's.  The later 109's have a more swept forward angle.  At what point in the evolution of the 109 did this change?

[6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann]

Question for the 109 experts:   What is the correct angle of the landing gear on the G6?   All of the 109's we have in game have an almost 90 degree angle relative to the wings (from a side view).  In photographs of the R/L aircraft I have seen this always on the 109E and maybe some 109F's but never on the 109G's.  The later 109's have a more swept forward angle.  At what point in the evolution of the 109 did this change?

I don't know of any such change. With the new, larger wheels the Angle of the Wheels on the Landing Gear Leg was changed, the Wheels are no longer Parallel with the Landing Gear Leg. In Car terms, they changed the Camber of the Wheels, not the Caster. 

 

Ingame that's the G-4 and later.

 

This thing

 

Edited October 13, 2017 by 6./ZG26_Klaus-Mann

[ITAF_Rani]

Waiting for the G6 

 

[PatrickAWlson]

That first landing looked like one of mine.  Except I bounce higher.  Then I finally set it down.  Then when I cut the engine it yaws on me and ground loops.  I walk away but High command is getting miffed about replacing a wing every time I fly.

 

Being serious, that was a pretty serious cross wind he put it down in.

[6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann]

Well, having had the Chance to fly a Bücker 131 today I understand why the 109 probably wasn't all that Scary even to a new Pilot. It's far more vicious than you would expaect from a Biplane and definetly not easy to fly. 

[ZachariasX]

Well, having had the Chance to fly a Bücker 131 today I understand why the 109 probably wasn't all that Scary even to a new Pilot. It's far more vicious than you would expaect from a Biplane and definetly not easy to fly.

 

Ha, get to fly one tomorrow again.

 

Well, it requires a determined way of controlling it. I‘d say I find it not difficult, but unusual. It doesn‘t allow for common practise errors in piloting such as a Cessna. But with practise... I find it a marvel. What remains an issue hovewer is that it is very apparent that crates like this one are made to be operated on large patches of gras for takeoff and landing always straight into the wind. If flaring out and putting it down on one wheel in Xwind condition doesn‘t come natural to the pilot, then you‘re in for some sweat.

[6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann]

Ha, get to fly one tomorrow again.

 

Well, it requires a determined way of controlling it. I‘d say I find it not difficult, but unusual. It doesn‘t allow for common practise errors in piloting such as a Cessna. But with practise... I find it a marvel. What remains an issue hovewer is that it is very apparent that crates like this one are made to be operated on large patches of gras for takeoff and landing always straight into the wind. If flaring out and putting it down on one wheel in Xwind condition doesn‘t come natural to the pilot, then you‘re in for some sweat.

War beim Bückerfest in Nörvenich. Hab in der deutschen Sektion zwei Schnipselchen geteilt. 

[ZachariasX]

War beim Bückerfest in Nörvenich. Hab in der deutschen Sektion zwei Schnipselchen geteilt.

 

Cool.

A good friend of mine owns one. So I get to fly it with him from time to time.

[novicebutdeadly]

 

[BuzzU]

300RPM, so 600 overall. And stay Metric. it's a 13mm. That Yankee Crap doesn't fly here. 

 

Still pissed we kicked your ass?

 

Suck it up. I can't let this go by with no comment.

[DB605]

Question for the 109 experts:   What is the correct angle of the landing gear on the G6?   All of the 109's we have in game have an almost 90 degree angle relative to the wings (from a side view).  In photographs of the R/L aircraft I have seen this always on the 109E and maybe some 109F's but never on the 109G's.  The later 109's have a more swept forward angle.  At what point in the evolution of the 109 did this change?

 

Change was done between E and F IRL. I did reported this to devs when BoS was still w.i.p but they did not change it, so all in game 109's (execpt E) have incorrect angle and probably will stay that way...

[6./ZG26_Custard]

I wonder if it sold for the €4,950,000 asking price? http://www.platinumfighters.com/bf109g6

 

Edit: For the benefit of Klaus that's £3,7258.0065 if were in dollars 

Edited October 15, 2017 by 6./ZG26_Custard

[LLv24_SukkaVR]

I wonder if it sold for the €4,950,000 asking price? http://www.platinumfighters.com/bf109g6

 

Edit: For the benefit of Klaus that's £3,7258.0065 if were in dollars 

 

If i just won the damn lottery some day..

[6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann]

I wonder if it sold for the €4,950,000 asking price? http://www.platinumfighters.com/bf109g6

 

Edit: For the benefit of Klaus that's £3,7258.0065 if were in dollars 

Well, where is the fun in just buying somehting? If anything I would like to get a Stuka and DFS-230 as well as a LaGG-3 back to Airworthy at some Point. And maybe a Bf109C. 

 

And a Junkers W.33 as well. And a Junkers D.I. That's an entire Lifetime of Aircraft that deserve Recognition and Airworthiness again. 

 

Buying a woking Airplane is like buying a New Car. It's boring and a sign of lacking Character. 

 

 

How about starting with something like this? 

 

Edited October 16, 2017 by 6./ZG26_Klaus-Mann

[xvii-Dietrich]

And a Junkers W.33 as well. {...}

 

Okay... now we're talking. 

 

 

But...  

 

 

 

Returning to the G6...

 

 

While looking for something else, I found this photograph:

 

Uusi Me 109 G6 ja uusi ohjaaja.jpg

 

The caption for the photo was "Uusi Me 109 G6 ja uusi ohjaaja"   (= New Me 109 G6 and new pilot)

 

 

 

Nyt tuli ennennäkemätön kuva! No mutta jatketaan englannilla 

 

Where is this taken?

 

 

@Zami...

 

I don't have a location or any information about the place. The suggestion is 1943, but that could be wrong. The photograph is originally from the Finnish archives (= SA-kuva-arkisto) but I couldn't find it there when I looked.

 

My guess is that this is a newly-delivered G6, which I'm saying on the basis it is Finnish photograph, but of a G6 with German markings. Again guessing, I would say it would have been flown in to Vantaa or Malmi. However, I've got no evidence for this, and this is just speculation.

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

Well, where is the fun in just buying somehting? If anything I would like to get a Stuka and DFS-230 as well as a LaGG-3 back to Airworthy at some Point. And maybe a Bf109C.

 

And a Junkers W.33 as well. And a Junkers D.I. That's an entire Lifetime of Aircraft that deserve Recognition and Airworthiness again.

 

Buying a woking Airplane is like buying a New Car. It's boring and a sign of lacking Character.

Your take on a great many things is curious at best and your worldview often puts you on a similar plane as raaaid.

[6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann]

Your take on a great many things is curious at best and your worldview often puts you on a similar plane as raaaid.

 

Edited October 16, 2017 by 6./ZG26_Klaus-Mann

[BMW801]

I really feel like you got an erroneous impression from your visit and it is not fair to generalize your assessment to all Americans. I seriously doubt you met all 300+ million of us while you were here.

If you return someday, I can introduce you to some superb human beings.

This is an honest invitation for even a place to stay should you return.

I am a 51 year old married guy with kids so I have seen and done a lot.

[von-Luck]

[edited]

 

No politics of any kind.

 

von Luck

Edited October 16, 2017 by SYN_Haashashin

[BMW801]

Agreed, but I was trying to stay positive and helpful.

I was attempting to be hospitable to hopefully educate others.

I am a neurosurgeon and my job is extremely stressful.

I fly the planes in BoX and come to this forum as an escape, not just from work, but also from the irritating 24 hours news channels and almost all popular culture now incorporating politics. I really don't want to see it here too.

This place should be a fun place for military history and aviation enthusiasts to discuss just that and leave the outside world outside of here where it belongs

[6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann]

He's trying to generalize a kind of nationalism.  The answer is anyone whom is a fervent believer of nationalism is capable of filling that roll.  America is in a strange place right now and there are a lot of nationalists however America isn't alone in that - all across the world (yes even the western world) nationalism has been on the rise.  Framing American's in this is simply short sighted - you needn't look hard to find a similar mindset in even your own country.  

 

von Luck

Of course, but I wasn't talking about nationalism in and of itself, but the culturally rooted unwillingness to seek the fault in one self. 

 

It is the general fault of all nationalist movements and extremely unhealthy to any nation. 

Edited October 15, 2017 by 6./ZG26_Klaus-Mann

[BMW801]

And by the way, I loved Hans von Luck's book

[6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann]

And by the way, I loved Hans von Luck's book

I'm about to get Joe Peterburs  Autobiography about his experiences as a P-51 Pilot in WWII and Korea. (The guy who shot down Walter Schuck in his Me-262). 

 

Quite Excited about it. 

Edited October 15, 2017 by 6./ZG26_Klaus-Mann

[von-Luck]

Of course, but I wasn't talking about nationalism in and of itself, but the culturally rooted unwillingness to seek the fault in one self. 

 

It is the general fault of all nationalist movements and extremely unhealthy to any nation. 

 

I remain unconvinced that there is some kind of wide spread culture that values deception over truth.  Especially if compared globally.  I would say the world is in a strange precipice and certain nations are behaving strangely - but culturally I think it's become too diverse to claim that there is some kind of unified trait in any place.  Anyways this has absolutely nothing to do about 109's so I'm done posting here about this nonsense.  

 

 

And by the way, I loved Hans von Luck's book

 

Thanks - von Luck was an interesting character and I too loved his book.

 

von Luck

[6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann]

I remain unconvinced that there is some kind of wide spread culture that values deception over truth.  Especially if compared globally.  I would say the world is in a strange precipice and certain nations are behaving strangely - but culturally I think it's become too diverse to claim that there is some kind of unified trait in any place.  Anyways this has absolutely nothing to do about 109's so I'm done posting here about this nonsense.  

 

Well, you could call it Nostalgia. And it's not about deceiving others, but yourself. These are the most dangerous lies. 

Whenever someone starts invoking "The Good ol' Times" it is appealing to your sense of self deception to draw a rose tainted picture of your own past. 

 

What South Park visualized as "(Re)Memberberries". Right now the US are living of the Scraps and Disjointed Bits of its Past, the Trashcan of Ideology as Zizek invokes it. 

The US National Identity reminds of a Person with Burnout. Overstressed with almost 50 years of Global Involvement, Wars and Hegemony. Burdened by Industrial Decline and huge Divide in Wealth.

 

I do not like to see America the way it is right now. I know there is something worthwhile underneath it all, but the way things are going now, nothing is going to get any better. 

Edited October 15, 2017 by 6./ZG26_Klaus-Mann

[BMW801]

I for one am looking forward to the G6 for the 13 mm so I can more than scratch the paint of an IL-2 when the 20 mm runs dry, despite the cost in performance

Edited October 15, 2017 by BMW801

[von-Luck]

The trick here, BMW801, is that the G6 will have a similar performance package to the G4 - we all know the G4 isn't a slouch in game so I would say you get the addition of the MG 131's, hopefully the MK 108, in a package that already performs in a familiar way.  If your the turn & burn 109 pilot then you may not appreciate this but for bounces it should be wonderful.  I hope the 108 makes it in and I pray it will be the 1 hit KO it deserves.  that darned shell had as much explosive in it as a 40mm Bofors.  

 

von Luck

[6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann]

I for one am looking forward to the G6 for the 13 mm so I can more than scratch the paint of an IL-2 when the 20 mm runs dry, despite the cost in performance

It won't perform well at all against the Il-2s I think. The Cartridge simply isn't powerful enough. It's a small Caliber HE Cannon, more than a true MG and against Armor it won't be much better than the 8mm of the MG17. 

However, against Pe-2s and A-20s it will be far more effective. My Guess at least. 

 

However, I also believe the Devs will give us the MK.108, historically correct or not, because it's the smart thing to do. 

Edited October 16, 2017 by 6./ZG26_Klaus-Mann

[xvii-Dietrich]

Here are a couple of Bf-109 G-6 photographs that I found. Source: SA-kuva (Finnish Armed Forces photograph archive)

 

 

 

The pilot is Nils Katajainen, the location is Lappeenranta, Karelia, during the Continuation War, 30-Jun-1944.

 

Original Finnish caption: Vääpeli Katajainen starttaa MT 109 G.6-koneella. Lappeenranta 1944.06.30

 

Reference: http://sa-kuva.fi/

Additional reference: https://fi.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nils_Katajainen

[von-Luck]

the armor pierceing power of the MG 131 is certainly not impressive:

 

The armor piercing version of the 13 x 64B cartridge, as used by the MG 131, had a low armor penetration with an impact angle of 60 degrees at a distance of 300 meters, penetration was 7.8 mm

 

 

however most of an aircraft isn't armored particularly well and you stand good odds of getting some ignition from the incendiary affect of the 131.  it won't be scything through things like the other 12.7's do presently but it should be more impressive than the Breda.

 

von Luck 

Edited October 16, 2017 by von-Luck

[6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann]

Really? I would say the Bredas do have more Punch Shot per Shot. 

 

Edited October 16, 2017 by 6./ZG26_Klaus-Mann

[-=PHX=-SuperEtendard]

armor penetration of 100 mm at 100 meters, with an impact angle of 60 degrees

 

That's more like this gun

 

 

:P

Edited October 16, 2017 by -=PHX=-SuperEtendard

[von-Luck]

That's more like this gun

 

 

:P

 

touche

 

I didn't vet that source very well.  I'll trim the post to exclude the questioned claim.  

 

von Luck

[-=PHX=-SuperEtendard]

touche

 

I didn't vet that source very well.  I'll trim the post to exclude the questioned claim.  

 

von Luck

 

It probably was a typo, meaning 10mm at 100m, then 7.8mm at 300m