About the horizon haze...

[Mmaruda]

So, I have seen a few people mentioning necessary changes to the blurry horizon, and as far as I understand it, the point is to aim for higher draw distance of terrain and landmarks. Jason himself said that improvements are planned, however, I would like to add my 2 cents here, since I think in all the discussions I have seen, on important element is missing. This is not WANT / DO NOT WANT argument. Just wanted to point out something, I think is important, when taking general terrain draw distance and how clear it is.

 

Long story short, I am not a real pilot, however I had the opportunity to sit a small aircraft with good visibility and also get out of it at 4000m. Compared to your standard passenger plane with crappy microscopic windows, the experience of seeing landscape around you from above is uncanny. One thing that struck me, was how low the visibility was and that was with clear weather. Not a cloud in sight! Granted, it was around the city (so smog maybe?) and the air might have been damp, but still, everything I have seen in various flight sims, seemed completely wrong. My experience was this - I was trying to understand as much as possible about what the pilot was doing and how he was navigating, but 5 minutes after take off, I had no idea where we were in relation to the airfield, even-though we have just been circling over it. My point is, the whole view was very hazy and despite clean weather, the visibility wasn't actually that high. Stuff on the ground wasn't clear at all. And my immediate association about which sims depict this the best was... Rise of Flight and Battle of Stalingrad.

 

Case in point, my impression was (from a perspective on a passenger and later a human missile and human umbrella) that you cannot really see that well IRL compared to flight sim. Basically, the amount of visual clarity you get in most sims in term of what is distinguishable in the distance is very wrong.

 

Again, I don't do stuff like this regularly  and the experience from a passenger seat of an airliner is something totally different. But from my experience, the blurry and hazy horizon in BOx is actually very immersive and I think representative of what you get in real life.

 

Just a personal opinion, but I think it's worth considering, if this discussion comes up again.

Edited September 1, 2017 by Mmaruda

[SAG]

i live in a valley in between two high mountains

 

we get smog buildups that makes looking far away look like in game. the city every so often declares environmental emergency on such days and personal use cars are prohibited for the day.

 

in a normal day visibility is much much better and one can easily see much much further away. 

we already have fog modeled into the game but when we get super clear weather ingame it is still too short of a draw distance. just my two cents

[unreasonable]

It is so weather dependent. From my apartment (not airborn, but high ) I can usually see a suspension bridge about 8 km away.  During clear winter weather I can only see the main structure. Although there are no or few clouds, the air contains a lot of fine dust.  In the rainy season, when a recent shower has washed the dust out of the air and reduced moisture content, I can see not only the main suspension wire but - if the light is right - make out the silvery thread of some of the support wires.

 

IMHO the BOS horizon haze is a good approximation to the usual cloudy, humid or dusty conditions. What we do not get is those occasional glorious days when you can see almost to the end of the world......

[ShamrockOneFive]

With the improvements I'm hoping and I'm suspecting that the team will do this well (as they have done well on other weather related items) is that we'll have some clear days with distant visibility but we'll also see the haze and it'll depend on conditions.

Even a clear day around here in the summer can be hot, humid and hazy.

[US63_SpadLivesMatter]

My problem is the visible and immersion-breaking bubble around my aircraft.

[unreasonable]

My problem is the visible and immersion-breaking bubble around my aircraft.

 

I assume you mean the "bubble of blur" - the transition in the textures, especially in forest areas?  I agree that looks wrong, although it is nothing like as bad as it was.  A puzzle to me why colour matching the trees with the long range texture is so hard, but I suppose it must be or it would surely have been fixed. 

[ShamrockOneFive]

I assume you mean the "bubble of blur" - the transition in the textures, especially in forest areas?  I agree that looks wrong, although it is nothing like as bad as it was.  A puzzle to me why colour matching the trees with the long range texture is so hard, but I suppose it must be or it would surely have been fixed. 

 

I suspect it is because all of the different lighting possibilities will change how the textures look. So much so that it is really difficult to make it blend in all the time. The work they did recently has made it far less of an issue for me and I barely notice it.

[unreasonable]

That sounds likely.  I barely notice it on the Kuban map because mostly there is no forest, and in the forested mountains there are lots of variations due to ridges, slopes etc so it does not stick out. I think it would still be an issue over a large area of flat forest.

 

If I was trying to fix it in a still picture I would use a gradient of opacity on the tree overlay to reduce the contrast at the edge of the tree area. No idea if this is practical in 3D.  

 

Best answer - maps with no trees. ie El Alamein..........

[Guest deleted@50488]

--> here it is <--

 

By Jason:

 

"The only thing that we do less than others is the horizon and that is changing soon and we should have the furthest in the genre if all goes to plan. So, stop whining and go fly some damn missions and leave the development to us. "

 

​​We just have to wait a little longer - every thing 1C / 777 has promised was delivered, in excelente shape!  2.012 is one of the best practical proofs of this.

Edited September 3, 2017 by jcomm

[SAG]

--> here it is <--

 

By Jason:

 

"The only thing that we do less than others is the horizon and that is changing soon and we should have the furthest in the genre if all goes to plan. So, stop whining and go fly some damn missions and leave the development to us. "

 

​​We just have to wait a little longer - every thing 1C / 777 has promised was delivered, in excelente shape!  2.012 is one of the best practical proofs of this.

 

 

Jesus Christ!!!

 

Thanks for this piece of godly news!! :D

[wonders9]

Let me point out something different but still relevant.

 

Has anyone paid attention to the colors of real haze (or fog) and compare them with that in game? Are they completely the same?

The color of the BOS haze probably needs minute tuning, because currently it is slightly too white -- just slightly. In fact there should often be a little amount of grey in the haze color, and this grey color may be with a little hint of blue, yellow, or brown,etc, and may vary a little in different weather conditions. 

 

If one is not so sure, looking at some good aerial photographs and comparing them with screenshots from BOS may help to get an idea, not proof. 

Edited September 3, 2017 by wonders9

[Torso]

Let me point out something different but still relevant.

 

Has anyone paid attention to the colors of real haze (or fog) and compare them with that in game? Are they completely the same?

 

The color of the BOS haze probably needs minute tuning, because currently it is slightly too white -- just slightly. In fact there should often be a little amount of grey in the haze color, and this grey color may be with a little hint of blue, yellow, or brown,etc, and may vary a little in different weather conditions. 

 

If one is not so sure, looking at some good aerial photographs and compare them with screenshots from BOS may help to get an idea, not proof. 

 

 

 

This..I completely agree. For one thing, the brightest white, meaning the brightest color in the entire game world should be reserved for distant and close range glints and reflections, and at night for lighting. As a glint is a flash of white light.Tuning the haze coloring down, which would take some testing sure, to a more grey/blueish base color with then yellow/brown slants depending on time of day and weather etc..will then allow PURE whites to be reserved for specular glints(a glint flash effect would be cool) and highlights that especially in VR would be really useful in spotting and targeting, especially at long ranges as that is a challenge in VR often and even in 2D. And it would be realistic, I mean we have all seen glints off objects from the sun from cars, boats, trains and yes even PLANES..lol. Heck, Snipers have to worry about this in combat. 

 

I think tuning the haze color down would be a good solution, that is IF what Jason and team have cooking does not give them the results they are hoping for. Cus that sounds pretty dang promising too

Edited September 3, 2017 by Torso

[VBF-12_Stick-95]

I agree the current horizon isn't that much off what I have seen, though it does depend on many conditions of the atmosphere, direction of view and important for the future, the terrain, i.e. land or sea.  The cockpit canopy really cuts into the visibility also.  I hope it is improved but still dependent on the various factors that can impact it.  I think terrain distance detail however does need improvement, which, unless I am wrong after reading Jason's comments, are linked to the horizon issue.

[Guest deleted@30725]

Il2 - summer setting, clear day vs the real world - Winter, clear day.

 

 

[TG-55Panthercules]

Interesting pictures, but I'm not sure what good it does to compare a summer shot in IL-2 with a winter shot IRL.  And the second shot is certainly not a "clear day" as stated (and like the first one is).

 

Not sure what we're supposed to conclude from the above post.

[US63_SpadLivesMatter]

Winter map will be just as bad; but hopefully that will be getting better.

 

We'll see!

Edited September 4, 2017 by hrafnkolbrandr