MiG 3 Ground control

[BM357_TinMan]

Can someone please tell me the secret to landing and, to a lesser extent, taking off in this thing?

I can take off successfully about 40% of the time but can NOT land without a ground loop.

Edited September 1, 2017 by TynMahn

[Guest deleted@30725]

Not landed it for ages, but taking off is just like all the rest, feed in the power, bit of rudder and up it goes.

[Guest deleted@30725]

Just did a quick land and not done one in it for 3 months. Came in level full flaps, gear down and waited till it came down steady with minimal / no engine power and as it lost lift near the ground pulled the nose up a bit and gently hit the deck with slight bounce. When all lift was gone and wheels staying on the ground full back on the stick, wheel brakes and tiny bit of rudder kept it arrow straight till it stopped.

 

Can't give you speeds, I just get 'the feeling' when it looses all its lift. I'm guessing full back on the stick is the key when its on the ground similar to the la-5.

Edited September 2, 2017 by deleted@30725

[Barnacles]

Indiaciki's video here shows you need to 'dance' on the rudder pedals in a tail dragger. Also maybe leave the throttle open a tiny bit to increase airflow over the rudder. 

[Boaty-McBoatface]

I don't understand, what's the problem with takeoff landing in Mig 3? Not a hard plane to land.

[Field-Ops]

You might be used to planes that require much more rudder input to get it to stay straight on takeoff. What the mig does is (as well as the i-16) is that the tail wheel is coupled with your rudder input, so if you rear wheel is touching the ground you need much less rudder to make it behave. That makes it hard when you are used to the rest of the planes that dont do this. Another weird quirk is that it only controls the rear wheel up to 50% of your rudder input, after you exceed that the wheel becomes free from control of the rudder and youl have to straighten it out to get that control back. 

 

TLDR, you need much less rudder input than other planes during takeoff and landing.

Edited September 2, 2017 by Field-Ops

[Chomp]

I was having the same issue with landing the Mig for quite a while. Spitfire and La 5 also. Got to the stage where I was touching down pretty good, but was always ending up in a ground loop, many times prop hitting the deck. I have recently found the main issue was that I was thinking that using brakes with peddles ( left and right mapped to axis's ) both together was the same as using the "Brakes" ie. the default mapped to "/". This however is not the case and I wasn't apply any brakes at all when I thought I was. Left and right brakes mapped to the a left and right axis's only work on German planes. The Russian planes have differential brakes, so applying brakes "/" or whatever you have that mapped to, is then controlled more to left or right depending on your rudder input. 

Bear in mind also that once more than 50% rudder input is applied with the Mig, the tail wheel unlocks, as Field-Ops has mentioned already.

[blitze]

Trick is stick back at sub 100kph speeds to lock the tail wheel.  On take off, line up runway, pull full baxk on stick, open throttle and use some rudder to keep nose straight.  Also rpm 100% and mix 80%. At 100+ kph, ease up stick to center and then above 150 gently pull back to climb.

 

On landing, rpm 100% flaps down, a little throttle and slow descend to a flare out above runway. When on ground cut throttle and pull stck right back again to lock tail wheel and brake. When stopped, flaps up, stick neutral and taxi with small throttle bursts, rudder and brakes.

 

You'll get used to it. The tail wheel locking is the key.

[Finkeren]

Trick is stick back at sub 100kph speeds to lock the tail wheel. On take off, line up runway, pull full baxk on stick, open throttle and use some rudder to keep nose straight. Also rpm 100% and mix 80%. At 100+ kph, ease up stick to center and then above 150 gently pull back to climb.

 

On landing, rpm 100% flaps down, a little throttle and slow descend to a flare out above runway. When on ground cut throttle and pull stck right back again to lock tail wheel and brake. When stopped, flaps up, stick neutral and taxi with small throttle bursts, rudder and brakes.

 

You'll get used to it. The tail wheel locking is the key.

That's not how it works. On the MiG the tailwheel is locked and unlocked by rudder movement (same as the Yak-1b) Pulling back the stick to lock tailwheel is for the Fw 190.

 

At more than 50% deflection of the rudder the tailwheel becomes unlocked, otherwise it is locked.

 

You should still pull the stick back during the first half of take off and during rollout to keep the tailwheel firmly on the ground, but it doesn't lock it.

Edited September 2, 2017 by Finkeren

[blitze]

My bad I thought it was the same as the La's, still gets me off the ground and I had a whole host of issues pre fm changes when I first started to fly the Mig.  Still do but that is to do with getting shot down ))

[Guest deleted@30725]

That's not how it works. On the MiG the tailwheel is locked and unlocked by rudder movement (same as the Yak-1b) Pulling back the stick to lock tailwheel is for the Fw 190.

 

At more than 50% deflection of the rudder the tailwheel becomes unlocked, otherwise it is locked.

 

You should still pull the stick back during the first half of take off and during rollout to keep the tailwheel firmly on the ground, but it doesn't lock it.

 

So maybe the issue with the OPs ground looping is too much rudder, moving the tail wheel and getting into a tank slapper and then loosing control at the end?

Edited September 2, 2017 by deleted@30725

[Finkeren]

So maybe the issue with the OPs ground looping is too much rudder, moving the tail wheel and getting into a tank slapper and then loosing control at the end?

That is certainly possible. During landing, you need to step-dance on the pedals, not hold a constant rudder input.

[BM357_TinMan]

I can land now.  The problem was, I had no brakes.  I was trying to use my toe brakes as assigned to my rudder pedals.  Evidently, this does not work in this plane.  I assigned "/" to my joystick and nailed the landing with no ground loop.

Thanks

[Guest deleted@30725]

I can land now.  The problem was, I had no brakes.  I was trying to use my toe brakes as assigned to my rudder pedals.  Evidently, this does not work in this plane.  I assigned "/" to my joystick and nailed the landing with no ground loop.

 

Thanks

 

Good job, glad you found your problem.

[LLv24_SukkaVR]

Most russian planes dont have toe brakes. I think I-16 had? And P-40 but thats american. Why didnt soviets and allied use toe brakes that much? Why did germans always use toe brakes?

[Finkeren]

Most russian planes dont have toe brakes. I think I-16 had? And P-40 but thats american. Why didnt soviets and allied use toe brakes that much? Why did germans always use toe brakes?

Toe brakes are fairly safe and simple, but the Soviet designs with differential brakes controlled by rudder movement (similar ti what the Spitfire has IIRC) is arguably more advanced.

[Herne]

That's not how it works. On the MiG the tailwheel is locked and unlocked by rudder movement (same as the Yak-1b) Pulling back the stick to lock tailwheel is for the Fw 190.

 

At more than 50% deflection of the rudder the tailwheel becomes unlocked, otherwise it is locked.

 

You should still pull the stick back during the first half of take off and during rollout to keep the tailwheel firmly on the ground, but it doesn't lock it.

 

I didn't know this is how it works with the Yak 1b. So many hours in this sim, and I am still learning stuff. I love it