are you guys doing anything with the FFB implementation?

[9./JG27DavidRed]

ok...just read the current update and about upcoming fixes...many "fixes" implemented by TF, that actually made me leave CLOD, now seem to get really fixed with the upcoming 4.5 patch...and of course new features like tree collision and the like do sound interesting....

 

BUT....as a guy using a FFB stick, all of the above good things will still be meaningless for me, IF the FFB implementation in CLOD remains as it currently is...its mainly the gunshake effect which makes the whole CLOD experience just an annoyance...and even the most fancy graphical improvements, engine improvements, new theaters or new plane types will not make me even look back, if thats not going to get fixed...

 

i know, FFB users are a minorty, and some of them still fly CLOD as they just live with it..but for me thats the one big "no go"....

 

so, are there any plans to improve the FFB implementation in CLOD?

[69thSpiritus]

So you only get a gun shake with FFB? I use the G940 and have all the FFB I'm used to having, gun shake, engine vibrations, violent shake when I blow my engine, wind resistance on control surfaces. 

 

Occasionally I will lose FFB in flight, especially if I window out of the game for some reason but if I just remove my hand from the stick a few times it jolts back on. 

[Sokol1]

I am not fan of  force feedback (own for a time MS FFB PRO and MSFFB2 USB), but what I think will be interesting is DCSW approach, that don't include the "gamey" gun hake in force feedback effects, only the related to flight.

[BOO]

HI

 

I use an MS Sindewinder2 FFB.

 

The cannon kick on the 109s in Clod is distracting for many. Its something that is also cross coded to the stall effect  (instead of the autocannon? - I cant fully recall) so removing the shake file to remove the big cannon kick also removes the stall shake (as I remember). I would hope that with the source code now out of the box its something that could be rectified quite easily (but I'm not a coder so wont presume this). 

 

You can alter the shake file slightly so that it gives much less of an initial kick but the trade off is a few ms of delay on the stall warning which translates into a larger delay at your hand. Its not so obvious in the air though. You could alter the mg files in the same way to by reducing the wave peaks in the file. Or you could just remove the MG file altogether.

 

In terms of FFB drop out when firing German MGs, dropping ordinance and rear gunners firing, I suffered it a lot but all that can be solved by tapping the MGs, dropping speed to reengage FFB then firing your cannon briefly. Once done the FFB usually stays good for as long as the game is active (regardless of missions flown) . I either do this as part of my checks after take off or on another server prior to a mission. 

 

The blenni suffers the same drop out with ordinance and rear gunners for me. I cant be sure but I think its as simple as firing the forward .303 and dropping speed to reengage FFB that sorts it (although it could be firing from the dorsal gun). Either way - its a quick do. 

 

Although this is not ideal  its hardly a bind and not problematic. I also prefer the overall FFB effect in Clod to BOS (especially since I can actually get an 88 to climb on trim and without constant back pressure in Clod) although the force trim and "clunk" effects of the opening and closing front edge lats are pretty cool - I know there also are debates about the differences in FFB v non FFB trim in BOS elsewhere.

 

Hopefully there enough TFS members with dirty little FFB secrets to also want this corrected. If not, I can live with it and it and isn't, for me at least, a reason not to play such a great game.

 

HOWEVER - If the average player also suffers the FFB drop out when mixing Mgs and cannon (I dunno if they do but it seems common) there will likely be an increase in "WTFs" when the Beaufighter goes online given that, to date, this has been exclusively a blue problem.

 

BOO

[Amarok]

Moin comrades,

 

I have also the MS SWFFB2 in use and I would welcome it, if this old known problem would be finally fixed, because now the source code is available.

[sniperton]

Yes, I think it's obviously a wrong file reference in the source code. Once the instance is found, it shouldn't take more than 10 seconds to replace the wrong reference for 'shake.ffe' with the correct one for 'autocannon.ffe'.

Edited July 27, 2017 by sniperton

[9./JG27DavidRed]

I am not fan of  force feedback (own for a time MS FFB PRO and MSFFB2 USB), but what I think will be interesting is DCSW approach, that don't include the "gamey" gun hake in force feedback effects, only the related to flight.

 

while DCS has a slightly different approach to ffb implementation, its still far from being really good...yes it doesnt have these gamey gunshake effects...but for example iirc, it still has some gamey ground forces effects at crashlandings...which are anything but realistic...furthermore, in dcs, the overall forces hardly change with speed, except at close to and below stall speeds where the stickforce begins to decrease...but you dont feel a difference between lets say 220kph and 800kph...furthermore, the buffeting effects dont feel realstic but have a certain frequence and strength, which resemble much more the artificial stickshaker feature you find nowadays in modern flybywire aircraft, than natural buffeting effects. so even dcs has much room for improvement in FFB implementation.

 

 

 

Yes, I think it's obviously a wrong file reference in the source code. Once the instance is found, it shouldn't take more than 10 seconds to replace the wrong reference for 'shake.ffe' with the correct one for 'autocannon.ffe'.

if its that easy it would be awesome...here is just hoping that they improve it with 4.5 which i understand will be the last free patch before its going to be payware...

[OBT-Mikmak]

For the happy owners of a joystick with force feedback here is how to configure the effects of it in COD:

In the "C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\IL-2 Sturmovik Cliffs of Dover Blitz\parts\core\FF" folder you will find .ffe files that match the various force feedback effects that COD supports.

- autocannon.ffe: effect on gunfire
- bomb.ffe: effect when dropping a bomb
- machinegun.ffe: effect when firing machine gun
- mortar.ffe: I do not know what this effect
- punch.ffe: effect that manages the vibrations during taxiing (during take-off in particular)
- shake.ffe: effect due to turbulence during stalling (as a function of the stall intensity) as well as when the flaps or the landing gear exit.
- spring.ffe: stiffness effect of the handle linked to the air flows on the control surfaces (function of the speed of the airplane)

The software Fedit (right clic -> save linked target) allows to edit these files and modify lot of parameters (amplitude, frequency, etc ...)



For my part, I have notably changed the effects of weapons as well as that of turbulence, I greatly reduced the effect of guns because on the 109 E3 / 4 I found the effect too strong.

Here is the files ffe that I use with my joystick Microsoft Force Feedback 2  (right clic -> save linked target)

Caution: When performing a "cache integrity check" in Steam, the .ffe files that have been modified are replaced with the default .ffe files.
Do not forget to save your .ffe files if you like your settings.

Edited December 30, 2020 by OBT-Mikmak

[AustinP]

As a coder, I can confirm that, yes, this is the type of modification that should be very easy. This is my best guess, as i do not have access to the BoB code.

 

 

while DCS has a slightly different approach to ffb implementation, its still far from being really good...yes it doesnt have these gamey gunshake effects...but for example iirc, it still has some gamey ground forces effects at crashlandings...which are anything but realistic...furthermore, in dcs, the overall forces hardly change with speed, except at close to and below stall speeds where the stickforce begins to decrease...but you dont feel a difference between lets say 220kph and 800kph...furthermore, the buffeting effects dont feel realstic but have a certain frequence and strength, which resemble much more the artificial stickshaker feature you find nowadays in modern flybywire aircraft, than natural buffeting effects. so even dcs has much room for improvement in FFB implementation.

 

 

 

if its that easy it would be awesome...here is just hoping that they improve it with 4.5 which i understand will be the last free patch before its going to be payware...

[9./JG27DavidRed]

For the happy owners of a joystick with force feedback here is how to configure the effects of it in COD:

 

In the ".. \ SteamApps \ common \ il-2 sturmovik cliffs of dover \ parts \ core \ FF" folder you will find .ffe files that match the various force feedback effects that COD supports.

 

- autocannon.ffe: effect on gunfire

- bomb.ffe: effect when dropping a bomb

- machinegun.ffe: effect when firing machine gun

- mortar.ffe: I do not know what this effect

- punch.ffe: effect that manages the vibrations during taxiing (during take-off in particular)

- shake.ffe: effect due to turbulence during stalling (as a function of the stall intensity) as well as when the flaps or the landing gear exit.

- spring.ffe: stiffness effect of the handle linked to the air flows on the control surfaces (function of the speed of the airplane)

 

The software Fedit (right clic -> save linked target) allows to edit these files and modify lot of parameters (amplitude, frequency, etc ...)

 

 

For my part, I have notably changed the effects of weapons as well as that of turbulence, I greatly reduced the effect of guns because on the 109 E3 / 4 I found the effect too strong.

Here is the files ffe that I use with my joystick Microsoft Force Feedback 2  (right clic -> save linked target)

 

Caution: When performing a "cache integrity check" in Steam, the .ffe files that have been modified are replaced with the default .ffe files.

Do not forget to save your .ffe files if you like your settings.

i am aware of the possibilty to adjust the .ffe files...the problem is that the buffeting effects and the gunshake effects have the same file...so if you want to get rid of the gunshake, you inevitably  lose the buffeting effect as well...

imo thats not acceptable...a change from the devs is needed to achieve a proper ffb implementation as far as i understand it...

[OBT-Mikmak]

..the problem is that the buffeting effects and the gunshake effects have the same file...so if you want to get rid of the gunshake, you inevitably  lose the buffeting effect as well...

 

That is true but you can adjust it in a way that it becomes really more manageable in game (less shake effect during 109 shoot and keep enough buffeting effects).

I suggest you to try my .ffe files to have a more precise idea of ffb behaviour.

[Sokol1]

 

 

..the problem is that the buffeting effects and the gunshake effects have the same file...so if you want to get rid of the gunshake, you inevitably  lose the buffeting effect as well...

 

Then what TF could do is - like DCSW -  erase the cannon shake effect from game code - even because this is "gamey" effect, planes control column don't jump all around when firing guns.

[9./JG27DavidRed]

any answer from a dev regarding ffb in 5.0? any chances we will see actually a good implementation of FFB?

[Buzzsaw]

14 hours ago, 9./JG27DavidRed said:

any answer from a dev regarding ffb in 5.0? any chances we will see actually a good implementation of FFB?

We are looking at this.

[MAXsenna]

I know this is an old thread. But I cannot get FFB to work in CLoD Blitz or Tobruk. 

I have not made any changes to the conf.ini as it already had FF=1.

I have the MS SW FFB2, and while effects are nice, my stick is totally limp, and makes it hard to very hard to fly.

Any tip would be much appreciated!

Cheers!

[OBT-Mikmak]

With the new version of Il2 COD Blitz / DW Tobruk V5.001, I adjusted some force feedback effects in my "ffe" files.
Here you can find my new ffe files (right clic ->"save target link as" )

PS. I updated the link of my previous post.

[Talisman]

FF still poorly implemented in CloD.  There is no joy in this.  Messing about with these files is not working for me and makes things worse with game files getting corrupted.  We should have a proper in-game setting facility to set FF for customers IMHO.  Nor should we be expected to use a 3rd party app to overcome this sort of shortfall.

Sadly, just another in a list of off putting issues for this flight sim.  FF still poorly implemented after all these years, no VR compatibility and still no proper compatibility with JetSet and JetPad.

No wonder customers give up and go fly a space sim or any other games.

Edited May 8, 2021 by ACG_Talisman

[Guest deleted@7076]

-Deleted-

Edited September 12, 2022 by Varrattu

[Dagwoodyt]

4 hours ago, ACG_Talisman said:

FF still poorly implemented in CloD.  There is no joy in this.  Messing about with these files is not working for me and makes things worse with game files getting corrupted.  We should have a proper in-game setting facility to set FF for customers IMHO.  Nor should we be expected to use a 3rd party app to overcome this sort of shortfall.

Sadly, just another in a list of off putting issues for this flight sim.  FF still poorly implemented after all these years, no VR compatibility and still no proper compatibility with JetSet and JetPad.

No wonder customers give up and go fly a space sim or any other games.

Well if you're having that kind of a day might as well mention lack of Tacview support ;-)