How do you use your keyboard while VR is on?

[Bearfoot]

Wow, I must have touched a sensitive button of yours. My opinion is not really that important to get upset or offended about. Relax and go enjoy some VR flying.

 

(Sigh. Forgot how taking the time to present a well-constructed arguments centered on facts can cause people on the internet to think someone is upset, simply because they put some effort into the response rather than typing things in 144-character or less bursts. Maybe it is a generation thing ... )

 

Seems like you consider yourself as big an expert on inferring my internal emotional state as you are in VR. Well, if you do in fact care so much, I would be happy to share with the deepest depths of what my feelings actually are ...

[Thad]

I don't think conversing with you is worth any more of my time. I really don't care what you think or feel. Like I said... relax and go enjoy some VR flying.

[Gambit21]

You misread him there Thad.

One of the ever present dangers of written communication.

[mrvile]

Unfortunate when a well-constructed argument is so quickly dismissed with "don't be so offended bro!"

[mga]

What works for me is a Logitech G13. It's small enough to keep it by my throttle and given that it's not a full size keyboard it's very easy to find the keys you need by touch. It is very versatile, as you can assign keys strokes, macros, lua scripts, etc to the keys. The small joystick can work as a mouse if you want it (although it does take a bit of time to get used to that).

[Thad]

Unfortunate when a well-constructed argument is so quickly dismissed with "don't be so offended bro!"

Salutations,

 

Quote. "You know how you can tell the difference between an alligator or crocodile? See if the fourth tooth sticks out when the mouth is closed. You know how you can tell the difference between someone who has never used VR and one who has? See if they are obsessed about image quality."

 

I suppose you think these statements represent part of a well constructed argument? I read them as a thinly (poorly) veiled and sarcastic put down of me and anybody not showing his apparent high regard or appreciation for the current graphic quality state of VR development. Regardless, I am not all that excited about the current state of VR. I'll wait, watch, read and see what developes.

[Bearfoot]

Salutations,

 

Quote. "You know how you can tell the difference between an alligator or crocodile? See if the fourth tooth sticks out when the mouth is closed. You know how you can tell the difference between someone who has never used VR and one who has? See if they are obsessed about image quality."

 

I suppose you think these statements represent part of a well constructed argument? I read them as a thinly (poorly) veiled and sarcastic put down of me and anybody not showing his apparent high regard or appreciation for the current graphic quality state of VR development. Regardless, I am not all that excited about the current state of VR. I'll wait, watch, read and see what developes.

 

Arguments 101, Part 1: Parts of An Argument

 

An argument consists of a claim, (optional) counter-claim, evidence, and reasoning.

 

"Someone who has never used VR obsesses about image quality" and "VR is not about the image quality" is the claim.

 

What follows later is the evidence and the reasoning.

 

The alligator/crocodile bit was a joke. Now who needs to relax?

 

You are welcome (of course!) to do as you wish with your money, your computer, and your life. My feelings will not get hurt, I promise.

[mrvile]

Salutations,

 

Quote. "You know how you can tell the difference between an alligator or crocodile? See if the fourth tooth sticks out when the mouth is closed. You know how you can tell the difference between someone who has never used VR and one who has? See if they are obsessed about image quality."

 

I suppose you think these statements represent part of a well constructed argument? I read them as a thinly (poorly) veiled and sarcastic put down of me and anybody not showing his apparent high regard or appreciation for the current graphic quality state of VR development. Regardless, I am not all that excited about the current state of VR. I'll wait, watch, read and see what developes.

 

Wow, I must have touched a sensitive button of yours. My opinion is not really that important to get upset or offended about. Relax and go enjoy some 4K flying. 

[Torso]

I always wish I could be a fly on the wall when the ones who are so, well basically 'anti-vr' then get a chance to try it. Seen it a few times, really fun to see them remove the headset and that look in their eyes and their dropped jaws..and they know you know. They know then they were wrong and had no clue what they were talking about because they just could not really grasp what it was like until they tried it themselves. They just had a 2d existence and just did not grasp what 1:1 scale, 3D/360degree immersion and 1:1 tracking was truly like. I love those "Jesus, what the f was I thinking and why was I" moments. Thank god I have always waited to try something before dismissing it. Don't miss out on as much that way.

Edited April 13, 2017 by Torso

[Gambit21]

I fully get that I'll think it's pretty damn neat...but I'm waiting until it's so mo flicking amazing, and affordable... that control of my bodily functions upon first exposure become well-nigh impossible.

Until then I'll enjoy my 4K monitor.

[RustNeverSleeps]

Yeah i have no issues with this given the Rift has that small gap.  I can't imagine not having that gap and hope future headsets also include this or allow the user to adjust it to have one. I use it constantly to type, use key commands, check my phone, and grab beverages and such. It'd be a real pain to have to lift the headset every time I needed to do one of those things. 

[Bearfoot]

I fully get that I'll think it's pretty damn neat...but I'm waiting until it's so mo flicking amazing, and affordable... that control of my bodily functions upon first exposure become well-nigh impossible.

Until then I'll enjoy my 4K monitor.

 

First few times up in VR, control of bodily functions were a real challenge! I'm talking specifically about keeping one's stomach contents, um, in said stomach. Really glad I'm past that stage, though I still get hint of possible queasiness around the corner at times during certain maneuvers. Same cause as sea-sickness --- confusion/debate within the body politic --- but in this case, your eyes+brain telling you are moving, but your vestibular system saying, "no, we're not!" instead of the other way around.  Not to mention how crashes --- especially spinning/tumbling ones --- still sometimes force me to close my eye involuntarily. Can't help it!

 

But, yes, I recognize that there are lots and lots and lots and lots of good reasons not to jump into VR right now, and yours are perfectly valid ones. It is the "image quality" argument, as put forward by many folk, that is indicative of a fundamental misunderstanding of the nature of the experience. 

[Torso]

What works for me is a Logitech G13. It's small enough to keep it by my throttle and given that it's not a full size keyboard it's very easy to find the keys you need by touch. It is very versatile, as you can assign keys strokes, macros, lua scripts, etc to the keys. The small joystick can work as a mouse if you want it (although it does take a bit of time to get used to that).

 

+1 on the G13, I have one attached to my Warthog throttle and it is great.

Edited April 14, 2017 by Torso

[Gambit21]

First few times up in VR, control of bodily functions were a real challenge! I'm talking specifically about keeping one's stomach contents, um, in said stomach. Really glad I'm past that stage, though I still get hint of possible queasiness around the corner at times during certain maneuvers. Same cause as sea-sickness --- confusion/debate within the body politic --- but in this case, your eyes+brain telling you are moving, but your vestibular system saying, "no, we're not!" instead of the other way around.  Not to mention how crashes --- especially spinning/tumbling ones --- still sometimes force me to close my eye involuntarily. Can't help it!

 

But, yes, I recognize that there are lots and lots and lots and lots of good reasons not to jump into VR right now, and yours are perfectly valid ones. It is the "image quality" argument, as put forward by many folk, that is indicative of a fundamental misunderstanding of the nature of the experience. 

 

Oh I read your post on image quality, and I thought it was a very good point and well stated.

I'll nevertheless wait for better image quality...at this stage I don't have much choice anyway.

 

The wife is already being very tolerant of the new monitor, plus a new PC build very soon.

[Bearfoot]

What works for me is a Logitech G13. It's small enough to keep it by my throttle and given that it's not a full size keyboard it's very easy to find the keys you need by touch. It is very versatile, as you can assign keys strokes, macros, lua scripts, etc to the keys. The small joystick can work as a mouse if you want it (although it does take a bit of time to get used to that).

 

+1 on the G13, I have one attached to me Warthog throttle and it is great.

 

 

I've been considering this option.

 

Two things I have not figured out yet:

 

(1) how easy is it to use as a mouse?

 

(2) how bulky is it --- for this, do you have a photograph of it next to the warthog, so I can have a sense of this?

[Torso]

I've been considering this option.

 

Two things I have not figured out yet:

 

(1) how easy is it to use as a mouse?

 

(2) how bulky is it --- for this, do you have a photograph of it next to the warthog, so I can have a sense of this?

 

 

It is pretty easy to use as a mouse, can also switch it on the fly to use it as a 2nd jstick as well. I am 3d printing up a mod to the little jstick thumb controller to give me more throw and thus more precision with it's use.  Basically putting 1-1.5 inch extension on it.

 

Here is a link to some progress pics of my VR chair project. Scroll to bottom for G13 with throttle pics. Link should work for you. Need to update it as I have made further progress and refinements.

 

https://imgur.com/a/j8Cbg

[Bearfoot]

It is pretty easy to use as a mouse, can also switch it on the fly to use it as a 2nd jstick as well. I am 3d printing up a mod to the little jstick thumb controller to give me more throw and thus more precision with it's use.  Basically putting 1-1.5 inch extension on it.

 

Here is a link to some progress pics of my VR chair project. Scroll to bottom for G13 with throttle pics. Link should work for you. Need to update it as I have made further progress and refinements.

 

https://imgur.com/a/j8Cbg

 

That is a very neat set up, for sure. Thanks for sharing! Looking forward to more updates, especially about the "custom G13" set up. I just ordered a Saitek throttle quadrant to help manage the extra engine management axes in the Yak-1/b (been flying the Bf-109x mostly, which has a much lower lever workload). Might actually return it and pick up the G-13, as the functionality seems better and more flexible.

[Feathered_IV]

I always wish I could be a fly on the wall when the ones who are so, well basically 'anti-vr' then get a chance to try it. Seen it a few times, really fun to see them remove the headset and that look in their eyes and their dropped jaws..

 

That was me when I found out the price.

[1PL-Husar-1Esk]

Why keys...

Use voice attack software to speak to her.For example: " Pretty please hide the feet".

[Europa]

I personally would prefer a cocpit. I hope devs one day publish an API where we can build our DIY cockpits. A well suited complimentary realism for VR's

[ShoeHash]

I always wish I could be a fly on the wall when the ones who are so, well basically 'anti-vr' then get a chance to try it. Seen it a few times, really fun to see them remove the headset and that look in their eyes and their dropped jaws..and they know you know. They know then they were wrong and had no clue what they were talking about because they just could not really grasp what it was like until they tried it themselves. They just had a 2d existence and just did not grasp what 1:1 scale, 3D/360degree immersion and 1:1 tracking was truly like. I love those "Jesus, what the f was I thinking and why was I" moments. Thank god I have always waited to try something before dismissing it. Don't miss out on as much that way.

My brother in law comes over, we have a smoke, and as he's talking I load up Robo Recall, explain a few things, and let him have at it. He was saying such silly things.

 

"Oh my god, this is like, another world!" 

"Are 'those' my hands?"

"I have guns? I have guns!"

 

Then he almost killed me for not showing him "The Climb" earlier. Found out he was a former rock climber that way. They say it's not worth the price. Sure say that then own one for a few weeks. I even remember certain smells now and equate them to VR memories because I was eating pizza or cleaning up and my brain thinks the top of the mountain should smell like pepperoni or Mr. Clean. 

[Wolf8312]

I just use HOTAS and a multi function HOTAS like the warthog is a godsend for something like VR as most things can be maped to it. The rest I just use the keys on the outer most ring of my keyboard and things that are easy to find like page, and home, insert etc. I guess soon there will be braille like tactile VR keyboards! it really isn't something I ever worry about but the first thing I will do tonight is make my pause button easier to find. It's one of those things that's rather like cognitive dissonance in users who don't have VR. They convince themselves it's not workable due to blindness and resolution in order to convince themselves it's rubbish and they don't want it anyway. That's not directed at you OP as I can see you are genuinely asking but it's something that simmers who are anti VR tend to say alot！

[Torso]

My brother in law comes over, we have a smoke, and as he's talking I load up Robo Recall, explain a few things, and let him have at it. He was saying such silly things.

 

"Oh my god, this is like, another world!" 

"Are 'those' my hands?"

"I have guns? I have guns!"

 

Then he almost killed me for not showing him "The Climb" earlier. Found out he was a former rock climber that way. They say it's not worth the price. Sure say that then own one for a few weeks. I even remember certain smells now and equate them to VR memories because I was eating pizza or cleaning up and my brain thinks the top of the mountain should smell like pepperoni or Mr. Clean. 

 

 

Nice. Yeah I have enjoyed seeing others 1st reaction to properly setup VR. I hear you on the smells, I eat gummy bears as I fly and now I just think VR when I smell or taste them.

[Quax]

CH Throttle and Throttle Quadrant is enough for me to not need the keyboard anymore.