Will there be some type of balancing when Multiplayer arrives?

[-MG-Cacti4-6]

We need COOPs or something similar so we can have online wars like we did in IL-2, this will bring over a lot of players that want a dynamic fight that lasts weeks.

 

Dogfight servers are all good but COOP games will bring in a whole other audience and let us re-create historical setups. From what I understand though ROF doesn't support that sort of mission model but it would be awesome to have it as an option in the future

oh man that would be awesome! plus it would REALLY add depth to squadrons/clans.

[M4rgaux]

I see good things, strange things... in this post.

 

 

Let's take the problem differently for a minute, let's say everybody has the same plane, each team has the same number of people...

What will happen ? Team A will be constituted of experienced player, who are used to play together, can work in pair and do so while Team B is so-so... Team B got steamrolled.

Now people from Team B are unhappy, some will quit, other will changed side. There ain't any balance.

 

Now, if you want balance, it's not a matter of better plane, better skill, greater number, starting farther away. It's only a question of community, good player going with the lesser planes, changing team to re-balance the party, people being ready to get *ss-kicked and progress.

If you want a balanced game, play toward it, not against it, the more people get that, the merryer it'll be.

 

Game balance is like respect, it's earned.

[71st_AH_Hooves]

I see good things, strange things... in this post.

 

 

Let's take the problem differently for a minute, let's say everybody has the same plane, each team has the same number of people...

What will happen ? Team A will be constituted of experienced player, who are used to play together, can work in pair and do so while Team B is so-so... Team B got steamrolled.

Now people from Team B are unhappy, some will quit, other will changed side. There ain't any balance.

 

Now, if you want balance, it's not a matter of better plane, better skill, greater number, starting farther away. It's only a question of community, good player going with the lesser planes, changing team to re-balance the party, people being ready to get *ss-kicked and progress.

If you want a balanced game, play toward it, not against it, the more people get that, the merryer it'll be.

 

Game balance is like respect, it's earned.

While in the perfect world this scenario is what is aimed for.  It is for intents and purposes Rainbows and Unicorns.  That is why Game "Balance" features must be introduced to aid in the achievement of this "balanced" goal.  I see a real opportunity to give some neat real world relevant missions with BoS.  Limited German Fighters, giving the ruskies a numerical advantage, built into the mission.  This can balance out the sides.  BUT, the team with the better skilled pilots will still most likely win here.  It is what it is.  One side has to win and surely enough, one will.

[Rama]

We need COOPs or something similar so we can have online wars like we did in IL-2, this will bring over a lot of players that want a dynamic fight that lasts weeks.

 

Dogfight servers are all good but COOP games will bring in a whole other audience and let us re-create historical setups. From what I understand though ROF doesn't support that sort of mission model but it would be awesome to have it as an option in the future.

RoF do support Coop mode, but you will not see much coop mission on the servers, because it's actually easier to create "coop style" mission on dog mode (the dog mode allows IA controlled flights and ground troops and to use some triggers to restrict take off on a given airbase to a limited time period) than on coop mode.

On BoS The dev stated that there will be no Coop mode at start... but it doesn't matter because of the dog mode specific triggers That allows "coop's style" events.

[=LD=Hethwill]

Gladly the editor is powerful enough to allow a full development of historical or fictional mission packages with proper balance.

Me being more interested in a on going "historical" arenas with dynamic missions being triggered according to the situation rather than the catfight arenas.

[dkoor]

This is all about whether you wanna to have a good simulation of something or quasi arcade game.

I think it is crystal clear where people in charge steer this game to.

And most of us old hands love it. My guess is most newcomers with little experience will love it as well.

 

There wasn't balance in real life.

I expect none in this game.

People said we can't do anything with plane X against plane Y?

That's not true.

They can always die, that's an option too, exactly the same way real pilots died because of inferior aircraft, being outnumbered, inexperienced or just unlucky.

 

So you think you have some superb aircraft in that Bf-109F so victory in any mission is guaranteed?

OK give me IL-2 and two semi brained guys in LaGGs that will escort me (but in reality serve as lure-victims to the 109s so I can get thru).

 

And I'll find your airfield and vulch you till the kingdom come.

By the time flak or fighters get me my side will meet the objectives.

Who is inferior now?

[Mogster]

*cough* IAR *cough*

 

 

 

Maybe someone could knock up an IAR 80 for BOS sig

 

They seemed to work for ROF...... sometimes.

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

This is all about whether you wanna to have a good simulation of something or quasi arcade game.

I think it is crystal clear where people in charge steer this game to.

And most of us old hands love it. My guess is most newcomers with little experience will love it as well.

 

There wasn't balance in real life.

I expect none in this game.

People said we can't do anything with plane X against plane Y?

That's not true.

They can always die, that's an option too, exactly the same way real pilots died because of inferior aircraft, being outnumbered, inexperienced or just unlucky.

 

So you think you have some superb aircraft in that Bf-109F so victory in any mission is guaranteed?

OK give me IL-2 and two semi brained guys in LaGGs that will escort me (but in reality serve as lure-victims to the 109s so I can get thru).

 

And I'll find your airfield and vulch you till the kingdom come.

By the time flak or fighters get me my side will meet the objectives.

Who is inferior now?

I absolutely disagree. The sim is hard enough for new flyers to master before ever braving combat. The "screw the noobs," attitude is what will kill this genre long term. Thankfully BOS will be very scalable and I think that is more in line with what the Devs think or they wouldn't have put in the option. Predominantly hardcore is excellent (and where I will spend the majority of my time) as long as there is a pathway into the game for new blood. Also why I will be exploring the possibility of sponsoring a training server when the time comes, as hopefully a few other will as well.

Edited December 10, 2013 by HerrMurf

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

But back on topic. The balance, at least in the early going, is likely to be skewed to the German side with slightly superior equipment. A lot of ETO fans and noobs will gravitate to the German side. So, this is not necessarily going to be historically accurate either. Later, in the expansion packs (yes, please) many servers will still be skewed to the German side and that will be wholly unrealistic. So, artificial balancing may still be required to ensure historical accuracy. It's not really and either or proposition. Again, fortunately server options will be in place. The good ones will thrive the bad ones will wither and people will flock to where they have fun.

Edited December 10, 2013 by HerrMurf

[ImPeRaToR]

I am quite optimistic actually Murf that the next addon will bring quite balanced plane sets with the 190A-5, the Yak1b, Yak9, the La5F and hopefully the one or other lend-lease and non-german axis plane, extending the fighter-performance scale for the Russians to the right and at the same time adding a few weaker planes for the Germans.

Primarily speculation which planes we will get but it seems a safe bet to me.Can't really reinvent the wheel and at the same time it makes a lot of sense as the devs can "recycle" huge parts of their existing graphical content, yet add to the gameplay.

 

Only the Yak9 would have to be made from scratch, at the same time this would open the door to many more variants, older and newer: Yak9T, Yak9U and the Yak7 series.

Edited December 10, 2013 by ImPeRaToR

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

Agreed. I look forward to flying all of them, too.........................of course the 190 in all of it's iterations holds sway with me   I look forward to the pendulum swing in later installments. Not afraid of a good outnumbered fight either. Just think some balancing is in order for certain types of servers and there is room for every style. Arcade is the gimme rock. Full real is the addiction.

[II./JG27_Rich]

Whens multiplayer coming anyway?

[thx1138]

This is all about whether you wanna to have a good simulation of something or quasi arcade game.

I think it is crystal clear where people in charge steer this game to.

And most of us old hands love it. My guess is most newcomers with little experience will love it as well.

 

There wasn't balance in real life.

I expect none in this game.

People said we can't do anything with plane X against plane Y?

That's not true.

They can always die, that's an option too, exactly the same way real pilots died because of inferior aircraft, being outnumbered, inexperienced or just unlucky.

 

So you think you have some superb aircraft in that Bf-109F so victory in any mission is guaranteed?

OK give me IL-2 and two semi brained guys in LaGGs that will escort me (but in reality serve as lure-victims to the 109s so I can get thru).

 

And I'll find your airfield and vulch you till the kingdom come.

By the time flak or fighters get me my side will meet the objectives.

Who is inferior now?

 

 

+1

 

Your my hero, I'll fly a LaGG as your wingman any day, just sve me some targets to vulch too !

[IIN8II]

The only balancing I would be ok with would be #of and types of planes available. Wouldnt fly in a sever with altered flight models etc. I feel like it defeats the purpose.

[SvAF/F19_Klunk]

Honestly? I don't really care what kind of "balancing features" are given server ops.... the more the merrier. If a server admin, when he creates a "scenario", can limit certain planes... be my guest. If he wants to balance the way pilots are distributed.... great. If another servers admin choose not to use that feature: fine. We as "gamers" choose what servers we want to fly. As long as these are OPTIONAL.

 

However.. I am quite certain that I heard from the developers in one of the streams  that there will be NO "balancing" in regards to planes FMs and such. Thank god for that.. that is the only balancing act I don't want to see.

 

PS as a member of a squad playing IL2 1946, I can tell you that we are very aware of the impact we have on gameplay when entering a server...but we ...as a unit-- naturally want to play as a group. Why else would we join a squad? That is why we almost always choose the side with the least amount of pilots, no matter what side/planes we actually prefer. The server are there not only for us, but also for the rest of the pilots flying there, and it would be respectless to them if we joined, with a 8+ squad, the team with better planes and more pilots. WE should all contribute with balancing a server. That should be a rule for everyone. I know that there are squads which ONLY fly a certain side (blue or red in IL2 lingo) and don't care about this. I wish they could reconsider. If not then yes; the server admins HAVE to use different balancing features. 

Edited December 11, 2013 by F19_Klunk

[BeastyBaiter]

Indeed a lot of it does come down to the players. I fully expect LD will be flying a lot of Soviet stuff early on. We are not partial to any particular nation's planes so we'll fly whatever is less popular. Expect to see a 10+ man flight of LaGG-3's swarming you as soon as we get MP. You're planes maybe greatly superior, but you'll run out of bullets before you get us all.  

[Sokol1]

 

I am quite certain that I heard from the developers in one of the streams  that there will be NO "balancing" in regards to planes FMs and such.

True, if 'dogfighters' what a balanced match, set Fw190 x Fw190 servers like in these Russian championships.

 

Sokol1

[SvAF/F19_Klunk]

Indeed a lot of it does come down to the players. I fully expect LD will be flying a lot of Soviet stuff early on. We are not partial to any particular nation's planes so we'll fly whatever is less popular. Expect to see a 10+ man flight of LaGG-3's swarming you as soon as we get MP. You're planes maybe greatly superior, but you'll run out of bullets before you get us all.

 

 

As crap plane lovers wouldnt it be great with a huge big wing of laggs consisting of LD and SvAF pilots roaming the sky in search 109 messermeat?

[White1]

No artificial balancing pls. I like a playground where u have to adapt to the team, the dicipline and the objectives at hand. I think that an aproach like that will both give the possibility to learn something and to have fun at the same time. I like it that way anyway.

[Primus_71]

...the next addon will bring quite balanced plane sets with the 190A-5, the Yak1b, Yak9, the La5F and hopefully the one or other lend-lease and non-german axis plane...

 

This is just a guess I suppose?

[ImPeRaToR]

A few months ago - due to miscommunication, not an intended leak - information was revealed about the next intended addon, Kuban. I believe there has been no official confirmation about this since then, or any chances regarding it, but it makes a lot of sense as it will allow the inclusion of many popular lend-lease aircraft (P-40, P-39, Spit Mk.V) as well as evolutions of existing aircraft (as mentioned in my post), and many of the aircraft we will get for BOS will also still be in service.

Edited December 13, 2013 by ImPeRaToR

[BeastyBaiter]

I don't think that was a leak, they've been pretty open about what directions they are considering going next. The main two are Kuban and Moscow. Kuban has the advantage of being easier to expand into North Africa afterwards, Moscow gives us the super cool MiG-3 and I-153. Kuban seems more likely however, greater mass appeal and all.

[Volkoff]

A few months ago - due to miscommunication, not an intended leak - information was revealed about the next intended addon, Kuban. I believe there has been no official confirmation about this since then, or any chances regarding it, but it makes a lot of sense as it will allow the inclusion of many popular lend-lease aircraft (P-40, P-39, Spit Mk.V) as well as evolutions of existing aircraft (as mentioned in my post), and many of the aircraft we will get for BOS will also still be in service.

 

I really hope the next add-on is Kuban. The plane set match-up will be extremely exciting. I was kind of down on the idea of having to perform ground attack missions with a low flying Mig-3 in the Battle of Moscow, facing down BF-109 F2s, anyway. After the plane set performance imbalance in this add-on, I could really go for a more balanced match-up next add-on. After Kuban, I am happy to let the Axis hunt Mig-3s or to have the BF-109s deal with Yak-3s. Heck, after Kuban, even North Africa sounds like a great place to stage an add-on, too.  MJ

Edited December 13, 2013 by =69.GIAP=MIKHA

[silent_one]

Kuban sounds good. Not so interested in Moscow. But if the way machine guns appear to be modeled now . It might be fun. I hope they stay away from the Pacific and USA centric stuff for a long time. 

 

Regarding balancing . I know Id leave a server where I was getting vulched all the time. If Il2's had a strategic target and we can escort them . Great.Id like to see more of that.  But vulching is for low lives. Its a game and everyone should have a chance to have fun. Vulching is just picking on the weak and being unfair. ( and dont give me the lifes unfair, its war line. lol. ) Its excluding people from the opportunity of playing and having fun. That isnt community spirited.

[BeastyBaiter]

Vulching is fine so long as you have multiple bases to use and it serves a purpose. On the new wings server for instance, destroying an enemy airfield is almost always one of the victory conditions. You damn well better believe anyone spawning at that base is a target. On the opposite end is flying circus with its capture the flag maps. The flags are generally airfields or in their immediate vicinity. Once again, vulching is encouraged as that is realistically the only way to capture that flag. If on the other hand it's a little pure DF server with no objectives at all, then yeah, I and most others frown upon it.