setting up the AI for multiplane parallel takeoff

[[DBS]airdoc]

Hi all

 

I want to create a scenario in the Moscow map. Using one of the very wide airfields, I 'd like to put many AI Ju-88s next to each other and program them to takeoff simultaneously. The runway is wide enough so there is no problem with collisions. I 've tried to do it, but each aircraft seems to wait until the runway is cleared in order to takeoff.

 

Is there a way to do it? Would i need a trick like setting multiple runways there?  How would I assign the aircraft?

 

thanks

Edited February 11, 2017 by [DBS]airdoc

[coconut]

Try deleting the taxi graph, or whatever it's called, I forgot exact name.

[[DBS]airdoc]

thanks coconut.

 

Deleting the entire taxi graph made the AI turn 90 degrees to the left before takeoff, but nevertheless they did it simultaneously. In order to get all aircraft fly the designated path I had to delete the airfield icon altogether and set waypoints (instead of a takeoff command).

 

cheers

[Jade_Monkey]

thanks coconut.

 

Deleting the entire taxi graph made the AI turn 90 degrees to the left before takeoff, but nevertheless they did it simultaneously. In order to get all aircraft fly the designated path I had to delete the airfield icon altogether and set waypoints (instead of a takeoff command).

 

cheers

 

 

Just turn the takeoff MCU in the right direction, notice it has a yellow line in the direction of takeoff.

[[DBS]airdoc]

thanks JM

[Gambit21]

Also set the nationality of the airfield MCU to "neutral"

This will keep the aircraft from taking off directly at the takeoff VPP

[coconut]

Just turn the takeoff MCU in the right direction, notice it has a yellow line in the direction of takeoff.

 

It doesn't, at least not on my version of the editor. Landing however has it. My interpretation of the take off command is that planes take off in the direction they are facing. At least that's what fighters used to do a while ago, but if planes now turn before take off, I would count it as a bug. Anyway, if they turn before take consistently, it can be managed.

[Habu]

 

 

It doesn't, at least not on my version of the editor. Landing however has it.

I agree with that.

 

Airdoc, may you post your mission, only the part with the JU88.

[[DBS]airdoc]

thanks for all the replies everyone.

 

I 've uploaded the mission. Link is : https://1drv.ms/f/s!ApxahBdLv24TlRUbgMTcCrW25xjF

 

I 've managed to get the AI to do what I wanted. Didn't use the takeoff MCU at all. Just set waypoints and they start rolling until they get in the air. In order to do this, I had to completely delete the airfield. If I kept it there, they just turned to the left before rolling (about 90 degress). Didn't try to test it with the takeoff MCU because it is a lot of work. So I can't tell if there is a bug or not.

 

Please note : this is a heavy object mission. There are 16 Ju-88s taking off, many 109s flying above as camera planes, and dozens of ground units around. They are set to russian nationality. The mission order in the editor is chaotic right now, so if you try to mess with stuff, do so at your own risk. If you want to test the Ju-88s, they belong to the group "player flight". as I 'm doing this only to get a few seconds of video material for a new trailer that I 'm working on. There is also a significant tail wind, in order to achieve a long takeoff run, with the planes barely making it over the edge of the field. This pushes the AI to its limit, sometimes they spin on takeoff.

 

However, it is a great scene to see! The takeoff starts 1:20 after the mission beginning. I 'd also point out that this is based on "Albert's life" template by Haash.

 

again, thanks to everyone for your comments.

Edited February 13, 2017 by [DBS]airdoc

[Habu]

I didn't know that Ai can take off without using the takeoff MCU. I'm going to have a look.

 

Next time, please do a zip files with all finles inside. It's easier to download.

Edited February 12, 2017 by Habu

[[DBS]airdoc]

I didn't know that Ai can take off without using the takeoff MCU. I'm going to have a look.

 

Next time, please do a zip files with all finles inside. It's easier to download.

 

i think that Onedrive zips the file automatically when downloading.

 

edit: sorry Habu, I see what you mean. I uploaded a folder and pasted the link to the folder thinking that there would be an option for a single file.

Edited February 12, 2017 by [DBS]airdoc

[Habu]

No problemo.

I have a look on your mission, and i stoped quickly to try to understand, because it's easier and quicker for me to build something from scratch.

 

Here is a mission with the same airfield :

https://www.dropbox.com/s/azjsmj3b7xaxujm/JU88_Take_off_v6.zip?dl=0

 

It's more academic, easier to debug, and easier to add or delete group. I used 9 groups of 3 JU88 for a total of 27 planes which take off.

 

The other method would be to use only single plane as you try, but with Group.

 

Here are a few trick you have to learn to use and you'll gain many time to build and debug your mission.

 

Learn to use group and name your plane. Have a look on my mission, i name each plane, and use description. as you can see, i did 6 version (i know it took me time). But, thanks to my method, i can see easily which plane do not work properly, because i use icon for debug. So if, i see AI01G03 which crash into AI02 G04, i know exactly where to look. It took me less time to debug.

 

Another thing, when you work on a big part of a mission, work on the same map at the location, but witout all the other things. Once you validate your group, save it, and import it. Then it will be import at the same location where you test, and you are sur that it works in your mission.

 

If you don't know what i'm talking about, we can talk about it on TS.

 

Ps : Send hello to marta if you have him on teamspeak.

[[DBS]airdoc]

Many thanks Habu, I tested your mission and it works fine. I 'll use your template to improve the existing one.

 

I 've used groups for the Ju-88s, but probably you didn't see them as the mission is very, very cluttered with numerous objects. I 'm new to mission editor and still have a lot of trouble doing stuff.

 

I 'll follow your suggestions. They were really helpful. Thanks for the TS offer, if I 'm in trouble I may send you a PM and we could arrange a meeting.

 

I 'll send Marta your regards.

 

cheers

Edited February 12, 2017 by [DBS]airdoc

[Jade_Monkey]

It doesn't, at least not on my version of the editor. Landing however has it. My interpretation of the take off command is that planes take off in the direction they are facing. At least that's what fighters used to do a while ago, but if planes now turn before take off, I would count it as a bug. Anyway, if they turn before take consistently, it can be managed.

 

Sorry I was thinking of land too. my bad.

[Habu]

Many thanks Habu, I tested your mission and it works fine. I 'll use your template to improve the existing one.

 

I 've used groups for the Ju-88s, but probably you didn't see them as the mission is very, very cluttered with numerous objects. I 'm new to mission editor and still have a lot of trouble doing stuff.

 

I 'll follow your suggestions. They were really helpful. Thanks for the TS offer, if I 'm in trouble I may send you a PM and we could arrange a meeting.

 

I 'll send Marta your regards.

 

cheers

Don't worry, it would come, but before doing big things like that. Try by the basis. Many person think that the editor is very hard, and it's false. You have to learn a few basis, and when you have it, after it's a question of logic. But the basis are not natural and that's why most of the person think that's it's hard. I teach the basis to people, and once they have it, they understand that it's one of the most powerfull editor we have. And some came from the old IL2. There are many tricks to know which can earn you many time.

 

For me the basis is :

- Undestand the entity concept

- Understand Add target

- Understand Add object

- Understand Group (some can say that it's not the basis, but i'm working on the editor since rof, and i learn group lately,, and as soon i understand it, it was a great help and change my mind of the editor).

 

After it's some logical which can be resume by some question.

In our mission exemple I use Ju88 which have to take off.

On the map, i place 1 JU88, create entity, add a takeoff order.

 

So here are the question i have to answer :

1- Which JU88 must take off => So i have to do a link between my order the the object which received the order.

2- My Ju88has an order but when do i want is take off. So i Had a mission Begin and a timer. The mission begin start as soon the mission is start, and i link the !mission begin to the timer. I set the timer to the time i want the JU 88 re ceive the order to take off. But at that time there is no link between my timer and my take off order. So i do one and in word there is the explanation.

 

When the mission begin, a timer start and after 1 minutes, it give the roder to take off which is given to the JU88.

 

 

To work with group, follow that exemple.

 

Do a group of 3 plane which take off. Name it for exemple Ju88 G01.

Test it. If it don't work, look what is the problem and do some version of your mission. It's easier to go back. Do not forget that there no undo key.

If the test is ok, duplicate your working, and your work is to place it.

 

In my mission exemple :

1- I work only on the JU88 G01.

2- I test it => It works.

3- I duplicate JU88 G01 to obtain 9 group that i rename. G02/G03/G04,... same things for plane.

4- At the end, i have only to manage the location on the airfield to avoid crash. But all my work was only on one group.

5- If i want to import my working group in your mission. I select the nam of the mission (left and right clic set as working.

6- Select the group JU88 AI (which contain all my JU88 subgroup G01/G02/G03...). Right clic and Select Move camera to object.

7- You are on the icon of the group name JU88 AI (be carefull to not move it, because you move all the component of the group, as you can see on my mission the name is important because i'm sur to select the right one). Sometimes you nedd to zoom to see it. Select it, you should have a green squarre, then right clic on it and select Save selection to file. Make a temporary directory and name the file Test.

8- Close the editor

9- Open editor and select moscow map without any element.

10- Go to File and select Import from files.

11- select the group file Test you saved at point 7.

12- Look your mission, you can see that all your group are in the same location that in your test mission.

 

 

For exemple, i work on a group which work and i saved it, so in another mission, i can import it again, and only move it for the need of my new mission.

 

As you learn, do not try to build big mission, you can build interesting mission without using many objects.

[seladon11]

Hi Habu,

 

i'm also interested on your takeoff example but i don't own the moscow map. Could you please transfer your example to the Stalingrad or Lapino map?

 

many thanks in advance,

seladon

[Habu]

It's not that i don't want, but it's not possible in the same configuration. In the mission from airdoc, plane take off from a field, instead of a classical airfield. So the location of the plane on the runway are not the same as on a classical airfield.

 

On a classical airfield which have a small runway, planes are like this :

Group 01

Group 02

Group 03

 

More you have group, les you have runway to take off.

 

On the Moscow map, you have classical airfield ad field. On field, the runway is large, so plane can be like this :

 

Group 01 --- Group 02 --- Group 03

--------Group 04 ----- Group 05

 

 

But writing this, i'm thinking that there are the same kind of field on Veliki luki (you should have that map), except that it's in winter. I'm going to adapt that on that map and post you the link asap.

[Habu]

Here is the mission. Keep in mind that it's  a quick adaptation, so it's not perfect and some planes crash. You would have a good vision of the thing.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/5ztplz30west0jy/PX_JU88_VL.zip?dl=0

[seladon11]

Hi Habu,

 

thanks for your time and the fast answer but unfortunatly that's not what i'm looking for. I thought the planes would start from their boxes and taxi to the takeoff point first.

 

My problem is that even in a small group, player and one wingman, the wingman needs minutes to taxi in short steps from the edge of the runway to his takeoff point.

 

thanks,

seladon

 

 

[Habu]

Hi Habu,

 

thanks for your time and the fast answer but unfortunatly that's not what i'm looking for. I thought the planes would start from their boxes and taxi to the takeoff point first.

 

My problem is that even in a small group, player and one wingman, the wingman needs minutes to taxi in short steps from the edge of the runway to his takeoff point.

 

thanks,

seladon

Ok, that's not the same problem. The problem you have with the Ai taxing, is the same as if they were not link to a human. Sometimes, they take a normal time, and sometimes, they take minutes (i wrotte minutes, not a few secondes) to take their position on the runway. It's something i report as soon i can but it should'nt be easy to fix (at my opinion). When i tested the Ai for taxing, sometimes, it's ok, and the next time not. It's difficult to fix something that we can't reproduce at any time. And the result can change from plane to plane, and with the number of plane.

 

Do you have a mission with the problem i can have  a look. Maybe i will see something.