Tompa_73 Posted January 16, 2017 Posted January 16, 2017 So no Stuka missions in BoM and no stukas in Battle for Kuban(or am I wrong?!) So I who only fly Stukas if I can choose is stuck in Stalingrad forever or what?
SCG_Tzigy Posted January 16, 2017 Posted January 16, 2017 (edited) well loved on MP..., all maps, might need to take the plunge.. i will be happy to fly with u anytime.. Edited January 16, 2017 by 5./ZG1_Tzigy
Lusekofte Posted January 16, 2017 Posted January 16, 2017 Well, was not the D 5 in Kuban? The Ju 87 D-5 was based on the D-3 design and was unique in the Ju 87 series as it had wings 0.6 metres (2-feet) longer than previous variants. The two 7.92 mm MG 17 wing guns were exchanged for more powerful 20 mm MG 151/20s to better suit the aircraft's ground-attack role. It should be a little more effective both in climb and in dive. I love the Stuka myself, but the LW is mostly overpopulated in servers I am not registered as red, rendering me to fly Red most of the time. I think there is a lot of Stuka fans. However I suspect many of them will fly HS 129 in Kuban, but will eventually migrate back to it.
1CGS LukeFF Posted January 16, 2017 1CGS Posted January 16, 2017 no stukas in Battle for Kuban(or am I wrong?!) It'll be there in the new career mode.
Tompa_73 Posted January 16, 2017 Author Posted January 16, 2017 well loved on MP..., Yes Im aware but SP campaign is more relaxed where you can do your own thing in your pace. I dont mind MP but without ingame map tools it can feel pointless in a way. It'll be there in the new career mode. Oh? That was good news, I can sleep tonight. *thumbs up*
The_Ant Posted January 16, 2017 Posted January 16, 2017 Well 1C and its talanted creators could always create a Ju87-B2 collecters plane for Moscow.Think theirs alot of hobby pilots on this forum that would buy it. 1
Lusekofte Posted January 16, 2017 Posted January 16, 2017 I find the B2 most interesting, it is the one I relate to. or the long range model R witch served a lot here in Norway. I would buy it , even if I will not find opurtunity to fly it
ShamrockOneFive Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 So no Stuka missions in BoM and no stukas in Battle for Kuban(or am I wrong?!) So I who only fly Stukas if I can choose is stuck in Stalingrad forever or what? Seeing as the Ju87D-3 we have served for quite a while... We'll undoubtedly be seeing it in the Battle of Kuban campaign. Probably a lot. And it should be flyable for Battle of Stalingrad owners flying the Kuban campaign. Where the Ju87D-3 doesn't really fit is Battle of Moscow. For that we need the earlier B-2 model that the other guys are talking about.
Dakpilot Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 Well it just recieved a bit of love https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/26696-ju-87-d-3-4k-resolution-template/ Cheers Dakpilot
Dutchvdm Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 Seeing as the Ju87D-3 we have served for quite a while... We'll undoubtedly be seeing it in the Battle of Kuban campaign. Probably a lot. And it should be flyable for Battle of Stalingrad owners flying the Kuban campaign. Where the Ju87D-3 doesn't really fit is Battle of Moscow. For that we need the earlier B-2 model that the other guys are talking about. The B2 or R model would be nice for BOM. I agree. Even during the Battle of Stalingrad Stg77 used some of the older models. For Kuban the D3 model fits perfectly. D5 model where delivered to the units only later in 1943. Grt M
hames123 Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 Any chance for a Condor? The only game I know that gives them their due is atlantic fleet, are rather good turn based naval game. They played a role flying supplies into stalingrad so even if their not flyable...
Lusekofte Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 All tho I fly mostly Red , I would love to have the D5 because of this more powerful 20 mm MG 151/20s to better suit the aircraft's ground-attack role. It will make this plane more popular and agile, personally considering the 37 mm load out we had on Stalingrad, I think it would not be outrageous cheating the timeframe a little bit with the D 5, since it will not be a game changing ac in any way.
Cybermat47 Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 So no Stuka missions in BoM and no stukas in Battle for Kuban(or am I wrong?!) So I who only fly Stukas if I can choose is stuck in Stalingrad forever or what? You can fly the Ju-87 over the Moscow map in PWCG. I know, it doesn't really solve your problem, but I think PWCG is a good alternative. 1
Dutchvdm Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 All tho I fly mostly Red , I would love to have the D5 because of this It will make this plane more popular and agile, personally considering the 37 mm load out we had on Stalingrad, I think it would not be outrageous cheating the timeframe a little bit with the D 5, since it will not be a game changing ac in any way. The 20 mm guns would be nice, but if i would have to choose between the D5 and the B2/R2 i would go with the latter. I would make the Stuka line-up more complete. GRt
JG1_Pragr Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 Well, was not the D 5 in Kuban? The Ju 87 D-5 was based on the D-3 design and was unique in the Ju 87 series as it had wings 0.6 metres (2-feet) longer than previous variants. The two 7.92 mm MG 17 wing guns were exchanged for more powerful 20 mm MG 151/20s to better suit the aircraft's ground-attack role. It should be a little more effective both in climb and in dive. I love the Stuka myself, but the LW is mostly overpopulated in servers I am not registered as red, rendering me to fly Red most of the time. I think there is a lot of Stuka fans. However I suspect many of them will fly HS 129 in Kuban, but will eventually migrate back to it. I know there are at least some pictures of D-3 armed with MG 151/20 instead of MG17. It would be way more reasonable load than Bk 3,7 we have at this moment. Personally I do not think we need D-5 model (though I would love to see it as well as B/R models in BoM). Anyway the MG 151 armament modification would be great addition. At least as part of Kuban version. I have no idea if it is even possible.
6./ZG26_5tuka Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 (edited) The 20 mm guns would be nice, but if i would have to choose between the D5 and the B2/R2 i would go with the latter. I would make the Stuka line-up more complete. GRt Agree although I'm more for the B2. It is a bit slower but also has better handling characteristics than the lateir Dora series. Flying a Stuka speed wasn't as crutial for survivebility as manouvrebility was after all. About the D5, don't know why it should dive better than the D3. Climb rate will likely increase but at the cost of speed (about 10-20km/h slower than the D3). Also it improved on the handling which was compromised in the D3 by adding weight on what basically was still an early type wing (there were differences like less pronounced 'crank' angles). I know there are at least some pictures of D-3 armed with MG 151/20 instead of MG17.Maybe some test models or uncomon field conversions. The D5s came with the guns and larger wings installed from the factory. They were not upgraded from D3s. Edited January 17, 2017 by 6./ZG26_5tuka
Dutchvdm Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 (edited) Agree although I'm more for the B2. It is a bit slower but also has better handling characteristics than the lateir Dora series. Flying a Stuka speed wasn't as crutial for survivebility as manouvrebility was after all. About the D5, don't know why it should dive better than the D3. Climb rate will likely increase but at the cost of speed (about 10-20km/h slower than the D3). Also it improved on the handling which was compromised in the D3 by adding weight on what basically was still an early type wing (there were differences like less pronounced 'crank' angles). I meant the B2/R2 as well . I thought the only difference between the D3 and the D5 where the bigger wings and the 20 mm guns. The reason i would chose for the early B or R model is the fact that it is more of a different plane. It would also make the Luftwaffe complete for the Moscow scenario. Right now there is a bit of an awkward gap... If that makes sense. I only thing that i can't figure out is the usage of the B model compared to the R models. According to Wiki the R models where produced quiet a lot. Did they replace the existing B1's? Last question. When did the B and R models received the more armored gunner position? Vs Ok.. Found it: http://mujweb.cz/navzdy/Stuka/Ju87armor.htm Now i want it.. Jason?.. Please... Grt M Edited January 17, 2017 by I./ZG1_Martijnvdm
Lusekofte Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 Well I do not mind the B2/ R. Why do you guys have to put one plane up against another? I basically ask for a 20 mm armament a little longer wings and maybe a roof mounted sight at most. I am a big fan of B2. I do not want to compromise that. When Kuban come , there is no reason to believe we will have a B2 in the pack. This will come as a extra together with PO 2 (I hope) later on. I guess BOK consume the capacity at the moment. And I do not think my request here is going to be taken serious. I hope for a total complete JU 87 series myself. But then again I hope for a complete set of bombers and transport on red side also About the D5, don't know why it should dive better than the D3. Climb rate will likely increase but at the cost of speed (about 10-20km/h slower than the D3). IT dive capabilities improved because of added strength to the control surfaces . They could take a lot more speed The window in the floor of the cockpit was reinforced and four, rather than the previous three, aileron hinges were installed. Higher diving speeds were obtained of 650 km/h (400 mph) up to 2,000 m (6,600 ft). The range was recorded as 715 km (444 mi) at ground level and 835 km (519 mi) at 5,000 m (16,000 ft).[58]
6./ZG26_5tuka Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 (edited) The B model was the early European one while the R (standing for 'Reichweite' or range) were mainly produced for the african theatre where the B2s effective range became limiting. The main difference in the model apart from a dustfilter was the removal of the wing racks to replace them with internal fuel tanks. After the retreat of the Afrika corps many of the R2s were shipped to the Eastern front to supplement the B2s. Edited January 17, 2017 by 6./ZG26_5tuka
Lusekofte Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 The R model was used in Norway too, and later on used from Kirkenes in the northern front. This is why I relate to this model more than the D3 . And I think the B2 or R model looks more like the iconic aircraft it is (if that make any sense) It looks like the stuka as I saw it as a child
Dutchvdm Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 Well I do not mind the B2/ R. Why do you guys have to put one plane up against another? Because we don't want to be greedy . Of course both would be great, but i don't think they will add more modifications to the current D3. At least not until now. Grt M
150GCT_Veltro Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 (edited) Ju-87B should have to be a must, but we are talking about nothing. We have a limited budget and a small Team, and this is a big problem even if we should have to thank 1C because "we still have a budget and a Team for an IL2 flight sim". This is reasonable but sad...... We know we could have in the next future (2018?) a G6 and a La-5F/FN..... What we should need is a dedicated Team for DLC, but we are talking about a business company so these DLC must be profitable, taxes included. So the question is: are these DLC profitable? What we need for a sim that does pretend to call itself "IL2" and that's dedicated principally to the ETO, is very simple: IAR-80 I-15 Macchi 200 Ju-87B Yak-1 Serie I ecc. ecc. ecc. Considering also that this sim does pretend to be an improvement of the old "IL2" concept....we should need: C-47 (Li2) Fi 156 "Storch" Po-2 FW-189 Arado 196 ecc. ecc...... Everybody of course could have a different list but we all agree, i think, there are a lot of "MUST HAVE" aircrafts missed: for ex. I-15, IAR-80, Macchi 200, Ju-87B. A dedicated DLC Team should have to provide at least 4 aircrafts every years, of course with the same standard quality of the addon release. Too many people on WoT and WT, this is the problem. Now, we have to hope for a G6 and La-5 as a sort of miracle, and IAR-80 like an utopia. Is not good at all in this way.......... Considering again WoT and WT, we should have to considere if this IL2 is not enough dedicated to multiplayer, or better....why we don't have the same number we see in WoT. For sure, the answer can not be the "unlock suicide policy"... Edit. Ju-52 is a real beauty, really immersive and with a great flight feeling, we need to think about this....... Edited January 17, 2017 by 150GCT_Veltro
Dutchvdm Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 Ju-87B should have to be a must, but we are talking about nothing. We have a limited budget and a small Team, and this is a big problem even if we should have to thank 1C because "we still have a budget and a Team for an IL2 flight sim". This is reasonable but sad...... We know we could have in the next future (2018?) a G6 and a La-5F/FN..... What we should need is a dedicated Team for DLC, but we are talking about a business company so these DLC must be profitable, taxes included. So the question is: are these DLC profitable? What we need for a sim that does pretend to call itself "IL2" and that's dedicated principally to the ETO, is very simple: IAR-80 I-15 Macchi 200 Ju-87B Yak-1 Serie I ecc. ecc. ecc. Considering also that this sim does pretend to be an improvement of the old "IL2" concept....we should need: C-47 (Li2) Fi 156 "Storch" Po-2 FW-189 Arado 196 ecc. ecc...... Everybody of course could have a different list but we all agree, i think, there are a lot of "MUST HAVE" aircrafts missed: for ex. I-15, IAR-80, Macchi 200, Ju-87B. A dedicated DLC Team should have to provide at least 4 aircrafts every years, of course with the same standard quality of the addon release. Too many people on WoT and WT, this is the problem. Now, we have to hope for a G6 and La-5 as a sort of miracle, and IAR-80 like an utopia. Is not good at all in this way.......... Considering again WoT and WT, we should have to considere if this IL2 is not enough dedicated to multiplayer, or better....why we don't have the same number we see in WoT. For sure, the answer can not be the "unlock suicide policy"... Edit. Ju-52 is a real beauty, really immersive and with a great flight feeling, we need to think about this....... Great set of aircraft. Add the SB-2 and you have BOO (Battle of Odessa).
hames123 Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 (edited) I like Stukas, they have a nice ungainly movement, yet it is the first plane that I have mastered(working on the sturmovik now). Also, I like the challenge of taking out the T-34, which I single out in the ground support missions because our AT guns will almost always deal with the lighter tanks(although occasionally, the get overrun by large groups of light tanks). Edited January 17, 2017 by hames123
hames123 Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 (edited) But 1 day we need Battle of Leningrad, with 4-year long career opportunity, as well as some Finish and even British squadrons and aircraft(but in the career mode, the British Hurricane squadron serving up there must have the default set to an RAF skin, not the Soviet one). Furthermore, as the ground war stagnated, the air war developed into the most lively, with daily air raids on artilery positions and airfields, constant skirmishes between patrols on the ground and in the air, and a few massive operations with huge amounts of air support(the stuka played a large role up North, supporting the ground troops diligently throughout the siege). Edited January 17, 2017 by hames123
Dutchvdm Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 (edited) I don't think we will see a Leningrad expansion anytime soon. After Kuban we go to the far east for some Pacific love. Grt M Edited January 17, 2017 by I./ZG1_Martijnvdm
Aap Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 I would like to see the selectable "feature" (or what is the official term for previous "unlocks") of automatic pull-out and horn at the drop altitude. Did the Stuvi sight come with D5? I don't think we will see a Leningrad expansion anytime soon. After Kuban we go to the far east for some Pacific love. Grt M I am really looking forward to the Virtualpilots comunity made map for Karelia as BoM, BoS, BoK and pretty much any other future Eastern Front planeset contributes directly to Leningrad front also.
SvAF/F19_Tomten Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 Great set of aircraft. Add the SB-2 and you have BOO (Battle of Odessa). ...And please also add the Hs-123 and the one plane I miss the most from the original; The TB-3!! :D
Pilot_Rabbit Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 (edited) Welp, I guess unlocking or locking certain mods (including FM) on Ju87 depending on certain scenario will be feasible to implement. (Edit: Off-topic: I, personally, doubt that the Hs129 will fulfill its job compare to its soviet counterpart whereas another high alt bomber He111 is just so unfavoured to myself due to its low speed and efficiency which I'd rather like to see a fast dive bomber, maybe do217? Sorry not a history savvy. ) Edited January 17, 2017 by =CHN=Pilot_Rabbit
=38=Tatarenko Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 loads of stukas in the kuban according to the Attack of the Airacobras book.
Guest deleted@30725 Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 I never loved it in the first place
ShamrockOneFive Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 Welp, I guess unlocking or locking certain mods (including FM) on Ju87 depending on certain scenario will be feasible to implement. (Edit: Off-topic: I, personally, doubt that the Hs129 will fulfill its job compare to its soviet counterpart whereas another high alt bomber He111 is just so unfavoured to myself due to its low speed and efficiency which I'd rather like to see a fast dive bomber, maybe do217? Sorry not a history savvy. ) The Hs129 was always a bit of a odd duck and while I doubt it will be as effective as the IL-2... it will be effective and I'm thrilled to see it. It can be a seriously good tank hunter under the right conditions. The Do217 would be great but is not well suited to the Kuban battle. It's also a matter of resources... the H-16 is not a direct copy of the H-6 but I'm sure it is easier than a full rebuild. Plus we're getting some good attackers on the Luftwaffe side that aren't of the medium bomber type. The FW190A-5, the Bf110G-2, and the Hs129B-2 all have good attack credentials. And we haven't lost the Ju-87B-3 that we already have or the Ju88A-4 which is very suitable.
Gambit21 Posted January 17, 2017 Posted January 17, 2017 The Stuka is a neat bird - always been one of my favorites. Both the Stuka and especially the IL2 are not talked about as much as they should be IMHO. Bang for the buck, the IL2 is one of the highlights of this sim - both online and off. I haven't done it it so long, but I love sneaking across the lines and giving the enemy base a good 'what for' then sneaking back.
Scojo Posted January 18, 2017 Posted January 18, 2017 Is OP saying existing Stuka won't be able to be used on the new Kuban maps?
Dakpilot Posted January 18, 2017 Posted January 18, 2017 Is OP saying existing Stuka won't be able to be used on the new Kuban maps? I cannot see why that would be the case, you are able to use BoM aircraft in BoS campaign Ex. Bf-110 and Ju-88 The only exclusions are if an aircraft is too late for timeframe Ex. Yak 1b 127 will not be allowed in BoS campaign due to appearing too late, although there were Yak-1b present at the end of the battle they were of an earlier series Online is purely up to server admins Cheers Dakpilot
Scojo Posted January 18, 2017 Posted January 18, 2017 I cannot see why that would be the case, you are able to use BoM aircraft in BoS campaign Ex. Bf-110 and Ju-88 The only exclusions are if an aircraft is too late for timeframe Ex. Yak 1b 127 will not be allowed in BoS campaign due to appearing too late, although there were Yak-1b present at the end of the battle they were of an earlier series Online is purely up to server admins Cheers Dakpilot That's what I thought too, so I just wanted to make sure. Kuban comes after Stalingrad, so there'll be Stukas 1
Tompa_73 Posted January 18, 2017 Author Posted January 18, 2017 That's what I thought too, so I just wanted to make sure. Kuban comes after Stalingrad, so there'll be Stukas Reason for my worries was that I checked the battle for Kuban store page and it was not listed there. Ju 87 is listed as part of the stalingrad pack and since I have only briefly checked out first chapter battle of Moscow I noticed that I cant choose Stukas at all, so I figured it will be missing.
II/JG17_HerrMurf Posted January 18, 2017 Posted January 18, 2017 There are two reasons it is lacking love in MP. Firstly is the lack of air cover. This is a two fold problem. I rarely see anyone asking for escort and the Stuka rightly does not do well without a strong fighter sweep in the operational area. We fighter jocks don't seem to help their cause much, if at all, either. My squad is happy to escort our own or anyone elses bombers/ground attack but most are happier in the furball over one airfield or another. The second is the DEV's let the tankies die on the vine. The tanks implementation was OK, and just OK. Two more models plus a tank destroyer each would have brought much more to the table. The balance was at least as skewed as the Yak v F4 problem was in EA. A couple more models and decent parity would have taken the ground game miles more than they got out of it for not a lot of developement. I know as a Jabo hitting tanks with players is infinitely more interesting and entertaining than hitting fuel dumps, crates and AI tanks. I can't imagine it is any different for Stuka guys. Lastly, they implemented 37mm AT mounts for the Stuka and then, well, start this paragraph over again from the top............
SCG_Tzigy Posted January 18, 2017 Posted January 18, 2017 It just really depends..this last Sunday i had a not so great mission tank busting on my own, with a Yak induced short flight after killing 1st t-34... 2nd mission i paired with CorZero, and got cover from JG54 guys. It was awesome. Killed 4 tanks in 3 minutes and egressed easily.. The cannon bird is awesome, still trying to work on consistent hits, t-34 are hard to kill..
Scojo Posted January 18, 2017 Posted January 18, 2017 It just really depends..this last Sunday i had a not so great mission tank busting on my own, with a Yak induced short flight after killing 1st t-34... 2nd mission i paired with CorZero, and got cover from JG54 guys. It was awesome. Killed 4 tanks in 3 minutes and egressed easily.. The cannon bird is awesome, still trying to work on consistent hits, t-34 are hard to kill.. Yeah those wing cannons are nice. Just one or two volleys in the right place can send a tank up. On VVS side, their wing cannons carry more ammo but also take more ammo to kill a tank. I don't like having to hang around an objective as long as I have to with their wing cannons to kill the same amount of tanks. I haven't tried to dive bomb tanks with the Stuka yet. I need to get around to that.
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