Does the keys command for YAW TRIM work in Russian a/c?

[TempestV]

In Russian Aircraft-I use the UP and DOWN CURSOR keys for trimming UP and Down. I see indication by HUD display (by degree) and graphically by trim tabs on left and right elevator that they move. I note it also in the PITCH of the aircraft as it fly's.

However no matter what key combination I use- even the simple LEFT and RIGHT CURSOR keys do not see any HUD display or external graphical display yaw trim is activated. I certainly don't see it in direction of travel.

Does YAW trim key commands work?

Edited December 24, 2016 by TempestV

[LittleJP]

What plane are you in? I know only some of the planes actually have yaw trim. Try the LaGG-3 or the MiG-3

[Finkeren]

Depends on which Soviet aircraft you're talking about.

 

From what I can remember off the top of my head it goes like this:

 

The Yaks have no adjustable trim on ailerons and rudder, only on elevators.

 

The IL-2s, Pe-2s and Mig-3 have adjustable trim on rudder and elevator but not ailerons.

 

The LaGG-3, La-5 and P-40 have adjustable trim on all three axis.

 

The I-16 has no adjustable trim at all.

 

All of this is according to how the real aircraft worked historically.

[TempestV]

Okay-thanks for the list of aircraft. I only have BoS and LaGG 5 Collector a/c. And lo and behold-when I booted up again-in the Lagg the commands were acknowledged. So much for ingaming mapping. :^/

 

But the Il-2 M42 in BoS display no movement of rudder trim with the key commands-but when I turn the rudder I see a rudder trim tab being activated by an exterior connecting rod. This isn't activated by key strictly turning the rudder.

The Yak-1 appears to have a trim tab but nothing happens when I move the rudder. I don't doubt what you are telling me historically it had no trim setting-but there is a tab-see yellow circle.

 

 

No BoM Mig-3 yet-holding off till I see how that Mig-3 tail wheel discussion shakes out. I know I read a lengthy forum string on it somewhere. heh

[DD_Arthur]

The rudder trim tab on the Yak was set manually on the ground.  It was set to trim the aircraft over a pre-determined speed range.

 

 It was not pilot-adjustable in the air.  The '109 rudder trim works the same way. 

 

Edit; you're holding off buying BoM because of a perceived issue with the Mig-3 tail wheel ?

Edited December 24, 2016 by DD_Arthur

[Finkeren]

Yes, the Yak has trim tabs on both rudder and ailerons (almost all aircraft at that time had trim tabs on all control surfaces, if you take a look, the I-16 has them as well)

However, these were not controllable by the pilot in flight, they could only be adjusted by the ground crew, and they would normally set them, so that the plane would fly straight and level at cruising speed. Only the trim tab on the elevator was adjustable by the pilot.

 

Same goes for a lot of different aircraft, including the German Bf 109s and Fw 190, they have trim tabs on all control surfaces, but the only trim that's controllable by the pilot is pitch trim through the adjustable stabilizer.

 

The Lavochkin fighters are actually fairly special in that they have pilot adjustable trim on all control surfaces.

[6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann]

As far as I know the Yak was also supposed to have adjustable tabs, but they dropped it for simplicity and because it wasn't necessary. 

Same for the Yak-7.

On the Yak-9 and Yak-3 they changed to simple Fixed Twist Metal Type ones. 

 

The Il-2 Tabs are there to lighten Aileron and Rudder Force. 

[TempestV]

Adjusted on the ground. Learn something everyday. Thanks.

[69th_chuter]

A nice feature would be to allow pilot adjustment of fixed tabs before flight (to deviate from standard setting) so the pilot can have the plane adjusted to personal taste (say, neutral at a higher power setting).  Tab adjustment was based strictly on pilot feedback anyway so the only person who would ever find out it wasn't set up "by the book" would be the (lucky) next pilot - lol.  The boost tabs (as on the IL2) act as ground adjustable trim tabs as well and are set by varying the tab's neutral point.

[Finkeren]

A nice feature would be to allow pilot adjustment of fixed tabs before flight (to deviate from standard setting) so the pilot can have the plane adjusted to personal taste (say, neutral at a higher power setting). Tab adjustment was based strictly on pilot feedback anyway so the only person who would ever find out it wasn't set up "by the book" would be the (lucky) next pilot - lol. The boost tabs (as on the IL2) act as ground adjustable trim tabs as well and are set by varying the tab's neutral point.

It's on my "nice to have" list, though not my "need to have".

[Dakpilot]

Not a great idea in my opinion, although options are always good.

 

People will use this to gain a (small) advantage in game with easier handling at 'combat' speeds

 

however the RL disadvantages which  pilot would have to deal with are not as relevant in game

 

It would lead to non historic settings, at the moment the settings are correct for what 99.9% of what was used in reality

 

No pilots are going to set up a trim situation that is bad for most regimes of flight. Except for a very very few privileged 'aces' , most combat aircraft are set up for any pilot to jump in and be familiar with handling, just for example, unusual rudder inputs on takeoff, 

In an aircraft with adjustable trim there is a standard setting for takeoff, with changed 'non standard' fixed tab you would be altering this datum point.

 

If you now have to apply rudder to overcome the fixed tab, at cruise setting, you will increase drag and increase fuel consumption, IRL when you arrive at combat situation you have reduced your efficiency 

 

Sometimes limited options that can prevent 'gamey' setups ' are a good thing   and keep playing field even

 

The extra work/programing would be better spent elsewhere

 

There you go, that is my "grinch" contribution for Christmas, Bah! Humbug 

 

Happy festive season to all

 

Cheers Dakpilot

Edited December 25, 2016 by Dakpilot

[TempestV]

The rudder trim tab on the Yak was set manually on the ground.  It was set to trim the aircraft over a pre-determined speed range.

 

 It was not pilot-adjustable in the air.  The '109 rudder trim works the same way. 

 

Edit; you're holding off buying BoM because of a perceived issue with the Mig-3 tail wheel ?

I just bought it. I believe I can handle the Mig-3 now after mastering the YAK-1 and Getting the LAGG 3 off and on the ground in one piece.

 

I had picked up the LAGG 5.

 

I hate that aircraft.

 

I hate the LAGG 5 with the intensity of a Million Suns.

[6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann]

I just bought it. I believe I can handle the Mig-3 now after mastering the YAK-1 and Getting the LAGG 3 off and on the ground in one piece.

 

I had picked up the LAGG 5.

 

I hate that aircraft.

 

I hate the LAGG 5 with the intensity of a Million Suns.

Then you're doing something Wrong. The La-5 (Neither Gudkov nor Gorbunov were involved) has amazing Speed, Rate of Roll and Climb below 2000m, and the Slats really help in tight turns. Just remember to to properly control the engine. 

 

I don't think you are aware of the "Boosted Mode" Button yet, that triggers the Forsazh on the La-5 and I-16 as well as RPM increase for the Mc.202. 

You also have to close the Outlet Shutters for best Performance, you will rarely need more than 15% opening in most Situations. 

Edited December 26, 2016 by 6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann

[TempestV]

HAHAHAHAH Your talking about tactics and in air procedures - Not EVEN there yet.

Just getting this virtual beast off the ground is a chore.

I pull back on the stick to lock the tail wheel and gently apply the power get past the il2 generic midway control tower and flip in.

[6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann]

HAHAHAHAH Your talking about tactics and in air procedures - Not EVEN there yet.

Just getting this virtual beast off the ground is a chore.

I pull back on the stick to lock the tail wheel and gently apply the power get past the il2 generic midway control tower and flip in.

The Tailwheel doesn't lock. 

[Finkeren]

HAHAHAHAH Your talking about tactics and in air procedures - Not EVEN there yet.

Just getting this virtual beast off the ground is a chore.

I pull back on the stick to lock the tail wheel and gently apply the power get past the il2 generic midway control tower and flip in.

Sounds more like the MiG-3 to me (though with a different tailwheel lock mechanism)

 

The La-5 can't lock its tailwheel

[TempestV]

Well in the LAGG 3 and 5  pulling back on the stick seems to keep me tracking straight down the runway (while also compensating from the torque with the proper rudder position). I know it doesn't have a dedicated tail lock.

The 3 I can take off with no problem now. 5 has so much torque.

[69th_chuter]

Even with a locked tailwheel it's always best to keep pedaling (real world talkin' there - lol).

[=WH=PangolinWranglin]

 

 

pulling back on the stick seems to keep me tracking straight down the runway

^^^ true for pretty much every plane when you unlock the tail wheels.  

[Sokol1]

Just getting this virtual beast off the ground is a chore.

I pull back on the stick to lock the tail wheel and gently apply the power get past the il2 generic midway control tower and flip in.

 

If you are in the stage where's still difficult take-off, I can imagine the landings. 

[IRRE_Centx]

Well in the LAGG 3 and 5  pulling back on the stick seems to keep me tracking straight down the runway (while also compensating from the torque with the proper rudder position). I know it doesn't have a dedicated tail lock.

The 3 I can take off with no problem now. 5 has so much torque.

 

Can you stop calling La-5 "Lagg-5" ?

La and Lagg are completely different aircrafts... Even if they're based on the same frame, Soviets changed the name for a reason xD

 

 

 

 

And just use full rudder, La-5 is easy to takeoff...

Edited December 27, 2016 by -IRRE-Centx

[andyw248]

 

 

I pull back on the stick to lock the tail wheel and gently apply the power get past the il2 generic midway control tower and flip in.

 

Procedure for easy takeoff in the La-5:

• Flaps down about 10 - 20 degrees (the flap indicator is in the lower left corner of the panel)
• Stick to neutral (so that the tail can lift at about 100 kph, thus reducing drag)
• Gently apply power (as you already do)
• If tail doesn't come up high enough, push stick forward slightly
• Let the plane lift itself off at about 180 - 200 kph

[TempestV]

Thanks andyw248.

I'll try that this weekend.