6./ZG26_Gielow Posted October 28, 2016 Posted October 28, 2016 Here we go again... I love you too, Luke!!
Cybermat47 Posted October 28, 2016 Posted October 28, 2016 Saying that the H-16 is the exact same plane as the H-6 just doesn't make sense. As Luke, Yogi, and I have already said, it improves a lot on the H-6, and we aren't talking about mods. Besides, what would you prefer to have? 1
Finkeren Posted October 28, 2016 Posted October 28, 2016 Besides, what would you prefer to have? The He 111 H-16 is fine, but the Do 217 would've been much more interesting. 1
Yogiflight Posted October 28, 2016 Posted October 28, 2016 Do217, absolutely, but it might not have been there, I suppose.
Finkeren Posted October 28, 2016 Posted October 28, 2016 Do217, absolutely, but it might not have been there, I suppose. It was, though mostly with a night reconaissance unit. The VVS did down some of them by day as well though, so maybe they served there as day bombers too?
Cybermat47 Posted October 29, 2016 Posted October 29, 2016 It was, though mostly with a night reconaissance unit. The VVS did down some of them by day as well though, so maybe they served there as day bombers too? I would say that they were probably doing day reconnaissance when they were shot down. The Do-217 would be a great collector's aircraft, but I think that the H-16 is the best choice for the standard BoK Luftwaffe bomber.
216th_Peterla Posted October 29, 2016 Posted October 29, 2016 I just hope they could squeeze time to make the ball turret as a mod. I will be defecting for a will the VVS :-) 1
6./ZG26_Gielow Posted October 29, 2016 Posted October 29, 2016 (edited) Saying that the H-16 is the exact same plane as the H-6 just doesn't make sense. As Luke, Yogi, and I have already said, it improves a lot on the H-6, and we aren't talking about mods. Besides, what would you prefer to have? The new three stooges? ! Improves a lot ?!?! Exactly same engine, no performance update. Two bomb bays ?!?! H6 also got two bomb bays. Just I don't know why Devs decided to block one with a fuel tank. Unfortunately our maps are not big enough to make extra fuel a strategic option for bombers. Make a bomb bay mod and H6 becomes H16. Bomb quantity?!?! Makes no difference unless you are bombing an entire city. Right now bomb accuracy on small targets it is what we need in the servers and the H6 is pretty accurate. Heavier Guns?!?! MG131 field of fire will be so restricted that will be nicknamed Noob Killer. Because only novice pilots parked on bombers six will get hit by it. Belt fed?!?! This can be considered an improvement since you know what are you doing, because you can run out of ammo really fast. I hope AI can handle it well as in the Ju88. Turret?!?! Han said there will be no turret. I really hope they think over about this decision. Because the H16 is actually a turret with a 111 attached to it Torpedos!?!? No torpedos. Thus, a new improved plane should means a 111 with that 13mm gun turret, MG81Z on every gun mount, torpedos along kommando gerat and the back up panel in the cockpit. Edited October 29, 2016 by 6./ZG26_Gielow
216th_Lucas_From_Hell Posted October 29, 2016 Posted October 29, 2016 I can only imagine what would happen if a unit commander wrote a strongly-worded letter to Berlin saying they refuse to upgrade to the new aircraft type because they don't think it's cool enough or has enough bells and whistles so it doesn't count as an upgrade. 2
Gunsmith86 Posted October 29, 2016 Posted October 29, 2016 They would send him to a torpedo unit that is still flying HE 115. Good luck on your next arctic convoy attack. If he survive that he will love to fly anything else even the HE 111 H-16. 1
216th_Lucas_From_Hell Posted October 29, 2016 Posted October 29, 2016 Upon the lack of He-115, I suppose the next best alternative is flying the Ju-52 in and out of the Stalingrad pocket. Not quite a winter wonderland.
6./ZG26_McKvack Posted October 29, 2016 Posted October 29, 2016 I think the He-111 H6 had the extra fuel tank straight from factory as there was no modification to have the other bomb bay available. Also if I am correct the H6 was supposed to be the torpedo version of the He-111 thus the fuel tank since the bomb bay was not needed
6./ZG26_Gielow Posted October 30, 2016 Posted October 30, 2016 (edited) I can only imagine what would happen if a unit commander wrote a strongly-worded letter to Berlin saying they refuse to upgrade to the new aircraft type because they don't think it's cool enough or has enough bells and whistles so it doesn't count as an upgrade. You don´t need to imagine, you just need to read books: https://www.amazon.com/First-Last-Adolf-Galland/dp/8087888928/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1477791082&sr=1-1&keywords=adolf+galland "During the battle of Britain, the fighter pilots were criticised by Göring for the growing bomber losses. In a front line General Officer briefing on Luftwaffe tactics, Göring asked what his fighter pilots needed to win the battle. Werner Mölders replied that he would like the Bf 109 to be fitted with more powerful engines. Galland replied: "I should like an outfit of Spitfires for my squadron." which left Göring speechless with rage." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolf_Galland Now my personal consideration about Lucas[Edited]. I like to debate, no problem at all. But you need to study and reach at least Wikipedia level before coming here and test me. Because this is not a debate at all. It is school time for you. They would send him to a torpedo unit that is still flying HE 115. Good luck on your next arctic convoy attack. If he survive that he will love to fly anything else even the HE 111 H-16. Considering the naked H16 they are delivering, the He115 would be really original and epic. Great suggestion !!! I really loved the 3D model Upon the lack of He-115, I suppose the next best alternative is flying the Ju-52 in and out of the Stalingrad pocket. Not quite a winter wonderland. Once again I would trade the naked H16 for this baby in the blink of an eye. I think the He-111 H6 had the extra fuel tank straight from factory as there was no modification to have the other bomb bay available. Also if I am correct the H6 was supposed to be the torpedo version of the He-111 thus the fuel tank since the bomb bay was not needed There is no "I think" in aviation. Or you know it or you don´t know it. "I think " will get you killed. Now class is over and our DJ got a music for you boys: Edited November 4, 2016 by Bearcat Personal
1CGS LukeFF Posted October 30, 2016 1CGS Posted October 30, 2016 (edited) H6 also got two bomb bays. Just I don't know why Devs decided to block one with a fuel tank Because that's the way the real plane was built. Look at any original Luftwaffe documentation that's been posted here (repeatedly), and you'll see that it's true. 4 x ESAC 250. It's right there as plain as day. That excerpt you posted up above is in error. Edited October 30, 2016 by LukeFF
Cybermat47 Posted October 30, 2016 Posted October 30, 2016 It's hilarious how Gielow was insulting people earlier because they didn't like the He-111, and now he's insulting people because he's decided that the He-111 H-16 is crap. Now my personal consideration about Lucas from Epic Fail. I like to debate, no problem at all. But you need to study and reach at least Wikipedia level before coming here and test me. Because this is not a debate at all. The new three stooges? ! Then again, this is an important issue. What weapons we get in a video game is serious stuff, guys
Gunsmith86 Posted October 30, 2016 Posted October 30, 2016 The Ju52 in your picture is fake no Ju 52 carryed torpedos. Before the war started there was one Early Ju 52 which had only one engine at that time that was used to test torpedos. That was the only Ju 52 that was able to use them
216th_Lucas_From_Hell Posted October 30, 2016 Posted October 30, 2016 Funny that you mention an episode where pilots simply listed their recommendations upon being questioned on what could improve things rather than whine about new aircraft but hey, if you like going down the personal insult route don't let me stop you I for one am very happy with the new Il-2 which, you know, is just our old Il-2 with a gunner station and one or two extra loadouts, the Yak-1b which is our old Yak-1 with a new cockpit and a few minor changes and the Yak-7B, which is similar to our old Yak-1 but heavier and packing an extra gun. Funny how everyone is pleased about those since they are so terrible by the standards laid out here.
6./ZG26_Gielow Posted November 7, 2016 Posted November 7, 2016 (edited) Nice to see the tought control police working together against non approved ideas. It makes 1984 novel even more scary and real. Because that's the way the real plane was built. Look at any original Luftwaffe documentation that's been posted here (repeatedly), and you'll see that it's true. H6_abwurfwaffe.jpg 4 x ESAC 250. It's right there as plain as day. That excerpt you posted up above is in error. Nice try, Luke. The old trick of airplane manual to have credibility. The H6 was to be used as a torpedo bomber, that´s why we have the extra bomb bay fuel tank from factory. They needed the extra range to reach the convoys. BUT, this plane was mainly used as a regular bomber and the bomb bay fuel tank was removed for the extra bomb payload when necessary. The 111 fuel tanks were modular, look how easy was to remove/replace one: German engineering !! You totally disrespect german ground crew skills and front line needs with your factory configuration logic. By the way, can you show me the manual that says it was forbidden to change factory standards?? Have you ever heard about field conversion sets (Rustsatze)??? This manual argument (Lukes books are the correct ones of ocurse) only shows how desperate you are. It's hilarious how Gielow was insulting people earlier because they didn't like the He-111, and now he's insulting people because he's decided that the He-111 H-16 is crap. Then again, this is an important issue. What weapons we get in a video game is serious stuff, guys That is exactly my point. The H16 is not crap !! Crap is the absence of important mods. I am fighting the mediocrity of how this great plane is being delivered. Fighting the mediocrity you all choose to embrace. The Ju52 in your picture is fake no Ju 52 carryed torpedos. Before the war started there was one Early Ju 52 which had only one engine at that time that was used to test torpedos. That was the only Ju 52 that was able to use them Did I say It was real ?? did I say It was mass produced ?? I just said it was really cool configuration. You guys are so desperate to put me down with your agressions that you are loosing your capabilty to understand a simple phrase context and trying to give your own interpretation to my words. Sorry, you failed again. Funny that you mention an episode where pilots simply listed their recommendations upon being questioned on what could improve things rather than whine about new aircraft but hey, if you like going down the personal insult route don't let me stop you I for one am very happy with the new Il-2 which, you know, is just our old Il-2 with a gunner station and one or two extra loadouts, the Yak-1b which is our old Yak-1 with a new cockpit and a few minor changes and the Yak-7B, which is similar to our old Yak-1 but heavier and packing an extra gun. Funny how everyone is pleased about those since they are so terrible by the standards laid out here. If telling to your Airforce Commander and Chief, face to face and in public, that you would like to be equipped with enemy equipment, risking your career and even life, can not be considered a complaint (whining) ?!?! I really don´t know what can be !!! If you were just a little cunning , you could said that Galland was the Original Luftwhiner. But you just failed once again. I also really like how you tried to victimize yourself. But it won´t work with me. Actually you have offended yourself. My contribution was to point your lack of WW2 knowledge. At last and not least, people maybe be happy with IL2 and fighters because they got all relevant mods. I am just pointing that H16 is not getting its fair share of mods. Would you be happy flying your precious IL2 with no 37mm cannons or rockets ?? I don´t think so. Thus, if you dont care about the H16, just stay out and stop trying porking other peoples favorite plane. Edited November 7, 2016 by 6./ZG26_Gielow
1CGS LukeFF Posted November 7, 2016 1CGS Posted November 7, 2016 Gielow, instead of constantly stirring up crap and insulting people, show the manual that approves the removal of the field tank for the H-6. Pictures without context don't count.
FuriousMeow Posted November 7, 2016 Posted November 7, 2016 (edited) [Edited] Please do not get personal. Edited November 8, 2016 by Bearcat 1
6./ZG26_Gielow Posted November 7, 2016 Posted November 7, 2016 (edited) Gielow, instead of constantly stirring up crap and insulting people, show the manual that approves the removal of the field tank for the H-6. Pictures without context don't count. Watch your words,Luke!! You are the ones trying to insult people here. I am just defending my point of view with socially acceptable words. You are way out of line just trying to give moderators an excuse to lock down this topic. Don´t try to turn tables. You that have to show us the manual saying that is impossible to remove the tank !! Or do you really think that a plane used in combat could not be damaged and its parts need to be romoved/replaced?? A few bolts and disconnecting hose would do the magic. It is common sense. Here it is the real 111under restoration and its wing fuel tank: No point in engaging Gielow, just whines all of the time and then gets insulting to people. You are the ones with no arguments. Edited November 7, 2016 by 6./ZG26_Gielow
1CGS LukeFF Posted November 7, 2016 1CGS Posted November 7, 2016 Watch your words,Luke!! You are the ones trying to insult people here. I am just defending my point of view with socially acceptable words. Oh please. Tell us the R number that allowed the removal of the fuel and oil tanks in the H-6, and maybe I'll start taking you seriously.
6./ZG26_Gielow Posted November 7, 2016 Posted November 7, 2016 (edited) Oh please. Tell us the R number that allowed the removal of the fuel and oil tanks in the H-6, and maybe I'll start taking you seriously. Three guys and a screw driver that is the "R" you are looking for Edited November 7, 2016 by 6./ZG26_Gielow
Gunsmith86 Posted November 7, 2016 Posted November 7, 2016 For those who are interested on the one Ju 52 that could carry torpedos here it is: In its original configuration, designated the Ju 52/1m, the Ju 52 was a single-engined aircraft, powered by either a BMW IV or Junkers liquid-cooled V-12 engine with 690 hp. However, the single-engine model was underpowered, and after seven prototypes had been completed, all subsequent Ju 52s were built with three radial engines as the Ju 52/3m (drei motoren — "three engines"). The JU 52 ce number 4004, registered D-2317, was sold to the Deutsche Verkehrsfliegerschule (German Transport Pilot School) in September 1932, but later that year it was transferred to the Junkers subsidiary Aktie Bolaget Flygindustri in Limhamn, Sweden, to be converted to a torpedo bomber. Reflown under the Swedish registration SE-ADM it returned to Germany and torpedo dropping was tested at Travemünde. After these tests were concluded the aircraft was again registered D-2317. 1
6./ZG26_5tuka Posted November 7, 2016 Posted November 7, 2016 The He111 H-20 manual mentions the fuel tank Rüstsatz (B1) in detail. 1
Gunsmith86 Posted November 7, 2016 Posted November 7, 2016 Ok Gielow if you want to know for your self if it is possible to use a second bomb bay with the HE 111 H-6 you have to look in the manual called: He 111 H-6 Teil 12 B Abwurfwaffenanlage There you will find out that there are no second bomb bays for HE 111 H-6 aircrafts the ones that could be fited to the HE 111 H-11 and H-16 can not be used with the H-6 aircraft they always had the fuel tank fited.
6./ZG26_Gielow Posted November 8, 2016 Posted November 8, 2016 The He111 H-20 manual mentions the fuel tank Rüstsatz (B1) in detail. He-111H-20_Rüstsatz.jpg He-111H-20_Rüstsatz2.jpg Ok Gielow if you want to know for your self if it is possible to use a second bomb bay with the HE 111 H-6 you have to look in the manual called: He 111 H-6 Teil 12 B Abwurfwaffenanlage There you will find out that there are no second bomb bays for HE 111 H-6 aircrafts the ones that could be fited to the HE 111 H-11 and H-16 can not be used with the H-6 aircraft they always had the fuel tank fited. This is the perfect example of how front line modifications led by squads own necessities has become later an official field conversion kit. Thanks Stuka !! Anyway, the H6 is done. Forget about it. My point is saving the H16 having torpedos, computers and turrets.
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