A-20B thoughts

[Legioneod]

I was hoping they would do a B-25 but I guess the Russians didn't receive them yet, I'm not sure though.

[Luger1969]

The front office.

 

http://atlantic-air-combat.com/JoeBaugherArchives/A20.Havoc.A20B.htm

Specification of Douglas A-20B Havoc:

Engines: Two Wright R-2600-11 Double Cyclone air-cooled radial engines, each rated at 1600 hp for takeoff and 1275 hp at 12,000 feet. Performance: Maximum speed 350 mph at 12,000 feet. Cruising speed 278 mph. Landing speed 95 mph. Service ceiling 28,600 feet. An altitude of 10,000 feet could be attained in 5.0 minutes. Range 825 miles with 1000 pounds of bombs. For ferrying purposes, the A-20B could be equipped with an auxiliary 200 US gallon fuel tank in the bomb bay. With this tank fitted, maximum ferry range was 2300 miles. Dimensions: Wingspan 61 feet 4 inches, length 48 feet 0 inches, height 18 feet 1 inches, wing area 464 square feet. Weights: 14,830 pounds empty, 21,000 pounds gross, 23,800 pounds maximum. Armament: Two 0.50-inch machine guns in the nose (one on each side of the forward fuselage) one 0.50-inch flexible machine gun in the top gunner's position, plus one flexible 0.30-inch machine gun in the ventral tunnel position. It could also carry aft-pointing 0.30-inch machine guns in the engine nacelles, although these were rarely actually fitted. Normal bomb load 1500 pounds, maximum bomb load 2400 pounds.

Edited September 16, 2016 by Chandalier1969

[6./ZG26_5tuka]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sVqImhbKAqg

Notes on flight characteristics start about at 10:00.

 

Also I have gathered this table some time ago (unfortunately only for the G version) from a manual I have no longer access to. Should give a general idea about performence.

Edited September 21, 2016 by 6./ZG26_5tuka

[Custard]

Curious as to if there's any chance of a Torpedo field mod for the A-20B, did the Soviets modify any of their B's to carry torps before they received A-20Cs? If not then the B would be a rather strange addition for a theatre like Kuban with such a large Naval component.

Edited September 21, 2016 by Custard

[ShamrockOneFive]

Curious as to if there's any chance of a Torpedo field mod for the A-20B, did the Soviets modify and of their B's to carry torps before they received A-20Cs? If not then the B would be a rather strange addition for a theatre like Kuban with such a large Naval component.

That's a good question. I've not been able to answer it so far...

 

I am hoping that the He111H-16 and A-20B can both do air dropped torpedoes. Something for the next Q&A with Jason maybe.

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

Something to think about, on the A-20C, was the torpedo carried inside the bomb bay? If so, I don't think that stopped the Soviets then. To my best knowledge on later models they just slung a pair of torpedoes onto the fuselage and that was that, and the same goes for some heavier bombs. I don't think they shied away from this practice with the A-20B.

[Custard]

To my best knowledge on later models they just slung a pair of torpedoes onto the fuselage and that was that

 

Indeed, as on these C's.

 

 

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

Nice pics. Look at that blister turret on the white 29 profile plus the underwing bomb pylons. I guess those will be among the mods available

 

I wonder how much drag will come from carrying torpedoes like that. Not that you can go very fast while dropping them, anyway

[Brano]

I'm about to order the book about LL Soviet Bostons. I'll try to share some knowledge and interesting infos later.

[216th_Jordan]

Indeed, as on these C's.

 

 

 

 

Looking at the Windows and lower turret that picture looks like a B model though.

[216th_Peterla]

Hopefully will get those fancy torpedoes.

[Trooper117]

Not unless we get the A-20C

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

Not sure, Jordan. The radio and navigational gear on the top looks like the A-20C's. Also, many Soviet A-20s came without the navigator's position, so Soviet workshops would make their own glass casing and cockpit for them.
 
A comment from Demidov, who sources the photo:
 

- By the way, it is a rebuilt airplane.
Modified. All the Bostons were rebuilt in Leningrad, at our aviation plant for navigator accommodation. We couldn’t fly without navigators.
…This is a photo of my airplane, “Number 6,” in flight, taken from another aircraft by my friend . It was shot down by our own AAA. They were based at our Panevezhis airfield. We had taken off for a mining mission.

 

As you can see of course, Demidov survived the incident.

Some more comments on torpedoes:

 

The Boston could carry two torpedoes. Why did you fly with just one?
It was very heavy, unmaneuverable and had a tendency to spin out of control [with two]; that’s why we flew with one torpedo. We used to carry two only when we had to deliver them from Leningrad to Baltic airbases. Combat missions were flown only with one torpedo.
There was a chief of staff in our regiment, a colonel from cavalry, I forgot his surname. He had no idea about aviation. He made us fly with a torpedo and a bomb. He ordered us to drop the torpedo from a range of one kilometer, and then perform a mast-top bombing. That was a complete delirium. We flew out to the coast line and dropped the bomb there. The mission was carried out with only a torpedo.

[migmadmarine]

Seeing as this is the glass-nose version, did the Russians use them for level bombing much? Or more as a heavy attack aircraft?

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

They were used for just about everything. Level-bombing, low-level attack, torpedo bombing, mast-top bombing, reconnaissance and whatnot.

[Monostripezebra]

I think it may draw me away a little from the Pe2 side of life...

[216th_Peterla]

I guess so Mr Zebra.

[Juri_JS]

If I understand this remark by Han correctly we won't get any aerial torpedos for BoK, only torpedos for ships:

 

 

Торпеды на самолетах пока не планируем, только на торпедных катерах. Может попозже.

found here:

http://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/topic/2965-voprosy-razrabotchikam-2/page-36?do=findComment&comment=451827

[Danziger]

I wonder how much drag will come from carrying torpedoes like that. Not that you can go very fast while dropping them, anyway

Looks like the torpedo on the drawing is at a lot steeper angle than the photograph.

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

Well spotted, Juri. Judging by how Han worded it, they should come sometime, just not right away. I guess ships will make it easier to fine-tune the mechanisms without having to account for pilot error.

[Custard]

Looking at the Windows and lower turret that picture looks like a B model though.

 

If it is that would be fantastic news of B's with torps, but I'm unsure. I've seen lots of pictures of A-20s with novel looking noses.

[ShamrockOneFive]

Seeing as this is the glass-nose version, did the Russians use them for level bombing much? Or more as a heavy attack aircraft?

 

The brilliant thing about the A-20 is that its incredibly versatile. It can function as an attack aircraft and strafer, level bomber, skip bombing, and so forth. The A-20 was exceptionally agile for an aircraft of its size.

[Gambit21]

I used to have great fun strafing in the old 46 A20. 

I'll fly the B plenty - but I will miss those guns.

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

I used it mostly for mast-top bombing. This 1946 server (still running by the way) has a mission where you need to bomb the Tirpitz, and it's gleefully protected by another two vessels overflowing with AA guns. With the A-20C I went the long way around it, evading the fighters, dove from 1500m down to 10m, dropped some heavy bombs and headed straight home. The whole experience was made better by bombing from the navigator's compartment, such a great view

 

A-20B shenanigans:

 

[Rjel]

Speaking of novel nose configurations, this one must rate near the top. I wonder how much the airspeed was reduced with this blunt nose?

 

 

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

I can only imagine the joy of German AA gunners and night fighters at the sight of this monster.

[LLv34_Flanker]

S!

 

 A-20 was considered quite hard to intercept by Finns. Even with the Bf109G-2 entering service 1943. Some were shot down and some crashed later after other engine was taken out. I liked to fly it in IL-2 1946. Low level bombing and torpedo runs were exciting.

[-=PHX=-SuperEtendard]

In IL-2 1946 the A-20 was really annoying to face in the Zero... you just couldn't catch it! You pretty much had to dive on it from straight above to make an attack run and that was it, back to climbing and wait for the next one to pass below.

Edited September 26, 2016 by -=PLR=-SuperEtendard

[Dutchvdm]

Hi Guys,

 

Want to speculate with me? I was wondering about the crew positions. Afaik the bombadier in the glas nose had no hand operated gun. Both forward firing guns we mounted on the side. What will the devs do with that. As a manable positions this seems weird.

 

Ayone some thoughts?

 

Grt M

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

It will probably be left as a secondary position with bombsight only I guess. Very useful when lining up for low altitude attacks

[Legioneod]

Hi Guys,

 

Want to speculate with me? I was wondering about the crew positions. Afaik the bombadier in the glas nose had no hand operated gun. Both forward firing guns we mounted on the side. What will the devs do with that. As a manable positions this seems weird.

 

Ayone some thoughts?

 

Grt M

If they ever give us a modeled bombsight like in The mighty eighth then it would be good position. Also if they ever let crew operate the bombsight that would be great, and give the position meaning.

[ShamrockOneFive]

Hi Guys,

 

Want to speculate with me? I was wondering about the crew positions. Afaik the bombadier in the glas nose had no hand operated gun. Both forward firing guns we mounted on the side. What will the devs do with that. As a manable positions this seems weird.

 

Ayone some thoughts?

 

Grt M

 

As I recall... in IL-2 1946 you could man that position and look forward. Pretty boring for a player in coop but great for a single player jumping between positions. Very good forward visibility from there.

Edited September 28, 2016 by ShamrockOneFive

[BlitzPig_EL]

I used to do my torpedo runs in '46 from there.

[hotshotmike1001]

[Finkeren]

The A-20G was a favourite of mine in the old IL-2. I remember modifying the stock IL-2FB career to fly the Boston as an attack aircraft in place of the IL-2. That plane had nearly unmatched survivability.

Edited October 21, 2016 by Finkeren

[Gambit21]

I made a nice Battle of the Bulge and Normandy campaign for it. The good ol days. Can't wait to get it back - would rather have the G though.

[Xenunjeon88]

One sexy beast:

(big image)

 

 

 

 

 

Hnnnnuughh... Shit. Laundry's not till Tuesday... 

[Scojo]

Any word on what the bomb load-outs available for this guy will be? At 2400kg max bomb load will we be seeing 1000kg bombs on the VVS side? Or will the max still be 500kg bombs?

[216th_Jordan]

Wasn't that pounds not kg? Would surely like kg though

[Dutchvdm]

Any word on what the bomb load-outs available for this guy will be? At 2400kg max bomb load will we be seeing 1000kg bombs on the VVS side? Or will the max still be 500kg bombs?

 

Most sources state normal bombload of 1500lbs and a max of 2400 lbs. That's almost half of that.

 

Grt M