OP rear gunners

[peregrine7]

Funny, I find the gunners fairly ineffective. 

They make the same mistakes as the ground fire guns, failure to lead targets properly (they don't account for steady maneuvers). 

Would love to see them buffed, as it is I can swoop on an He111, Ju88/87, Pe2 all day and more often than not the gunners barely fire at me, let alone get hits.

[LLv34_Flanker]

S!

 

You can game the game with AI controlled AAA. Just fly low enough around a target area and they will blast everything to pieces as they will try to shoot you thru everything, including buildings etc. AI always has a perfect LOS to you, it sees thru it all. Tanks will be a nightmare to play with current AI seeing you no matter how well you go hull down or use terrain. AS long as you are inside their detection range there is no escape and AI just keeps stupidly firing on you even there are obstacles or no direct LOS. 

[Blitzen]

I totally agree...but its even worse in RoF ( & I imagine it will be in Flying Circus ) when closing speed from the o blast you as you try to close on any two seater. The only way you stand a chance s drop below the target ,building speed up & then when directly below the target ,pop up & blast the belly of the wo seater before the gunner can drop his machine gun over the side and never ever be directly astern the two seater offering a no deflection shot.

[69TD_Hajo_Garlic]

I think the gunner ai is fine.  Gunners with with good field of fire and without vert stabalizers blocking them are the most effective in my experience.  In the pe2 and 110 with their good visability it is easy to spot a fighter high six when you are running on the deck and switch to the gunner and put a cone of lead into the flight path of predictable enemies which I think is half the problem for some.  The twin engines are pretty vulnerable from the sides or other good angles.  I think one other thing that would help would be to make radial engines tougher so the i16, fw190, and la5's arnt as vulnerable to gunner damage as the inline engined fighters because to me it seems like there is little difference.  

[=EXPEND=Tripwire]

Predictable flight paths aren't the issue.

 

Yes the argument gets watered down when people post videos whining about the issue when it was clearly a foolish attack, but the issue is still there. 

 

It's when you take a huge slashing attack that the gunner has little chance of following (especially when being thrown about by a pilot flying the plane like a fighter) and the gunner (sometimes even the one on the blind side of the plane) still hits and rips the attacking plane apart. 

 

Issues -

ACE AI gunners are deadly accurate unless you are updating your flight path. To be fair, that's fine. But server operators keep using this setting rather than something more appropriate. 

 

AI gunners have an all seeing eye and hive mentality. The gunner that can't see your plane is ready to follow your trajectory very quickly. 

 

 

[Gambit21]

LOW = for most weapons, ground units, artillery etc you get about what you'd expect for a real life, REALLY good ACE gunner.

You still witness some extraordinary hits and target tracking, but it's reasonable 90% of the time, which means just as in real life, most of the time they miss.

 

For the most part, in most situations, this is the most plausible setting and is more than serviceable I find.

 

NORMAL = starting to get a bit too accurate, but OK to throw a few in among the LOW guns to add some pucker factor/difficulty.

Use with care.

 

HIGH = Laser guided accuracy

 

ACE = Next Gen per-cognitave Laser guided accuracy

 

Now for artillery etc the answer is easy, just set the damn things to low or normal and that's the end of it. Easy.

The problem is that maybe you want an aircraft to be very proficient at bombing/hitting targets. Now you have to pick your poison a bit.

I haven't spent any time testing bombing accuracy at various AI settings, but I'm guessing that most of the time, "LOW" would serve the purpose from the player/experience

perspective unless points are being tallied/counted etc.

 

 

 

[US63_SpadLivesMatter]

Having a real person in the gunner seat should be an upgrade.  With the settings in common use right now, that just isn't the case.

[Georgio]

6 hours ago, hrafnkolbrandr said:

Having a real person in the gunner seat should be an upgrade.  With the settings in common use right now, that just isn't the case.

 

When I'm flying the IL-2 I always switch to the gunners seat and chew up fighters queuing up for an easy kill.

With some practice you can kill everything that threatens your six. The only issue is running out of ammo and smart-asses who suss to attack from the side while you're perforating someone at the back.

[US63_SpadLivesMatter]

7 hours ago, Georgio said:

 

When I'm flying the IL-2 I always switch to the gunners seat and chew up fighters queuing up for an easy kill.

With some practice you can kill everything that threatens your six. The only issue is running out of ammo and smart-asses who suss to attack from the side while you're perforating someone at the back.

 

I don't think anyone has a problem with that; but I don't think you're headshotting 109 pilots on slashing attacks.

Edited October 19, 2018 by hrafnkolbrandr

[Georgio]

On 10/19/2018 at 7:44 PM, hrafnkolbrandr said:

 

I don't think anyone has a problem with that; but I don't think you're headshotting 109 pilots on slashing attacks.

 

Maybe not but you can get a lot more shots in target than the AI riding in the back.

A couple of hits on the engine soon put off the 109 space-cadets who break off looking for easier kills.

[Gambit21]

You’re missing the point about Ace AI.

 

One shot, one kill, no exceptions.

 

 

[Cpt_Siddy]

13 hours ago, Gambit21 said:

You’re missing the point about Ace AI.

 

One shot, one kill, no exceptions.

 

 

 

 

The AI can only aim to the derivative of your vector, as long as you keep changing your vector, ace AI will have lesser chance to hit you than novice AI because of no random spread. 

 

The AI is dumb as bag of rocks, learning the way it aims makes you more or less immune to its fire. 

Edited October 24, 2018 by Cpt_Siddy

[Gambit21]

32 minutes ago, Cpt_Siddy said:

 

 

The AI can only aim to the derivative of your vector, as long as you keep changing your vector, ace AI will have lease chance to hit you than novice AI because of no random spread. 

 

The AI is dumb as bag of rocks, learning the way it aims makes you more or less immune to its fire. 

 

Yes you can always game the game.

Novice AI precludes the need for this.

 

The gunner AI is the opposite of dumb, it’s dumbing it down that poses the issue.