Flying the JU-88: BoS/BoM vs. CLoD

[Bearfoot]

Preface --- full disclosure: (a) I enjoy and play BOTH BoS/BoM and CLoD, and think both a very worthy sims; (b) I am just coming to grips with the JU88 in both, having generally been flying fighters for a while now; © surprising as it may seem, I have no RL experience in flying medium piston-engine bombers; (d) I really do not mean to start a petty/fanatic flame war.

 

So, with that out of the way ...

 

The JU-88 in BoS/BoM is a nimble beast. Multiple low-level precision passes on targets, with hard-banking turns on to target, are easy enough to pull off, making it quite amenable to being used as a ground attack aircraft. Maybe not for tanks due to lack of armament, but certainly on soft targets and infrastructure. 

 

The JU-88 in CLoD is, while fast, not quite as nimble. It's relatively ponderous. Trying to "sturmovik" it in the CLoD JU-88 is laborious: the fine precision maneuvering on the final approach on a low-level run are difficult to do, and it takes a while to bring the bird around for another pass. 

 

In summary, the BoS/BoM JU-88 is closer to a Mosquito than a B-17, and vice versa in CLoD. Of course, reality is somewhere in between! 

 

But for folks who have flown both versions, what are your thoughts?

 

NOTE: I've also posted this same question over the ATAG CLoD forums. Hope that is OK.

 

As discussed on another thread, this "sturmoviking" in a JU88 in BoS/BoM is not historically accurate, at least generally or widespread, yet it appears to be a common tactic used by folks online. Could a tweaked flight model which makes the aircraft in BoS/BoM more (authentically?) sluggish help fix this (at the cost of millions of howls and complaints about nerfed planes ...)?

Edited August 30, 2016 by Bearfoot

[ShamrockOneFive]

 

Preface --- full disclosure: (a) I enjoy and play BOTH BoS/BoM and CLoD, and think both a very worthy sims; (b) I am just coming to grips with the JU88 in both, having generally been flying fighters for a while now; © surprising as it may seem, I have no RL experience in flying medium piston-engine bombers; (d) I really do not mean to start a petty/fanatic flame war.

 

So, with that out of the way ...

 

The JU-88 in BoS/BoM is a nimble beast. Multiple low-level precision passes on targets, with hard-banking turns on to target, are easy enough to pull off, making it quite amenable to being used as a ground attack aircraft. Maybe not for tanks due to lack of armament, but certainly on soft targets and infrastructure. 

 

The JU-88 in CLoD is, while fast, not quite as nimble. It's relatively ponderous. Trying to "sturmovik" it in the CLoD JU-88 is laborious: the fine precision maneuvering on the final approach on a low-level run are difficult to do, and it takes a while to bring the bird around for another pass. 

 

In summary, the BoS/BoM JU-88 is closer to a Mosquito than a B-17, and vice versa in CLoD. Of course, reality is somewhere in between! 

 

But for folks who have flown both versions, what are your thoughts?

 

NOTE: I've also posted this same question over the ATAG CLoD forums. Hope that is OK.

 

As discussed on another thread, this "sturmoviking" in a JU88 in BoS/BoM is not historically accurate, at least generally or widespread, yet it appears to be a common tactic used by folks online. Could a tweaked flight model which makes the aircraft in BoS/BoM more (authentically?) sluggish help fix this (at the cost of millions of howls and complaints about nerfed planes ...)?

 

 

I haven't flown the one in CLOD but correct me if I'm wrong...that's the A-1 model with shorter wings and less powerful engines. The A-1s handling was criticized by pilots and that lead to multiple changes across the line leading to the interim A-5 and major design changes on the A-4.

 

I've been reading a fair bit about the Ju88 employed as a low level attacker. The C-6a version certainly was operating as a low level "Destroyer" attacking trains and the like. Although armed differently than the Ju88A-4... it is much more similar.

[[CPT]Pike*HarryM]

I don't fly the CoD Ju-88 but by all accounts the real plane had very good handling and agility for a twin engine bomber. 

http://forums.ubi.com/archive/index.php/t-328299.html

[Bearfoot]

I haven't flown the one in CLOD but correct me if I'm wrong...that's the A-1 model with shorter wings and less powerful engines. The A-1s handling was criticized by pilots and that lead to multiple changes across the line leading to the interim A-5 and major design changes on the A-4.

 

I've been reading a fair bit about the Ju88 employed as a low level attacker. The C-6a version certainly was operating as a low level "Destroyer" attacking trains and the like. Although armed differently than the Ju88A-4... it is much more similar.

 

Ah yes, the A1 vs. A4 difference might explain the differences in the modeling and "feel" of the aircrafts! 

 

Thanks!

[Lusekofte]

The JU 88 in COD is a A4 like we have. I find its durability in COD more realistic. And just to say it. Being a maneuverable bomber does not mean turning like a fighter. I said this before. Flying in BOS give a better feel of thermic condition and the simulated flight feels much more realistic. But when it comes to Bombers and especial the Luftwaffe bombers I find BOS a bit off.

Flying JU 88 in COD, witch I have done for years with squadrons is a much more realistic feel than in BOS. Same goes for the Heinkel and Stuka , this is on the so called "feel" bases. (Let stay to of the FM question, I know the Stuka in COD is over performing, I am not talking about that part.)

In regard of authentic feel this is the only part I feel COD got it better than BOS in regard of feel of flight. And one of the reasons I migrate a bit to COD. In terms of maneuvering The JU 88 in low altitude a bit more gut´s are needed, you got a stall feeling when pushing it, a feel of weight, witch you simply do not have in BOS version of Luftwaffe bombers. In Russian bombers like PE 2 and IL 2 this weight is felt and we are talking exceptional simulation in BOS much better than COD

Edited August 31, 2016 by 216th_LuseKofte

[Monostripezebra]

I haven´t played much COD, but I noted, that they did put a little more detail into the simulation of the lotfe-bombsight. But I´m not really complaining... the Ju88 in BoS works really well and is a ton of fun:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gHHbopgtwsQ

 

but overall I find the flightmodel of the Pe2 feels just a whole lot better for my personal like, I think it is one of BoS best planes in my subjective "feels real" oppinon, right down to the landing bounce that you can observe in real world videos of landing Pe´s.. I think it is one of the best sim planes of all games, for me it is right up there with the DCS P-51

Edited August 31, 2016 by Dr_Zeebra

[xvii-Dietrich]

I have 1200+ hours of flying the Ju 88 A-1 in CloD and about 40+ hours on the Ju 88 A-4 in BoM. They are different variants of the Ju 88 and so have different performance and loadouts.

 

The CloD Ju 88 is bug-ridden, with all sort of things not working correctly: from the autopilot to the bomb-drop mechanism, and from the guns to the internals. However, despite these quirks, I still find it handles better and is a more responsive aircraft to fly than its BoM counterpart. It is not better performing, but you get a better feel for the weight and control of the aircraft in CloD. This applies to the climb and level flight, but also to things like being on the brink of a stall, or when trying to handle the aircraft on the ground.

 

The Ju 88 in BoM is visually good, and the aircraft-environment is nicer. However, I have less appreciation of the flight with it as I do in CloD. While the BoM version is certainly beautifully rendered, the CloD Ju 88 has a better feel and more versatility. I actually find the CloD version more nimble and easier to "precision-strike" ground targets. And high-altitude bombing is also easier with the CloD version, due to controller-driven bomb-sight operation and better target visibility distances.

 

One point of note is that the perceived performance of the Ju 88 is also dependent on the context. Different games, and thus different ground targets, map, weather and opponents... all make for apparent differences in the aircraft, even if the performance is nearly identical. The versatility of the roles in CloD make the Ju 88 a much more engaging aircraft there... assuming you keep off the dog-fight servers and use it on the strategic-campaign servers instead.

 

Both Ju 88s are nice, but I definitely prefer the one in CloD.

[LLv34_Flanker]

S!

 

 I did read some pilot memoirs who flew Ju88A-4 in FiAF during WW2. They liked the plane. Fast, easy to handle and stable to fly. And not the stiffest to turn either. 

[ShamrockOneFive]

The JU 88 in COD is a A4 like we have.

 

You mean like this one?

 

That's definitely an A-1. The easiest way to recognize it is from the shorter stubbier wings which did change the handling dramatically.

 

I don't have CLOD but I can't find any reference to the A-4 being available there. Only the A-1.

[Bearfoot]

Yes, CLOD has the JU-88 A1, not the A4.