Bf 109 breaks not working right?

[Anatta]

I can *brake just fine, but I can't seem to turn the bf by applying only one of the brakes. Anyone else? Or is it my fault?

 

*idiot at work, ignore the title

Edited November 25, 2013 by Anatta

[Sim]

Tail-wheel is locked? (Unlock with Shift+G)

Edited November 25, 2013 by Sim

[Anatta]

That does not seem to be the problem

[HeavyCavalrySgt]

I can't say I noticed that.  I landed, went to the end of the runway, stopped, stood on the left brake to turn around and took off again.

[Matt]

Turning right seems to be much more difficult than turning left.

[Anatta]

Yes, turning left seems to kind of work (which is no surprise because the plane turns there anyway), but I can't turn right at all.

 

Edit: With full rudder it kind of works. Maybe it's supposed to be that way. I don't know. To me it is strange.

Edited November 25, 2013 by Anatta

[FuriousMeow]

Not having too much trouble with brakes, so long as I remember to set my throttle properly each time I startup the game.

 

Do you notice the pedal's fully rocking forward when depressing the toe brakes? Mine are equally rocking forward when depressing the toe brakes, just wondering if maybe the depression isn't going fully on one side for you?

[HagarTheHorrible]

A trick I discovered in RoF is, if you push your stick forward you turn more easily and if you pull it back, into your lap, it becomes more difficult.

[Anatta]

The brakes seem to fully go forward. I tried keyboard buttons and my pedals. But even if I only brake right, the plane turns left without rudder. What Hagar said also does not help really.

Edited November 25, 2013 by Anatta

[JaMz]

They are inverted for some reason on my G940... I have to keep my pedals pressed for the brakes in game to not be engaged, and the GFX is telling me that too...when I take my feet off the pedals go forward

[HeavyCavalrySgt]

You might look to see how the brakes are being activated.  If you look at the pedals, they move as you activate the brakes, so you can make sure that when you ask for left brake that is really what you are getting.

 

Your pilot has very slow feet as well, so that might add some confusion.

[Anatta]

Like I said, I can confirm by looking down that my brakes should in fact work right.

[SYN_Ricky]

A trick I discovered in RoF is, if you push your stick forward you turn more easily and if you pull it back, into your lap, it becomes more difficult.

 

You should also make sure that the tailwheel is unlocked, makes a huge difference when turning on the ground with the 109. Then you can turn easily even without pushing the stick forward.

[HeavyCavalrySgt]

Like I said, I can confirm by looking down that my brakes should in fact work right.

 

Ah, sorry - missed that.

[Anatta]

I try and try but it doesn't work like I expect. Maybe I should clarify. What I want: When braking full right and standing still, when applying throttle, the plane should turn right without need of applying rudder (Turning left works as I mentioned). This works for you guys, correct?

[Fifi]

This works for you guys, correct?

 

Nope

You should also make sure that the tailwheel is unlocked, makes a huge difference when turning on the ground with the 109. Then you can turn easily even without pushing the stick forward.

 

Doesn't work either. As Lagg, tailwheel locking isn't working here.

[Sim]

Tail-wheel lock works for me on Bf 109. I don't think LaGG-3 has lockable tail wheel..

[Fifi]

 I don't think LaGG-3 has lockable tail wheel..

 

You're probably right. But locked or unlocked, i can turn on a dime the 109 to the left, and in external view, the tailwheel is still turning while it should be locked.

[Anatta]

The lock for the tail wheel works and it is nice for landing. For the problem that you can't turn to the right it does nothing at all.

[Sim]

My theory is that without rudder - there is no deflection and the torque is working in the opposite direction of the right toe brake. Thus - no way to turn right without the extra help of a rudder. Correct me if I am wrong

[NonWonderDog]

Eh.. I don't have any toe brakes over here, and my experience is that it's very easy to turn the Bf 109 as long as the tailwheel is unlocked. Toe brakes are unnecessary as long as you aren't trying to swivel in place.

 

If the tailwheel is locked, though, you need to gun the throttle and lift the tail up to turn right. It's tricky without toe-brake axes.

 

The tailwheel very definitely swivels in externals when unlocked, and doesn't swivel at all when locked.  All seems to be working as intended.

 

[EDIT]

To clarify: I don't have any toe brakes because I don't have rudder pedals with toe brakes. I'm sure they work fine in the sim.

Edited November 26, 2013 by NonWonderDog

[Anatta]

I once again made sure the tail wheel is unlocked, plain standing still, applied right toe brake (via padels, and I controlled visually in game that they are applied), applied throttle slowly, plane turns left instead of right... . In clod i could rotate the plane in both directions around it's own axis this way to align it in one direction when standing still. This was very helpful. Here it just doesn't work that way (till now).

[Sim]

In clod i could rotate the plane in both directions around it's own axis this way to align it in one direction when standing still. This was very helpful. Here it just doesn't work that way (till now).

 

Could be that CloD ground handling is less complex than BoS.. As mentioned, turning right means you have to fight the torque without no deflection on your rudder surface. Why don't you use the right rudder to help with the right toe brake turn?

[Anatta]

I do that. It's just that I have to press the rudder fully to get the plane moving right. Also the plane is still moving a little and not just rotating around is't axis. But like I said. I just wanted to ask if that's my fault or if it is normal. So thanks for answering that.

[AndyHill]

I made a video of this so that you can see if your plane behaves in a similar fashion. Don't worry the 109 turns just fine, we'll figure out what the problem is for you and get it fixed.

 

In the video I start up the 109, try to turn it with tail wheel locked. Right turn is a bit of a challenge, doesn't really want to go, left turn is more ok because of the torque. With the tail wheel unlocked, however, the 109 loves doing donuts!

 

Two things that come to mind:

1) are you absolutely sure (seen the wheel turning in F2 view) that the tailwheel is unlocked?

2) are you sure you didn't bind the "wheel brakes" function to one of your toe brakes for the LaGG? If so, unbind that and make sure you have the left and right toe brake only bound. 

 

Check these out and let me know how it went.

 

Here's the vid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uw6eu5DI1KM&feature=youtu.be

 

Ah yes of course, I'm also turning the rudder fully. I suppose you tried only with the brake? That doesn't work as well, I'm not sure how it should be in reality.

Edited November 26, 2013 by AndyHill

[Anatta]

Yes that's exactly how it is for me too. But like you said to turn right you have to go full rudder. That's just not what I expected so I asked how it behaves for others. And it seems it's the same for everyone.

 

Thank you

[AndyHill]

Thinking about it a bit, there's an awful lot of torque when that engine is running and the landing gear is narrow. The LaGG's brakes give up fairly soon when you add throttle and if that's accurate, I can see how it could be hard for the 109 to turn especially right with only toe brakes. It all depends on how strong the brakes actually are, but to me BoS handling feels plausible. It would be interesting to see some historical material on how the real thing worked.

[ST_ami7b5]

They are inverted for some reason on my G940... I have to keep my pedals pressed for the brakes in game to not be engaged, and the GFX is telling me that too...when I take my feet off the pedals go forward 

 

The same here.

The axis for toe brakes are inverted and there is no way to 'uninvert' them ATM...

[SYN_Ricky]

The same here.

The axis for toe brakes are inverted and there is no way to 'uninvert' them ATM...

Have you tried to assign your toebrakes in the settings while releasing them?

[Fifi]

Finally got it working...and the tailwheel locking as well.

It seems i have to press my Warthog button longer than usually 

[ST_ami7b5]

Have you tried to assign your toebrakes in the settings while releasing them?

 

Yes, I tried that but it didn't help... Just for a brief moment they went the right way but immediatelly returned to inverted state...

Even tried to edit the  file as recommended in this bug report:

http://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/2093-controls-gui-texts/?p=51874

but the same result...

There is missing the 'invert'button...

So now I have switched off toe brakes and use the same JS button I have mapped for LaGG-3 wheel breaks, but this way I can't use individual brakes which is a big disadvantage...

[Panzerlang]

The tail-wheel lock is a lever just under the left canopy sill. Forward is locked, back is unlocked.

[DD_bongodriver]

Have you tried to assign your toebrakes in the settings while releasing them?

 

I tried that on my G940 but it doesn't work, even tried to find a setting in a config file that might reverse it but no joy, not likely the devs will be fixing these issues until the next cycle of access either.

[ST_ami7b5]

Now I have mapped left toe brake to hat-switch 270, right brake to hat-switch 90 and (both) wheel brakes to JS button (S3) on the right side, next to the hat-switch.

Works good including the pedal animation.

So this is my temporarily  work-around until it's fixed...

[O_catarM]

What we need is a option to invert axis on breaks same as pitch etc.I have G940 btw

[ST_ami7b5]

^^

'xactly...

It's in the bug list so devs will solve the problem for sure.

[ATAG_Slipstream]

It works perfectly for me, nothing reversed from last week, and the toe breaks work fine as well on my CH pedals.

[J4SCrisZeri]

omg!!

 

servers open and bf109 unlocked!

when did this happen? where was my head?

:facepalm:

[DD_bongodriver]

No, you can't play now, not allowed so ner!

[J4SCrisZeri]

No, you can't play now, not allowed so ner!

Not now? I've just closed a flight session with the 109.....

what's happening?