I'm retiring my MSFFB stick for this sim, just got the new VKB Sim Gladiator!

[skline00]

Jason: Just placed an order on your website for the Gladiator!

 

I realize it is back ordered so I'll keep using my MSFFB2. It look like a very good stick.

 

Blitzen did a great review.

[1Sascha]

Blitzen: Any chance you could film yourself while using the stick? I'd be curious to see (and hear, lol!) how it responds to input mechanically.

 

I'm still traumatized by my experiences with the old Thrustmaster FCS (old F-4 style Gameport-sticks), I suppose. I reviewed both the non-Pro and Pro versions of that thing back in the day and they did look pretty similar at a glance. But the Pro had a metal base and tough springs, while the cheaper version was just a plastic construction with a fancy grip. It felt pretty terrible and flimsy for its price and on the last day of testing the non-Pro's stick snapped clean off during calibration... :D

 

 

S.

[skline00]

Just got my Gladiator and OMG what a nice stick. Puts the MSFFB2 to shame. Was very easy to set up and program a number of the buttons.

 

WOW what a great stick.

[1Sascha]

 

 

Puts the MSFFB2 to shame

 

That's high praise.

 

Although... one should probably expect that, given how long ago the last FF2s were built.. :D

 

 

S.

[Blitzen]

Did you try to set MSFFB JOYSTICK without FFB enabled before stats that is not accurate like your new VKB? You will be surprized that the accuracy of MSFFB is THE SAME of your new rig if you take off the ffb.

After getting this post of yours I did go back & gave your suggestion a try.I didn't test it for a very long time but lack of positive control & wobble seemed to be greatly reduced, unfortunately so did force/back pressure.Away went to feel of the stick.I'll be there is some way to program it in either the game or in joystick set up, but I wouldn't know where to begin or how long it would take to get it working just so.Good suggestion of yours though...

Edited July 19, 2016 by Blitzen

[89-]

Seems strange to compare FFB stick to non FFB stick. The comparison should be against CH Products stuff, maybe Warthog... MSFFB2 will only be dethroned by a FFB challenger.

[1Sascha]

Seems strange to compare FFB stick to non FFB stick. The comparison should be against CH Products stuff, maybe Warthog... MSFFB2 will only be dethroned by a FFB challenger.

Isn't FFB more or less dead these days?

 

It's not as much "apples and oranges" as one might think though if you look at it from a different perspective:

 

Personally, I never liked FFB all that much - the effects were usually way overdone in the old days to show off the capabilities of FFB, trying to use all of the built-in effects (like having the stick "rock" with every shot you fired). To me, FFB is only interesting where it comes to simulated spring force/self centering force - like what you get in most games when you turn FF off in the options. And in this regard, the Sidewinder is still pretty much perfect. Although I have to say that BoS' approach of using FFB pretty much only to let you know once you're approaching stall speed is probably one of the better implementations of the technology. Still: I found that I can fly better when I simply turn it off in-game and have the motors simulate centering springs. :D

 

S.

[Sokol1]

You try your MS FFB2 with DCS? Seems there the "gamey" effects of FFB like stick shake when firing cannons, etc. is not modeled, only the effects related do flying.

I don't try, I am too never like of FFB2 sticks, have owned MS FFB PRO (have other these here for test the "USB'erizing" mod) and MS FFB2 USB.

[1Sascha]

DCS and BoS do a fine job with FFB. I did disable "stick shaking" in BoS and then I only got the "stick goes light when approaching stall speed" effect. I *think* it's the same in DCS.. haven't flown my Dora-9 in a while...

 

As I've said: It was overdone in a lot of older games when they wanted to show off the capabilities of FFB.

 

 

 

S.

[Spinnetti]

Cool stuff.. glad to find this thread. KG12 stick is something I've wanted a long time... I'd want the "gunfighter" with the extension tho. I had extended my X45 years ago as I like the stick to move with the same motions the real thing would and gives finer control. looking on amazon, the few user reviews of the gladiator didn't look too hot....

[1Sascha]

You try your MS FFB2 with DCS? Seems there the "gamey" effects of FFB like stick shake when firing cannons, etc. is not modeled, only the effects related do flying.

I don't try, I am too never like of FFB2 sticks, have owned MS FFB PRO (have other these here for test the "USB'erizing" mod) and MS FFB2 USB.

I just went back to DCS the last couple of days and I think I know what you mean.

 

Although I'm having difficulty setting the forces up correctly. Once I start to trim the aircraft, things go wrong. Trimming right wing down will make the stick move to the front and left for some reason for example. Really weird. Plus DCS loses FFB from time to time. It works in one mission, but in the next one it's gone. Only way to cure this is to re-plug the stick.

 

*shrug*

 

 

S.

[9./JG27golani79]

Try swapping the FFB axis if you have problems with FFB and trimming in DCS.

 

But do this while being in the main menu - if you change this option during pausing the sim it might not work properly.

I´ve never lost FFB though in DCS - this only happens to me in BoS.

 

edit:

Just tried it out in the P-51D - trim is working perfectly fine after swapping the FFB axis.

Edited July 29, 2016 by 9./JG27golani79

[SYN_Mike77]

Any idea when new Gladiator sticks are coming in?

[1Sascha]

Any idea when new Gladiator sticks are coming in?

You can order both on amazon - says delivery is in "2 to 4 weeks". Plus there's some jokers on there who offer the Glad for $223 and the Pro for $523...lol.

 

Or, since you're in the US, just go to stratojet (www.gostratojet.com). Says delivery is expected in "July 2016" - and the first sticks have already been shipped to customers ... so..

 

 

S.

[SYN_Mike77]

Stratojet says out of stock.  Jason had said that they got a very limited shipment that they sent out but that full inventory was on the way.  I was wondering when the full inventory might be in.

[KoN_]

We need reviews from the guys here who have got the sticks , video please utube .. 

[Sokol1]

What I am curious to know is how this stick help (or not) in "dogfights". What (IMO) is the main purpose of joystick, specially a "WWII" one, not if the stick has "33 HAT corners" or if his program software is able to "frying sausages and open beer cans".

Edited August 16, 2016 by Sokol1

[Lusekofte]

FFB is not dead, it just too expensive . Here is my wet dream the Brunner yoke. It simulate gravity on the elevators and push forward when plane is standing on ground. it will go back again when speed give air resistance. It cost about 1700$ and are considered the cheapest but best yoke there is.

 

 

 

I got rid of my MS FFb stick years ago, until I got my new maxflightstick I used yokes. Because it gave a feeling of work and realism. I never liked the fingertip maneuvering , it feels non realistic and FFB do not change that.

I do not mind people using digital tabletop joystick´s, but you cannot add te word realistic together with it

Edited August 17, 2016 by 216th_LuseKofte

[=/WoVi/=kirumovka]

Are wheel style yokes hard to use in combat sims?

[Lusekofte]

No they are in general good, NOT the CF and Saitek standard though, Saitek cessna is quite good and accurate. But it is not easier, just  a tad more realistic. I had a floor mounted ACE yoke and it was fantastic, but the tension springs for pitch was not made for active flying and broke,

 

 

so I sold it and bought this instead

 

https://www.facebook.com/finnotto.krogsen/videos/1336659009695871/

 

 

This is way above most people budget. And a Gladiator stick give a realistic feel. But it is not in reality. that is my point.

When people complain about realistic FM , they forget that flying planes in 1942 was hard work and very exhausting . Stukapilots was physically trained more than pilot trained just to sustain the force of 9 G pulling out of a dive. Fingertip maneuvering was never a part of WW 2 flying

[Bommel]

Really nice pit you got there, I wish they would offer it with FFB.

[JG27_Chivas]

The MSFB stick IMHO was, and may still be one of the best sticks ever made for plane handling and especially for  putting bullets on target.  Its forcefeedback feature was nice, but that wasn't what made the flight stick so good.   I've bought almost EVERY new joystick to replace my old MSFB joystick, but none of them were as good.   My latest purchase, albeit months ago was the VKB Mark3, which I have high hopes for, but I haven't had enough flight time to make a valid decision on its capabilities.   I'm still waiting for flight sims to finish the beta process of  properly instituting VR support for the Rift before venturing into gaming again.