Battle of Moscow review

[ShamrockOneFive]

Hey folks,

 

I'm not sure if General Discussion is where this belongs (apologies to the mods if its the wrong place) but I thought I would mention that I've decided to have a go at doing a little blogging on PC flight sims including IL-2 (actually its mostly IL-2 and some RoF) and I have published my initial review of Battle of Moscow.

 

https://stormbirds.wordpress.com/2016/05/26/il-2-battle-of-moscow-full-review/

 

I know its not Steam official yet but 2.001 is pretty much as official as it will be. I'm also going to assume that development won't stop with the release of BoM and that the series will continue. So really... this review is a kind of snapshot of the way that things are currently.

 

For me there is a lot to like but everyone is, of course, free to disagree

 

Let me know what you think.

[pilotpierre]

I think it is a very fair and accurate appraisal. One green arrow coming up.

Edited May 27, 2016 by pilotpierre

[seafireliv]

Seemed a very fair and honest review to me. Explains the good and bad and the neutrals.

[Rjel]

Solid review. Well written, IMO.

[SAG]

I mostly agree with your review 

 

i would just take away a point in the graphics department since the draw distance "bubble" cant be turned up enough to see buildings for high level bombing

[SCG_Neun]

Good job!

[Pharoah]

Fair review (only spotted two grammatical errors you might want to fix) although I think your 6.5 for the SP campaign is mighty generous esp when you give examples which make the experience quite frustrating - I'd suggest 5 or lower but that's my opinion. I'm thinking from the point of someone who hasn't flown IL2 before (or just came across from IL2 1946) - they would certainly be disappointed. Can't argue with the other stuff (MP, graphics, etc) though.

[ShamrockOneFive]

Fair review (only spotted two grammatical errors you might want to fix) although I think your 6.5 for the SP campaign is mighty generous esp when you give examples which make the experience quite frustrating - I'd suggest 5 or lower but that's my opinion. I'm thinking from the point of someone who hasn't flown IL2 before (or just came across from IL2 1946) - they would certainly be disappointed. Can't argue with the other stuff (MP, graphics, etc) though.

 

Dang... Where are those grammatical errors? I did three read thoughts and missed them each time. :D

 

I actually like the SP campaign and I really appreciate the design ethos behind it which I know not everyone does. That said, it is lacking in several ways and I hope it gets better in the future. I may write a future blog post specifically on the 10 things that I don't like and constructively how they might be improved. I have hope that stuff will improve with development time!

Edited May 27, 2016 by ShamrockOneFive

[CUJO_1970]

Dang... Where are those grammatical errors? I did three read thoughts and missed them each time. :D

 

 

 

 

Above the picture of the P-40 it says "The premium aircraft are a mixed back..." (should be mixed bag?)

 

Anyway - writing is not easy at all - I enjoyed your review!

[ShamrockOneFive]

Above the picture of the P-40 it says "The premium aircraft are a mixed back..." (should be mixed bag?)

 

Anyway - writing is not easy at all - I enjoyed your review!

 

Updated! Thanks!

 

I like writing and this is blog is a good way for me to write a bunch plus it gives me an excuse to post all of the screen shots I take

[pilotpierre]

Dang... Where are those grammatical errors? I did three read thoughts and missed them each time. :D!

I spotted a couple too but I can't remember what they were. But don't sweat it, you can proof read your own writings several times without picking up your own errors.

 

It pays to get somewun else to prof reed four yu (provided they was ederadicated in a generation were speling, punctuation and grandma was important)

Edited May 27, 2016 by pilotpierre

[Pharoah]

Above the picture of the P-40 it says "The premium aircraft are a mixed back..." (should be mixed bag?)

 

Anyway - writing is not easy at all - I enjoyed your review!

 

yeah sorry mate (Shamrock), I did try and look for them again but got lazy (was lunchtime!). The above is one...the other I can't remember I'm sorry (its there and similar to the above) but I wouldn't worry too much about it. Its well written.

[ShamrockOneFive]

I spotted a couple too but I can't remember what they were. But don't sweat it, you can proof read your own writings several times without picking up your own errors.

 

It pays to get somewun else to prof reed four yu (provided they was ederadicated in a generation were speling, punctuation and grandma was important)

That's always the worst thing about proofreading your own stuff... you  can read over it easily without noticing the error. Good ole ederadication

 

yeah sorry mate (Shamrock), I did try and look for them again but got lazy (was lunchtime!). The above is one...the other I can't remember I'm sorry (its there and similar to the above) but I wouldn't worry too much about it. Its well written.

 

No worries. I'm a stickler for finding these things Thanks though! I appreciate the positive comments all around!

 

I did aim to be as fair and balanced as possible. I love the series and I think it has phenomenal potential and its already something that is quite good.

[Guest deleted@50488]

Nice review.

 

I use il-2 BoS / BoM just for the unique pleasure of profiting from what I consider the Best Flight Dynamics in ANY flight simulator I ever used, including DCS World.

 

It's true that il2 does not have the immersion / depth of systems interaction ( not necessarily modeling, because most of it is still there even if we can't directly interact through clicks... ) of a DCS modules or an A2A prop in FSX, the feel of flight, actually the whole physics modeling, from the ground to the upper Angels is UNIQUE in this tittle, and although I hate using it as a combat sim, because I hate War and playing any sort of War games, I use it whenever I need to feel as close as possible to flying, like I can't in any of the other sims I used...

 

There are times when IL2 is the only sim installed on my rig.

[=FEW=Hauggy]

I don't understand why everybody is comparing this game to DCS... this game has many many things that enhance immersion while DCS is just 3 poor ww2 warbirds that cost a fortune on ww3 maps.

The planes flight models might be nice and stuff but imo it's overpriced and there is no immersion and content, they should stick with Jet fighters if they can't make proper maps and so on to make their game worth something.

All that to say it's like comparing apples and oranges.

Personally I prefer the full experience over the button pushing simulator that cost a fortune and looks dated, it's just day and night.

Edited May 27, 2016 by 4./JG52_Hauggy_

[LLv24_Zami]

Nice and fair review!

 

I would not change anything, you nailed it.

[Elem]

Dang... Where are those grammatical errors? I did three read thoughts and missed them each time. :D

 

I actually like the SP campaign and I really appreciate the design ethos behind it which I know not everyone does. That said, it is lacking in several ways and I hope it gets better in the future. I may write a future blog post specifically on the 10 things that I don't like and constructively how they might be improved. I have hope that stuff will improve with development time!

A good review, and I generally agree with all, but here's one error in your post. I think you mean 'through'.

[Lusekofte]

I liked your review, but you are way to kind with the points. I dont think there are any modern WW2 simulators out there able to score more than 6

 

My one and only problem with this game is that they continued the original plan of IL 2 sturmovik and did not take this to the next level , making it more a simulator.

In other words, I do not agree with the developers ambitions for this game

That said , in my opinion they earned the right to call it a true successor of IL 2, they have done their job excellent. 

But is it only me that get the feeling this could have been so much more? I realize that in many aspects you can evolve as a simpilot for a long time, but for a bomber pilot , not so.

I hardly miss anything at level bombing anymore, not even in DED server where you do not know where the target is. As a bomber pilot you are left with events to keep it going. I would not fly this game if it was not for the FNBF events.

When you learned accurate non GPS navigating and setting wind strength and directions , you have reach the peak of your career.

This is why I migrated to DCS, that sim offer you endless frustration and hair tearing lessons. And you can stay entertained offline for years, and never fully be experienced .

I hope this game get a full real complexity mode at some point, it is not a critique to the developers, I respect their choise and I will buy all their patches . Because I think they deserve success. It is just not my cup of tea anymore

[HotPursuit]

Well written review.

 

Here are two errors I spotted.

 

 

......go forward with the series into the next battle and that we would lose the opportunity to fly some iconic earlier types.

 

 

They would add variety above and beyond the current 10 types in Moscow and 20 types overall.

[Albino]

Good review Shamrock!

 

Thanks for drawing attention to your blog. It's a nice place to highlight news and speculation from the community without all the back and forth that you sometimes find on the forum

 

Regards

Albino

[keeno]

In my opinion,

 

a very fair review of the game as it is now, I enjoyed reading it and agree on most if not all points.

 

Well done.

 

 

Cheers

[mb339pan]

review a little 'too permissive
 

Graphics: the external effects are good, (missing the rain does not put on the glass), some poor textures and cockpit are lower by CLOD
visible damage very improvable: Vote 78

 

Flying, Sound, and Simulation Fidelity: some weirdness on aircraft still to be fixed (jumping), but in very good overall, g effects a lot of improvement, impact sounds be reviewed again, rough plane skin: vote 80

 

Single Player: no charisma, unlock system is boring, bombsight lock's like WT: vote 60

 

multiplayer: complexity of the mission builder brake the expansion of the game, unlock system is boring, Bombsight lock's like WT, no dynamic campain, no coop, currently the Moscow map is unused vote 72

Edited May 27, 2016 by 150GCT_Pan

[Jade_Monkey]

Nice review!

 

I do agree with the overall score. Its a step in the right direction with respect to BOS (at launch) and the fact that a lot of improvements are also retroactive makes them even better.

 

I think something that wasnt mentioned was the community made missions and skins as well as PWCG and other third party tools.

 

The ability to host your own server and the full mission editor are big pluses, while the lack of mods can be missed by some (although i do understand the reasoning behind the decision).

Bombsight lock's like WT

What do you mean by that? I dont have a lot of experience with WT.

 

Are you referring to the autolevel?

Edited May 27, 2016 by Jade_Monkey

[ShamrockOneFive]

I don't understand why everybody is comparing this game to DCS... this game has many many things that enhance immersion while DCS is just 3 poor ww2 warbirds that cost a fortune on ww3 maps.

The planes flight models might be nice and stuff but imo it's overpriced and there is no immersion and content, they should stick with Jet fighters if they can't make proper maps and so on to make their game worth something.

All that to say it's like comparing apples and oranges.

Personally I prefer the full experience over the button pushing simulator that cost a fortune and looks dated, it's just day and night.

 

For my part I use DCS as a point of comparison as its a modern product and there really aren't too many other products in the business that we can compare to. They are quite different and the DCS model isn't the IL-2 model but they are both modern flight sim products.

 

A good review, and I generally agree with all, but here's one error in your post. I think you mean 'through'.

 

You're killing me! :D

 

I liked your review, but you are way to kind with the points. I dont think there are any modern WW2 simulators out there able to score more than 6

 

My one and only problem with this game is that they continued the original plan of IL 2 sturmovik and did not take this to the next level , making it more a simulator.

In other words, I do not agree with the developers ambitions for this game

That said , in my opinion they earned the right to call it a true successor of IL 2, they have done their job excellent. 

But is it only me that get the feeling this could have been so much more? I realize that in many aspects you can evolve as a simpilot for a long time, but for a bomber pilot , not so.

I hardly miss anything at level bombing anymore, not even in DED server where you do not know where the target is. As a bomber pilot you are left with events to keep it going. I would not fly this game if it was not for the FNBF events.

When you learned accurate non GPS navigating and setting wind strength and directions , you have reach the peak of your career.

This is why I migrated to DCS, that sim offer you endless frustration and hair tearing lessons. And you can stay entertained offline for years, and never fully be experienced .

I hope this game get a full real complexity mode at some point, it is not a critique to the developers, I respect their choise and I will buy all their patches . Because I think they deserve success. It is just not my cup of tea anymore

 

I can appreciate wanting that attention to detail but you may be in the minority group of flight sim pilots within a niche genre. Congratulations! For me I'm still having a great deal of difficulty being accurate or even useful level bombing so I suspect the challenge will continue and I find low level ground strikes in the IL-2 and Bf110 more interesting anyways - probably more dangerous and less clinical than the level bombing missions. I think there has to be a balance between just how much fidelity you cram in and how much of the audience will appreciate it.

 

We're at a high level here but it could be higher of course.

 

Well written review.

 

Here are two errors I spotted.

 

 

......go forward with the series into the next battle and that we would lose the opportunity to fly some iconic earlier types.

 

 

They would add variety above and beyond the current 10 types in Moscow and 20 types overall.

 

Cheers! I will edit those tonight!

Nice review!

 

I do agree with the overall score. Its a step in the right direction with respect to BOS (at launch) and the fact that a lot of improvements are also retroactive makes them even better.

 

I think something that wasnt mentioned was the community made missions and skins as well as PWCG and other third party tools.

 

The ability to host your own server and the full mission editor are big pluses, while the lack of mods can be missed by some (although i do understand the reasoning behind the decision).

 

 

Good points about the community made missions and PWCG. I don't have a lot of experience with those but I should mention them. Or even write another blog post sometime.

[wtornado]

Good review pretty straightforward.

 

Quoting:

 

''The second generation IL-2 has struggled to attract the kinds of servers and player numbers that truly make a thriving healthy community.''.

 

And we all know why ,where,how and what will be don't we?

 

''In part that is the slow pickup among players of the new series.''

 

 

Slowest pickup ever.

Edited May 27, 2016 by WTornado

[74_jim_nihilist]

That said , in my opinion they earned the right to call it a true successor of IL 2, they have done their job excellent. 

But is it only me that get the feeling this could have been so much more?

 

They did.

 

I come from a different angle, but I have to say yes. For me it is like to have a Porsche, but I can only drive it in a parking lot. All is great, but the content is lacking.

 

The review is spot on in this regard.

Edited May 27, 2016 by 74_jim_nihilist

[Scarecrow]

Completely "bang on" my views on this new title. What you said about the lack of AI type variety is so correct, that mere fact itself produces so much of the sterility in the SP campaign.

 

I wish the devs had spent a bit of time on fleshing out the AI plane-set a bit instead of tanks.

[ShamrockOneFive]

Completely "bang on" my views on this new title. What you said about the lack of AI type variety is so correct, that mere fact itself produces so much of the sterility in the SP campaign.

 

I wish the devs had spent a bit of time on fleshing out the AI plane-set a bit instead of tanks.

 

Thanks! Having some more of the liaison/transport types would be great to have as a kind of added scenery. I know its not super easy for them but hopefully they will do a few more at some point.

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

Nice review, looking forward to the next one

[LLv44_Damixu]

Very well written review and splendid analysis of cons and pros of this fine simulation. Jood job ShamrockOneFive!  

[Mac_Messer]

You failed to translate your 8,5 note feelings for this game. Everything in this review sounds and reads like a note not higher than 6,5-7,0.

[LLv24_Zami]

You failed to translate your 8,5 note

feelings for this game. Everything in this review sounds and reads like a note not higher than 6,5-7,0.

I disagree.

 

Well, who is right?

[ShamrockOneFive]

You failed to translate your 8,5 note feelings for this game. Everything in this review sounds and reads like a note not higher than 6,5-7,0.

 

Translate? So my overall rating is not an average of the ratings in each category. Some reviewers do that and other reviewers don't and my philosophy is that you can rate each individual section accordingly but then there is also an overall feeling on not just a single section but the entire thing. I didn't use a complex rubric if that's what you're asking for

 

I think the IL-2 series is fantastic and BoM is everything BoS was and better. There are some issues that you can see I'm critical of (and I hope to see improvements on in the future) but that doesn't take away from my overall enjoyment or my rating. Some of the key things about this for me are the feeling of flight, how good everything looks, overall performance and the man/machine interface and I don't think anyone does it better. Maybe I need to say that more explicitly?

 

You are, quite rightly so, able to rate differently according to your thoughts and feelings. Everyone is going to bring their own perspective to how they feel about this. I think enough of us like what we see to be very excited for what comes next!

[ShamrockOneFive]

Very well written review and splendid analysis of cons and pros of this fine simulation. Jood job ShamrockOneFive!

 

Thanks! My aim was to balance the stuff that is excellent with the stuff that needs work. If someone is on the fence then I'm trying to provide as evenly balanced a review as I can. If anyone asks me straight out if they should get it... Yeah, absolutely. Its the most fun I've had with a sim in a long time.

[Jade_Monkey]

Translate? So my overall rating is not an average of the ratings in each category. Some reviewers do that and other reviewers don't and my philosophy is that you can rate each individual section accordingly but then there is also an overall feeling on not just a single section but the entire thing. I didn't use a complex rubric if that's what you're asking for

 

I think the IL-2 series is fantastic and BoM is everything BoS was and better. There are some issues that you can see I'm critical of (and I hope to see improvements on in the future) but that doesn't take away from my overall enjoyment or my rating. Some of the key things about this for me are the feeling of flight, how good everything looks, overall performance and the man/machine interface and I don't think anyone does it better. Maybe I need to say that more explicitly?

 

You are, quite rightly so, able to rate differently according to your thoughts and feelings. Everyone is going to bring their own perspective to how they feel about this. I think enough of us like what we see to be very excited for what comes next!

I think that by "translate" he meant that after reading your review he wouldnt expect you to give it a 8.5 based on your words. Like you didnt sound as excited avout BOM?

 

I could be wrong though.

[ShamrockOneFive]

I think that by "translate" he meant that after reading your review he wouldnt expect you to give it a 8.5 based on your words. Like you didnt sound as excited avout BOM?

 

I could be wrong though.

 

Maybe? I did a re-read and it does sound more critical than I thought it sounded. I may do an edit.

[KoN_]

I don't understand why everybody is comparing this game to DCS... this game has many many things that enhance immersion while DCS is just 3 poor ww2 warbirds that cost a fortune on ww3 maps.

The planes flight models might be nice and stuff but imo it's overpriced and there is no immersion and content, they should stick with Jet fighters if they can't make proper maps and so on to make their game worth something.

All that to say it's like comparing apples and oranges.

Personally I prefer the full experience over the button pushing simulator that cost a fortune and looks dated, it's just day and night.

Even though i agree that things are over priced in DCS ......... but so is BOM . The Campaign is the same as BOS with the unlocks . I dont see any change here in the campaign , its just a frustrated mix bag of missions . 

I know loads of people waiting for the sales for BOM . 

And DCS graphics are stunning .

When i look outside my cockpit in my F4, zoomed out .   i see a blurry mess in summer maps ,  sorry guys has to be said  .

You cant even spot ground or air targets against the back ground in BOS maps ,  but not tried BOM yet  , so i am hoping for a change . Just saying it as it is .

Oh and before some of you start trying too slat me , i don`t see half of you flying on line in servers ,

I put a lot  time and effort into this game .

Edited May 29, 2016 by II./JG77_Con

[Lusekofte]

It might have been me bringing in DCS into this, but I did not compare it. In DCS every module you buy got its own campaign , mission and qmb. In other words you get a BOS for every module. 

But that was not my point, my point was that if you are not into online dogfighting dogfighting , there is not much of a challenge. But as I said, FNBF keeps me flying

[LLv24_Zami]

Even though i agree that things are over priced in DCS ......... but so is BOM . The Campaign is the same as BOS with the unlocks . I dont see any change here in the campaign , its just a frustrated mix bag of missions . 

I know loads of people waiting for the sales for BOM . 

And DCS graphics are stunning .

When i look outside my cockpit in my F4, zoomed out .   i see a blurry mess in summer maps ,  sorry guys has to be said  .

You cant even spot ground or air targets against the back ground in BOS maps ,  but not tried BOM yet  , so i am hoping for a change . Just saying it as it is .

Oh and before some of you start trying too slat me , i don`t see half of you flying on line in servers ,

I put a lot  time and effort into this game .

What does the playing online have to do with anything?

 

I play 99% offline. 

[Guest deleted@50488]

And the flight dynamics and overall physics modeling + damage model + maps that represent the correct historical period ?  Isn't all of this better in il2 BoS / BoM ? 

 

I honetsly think it is!  DCS is great for the modern jet fighters and the helicopters...