Ju-88 Discussion/Tips-and-tricks

[BSS_Sniper]

Maybe when the 88 comes out people will stop "war thundering" with the 111's and actually use them to level bomb instead of dive bombing with them.

[ShamrockOneFive]

I did not say the PE 2 is bad, I said the HE 111, JU 88, Ju 87 and 110 totally outmatch the IL 2 and PE 2. Say it is not so.

I say to balance things a level bomber on Russian side is in order. Nothing else

 

Ok, but let's address the outmatch issue because I see it rather as the opposite. The Pe-2 and IL-2 being the most efficient bomber/dive bomber and attacker respectively. The Bf110 and Ju88 at least make things a little more even in my mind. What the Germans do have is the big bombs on the He111 and Ju87 but both are easier to intercept.

 

The second part of your statement I can get behind. A Russian level bomber would be nice in the future and the IL-4 would be ideal (also being a torpedo bomber).

[6./ZG26_5tuka]

Russian level bomber development lacked behind in the late 30s and even early 40s. Their arsenal mainly consisted of long range and multi purpose aircraft like the SB-2, DB-3 and IL-4, which did have respectible range (IL-4s flew raids against Berlin very early with mild sucess) but also many drawbacks. Thei're bomb capacity, crew compartment and defensive armarment and last but not least flight characteristics were lacking.

 

Peshkas were probably among the most effective utilized bombers at the frontlines even though soviet pilots were very inexpirienced with dive bombing and devloped some rather strange methods.

 

The first noteworthy improvements were made with the IL-6 (refined version of the IL-4, although only produced in low numbers) and Yer-2 series. But they came as late as 1943+ if I'm not mistaken.

 

So it's not as easy as to say they should balance out the field given the lacking equipment the russian airforce had at the time. The Pe-2 may be disappoiting as a level bomber (and I never really use it in that role) but has unique strenghs over the slow, sluggish 111. A groop of Pe-2 acting like a wolf pack can have devastating effect.

Edited March 1, 2016 by Stab/JG26_5tuka

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

Pilots actually loved the handling of the Il-4 because it was pretty nimble, despite its decidedly low speed.

 

The Yermolayev Yer-2 was actually flying since the beginning of the war in 1941, but its production numbers were never exactly high because tactical bombing was needed way more than long-range strategic in the Eastern Front.

 

LuseKofte, if it serves as consolation if you take FNBF as an example the VVS Pe-2s and Il-2s always deal more devastating ground blows than the Heinkels.

[6./ZG26_McKvack]

are you threatening me? I don't know MK_Turbo and i don't see the problem with saying the truth. I don't value your opinion, what's wrong with that?

 

I am not the guy who likes getting into arguments however I agree with you Asgar. As a moderator, your job is not to threat or just act like a c*nt towards people like I have seen Luke done many times before.

 

Completely unprofessional. 

 

7. Comments containing profanity, personal insults, accusations of cheating, excessive rudeness, vulgarity, drug propaganda, political and religious discussion and propaganda, all manifestations of Nazism and racist statements, calls to overthrow governments by force, inciting ethnic hatred, humiliation of persons of a particular gender, sexual orientation or religion are not allowed and will result in a ban.

Violations of this rule will result in the following:

 

First offense - 3 days ban on entry

[Asgar]

Luke is not a moderator. he's a tester, a player who gets to play new builds early (like beta tests of planes) and who is supposed to give constructive feedback to the devs 

edit: typo

Edited March 1, 2016 by I./JG3_Asgar

[6./ZG26_McKvack]

Luke is not a moderator. he's a tester, a player who gets to play new builds early (like beta tests of planes) and who is supposed to give constructive feedback to the devs 

 

edit: typo

That makes it even worse. A tester who acts like he's a dictator 

Edited March 1, 2016 by 6./ZG26_McKvack

[LukeFF]

Luke is not a moderator. he's a tester, a player who gets to play new builds early (like beta tests of planes) and who is supposed to give constructive feedback to the devs 

 

edit: typo

 

Yes, and if I want to call you out for making nonsense statements, I will. 

[Lusekofte]

Ok, but let's address the outmatch issue because I see it rather as the opposite. The Pe-2 and IL-2 being the most efficient bomber/dive bomber and attacker respectively. The Bf110 and Ju88 at least make things a little more even in my mind. What the Germans do have is the big bombs on the He111 and Ju87 but both are easier to intercept.

 

The second part of your statement I can get behind. A Russian level bomber would be nice in the future and the IL-4 would be ideal (also being a torpedo bomber).

 

 

I fly PE 2 99 % of the time, and I agree with you. In a pure BOM environment The balance is good. I do not oppose the add of JU 88, I just wish for a Level bomber on Russian side  

[Asgar]

Yes, and if I want to call you out for making nonsense statements, I will. 

blablabla here we go again

[Lusekofte]

Well Asgar and Luke at some point there is best to let things go,

But Asgar what did you mean by giving critique for a plane not released yet?

Personally I think it is the developers right to choose armament. While the cannons may have been tested on a JU 88 in time for BOM it was not fitted with those serving, or there is absolutely no record of a JU 88 armed with it at this early stage, if we get later theaters I think you will see more versions of this plane.

[ShamrockOneFive]

I fly PE 2 99 % of the time, and I agree with you. In a pure BOM environment The balance is good. I do not oppose the add of JU 88, I just wish for a Level bomber on Russian side

 

Sounds good to me! When TD finally added a flyable IL-4 to IL-2 1946 I spent ages flying it around. It's a ton of fun especially with the heavier (though performance sapping) loadouts. It works great as a torpedo bomber too.

[6./ZG26_5tuka]

We have the Ju-87 G-1 (1943) configuration for the Stuka and the Fw-190 in BoS (not present at said time period). That should be evident enought to show that the devs rank playability/gameplay over historical accurancy (at least in terms of aircraft equipment).

 

Han commented on the MGFF nose mounted cannon that this required the removal of the bombsight which would be too time consuming to implement ingame.

 

As for the already existing MG81Z "Gießkanne" gunpods nothing has been said apprently although it should be an easy to implement upgrade. Time definetly isn't an issue here.

 

To me it seems to be less a sign of lazyness but more an attempt to press the Ju-88 into a sole level bomber role despite it's great variety of tasks it could fulfill in reality. 

Edited March 1, 2016 by Stab/JG26_5tuka

[6./ZG26_Custard]

Maybe when the 88 comes out people will stop "war thundering" with the 111's and actually use them to level bomb instead of dive bombing with them.

I tend to agree with you but in defence of the dive bombing 111's it's almost pointless carrying out level bombing missions on dogfight servers. You spend 30 minutes climbing just for the map to rotate or even better still the glaring target icons are like magnets for opportunists to circle around waiting for those big old bombers and a cheap  kill to increase the stats. Oh and did I mention the flak, its lethal particularly to the wings of a 110 it's like they are made of glass    

[Jade_Monkey]

Yes, and if I want to call you out for making nonsense statements, I will.

Calling people out and keeping good manners is not mutually exclusive.

 

This is getting out of hand.

[6./ZG26_Custard]

 

 

This is getting out of hand.

 

 

[6./ZG26_McKvack]

As for the already existing MG81Z "Gießkanne" gunpods nothing has been said apprently although it should be an easy to implement upgrade. Time definetly isn't an issue here.

 

Yea this. Sure about the other modifications but we should get the 81Z pod at least 

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

I tend to agree with you but in defence of the dive bombing 111's it's almost pointless carrying out level bombing missions on dogfight servers. You spend 30 minutes climbing just for the map to rotate or even better still the glaring target icons are like magnets for opportunists to circle around waiting for those big old bombers and a cheap kill to increase the stats.

Not to mention that in the Eastern Front the He-111, Ju-88 and Do-217 did a decent amount of medium to low tactical level bombing.

[Monostripezebra]

on a sidenote.. I´m always amazed at the amount of engineering in war. For the late Ju-88 there was an mechanical balistic computer to enable low visibility attack in low level flight with maximal standoff distance (toss-bombing I think it is called in anglo terms)

 

unfortunately german only: http://www.deutscheluftwaffe.de/archiv/Dokumente/ABC/b/Beobachtungsgereate/TSA/TSA%202/TSA%202.html

 

 

also noteworthy is the de-icing system in the early Ju-88s which was one of the most practical for it´s time. Hot air ducts inside on the leading edge and rubber boots on the tail. With the A-series the props get de-icing, too... with the A4 beeing the variant with another de-icing rework, that included new prop de-icing and experiementing with de-icing for weapon systems.  When you look at the artic war on the convoys, you see why it was such a plane of choice in the most harsh conditions.

 

 

 

Just as another sidenote: the A4 variant with a reworked tail was empirically flown by the Flugerprobungsgruppe into 700km/h dives without problems.. which is amazing for such a huge plane, with the A1 standard the permissable load factor for the wings was raised to 10g and also with the A1 series the dive automation was introduced (retained in the A4 variant, which was basically a further improvement of the A1)

Edited March 1, 2016 by Dr_Zeebra

[6./ZG26_Gielow]

blablabla here we go again

Don't worry Asgar. Must be difficult for an ex low level rank military to think by himself, so He come here playing the Sargent to compensate his boot camp traumas with the blessing of who should moderate everyone. This is a classic George Orwell situation“All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others."

 

That's why this forum goes out of control frequently because those two groups lack users respect and credibility.

 

7. Comments containing profanity, personal insults, accusations of cheating, excessive rudeness, vulgarity, drug propaganda, political and religious discussion and propaganda, all manifestations of Nazism and racist statements, calls to overthrow governments by force, inciting ethnic hatred, humiliation of persons of a particular gender, sexual orientation or religion are not allowed and will result in a ban.

 

Violations of this rule will result in the following:

 Second offense - 7 days of the ban on entry

Edited March 2, 2016 by BlackSix

[Dutchvdm]

I think the for the A4 version we are getting the basic options are just fine. If the next installment of Il2 is going to be Kuban or Crimea then an extra Ju-88 can be added in the form of the C6 version. 

 

Grt M

[Asgar]

the Ju-88 A-4 was used till the end of the war and was fitted with tons of equipment. what we need is not more Ju-88s, but modifications for the one we get. I don't want Ju-88 A-4 (1941), (1942),(1943),(1944). sure, would be a easy way to fill the line-up, but instead we could have more modification on the ONE ju-88 A-4 we get and fill the line-up with Me 410, Do 217, He 177 and other planes

Edited March 2, 2016 by I./JG3_Asgar

[Matt]

Yea this. Sure about the other modifications but we should get the 81Z pod at least

For doing what exactly? Just curious. Only use I could think of is strafing infantry, which basically doesn't exist in BoS. I would rather have a Stuvi, that would really be useful at least.

[Lusekofte]

I fly PE 2 mostly, and I find the fixed guns quite satisfying to have, not that I use them very much since I fly levelbombing if I got targets noticeable from high altitude. I survive a lot more staying at altitude in non GPS servers. 

Flying low with a cannon in a big aircraft is not a good idea over a target. It is over the target most fighters tend to camp. I think soon enough people find that dive bombing at least give you a chance to reach the target.

I would not mind a Suvi or mg + 20 mm in front of a JU 88, I think if this sim survive and not implode due to the constant conflict and whining going on. We might see a development in JU 88 armament.

Aggressive approach here tend to denied that option more than helping

Edited March 2, 2016 by EG14_LuseKofte

[6./ZG26_5tuka]

For doing what exactly? Just curious. Only use I could think of is strafing infantry, which basically doesn't exist in BoS. I would rather have a Stuvi, that would really be useful at least.

Let's see, we have:

 

- light boats

- trucks

- artillery

- AAA

- airfields with lots of soft targets

 

8 MG81 might come in very handy for this even though I agree it's pointless outside CAS against soft targets.

Edited March 2, 2016 by Stab/JG26_5tuka

[Asgar]

and maybe dive on a Pe-2 once or twice in a lifetime 

[LuftManu]

Do I need to remind you what happened to MK_Turbo when he made similar statements? So yes, knock it off already. The plane isn't even out yet, and you're already panning it. 

Well, I think he can share his opinion, maybe in another way, more towards the rules of the forum would be better. For me it would be (I hope the Devs expend more time on adding more capabilities on the planes of BOM, that would add some new content)

but this statement is like:

 

Don`t you remember what we do to this kind of people? (Looks kinda agressive imho)

Edited March 2, 2016 by ManuV

[Asgar]

little question. in the information the devs posted the 88 A-4 can carry up to 4 500kg bombs. the schematic 5tuka posted say 4x 500 + 2 250 is possible.  (but it says it's for A-1 and A-5). On some other sites online i read the A-4 could carry 6 500kg bombs as 3000kg configuration as well as 2 1000kg + 2 500. Does anyone have reliable information if that was actually possible?

 

i read again and again that 3000kg is the max bomb load for the Ju-88 but in game ~ 2000-2400kg seems to be the maximums we get

Edited March 19, 2016 by 6./ZG26_Asgar

[LukeFF]

2800 kg is the max bomb load the BoM Ju 88 can carry (1 SC1800 & 1 SC1000). Max sure you have plenty of room for your takeoff run with that one.

[Asgar]

i can imagine :D thanks for the answer

[Gunsmith86]

Isn´t there a load with 28x SC50 and 6x SC 250 = total of 2900kg ?

 

The most the manual of the A4 permitted is 3000 kg but there was only two combination that had 3000kg (loadout number 7 2x1000kg+2x500kg and number 9 2x1000 mine and 2x500kg mine ) all others were 2900 or less.

 

 

 

loads of more than 2000kg were marked as "overload" and needed a special order to be carried.

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

Personally most of the flights I make online are either armed recce, point defense or escort. Not the stats type either, and if I manage to chase a bomber or fighter away from the target I am protecting I am happy enough. From experience if you make it clear you are not letting up a lot of people turn around and RTB.

[6./ZG26_Custard]

I generally feel the objective of fighters IS to shoot down the opposition's bombers

I'm not disagreeing with you on that point but the "problem" for me is on dogfight servers. It's almost pointless to level bomb because the targets are just static and are the same all the time. After you have taken 20 minutes to climb to 5K to carry out your level bomb run the opportunists just know you will be there. I tip my hat to the people prepared to escort. I don't think I have seen a large VVS level bombing raid carried out to date on any DF server. The reason, I assume is that many of the VVS aircraft set are very well suited to low level ground attack.

 

I'm not knocking fighter escorts or am I worried about being shot down but in my own view its fairly pointless level bombing in a DF server like WL. Here is hoping the 88 mixes things up a bit.

Edited March 22, 2016 by 6./ZG26_Custard

[Monostripezebra]

I think it would be awesome to see more mods for the 88.. and crew switching positions.. after all that was kind of the idea behind the "Kampfkopf"

 

 

 

shouldn´t those linsenlafetten theoretically rotate for better fields of fire and be able to manned by 2 at the same time?

[III/JG2Gustav05]

well...i'd say that makes it even worse...seems like the devs don't want to invest too much work in the new planes anymore. no MG 131, no 20mm no Stuvi...nothing. and the Ju-88 needs the stuvi for effective dive bombing since it can't bomb at 90° dive. i think the maximum allowed angle is 55-60°?

 

edit: all these statements were made by Han in the Q&A thread

 

is this better? 

Just want to share sth interesting, According to Ju88 pilots' memories on east front, they dived the ju88 at 70° in a lot cases even though the allowable angle is 50-60°.

[SOLIDKREATE]

So I saw angle indicators on the pilot port windscreen. Does this mean I can treat this magnificent beast like a Stuka and dive bomb! 

 

 

I really enjoy flying this plane! I feel like God flying around in it. I feel like nothing can kill me. I dropped my whole load on an airbase and it was glorious!

Edited April 1, 2016 by 6./ZG1=SPEKTRE76

[6./ZG26_McKvack]

Is it just me or do the MG81s overheat quite fast? I have no idea about it but it feels really fast 

[Asgar]

yeah they overheat quite fast. but i have no idea if that's realistic or if it's too fast

[1./ZG1_ElHadji]

So I saw angle indicators on the pilot port windscreen. Does this mean I can treat this magnificent beast like a Stuka and dive bomb! 

 

 

I really enjoy flying this plane! I feel like God flying around in it. I feel like nothing can kill me. I dropped my whole load on an airbase and it was glorious!

 

It was orginally designed for horisontal bombing but Udet and Jeschonnek decided it should be used for dive attacks as well and the structure was strengthened at the cost of speed. Some argued that this ruined the original Ju 88 concept. It can't dive as steep as the Ju 87 of course, but it can dive.

 

[YoYo]

but it can dive.

 

 

 

For sure: (0:58)