How to fly the Lagg 3 Well ?

[jaydee]

I know a lot of guys are itcin to fly the 109 but Ive decided to "learn" the Lagg !  Ive been usin IL2 to practice against F4's.I have been getting hammered unless I get a lucky shot ! The 109 climbs better,dives faster, and can match my turns,its faster straight and level, as well as being well armed !

Any tactics or "Tips" would be appreciated ! ~S~

[Cybermat47]

The LaGG is better as a bomber interceptor.

Edited November 16, 2013 by Cybermat47

[FlatSpinMan]

You are clearly not über enough. My advice would be to take immediate steps to advance your überosity rating before the game comes out.

First I'd suggest attacking only from the high six.

Second I'd like to add that you shoulld have a sexy paint scheme - preferably with mottling and your girlfriends' name written in a heart below the cockpit.

Finally I'd suggest you just generally try to be more über in your daily life. A little bit of überosity eating your morning yoghurt every day translates to a significant increase in general überosity levels.

[=38=Tatarenko]

Gun them in the face!

 

You'll have the option to upgrade to the 23mm and 37mm cannon.

 

Oh, and don't get sucked into a flat turn at low level. The LaGG didn't get slats until s35.

 

Basically - shoot Stukas instead. If we can trade 1 LaGG v 1 Stuka they lose twice the crew and we save our troops. 1 LaGG v 2 Stukas and we are well ahead.

[SOLIDKREATE]

I know a lot of guys are itcin to fly the 109 but Ive decided to "learn" the Lagg !  Ive been usin IL2 to practice against F4's.I have been getting hammered unless I get a lucky shot ! The 109 climbs better,dives faster, and can match my turns,its faster straight and level, as well as being well armed !

Any tactics or "Tips" would be appreciated ! ~S~

 

That's because this is not War Thunder.

[Finkeren]

Disclaimer: Don't take the old IL2 as indicative of how planes will perform in BoS. This is going to be an entirely different beast with a completely different and much more detailed flight model.

 

There is no question, that the LaGG-3 is significantly inferior to the Bf-109F and G. In BoS we'll fly the LaGG in a "series 29" configuration, which is good news compared to the early overloaded series, but it's still a far cry from the late 1943 production, which finally put the LaGG on par with the 109 just before production was terminated.

 

Basically there are only a handful of minor things, and one big thing, that work in the LaGGs favor:

 

1. Cockpit view should be slightly better. All other things being equal,  it should be somewhat easier to sneak up on a 109.

 

2. Down low the Bf-109 only has a minor advantage in speed. If you can get him down low, you even the playing field somewhat.

 

3. The pleasant low speed handling of the 109 with its automatic slats and gentle stall characteristics might tempt rookie German pilots to turn too much, burn a lot of energy and end up low and slow. On the other hand LaGG pilots will have to fly with dicipline just to stay in the air and will be less tempted to needlessly burn energy. It doesn't matter how much better the 109 is on paper, if he ends up on the deck at an energy disadvantage, his ass is yours.

 

4. The LaGG is a sturdy beast, and only the 20mm shells of the 109 is going to have a devastating effect on its structure.

 

5. Even though the armament of the LaGG seems rather pitiful, both the ShVAK and the UBS have a very high volume of fire, meaning that you only really need a second on the target to make the kill. Your ammunition supply is small though, and you'll only have 10 - 12 sec of fire, unlike the 109, which can shoot all day.

 

6. And this is the big one: In a historical scenario the Bf 109 is nearly always going to be at a numerical disadvantage. After 1941 the Luftwaffe fought just about all of its battles with fewer numbers than their adversaries. To what extent this will be reflected in BoS is an open question, but in MP it should be pretty straightforward to force a "team inbalance" that reflects the historical reality.

[SYN_Vorlander]

Work as a team

[Karost]

Lagg vs bf 109F

imho

- by concept  to counter energy fighter from B&Z  you have to kill room of  vertical  space  between you and opponent

 

IRFC Requiem  make a very good sample 

 

but key factor is plane speed  IL2 is faster then ROF 2-3 time  (normal and driver speed)

 

hunting 109F (IL2-AI) if you can keep stay at same horizontal level AI will use speed advantage to fly away.

and I drang AI to low level AI has no space and no option

 

but player vs player  is other story.

 

noone know how BOS AI look like

Edited November 16, 2013 by karost

[ATAG_Slipstream]

If you are going to meet an F4 in a LaGG make sure your bail out button is handy.I recommend the trigger button.

[Marrond]

Disclaimer 2:

AI will allways climb better than you - try flying F4 vs LaGG and outcome will be the same (unless you're training online) On the bright side AI is predictable but all you can train with it is aim tbh.

 

That's because this is not War Thunder.

If what you wrote made any sense in regard to topic it would be better. Edited November 16, 2013 by Marrond

[LLv34_Flanker]

S!

 

 Finkeren. I bet LagG-3 is not even remotely as fast as Bf109F-4 down low. Not even La-5 of first series could catch it, barely hit 508km/h with WEP. Scoured various sources and those give maximum speed at sea level around 450km/h (early series) compared to Bf109F-4 having it around 510-530km/h. Kurfürst's page gives 526km/h at 0km. Unless you get a shallow dive on the Bf109F-4 and speed advantage from that there is no way LAgG-3 Series 29 can even catch it, at any altitude. And even if disengaging the Bf109F-4 will outaccelerate the LagG-3 with ease. Only way to get a Bf109F-4 in a LagG-3 is surprise attack or when catching them at landing/take off. But what LagG-3 lacks in performance the guns sure will make shreds of any unwary Bf109F-4. Even the LagG-3 is an underdog will for sure fly it It has certain appeal to it

[JtD]

We're not getting an early series LaGG. Ours will have the 105PF engine, and Yefim Gordon book states: "tests of a LaGG-3 from the 29th batch showed that the fighter weighing 3160 kg attained a speed of 507 km/h at sea level and 573 km/h at 4.200m". That performance is still a bit worse than the 109F-4, but it's at least going to be in the same league.

[Marrond]

That performance is still a bit worse than the 109F-4, but it's at least going to be in the same league.

Well it doesn't change much in regard of LaGG3 being cannon fodder in this dogfight

 

Can't wait for Yak1 though. I really like Yaks. Hopefuly as the game expands we will see my favourite Yak3

[ImPeRaToR]

That's because this is not War Thunder.

Even in Warthunder the 109F-4 is superior to the LaGG3 and Yaks At least it was several months ago when I played it in FRB.

[Blooddawn1942]

, unlike the 109, which can shoot all day.

 

 

 

 

Muahahaha! couldn´t sopt laughing! Thats a great point!   shoot all day...haha....I need to get the tears out of my eyes! great!

[=38=Tatarenko]

Let's face it, our fighters suck compared to theirs, and they have the 190 coming as well to murder our IL-2's.

 

But we will win.

[Bearcat]

Disclaimer: Don't take the old IL2 as indicative of how planes will perform in BoS. This is going to be an entirely different beast with a completely different and much more detailed flight model.

 

There is no question, that the LaGG-3 is significantly inferior to the Bf-109F and G. In BoS we'll fly the LaGG in a "series 29" configuration, which is good news compared to the early overloaded series, but it's still a far cry from the late 1943 production, which finally put the LaGG on par with the 109 just before production was terminated.

 

Basically there are only a handful of minor things, and one big thing, that work in the LaGGs favor:

 

1. Cockpit view should be slightly better. All other things being equal,  it should be somewhat easier to sneak up on a 109.

 

2. Down low the Bf-109 only has a minor advantage in speed. If you can get him down low, you even the playing field somewhat.

 

3. The pleasant low speed handling of the 109 with its automatic slats and gentle stall characteristics might tempt rookie German pilots to turn too much, burn a lot of energy and end up low and slow. On the other hand LaGG pilots will have to fly with dicipline just to stay in the air and will be less tempted to needlessly burn energy. It doesn't matter how much better the 109 is on paper, if he ends up on the deck at an energy disadvantage, his ass is yours.

 

4. The LaGG is a sturdy beast, and only the 20mm shells of the 109 is going to have a devastating effect on its structure.

 

5. Even though the armament of the LaGG seems rather pitiful, both the ShVAK and the UBS have a very high volume of fire, meaning that you only really need a second on the target to make the kill. Your ammunition supply is small though, and you'll only have 10 - 12 sec of fire, unlike the 109, which can shoot all day.

 

6. And this is the big one: In a historical scenario the Bf 109 is nearly always going to be at a numerical disadvantage. After 1941 the Luftwaffe fought just about all of its battles with fewer numbers than their adversaries. To what extent this will be reflected in BoS is an open question, but in MP it should be pretty straightforward to force a "team inbalance" that reflects the historical reality.

 

 

I agree.. in fact if you look at the first few in game videos posted by Loft .. I get the impression that the take off he managed took a lot of practice..

[ImPeRaToR]

 

but in MP it should be pretty straightforward to force a "team inbalance" that reflects the historical reality.

Just had a look at the Warthunder events in FRB, they actually seem to feature uneven team numbers which seems quite the novelty. I don't think uneven or even even teams can currently be enforced in ROF and I doubt it will be possible in BOS - although I'd love to see such a feature in the future.

 

 

In an online war enviroment, you could partially solve this by having a larger signup pool on the Russian side - then again if the Luftwaffe pilots are more active you still don't really have control over the numerical balance.

Edited November 16, 2013 by ImPeRaToR

[1./KG4_Blackwolf]

I always take the underdog( less numbers) in MP. So I guess I'll be flying red :D ..but I have no idea how to fly this thing! Oh this is going to be fun to learn.

[VA_NAVY]

The US faced the same dilemma in many theaters, Its about tactics, training, trustworthy wing-men who actually protect your six, and teamwork.  Knowing not only your aircraft's  strengths and weaknesses but also the enemy's. Having squad members that put survival of the squad at the highest level of importance instead of number of personal kills. Those are the kind of pilots I am inviting to the Sea Eagles Squadron.

[=69.GIAP=MALYSH]

not a great match, as the 109 seems custom-fit for Boyd's light fighter doctrine. It's decent in a turn and has great T-to-W. It can gain and lose energy more quickly, making it far more nimble, particularly in the vertical. I'd say, treat the LaGG like a Russian 190 (but slower). It's got firepower and armour, it's good against bombers and can hold its own in a 1v1 long enough for help to arrive, hence good as a fighter-bomber where the airspace has not been sufficiently cleared to allow for the il2.

But it's not an air superiority fighter.

 

When mixed in with no room to exit (for whatever reason, maybe the exit window is closed or you have responsibility in the airspace (friendlies dying)), then your firepower (particularly rate of fire) and armour suggest going for a snapshot rather than a prolonged fight. Not much chance of sitting on his his low-six control position. Work the throttle and the ailerons/rudder, give him closure and angle-off problems, look for a quick overshoot, be wary of the vertical which is where a good 109 pilot will take this kind of fight. Make it a knifefight in a phonebooth, in other words, that's my suggestion. Both of you get stabbed, but hopefully you're only damaged while he's dead, or (at worst) you deprive your opponent of a lengthy tracking shot from you dead six.

 

From an advantageous position, the converse applies: the LaGG is not so disadvantaged that it can't keep up in a dogfight, much like the 109 against the yak or La5, it just can't do so for a prolonged time and will start losing as the energy levels become equal. That doesn't mean a pilot should get suck into 'hud BFM', the LaGG is nimble enough to win the fight, just be aware of your exit window if the opponent is a little too slippery.

[jaydee]

You are clearly not über enough. My advice would be to take immediate steps to advance your überosity rating before the game comes out.

First I'd suggest attacking only from the high six.

Second I'd like to add that you shoulld have a sexy paint scheme - preferably with mottling and your girlfriends' name written in a heart below the cockpit.

Finally I'd suggest you just generally try to be more über in your daily life. A little bit of überosity eating your morning yoghurt every day translates to a significant increase in general überosity levels.

And YOU are a MODERATOR ? YOUR post was "Off Topic",Condescending,and PERSONAL !...You should Ban "yourself "

You are a JERK !...~S~

not a great match, as the 109 seems custom-fit for Boyd's light fighter doctrine. It's decent in a turn and has great T-to-W. It can gain and lose energy more quickly, making it far more nimble, particularly in the vertical. I'd say, treat the LaGG like a Russian 190 (but slower). It's got firepower and armour, it's good against bombers and can hold its own in a 1v1 long enough for help to arrive, hence good as a fighter-bomber where the airspace has not been sufficiently cleared to allow for the il2.

But it's not an air superiority fighter.

 

When mixed in with no room to exit (for whatever reason, maybe the exit window is closed or you have responsibility in the airspace (friendlies dying)), then your firepower (particularly rate of fire) and armour suggest going for a snapshot rather than a prolonged fight. Not much chance of sitting on his his low-six control position. Work the throttle and the ailerons/rudder, give him closure and angle-off problems, look for a quick overshoot, be wary of the vertical which is where a good 109 pilot will take this kind of fight. Make it a knifefight in a phonebooth, in other words, that's my suggestion. Both of you get stabbed, but hopefully you're only damaged while he's dead, or (at worst) you deprive your opponent of a lengthy tracking shot from you dead six.

 

From an advantageous position, the converse applies: the LaGG is not so disadvantaged that it can't keep up in a dogfight, much like the 109 against the yak or La5, it just can't do so for a prolonged time and will start losing as the energy levels become equal. That doesn't mean a pilot should get suck into 'hud BFM', the LaGG is nimble enough to win the fight, just be aware of your exit window if the opponent is a little too slippery.

Thank you ~S~

Disclaimer: Don't take the old IL2 as indicative of how planes will perform in BoS. This is going to be an entirely different beast with a completely different and much more detailed flight model.

 

There is no question, that the LaGG-3 is significantly inferior to the Bf-109F and G. In BoS we'll fly the LaGG in a "series 29" configuration, which is good news compared to the early overloaded series, but it's still a far cry from the late 1943 production, which finally put the LaGG on par with the 109 just before production was terminated.

 

Basically there are only a handful of minor things, and one big thing, that work in the LaGGs favor:

 

1. Cockpit view should be slightly better. All other things being equal,  it should be somewhat easier to sneak up on a 109.

 

2. Down low the Bf-109 only has a minor advantage in speed. If you can get him down low, you even the playing field somewhat.

 

3. The pleasant low speed handling of the 109 with its automatic slats and gentle stall characteristics might tempt rookie German pilots to turn too much, burn a lot of energy and end up low and slow. On the other hand LaGG pilots will have to fly with dicipline just to stay in the air and will be less tempted to needlessly burn energy. It doesn't matter how much better the 109 is on paper, if he ends up on the deck at an energy disadvantage, his ass is yours.

 

4. The LaGG is a sturdy beast, and only the 20mm shells of the 109 is going to have a devastating effect on its structure.

 

5. Even though the armament of the LaGG seems rather pitiful, both the ShVAK and the UBS have a very high volume of fire, meaning that you only really need a second on the target to make the kill. Your ammunition supply is small though, and you'll only have 10 - 12 sec of fire, unlike the 109, which can shoot all day.

 

6. And this is the big one: In a historical scenario the Bf 109 is nearly always going to be at a numerical disadvantage. After 1941 the Luftwaffe fought just about all of its battles with fewer numbers than their adversaries. To what extent this will be reflected in BoS is an open question, but in MP it should be pretty straightforward to force a "team inbalance" that reflects the historical reality.

Thank you ~S~

I always take the underdog( less numbers) in MP. So I guess I'll be flying red :D ..but I have no idea how to fly this thing! Oh this is going to be fun to learn.

That's why I want to learn the Lagg ! ~S~

[jaydee]

That's because this is not War Thunder.

Mr Spectre,if you ever want to set a time and place on ATAG ! I'll fly a Spit and you can have the 109 of your choosing ! We can meet in in a one on one ! ~S~

[FlatSpinMan]

Wooaah, there Jaydee!!

I'm not 100% sure you were serious in your comment to me. I certainly hope not.

My post was meant as a joke. I thought that would have been clear from the exaggerated nature of my comments.

Now, if you seriously thought I was questioning your "überosity" levels (cos that's a real thing?)

then I apologize for not making my post's intent clear. That said, if you were serious in your response then there are far, far better ways to go about it.

[Karost]

Wow..... Hey FlatSpinMan   I think  this is very good opportunity that you can try to ban your self for one 1 hrs  LOL..... ( just kidding )

 

[Finkeren]

Well FSM, best be a bit careful around a forum with so many non-native English speakers. No matter how obvious a joke is (and this was pretty obvious) there is bound to be someone who will interpret it litterally. As a non-native English speaker, it took me a few years to really grasp the jargon on gaming forums.

 

Jaydee: The next time you see a post that seems completely outrageous, insulting or absurd, try looking for signs, that the poster is joking. Often it will turn out to be the case, at least on a dedicated forum like this, where people get to know each other well, and where trolling is rather limited compared to your standard 4chan/reddit/Justin Beiber-forum.

Edited November 17, 2013 by Finkeren

[FlatSpinMan]

I should reiterate, if the tone of my original post wasn't clear then I'm sorry.

[Finkeren]

Seemed quite clear to me, but no matter what you do, there is always the risk of misinterpretation. I guess we all have to find our own balance in the way we post. I'm not gonna claim, that there is one 'right' middle ground

[JtD]

I should reiterate, if the tone of my original post wasn't clear then I'm sorry.

If you were über enough yourself, this wouldn't have happened. You therefore shouldn't be flying a LaGG-3.

Edited November 17, 2013 by JtD

[Furio]

I agree with Finkeren. Being another non-native English speaking, I had hard times not only to understand when people were joking but even to understand what the hell they were saying in the first place! To limit jargon is surely a good way to help people like me.

Oh, by the way: perhaps I’m improving my poor English, but I understood immediately that FSM was joking, and – I believe – also Jaidee was joking… By the way he posted from Australia, so he can be English-speaking…

Returning on topic.

As far as I know, weather during Stalingrad’s winter varied from horrible to awful. Low ceilings, snowfalls, bad visibility were surely of help to Ju52s and other transports flying in and out of Pitonmik, but also negated any vertical manoeuvre. You cannot climb that much when ceiling is 500 feet AGL or less. Moreover, Luftwaffe pilots could not rely on their usual ambushes and sniper tactics. For a change, they were the ones with a desperate mission, forced to accept combat in any condition, usually outnumbered. If the tactic situation is correctly simulated, the odds for the LaGG are not that bad, I believe.

Edited November 17, 2013 by Furio

[=69.GIAP=MALYSH]

haha. We'll lose something downright fun if we discourage all ambiguity. Language is so much more than merely one-word-one-image. I very much enjoyed FSM's post, and I am not ashamed :D

 

it's up to the reader to bring his own salt (and any other seasoning)

[jaydee]

Thanks for ALL replies ! ~S~ to ALL !

[Finkeren]

haha. We'll lose something downright fun if we discourage all ambiguity. Language is so much more than merely one-word-one-image. I very much enjoyed FSM's post, and I am not ashamed :D

 

it's up to the reader to bring his own salt (and any other seasoning)

I'm not discouraging irony at all. I'm simply saying that it comes with a risk on a forum with many non-native English speakers. Each can find his/her own balance.

[DD_fruitbat]

Flight sim forums without humour are all charts and no fun....

[Furio]

haha. We'll lose something downright fun if we discourage all ambiguity. Language is so much more than merely one-word-one-image. I very much enjoyed FSM's post, and I am not ashamed :D

 

it's up to the reader to bring his own salt (and any other seasoning)

 

I don’t know way, but I feel this post singularly impolite. We are not talking of people understanding more or less irony, but more or less English. A little good will would do no harm, I believe. Oh, never mind: probably is just my bad English.

That said, what do you think to consider closed the case and to return on-topic? I was just saying that tactical situation was favourable to LaGG. In the end, as inferior as Russian fighters were, Stalingrad represented one of the worst Luftwaffe’s defeats…

[LuftManu]

I will be fliying the Lagg, Nobody is going to shoot me down, Im going down for my own for the first weeks 

Edited November 17, 2013 by .-RDS-.Manu_vc

[DocSnyder]

Ok. So there's somebody asking for advice flying the Lagg3.

All he gets is some roflstomping from 109 pilots. People who only fly these planes cause they are what ... "the best" ? Ridiculous. It's not the guy who asks for opinions on a hard mode but the masses who abuse their precious easy modes who are supposed to be made fun of. Even full clans (yes, I  won't call them squadrons cause of obvious reasons) who only fly German setups - well I guess, cause they are all named after real German squadrons (x_X). CFS forums are silly.

 

But I guess it's "historical"! I mean ... all the US / RuS / Brit / French kids playing virtual German pilots. That must be the reason of all the German Aces in WW2.

Edited November 17, 2013 by DocSnyder

[Furio]

I think Political Commissars will not be modelled, so the number one advice for LaGG pilots probably is: accept combat only in the most favourable conditions. Remember that your main goal is to stop German transport planes. Most of the times, Luftwaffe was forced to go ahead with their missions whatever the conditions and at all costs. So: be patient and wait. 

[Allons]

My post was meant as a joke. I thought that would have been clear from the exaggerated nature of my comments. Now, if you seriously thought I was questioning your "überosity" levels (cos that's a real thing?) then I apologize for not making my post's intent clear. That said, if you were serious in your response then there are far, far better ways to go about it.

 

Just to give feedback, i found your post clearly offensive as well. Moderator= From Latin moderor (“moderate, restrain”).

[=38=Tatarenko]

There have been problems in European meetings etc held in English where the foreigners all understand each other perfectly because they mean exactly what they say and Brits feel left out in their own language because we use language entirely differently, often not meaning what we are saying and expecting that it is clear through nuance. Even worse with the Americans cause they are so damn sincere.