v1.105 singleplayer campaign : lot of Mc202

[jeanba]

Hello

 

I am playing the campaign and I just started the second chapter :

I found that I was very frequently meeting Mc202, and I don't even now if some were oprationnal at that time over Stalingrad !

Basically, 50% of my missions as a Russian player encounter Mc202, even when attacking Pitomnik !

It really spoils the immersion (though slightly increases the odds to survive the mission !)

[Jade_Monkey]

There might be a balancing issue introduced in the last update. The best thing would be to report it in the bugs section instead of here, that way they will address it.

 

Link to section: http://forum.il2sturmovik.com/forum/89-technical-issues-and-bug-reports/

[Finkeren]

Yeah, flying the campaign a bit over the last few days, I definately see a lot of BoM planes in the air. It's all great, but perhaps a bit much, something that could be tweaked.

[jeanba]

There might be a balancing issue introduced in the last update. The best thing would be to report it in the bugs section instead of here, that way they will address it.

 

Link to section: http://forum.il2sturmovik.com/forum/89-technical-issues-and-bug-reports/

Done, I will add some statistics if I can

[SCG_Space_Ghost]

Hello

 

I am playing the campaign and I just started the second chapter :

I found that I was very frequently meeting Mc202, and I don't even now if some were oprationnal at that time over Stalingrad !

Basically, 50% of my missions as a Russian player encounter Mc202, even when attacking Pitomnik !

It really spoils the immersion (though slightly increases the odds to survive the mission !)

 

There were something like 12 Mc.202's deployed at the BOS.

[Brano]

Kill "The Dozen" and they will not appear anymore

[jeanba]

There were something like 12 Mc.202's deployed at the BOS.

12 end of September + 6 december

But they did not fly : only 17 sorties total

[Saurer]

Where there MC.200's too at stalingrad?

[LLv24_Zami]

Yes, too much Mc.202`s appearing in campaign. They should tone it down a bit. I think plane model selection for missions are totally random now. But overall it`s really nice to see BoM planes flying there.

[SCG_Space_Ghost]

Where there MC.200's too at stalingrad?

 

Yes, but in no strength. The ones that were there barely flew/fought and were transferred back out of the theatre relatively quickly.

 

I'm not sure where in the battle itself they were stationed.

[jeanba]

 

Where there MC.200's too at stalingrad?

MC200 (unlike 202) were the mainstay of the Italian air Force on the Eastern Front, thoug their number was very small.

They were used as fighters but also as ground attack planes

Yes, too much Mc.202`s appearing in campaign. They should tone it down a bit. I think plane model selection for missions are totally random now. But overall it`s really nice to see BoM planes flying there.

Yes, it seems

I am happy to see I-16, 1019E and 110 which were used in numbers, but less for P40 and Mc202, which did not fly very much there (I don't even think there was P40E at Stalingrad)

[Finkeren]

I'm pretty sure there were a good number of P-40s at Stalingrad during late summer/autumn, but they were more or less wiped out during the first couple of months (along with rest of the VVS forces in the area)

[LukeFF]

(I don't even think there was P40E at Stalingrad)

 

There was a least one P-40E regiment there, yes.

[jeanba]

I will have to go in my attic to search for "Red Star vs Black Croiss, tome 3, All for Stalingrad", if in 3 days, I have not answered Finkeren, call a SAR team !

[Brano]

126.IAP (Istrebitelny aviacionny polk = fighter air regiment) was shortly part of 268.IAD from 28.8.1942.Equipped with P-40E.Operational time one week,after that completly wiped out and sent back to reequip with La-5.Airfield Solodovka or near around.

 

731.IAP PVO of Stalingrad also equipped with P-40E in around same time with airfield base at Solodovka (eastern bank of Volga almost at the edge of the game map) part of 102.IAD PVO

[Jaws2002]

Machi Mc.202 saw Stalingrad only in postcards.

 

ONE SORTIE flown in the Stalingrad area!!!   ONE!!!

 

[7.GShAP/Silas]

What about Romanians in the IAR?  And did they enjoy much success?

 

Also, was the P-39 at Stalingrad?

 

 

Sorry to derail the topic, but my curiosity was piqued.

[Sim]

Where there MC.200's too at stalingrad?

 

Yes, and MC.200s make even more sense as they were actually brought in and stationed on Oblivskaya airfield (that we have on BoS map) and flew escort missions for stukas during the summer Battle of Kalach. While MC.202s on the other hand operated from Voroshilovgrad and were tasked with covering the 8th Italian Army sector - which is not really represented on the BoS map anyway. They might have come in for a couple of sorties on escort duties, but IMHO that was hardly a reason to include this plane... Although I can see why would the devs choose MC.202 over MC.200 for other obvious reasons.

 

What about Romanians in the IAR?  And did they enjoy much success?

 

Romanian GAL is really missing from BoS theater. That was a major force - the two fighter groups flew nearly 1400 sorties between October 1942 and January 1943 alone. They operated a mix of Bf 109 E-3s, E-4s, E-7s and I.A.R. 80s. Not to mention the bomber and ground attack force that included everything from I.A.R. 81s, to He 111s.. to SM.79s.. and even polish PZL.23s! I would love to fly that underdog Bf 109 E-3 over Stalingrad skies!

 

Also, was the P-39 at Stalingrad?

 

No P-39s took part in Stalingrad battle.

 

I'm pretty sure there were a good number of P-40s at Stalingrad during late summer/autumn, but they were more or less wiped out during the first couple of months (along with rest of the VVS forces in the area)

 

Two polks under TOE 015/174 (two eskadrilyas, ~20 aircraft) with P-40s were deployed to Stalingrad during what one probably can call the hardest phase of the battle for VVS - from late August and into the September. They were wiped out during the first two weeks of operations.

Edited December 7, 2015 by Sim

[ShamrockOneFive]

I know this runs counter to what some of you guys are thinking but I'm loving the variety so much that I hope they don't get toned down too much. If we get a MC.200 sometime then maybe rebalance Italian fighter numbers in favour of that during the late summer part of the campaign.

 

I'm just happy to see other types of aircraft kicking around. I was genuinely surprised when instead of the usual Bf109 and Stuka bomber intercept I instead faced Bf109E-7s with bombs and MC.202 escort. Great!

[LLv24_Zami]

I know this runs counter to what some of you guys are thinking but I'm loving the variety so much that I hope they don't get toned down too much. If we get a MC.200 sometime then maybe rebalance Italian fighter numbers in favour of that during the late summer part of the campaign.

 

I'm just happy to see other types of aircraft kicking around. I was genuinely surprised when instead of the usual Bf109 and Stuka bomber intercept I instead faced Bf109E-7s with bombs and MC.202 escort. Great!

It`s awesome! Even though Mc.202 is seen too much compared to history, it doesn`t bother me too much.

 

Hope we get missing ground units too. It would be nice to see those those rockets flying sometimes in frontlines. I think StuG and Bt-7 is missing also.

[Finkeren]

Also: You guys forget, that the campaign takes place in a Groundhog Day-universe, where time doesn't move forward. Maybe it's just the same 12 Macchis we're shooting down every day?

[jeanba]

It`s awesome! Even though Mc.202 is seen too much compared to history, it doesn`t bother me too much.

 

Hope we get missing ground units too. It would be nice to see those those rockets flying sometimes in frontlines. I think StuG and Bt-7 is missing also.

For me it is : I checked that ALL 3 missions in my Lagg-3 encountered Macci Mc202 : we lose the flavour of Stalingrad.

 

And you are right for P40E, but they were completly dispatched in a matter of days (except as little crosses on the fuselage of some german fighters)

 

 

I'm just happy to see other types of aircraft kicking around. I was genuinely surprised when instead of the usual Bf109 and Stuka bomber intercept I instead faced Bf109E-7s with bombs and MC.202 escort. Great!

Completly irrealistic, fun once, but I meet this kind of mix too often !

 

I will soon shift to PWCG and give up the campaign

Another reason for me not to buy "BoM"

Edited December 8, 2015 by jeanba

[LLv24_Zami]

For me it is : I checked that ALL 3 missions in my Lagg-3 encountered Macci Mc202 : we lose the flavour of Stalingrad.

 

And you are right for P40E, but they were completly dispatched in a matter of days (except as little crosses on the fuselage of some german fighters)

 

In the release notes devs mention this: 5. Planes made for Battle of Moscow are added to Battle of Stalingrad campaign as AI controlled planes based on their real life participation in the battle (they appear in certain time periods)

I think that P-40 and Macchi will disappear in later periods of campaign. Maybe after chapter 2.

 

BTW, I don`t recall seeing Mc.202 at least in a last five missions or so in chapter 2. So it`s quite random.

Edited December 8, 2015 by Zami

[Brano]

For me it is : I checked that ALL 3 missions in my Lagg-3 encountered Macci Mc202 : we lose the flavour of Stalingrad.

 

And you are right for P40E, but they were completly dispatched in a matter of days (except as little crosses on the fuselage of some german fighters)

Completly irrealistic, fun once, but I meet this kind of mix too often !

 

I will soon shift to PWCG and give up the campaign

Another reason for me not to buy "BoM"

PWCG will work for BoM

[Dakpilot]

The problem with 'random' is that all users experience can be different 

 

It is also possible to have a string of missions with very unrealistic odds or a very high proportion of night flights in a row, with a larger volume of missions the chance of random results always being the same will reduce

 

However it may also be very possible that the 'odds' need some fine tuning ,and a wide range of feedback is always good for adjustments to be made if needed

 

potentially to give up with the campaign due to a few 'outlier' results seems a little premature, and discounting the BoM expansion purely on those results (also bear in mind this has only just been introduced as a new feature) seems also a little extreme 

 

Cheers Dakpilot

[Livai]

 

 

So it`s quite random.

 

Improved or not these Campaign it will be every time random gameplay sometimes with too much Bf-109 or whatever. Maybe if you fly BoM planes you will see too much BoS planes this will be still random of course..... Hard to believe from where the planes come from? Enjoy the Challenge whatever plane you meet and if it gets boring enjoy something else things like PWCG, Own or downloaded Missions created by Hand or Multiplayer.  

[senseispcc]

At the Stalingrad front the Hungarian had Reggiane Re.2000 but I still cannot know how much were deployed? At least two where lost! ! In Russia the Italians utilized mostly Macchi C.200 and 51 of them from Gurppo 22° from 1941 until spring 1942 where they where replaced by Macchi C200 from Gruppo 21° and in early september 1942 twelve Macchi C202 also form gruppo 21° this until may 1943.

Edited December 8, 2015 by senseispcc

[ShamrockOneFive]

For me it is : I checked that ALL 3 missions in my Lagg-3 encountered Macci Mc202 : we lose the flavour of Stalingrad.

 

And you are right for P40E, but they were completly dispatched in a matter of days (except as little crosses on the fuselage of some german fighters)

Completly irrealistic, fun once, but I meet this kind of mix too often !

 

I will soon shift to PWCG and give up the campaign

Another reason for me not to buy "BoM"

 

You mean unrealistic. And yeah it does border on that, although I'm still only seeing this kind of combination ever so often.

 

It's certainly not ever intercept which makes me think that the random variable could be adjusted a bit but I certainly hope that community comments take away the feature altogether.

 

Again, I'm loving the variety of it. The campaign was so predictable before but now we've got a few more varieties of action so that things are more interesting. I would implore the devs to go the next step and make sure that the unlocks are sometimes used by the aircraft flights as well. IL-2s with field modified turrets and flights of Bf109s with bombs being escorted by more Bf109... possibly with gunpods as an example.

[jeanba]

I think I saw some bf109 carrying bombs

[ShamrockOneFive]

I think I saw some bf109 carrying bombs

 

Were they Bf109E-7s or later models?

[xvii-Dietrich]

I only fly the He-111^*, and I see a flight of MC.202 as my escort on many of the missions in the campaign. Aside the rarity of the MC.202, it seems to me very odd to have Regia Aeronautica aircraft escorting flights of German bombers.
 
 
* Because the Ju-88 is not yet available ;-)

[ShamrockOneFive]

I only fly the He-111^*, and I see a flight of MC.202 as my escort on many of the missions in the campaign. Aside the rarity of the MC.202, it seems to me very odd to have Regia Aeronautica aircraft escorting flights of German bombers.

 

 

* Because the Ju-88 is not yet available ;-)

 

That kind of inter air force cooperation isn't entirely without precedent. The one MC.202 mission over Stalingrad proper was while escorting Ju-87s as I recall. There are plenty of examples of that kind of cooperation in the North African campaign too.

[xvii-Dietrich]

That kind of inter air force cooperation isn't entirely without precedent. The one MC.202 mission over Stalingrad proper was while escorting Ju-87s as I recall. There are plenty of examples of that kind of cooperation in the North African campaign too.

 

Wow. Well, I'm quite surprised at that. It strikes me as being a difficult thing to do, given the different procedures, equipment, languages, command hierarchy, etc.

 

That's still only one MC.202 mission over Stalingrad, though. :-)

[LLv24_Zami]

Were they Bf109E-7s or later models?

I am happy to report that I just started my Yak campaign and my first mission was to intercept a flight of E-7 jabos escorted by couple of F-4`s. So there are bomb carrying AI fighters in campaign these days. 

[F/JG300_Gruber]

Were they Bf109E-7s or later models?

 

E7 for me, usually with F4 or G2 as escort.

 

I didn't encountered Stukas for a while.