Recommended settings for a "lively" campaign.

[CIA_Yankee_]

Salutations.

 

I was wondering if anyone had any recommendations on what the right campaign settings should be to ensure the mission generally feel more alive than what we get in the campaign.

 

By "alive" I mean that there is a sense of being part of an ongoing war effort, with other flights and ground forces being active during the mission. In effect, what I'd like is to encounter more than just the mission objectives, and have the illusion that there is more going on around me.

 

Right now I am using the basic mid/mid ground/air activity settings, but I imagine there are other settings I could do that would help (beyond just going high/high, though I should try that too, admittedly).

 

Thank you.

[PatrickAWlson]

Provided your computer can handle it I would recommend setting ground activity to High.  IMHO for the eastern front setting that is almost more important than high air settings.  In advanced configs you can find parameters for flight size and numbers of flights to keep.  Increasing these will give you more activity.  Just be aware that they will impact load times and performance.

[CIA_Yankee_]

Excellent, I'll try that. Thank you.

 

And excellent work, BTW. This is awesome.

[CIA_Yankee_]

Here's another question:

 

What settings would help in making missions be shorter? The average mission right now seems to take me 45 minutes, and that's 95% ingress/egress and climbing WPs, while at x2 speed.

 

I know I could remove the climbing WPs, but without those the entire flight tends to be stretched out and still struggling to catch up to the leader and reach altitude before the objective.

 

In effect, what should be done to reduce the distance to the objective? While I don't mind a pleasant flight or two, it can be excessive at this point.

 

Thank you.

[PatrickAWlson]

Start in the air.  That puts you at altitude without the takeoff sequence.  

[CIA_Yankee_]

Very well, thank you.

[CIA_Yankee_]

Another settings question: What setting controls the numerical odds in a mission?

 

Specifically, it seems that most of my missions end up pitting my flight against twice their numbers, making most missions almost impossible (usually a clump, of enemies will focus the wingleader and take him out fairly early, and then work through the rest of the flight, for example).

 

Given I'm flying for the VVS, the luftwaffe having numerical superiority in almost every mission is getting fairly ridiculous, and I would certainly appreciate some good config recommendations to rectify that.

 

Also, it does not help that when another VVS flight shows up (which is fairly rare), that flight just putters around and never actually engages the extra LW flights that show up (while THOSE flights are very keen in attacking mine, which is why we end up facing twice our numbers almost every mission). There's some AI issues going on there.

 

In any case, some assistance would be very much appreciated.

 

Thank you.

[CIA_Yankee_]

Anyone? Some help would be appreciated.

[LLv24_Zami]

Another settings question: What setting controls the numerical odds in a mission?

 

Specifically, it seems that most of my missions end up pitting my flight against twice their numbers, making most missions almost impossible (usually a clump, of enemies will focus the wingleader and take him out fairly early, and then work through the rest of the flight, for example).

 

Given I'm flying for the VVS, the luftwaffe having numerical superiority in almost every mission is getting fairly ridiculous, and I would certainly appreciate some good config recommendations to rectify that.

 

Also, it does not help that when another VVS flight shows up (which is fairly rare), that flight just putters around and never actually engages the extra LW flights that show up (while THOSE flights are very keen in attacking mine, which is why we end up facing twice our numbers almost every mission). There's some AI issues going on there.

 

In any case, some assistance would be very much appreciated.

 

Thank you.

74_jim_nihilist made a nice job gathering information about those advanced settings. You can read it here: http://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/19061-advanced-config/?p=300503

 

This setting particularly could be useful to you:

- Max Enemy planes: as it says. This option will help solve the problem you have Duck with encountering 12 planes at once. Lowering this setting also helps people with lower spec PCs deal with the CPU and GPU load.

[FilMit]

@Zami,  Please show your BoSCampaignSpecific.config with optimal settings 

[LLv24_Zami]

@Zami,  Please show your BoSCampaignSpecific.config with optimal settings 

I am using medium/medium in simple config. Other than that pretty much default settings  .

Only setting I`ve changed in advanced config is Max opposing flights from 1 to 0. As I understand this gives chance that no enemy flights cross my flight path. 

- Max Opposing Flights: Controls the maximum number of flights which will intentional have flight routes that cross the player's flight's flight route. The number of aircraft in the flight is controlled on the second page, and the chance the flights used to be Opposing Flights exist is controlled by the Flight Opposition setting (See below). Setting this to the default of '2' is a good idea to keep things manageable.

[FilMit]

@Zami, please, if not more difficult, attach the file here BoSCampaignSpecific.config.

 

I translate by Google, and I do not understand everything, unfortunately.

 

Just your file, and everything.

[LLv24_Zami]

 

@Zami, please, if not more difficult, attach the file here BoSCampaignSpecific.config.

 

I translate by Google, and I do not understand everything, unfortunately.

 

Just your file, and everything.

 

Okay, it`s not really different from stock file except for that one setting  . But here you go:BoSCampaignSpecific.zip

[FilMit]

Thank you very much, Zami 

[CIA_Yankee_]

I am using medium/medium in simple config. Other than that pretty much default settings  .

Only setting I`ve changed in advanced config is Max opposing flights from 1 to 0. As I understand this gives chance that no enemy flights cross my flight path. 

- Max Opposing Flights: Controls the maximum number of flights which will intentional have flight routes that cross the player's flight's flight route. The number of aircraft in the flight is controlled on the second page, and the chance the flights used to be Opposing Flights exist is controlled by the Flight Opposition setting (See below). Setting this to the default of '2' is a good idea to keep things manageable.

 

So do you not have the problem I encounter, which is to say being frequently outnumbered by enemy flights?

 

It makes most missions nearly impossible, because my own flight usually ends up getting shot down. Even when I do quite well and down half the enemy fighters, by then the rest of my flight is gone and I end up alone vs 3-4 enemies, which is generally a losing proposition (especially in a LaGG-3 *grin*).

 

So my issue is not one of performance, but of odds, which is very unfortunate when considering that the VVS generally had numerical superiority.

[CIA_Yankee_]

That said, looking at the link explaining the setting, it looks like "Randomise Planes per side" may be an issue:

 

 

Randomise Planes per side: adds a variable that increases the amount of planes on each side over the settings you put in for Max Enemy planes and Max friendly planes.

 

So this might be one of the culprits. It looks like there are several components that causes issues.

 

Also, setting max enemy flights to 0 probably eliminates all flights specifically created to oppose yours, leaving only the random flights. This probably (on its own) would resolve my odds problem.

[FilMit]

@Yankee_ , try my settings 

BoSCampaignSpecific.zip

[LLv24_Zami]

So do you not have the problem I encounter, which is to say being frequently outnumbered by enemy flights?

 

It makes most missions nearly impossible, because my own flight usually ends up getting shot down. Even when I do quite well and down half the enemy fighters, by then the rest of my flight is gone and I end up alone vs 3-4 enemies, which is generally a losing proposition (especially in a LaGG-3 *grin*).

 

So my issue is not one of performance, but of odds, which is very unfortunate when considering that the VVS generally had numerical superiority.

No, I`m not outnumbered all the time. Of course sometimes that happens but that`s war. I think in Stalingrad Luftwaffe had locally numerical superiority in some cases, at least in early and middle stages. But overall VVS was numerically superior in every front of course.

 

That said, looking at the link explaining the setting, it looks like "Randomise Planes per side" may be an issue:

 

 

So this might be one of the culprits. It looks like there are several components that causes issues.

 

Also, setting max enemy flights to 0 probably eliminates all flights specifically created to oppose yours, leaving only the random flights. This probably (on its own) would resolve my odds problem.

Those are good ones to start with. I use the Max enemy flights=0 to create random encounters. Lot of action even then, program just won`t create enemy flight to oppose me directly in every mission. 

 

Luckily Pat has made PWCG highly customizable, I am sure you find nice balance with a little tweaking. If you find great balance, please do share them 

Edited December 8, 2015 by Zami

[CIA_Yankee_]

I'lll try your settings, FilMit.

 

Thank you.

No, I`m not outnumbered all the time. Of course sometimes that happens but that`s war. I think in Stalingrad Luftwaffe had locally numerical superiority in some cases, at least in early and middle stages. But overall VVS was numerically superior in every front of course.

 

Those are good ones to start with. I use the Max enemy flights=0 to create random encounters. Lot of action even then, program just won`t create enemy flight to oppose me directly in every mission. 

 

Luckily Pat has made PWCG highly customizable, I am sure you find nice balance with a little tweaking. If you find great balance, please do share them 

 

See, what happens to me with my current settings is I'll be flying, get to my objective, and there will be a flight there to oppose me. Maybe it's equal numbers, maybe less, maybe more. This is fine.

 

But then as we move in, more flights start showing up (usually at least 1), which will eventually engage us. When a VVS flight shows up, it just putters around and ignores us.

 

The end result is I usually end up being outnumbered 2 to 1, against superior LW aircraft of course. That's a very difficult proposition.

 

Anyway, I will try the various recommendation and get back to you.

[CIA_Yankee_]

No, I`m not outnumbered all the time. Of course sometimes that happens but that`s war. I think in Stalingrad Luftwaffe had locally numerical superiority in some cases, at least in early and middle stages. But overall VVS was numerically superior in every front of course.

 

Those are good ones to start with. I use the Max enemy flights=0 to create random encounters. Lot of action even then, program just won`t create enemy flight to oppose me directly in every mission. 

 

Luckily Pat has made PWCG highly customizable, I am sure you find nice balance with a little tweaking. If you find great balance, please do share them 

 

I tried your settings, though I went with airstarts to shorten the missions, and the end results were little different from what I experience: lots of enemy flights, particularly on intercept missions.

 

I then tried it without any changes at all, and (in the one mission I was able to fly, due to time constraint) it seemed to be better. It's too early to properly tell, and will likely have to wait for the week-end.

 

THAT SAID, I think I identified some issues with air starts. Pat should look into this:

 

1- The Airstart altitude setting does not seem to work at all. Regardless what I do, my airstart altitude seems more determined by the mission type than anything else (500m for intercepts, for example). The end result is that with airstart activated my flight always meets the enemy at a massive altitude disadvantage, which is usually insurmountable by the AI (meaning the enemy AI is able to successfully use their higher E to decisively win the engagement... which is actually very cool to see).

 

2- For intercept missions, it looks like doing an air start will result in encountering the enemy flights almost immediately. It's as if they spawn very close by and show up all at once. This is 100% reproducible, as it happened over a dozen different intercept missions in a row with airstart. I would pop in, and by the time I had regained formation with my flight we'd make contact already (at a massive altitute disadvantage, as intercepts airstart you at 500m). It was only when I did not do an airstart that my flight was able to actually fly to the intercept point in order to make contact.

 

So for now I will try flying normally with no airstart and with climb WPs (basically Zami's original settings), and see if it makes a difference.

[LLv24_Zami]

I tried your settings, though I went with airstarts to shorten the missions, and the end results were little different from what I experience: lots of enemy flights, particularly on intercept missions.

 

I then tried it without any changes at all, and (in the one mission I was able to fly, due to time constraint) it seemed to be better. It's too early to properly tell, and will likely have to wait for the week-end.

 

THAT SAID, I think I identified some issues with air starts. Pat should look into this:

 

1- The Airstart altitude setting does not seem to work at all. Regardless what I do, my airstart altitude seems more determined by the mission type than anything else (500m for intercepts, for example). The end result is that with airstart activated my flight always meets the enemy at a massive altitude disadvantage, which is usually insurmountable by the AI (meaning the enemy AI is able to successfully use their higher E to decisively win the engagement... which is actually very cool to see).

 

2- For intercept missions, it looks like doing an air start will result in encountering the enemy flights almost immediately. It's as if they spawn very close by and show up all at once. This is 100% reproducible, as it happened over a dozen different intercept missions in a row with airstart. I would pop in, and by the time I had regained formation with my flight we'd make contact already (at a massive altitute disadvantage, as intercepts airstart you at 500m). It was only when I did not do an airstart that my flight was able to actually fly to the intercept point in order to make contact.

 

So for now I will try flying normally with no airstart and with climb WPs (basically Zami's original settings), and see if it makes a difference.

My settings does not change anything but the fact that no enemy flight is directed intentionally to your flight path to give some randomness. It is possible that you don`t see enemy at all or that you will be overwhelmed. Or something betweene. I have had missions where is no enemy contact at all. I think best result will be when you tweak those other settings on top of this Max opposing flights=0 for that goal of yours.

Edited December 9, 2015 by Zami

[CIA_Yankee_]

Well, as I wrote, I need to try more ground-start missions, because there is definitely something funky with airstarts going on, as reported in my post. Hopefully Pat will take a look.

[LLv24_Zami]

It seems that I can`t edit my old posts.

 

Regarding the random factor I was talking about above. I made a LaGG-3 campaign and flew couple of missions. In fact I never flew PWCG campaign in LaGG before, not the easiest plane to survive if you are outnumbered. I have usually flown Bf-109 or Yak which are much easier planes in that aspect.

The first one was intercept mission with 4 LaGG`s. After take off we managed to climb about 1700 meters before we were jumped by high flying Fw-190`s. We were outnumbered 6 to 4 and they had the altitude advantage.Very difficult situation to survive and they shot 2 of us down and then the WP changed to home base. They chased us there but that is realistic because it was so close. 

Second mission was patrol with 6 LaGG`s. After take off we climbed a while before encountered 2 Bf-109F4`s above us and they dived to attack us. But there were nearby flight of 3 LaGG`s circling and they joined our furball. So this time odds were 9-2 for our favor. 

 

So, if you are unlucky with the missions you can get pretty hard situations. Especially with LaGG. But not always. Although I think LaGG campaign can use some tweaking before it is enjoyable. 

 

Well, as I wrote, I need to try more ground-start missions, because there is definitely something funky with airstarts going on, as reported in my post. Hopefully Pat will take a look.

I don`t think that is decisive to number of planes in missions. 

 

BTW, Pat gave some instructions to tweak number of flights in the other thread: http://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/19871-ai-aggressiveness/?p=312894

Edited December 9, 2015 by Zami

[LLv24_Zami]

I flew 2 more missions with my stock settings in LaGG tonight. 3rd mission was intercept and it ended 4vs4 situation with Messerschmitts so that was quite fair. No problem. 4th was a patrol with just 2 LaGG`s and I knew it was doomed from the beginning. But I flew it anyway and we got to the fight with 7-8 enemy fighters. Leader was shot down and I was wounded. 

 

After that I decided to lower Max enemy planes to 10 for testing. I did couple of missions with it and they wen`t pretty nicely. I think I`ll keep those for now and see how it works out with more missions.

[CIA_Yankee_]

I flew 2 more missions with my stock settings in LaGG tonight. 3rd mission was intercept and it ended 4vs4 situation with Messerschmitts so that was quite fair. No problem. 4th was a patrol with just 2 LaGG`s and I knew it was doomed from the beginning. But I flew it anyway and we got to the fight with 7-8 enemy fighters. Leader was shot down and I was wounded. 

 

After that I decided to lower Max enemy planes to 10 for testing. I did couple of missions with it and they wen`t pretty nicely. I think I`ll keep those for now and see how it works out with more missions.

 

But like I said, I have the sneaking suspicious that airstart may play a factor in the behavior I'm seeing. At least partly, and for intercepts. But I iwll keep on flying and report back, probalby over the week-end end.

[Yogiflight]

I don´t think it has to do with airstart, because I made the same experiences with groundstarts. I was flying several intercept missions with G2 and everytime I was attacked by russian fighters in the first minute after takeoff. And there is the difference between our experiences, I was attacked, not my flightleader. And while I had four fighters at the minimum behind me, my flight attacked one russian aircraft, without taking any notice of my situation.

[74_jim_nihilist]

@Yankeee_

Maybe more explanations to the options will help you out:

http://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/19061-advanced-config/