p40 - stand alone purchase ?

[Recon]

Any idea with the p40 will be available for purchase ?

 

I'm not interested in any of the other planes provided in BOM but would like to be able to fly the p40 in offline campaigns.  I've been waiting for the p40 since BoS early days.

[Potenz]

After official BoM release, winter/spring 2016

[-TBC-AeroAce]

but u will still need to get the base BOM package. So u will need to buy BOM Standard + the p40 unless the devs change tackt 

[indiaciki]

she's the worst plane by far. Not even fun flying (great FM)i f you fkew the E-7 that is far from perfect as a plane but the FM is perectly done. One in a  million.The P-40 is a bore by any standards. Great to look at in flight recordings with the F2 key. my opinion. For a mediocre plane she's easy to fly. No challange at all. Somebody said in an earlier Thread: She's faster than a t-34 and climbs uphill faster than a Kübelwagen.And she really has an ugly cockpit.Don't get me wrong - I have a 1:32 model in my living room. She really looks great. If you get a shark's mouth skin she might look like a fighter.

Edited November 19, 2015 by indiaciki

[-TBC-AeroAce]

P 40 is a very good plane if u know how to use it! (Just the same as any other plane (if u know how to use it))

 

P40 is a good fighter bomber and after that its a good one hit run wonder!!!!!!!

 

Above its tactically speaking 

 

I say the p40 is the best worst plane in the series!!! I,e its a joy to fly and manage but do not expect easy results 

 

 

 

 

++++++++++++++++++++

 

 

GOing back to OP i think i summed it up earlier

Edited November 19, 2015 by [TBC]AeroACE

[indiaciki]

I love how she is modelled and she's a beauty...but she's boring as hell. She doesn't even have flaws that make her challing to handle. And she has an boring cockpit, she not fun :D

Edited November 19, 2015 by indiaciki

[FuriousMeow]

No flaws? Try yawing excessively.

[Y-29.Silky]

she's the worst plane by far.

 

Although it lacks acceleration and climb speed, I highly disagree with this statement.

[Jade_Monkey]

Im highly disappointed with the p40's engine. I didn't know what to expect bc im fairly new to WWII sims, but it's the worst plane when playing a quick 8v8.

The guns are great though.

[ShamrockOneFive]

I love how she is modelled and she's a beauty...but she's boring as hell. She doesn't even have flaws that make her challing to handle. And she has an boring cockpit, she not fun :D

 

I take it you've never stepped on the rudder a little too hard and watched as the yaw instability turns into a departure from controlled flight?

 

The only thing I'm not sure about is the P-40s roll rate which I had thought was excellent but in this case seems to be fairly mediocre. Other than that... its a challenge to fly and quite a lot of fun.

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

The P-40's engine has fairly poor high altitude performance, and it simply can't handle the weight of the aircraft like the DB+109 combination does. That means acceleration and climb leave a lot to be desired, while the P-39, which had a similar engine but was lighter, shone in the Eastern Front. The earlier LaGG-3 series followed from the same problem - the M-105 was used in the Yakovlev fighters just fine, but they were lighter.

 

However, the P-40 is of very sturdy construction and as you mentioned it has good firepower. You just need to be more prudent and bring your best tactical game. You can't fly it like a Yak or a Messer, so fly it like a P-40 instead

[MikeDitka]

Don't most of the favorable comparisons of the P-40's roll come from actions against early Japanese fighters, and early 109s?

 

It's got a decent roll, but it's no 190.

 

What I like best about it is the firepower. The effect isn't as spectacular as shredding a wing with a single cannon shell but a very short burst can cause catastrophic damage to engines and flight control surfaces.

[indiaciki]

I take it you've never stepped on the rudder a little too hard and watched as the yaw instability turns into a departure from controlled flight?

 

 

That's basic to knowing your aircraft. Every AC has flaws. That's why there is a pilot and pilots don't randomly swich planes like they do in sims.

[ShamrockOneFive]

That's basic to knowing your aircraft. Every AC has flaws. That's why there is a pilot and pilots don't randomly swich planes like they do in sims.

 

True. But if you want to assert that it doesn't have any flaws that make it challenging to handle... well that yaw instability is a bit of a challenge isn't it? Not a boring aircraft in the slightest.

[indiaciki]

True. But if you want to assert that it doesn't have any flaws that make it challenging to handle... well that yaw instability is a bit of a challenge isn't it? Not a boring aircraft in the slightest.

 

I didn't notice. As I said I have a model plane and I love the iconic looks. I'l give it a try right now. Rudder sensitive, you said? I actually like that. ROF infected

Edited November 20, 2015 by indiaciki

[indiaciki]

You're right. Makes her way more interesting Maybe it's too much. don't know if it historically correct but you can decrease rudder sesitivity in the settings. Now she's like a DR I. Turning without ailerons.  like her now. She's not only underpowered, she pretty dangerous at low altitude steep turns. Very WWI like.

 

Huge rudder !!!!!!!!!!!

Edited November 20, 2015 by indiaciki

[indiaciki]

my guess is: you use rudder for TO only and cruise with 80+% power. Aprroach incl. touchdown and taxi with not less than 20% to avoid groundlooping. Heavy and really underpowered. A failed WWII fighter by any means. Fun flying, though. She's a desaster :D 

Edited November 20, 2015 by indiaciki

[MigSu]

Although it lacks acceleration and climb speed, I highly disagree with this statement.

Come on, what do you think about the P40?    

 

 

I like that plane, i want it (waiting), but this is not the first time i see this statement (is the worst plane) so, i don't know what to think about. 

 

regards

[indiaciki]

the worst plane doesn't mean it's not fun flying her. Quite the opposite. I fly the R.E.8 in ROF and she is the absolutely worst plane in ROF.

Edited November 20, 2015 by indiaciki

[Cybermat47]

The P-40 is like the Bf-110. Slow and clumsy, but capable of massive damage against planes and ground targets. I'll use it as a bomber destroyer and fighter bomber.

[Finkeren]

The P-40E has one major flaw only: The engine is far too weak for such a big and heavy airframe. This leads to all the other problems that the aircraft has.

 

Stick a 1600hp engine at the front, and it would've been an amazingly good fighter.

 

EDIT: Ok, it also has the problem with lateral instability with full fuel load, but that's minor compared to the abysmal T/W ratio.

Edited November 20, 2015 by Finkeren

[indiaciki]

Been flying her for two days now. The P-40 and the E-7 are worth buying the BOM Full version. She's still a fighter I would like flying in combat but she's totally unique a a pleasure flying. If you love flying around in QM and enjoying the plane - the P-40 is a must have.

[Finkeren]

Also: As mentioned in todays DD, the next update will remove the cap on manifold pressure for the Allison (for historical reasons, since apparently the VVS imposed no such limitations) so we might get to fly the P-40 with a slight extra boost for a limited amount of time.

[indiaciki]

Since the P-40 has no lockable tailwheel it teds to groundloop once aerodynamics stop working. Counter with brakes? Any tips on that issue?

Edited November 20, 2015 by indiaciki

[Finkeren]

Since the P-40 has no lockable tailwheel it teds to groundloop once aerodynamics stop working. Counter with brakes? Any tips on that issue?

Taxi slowly (as you should be doing anyway) and stop with brakes as soon as you sense a ground loop coming and only apply throttle again once you've come to a complete stop. During landing, just do what you do in the LaGG-3.

Edited November 20, 2015 by Finkeren

[indiaciki]

Thanks Finkeren !

[Recon]

she's the worst plane by far. Not even fun flying (great FM)i f you fkew the E-7 that is far from perfect as a plane but the FM is perectly done. One in a  million.The P-40 is a bore by any standards. Great to look at in flight recordings with the F2 key. my opinion. For a mediocre plane she's easy to fly. No challange at all. Somebody said in an earlier Thread: She's faster than a t-34 and climbs uphill faster than a Kübelwagen.And she really has an ugly cockpit.Don't get me wrong - I have a 1:32 model in my living room. She really looks great. If you get a shark's mouth skin she might look like a fighter.

 

Doesn't matter to me - let's say I enjoy a good challenge.

 

$80 for a p40 is quite steep.   I already spent ~$80 on BOS and feel I haven't really gotten my money's worth yet on it.   I assumed at that time the price was going to be the base price for the game and then we'd be buying aircraft.   

 

I'd rather have the ROF and DCS pricing model vs. what we have for this game.   I have no interested whatsoever on Russian planes - flew them for sooo many years in IL2:1946.  I do enjoy 109's.

 

The game engine is improving, but the 'you have to spend $80 to get a 'special plane'' is BS - as we all know they are trying to get US interested pilots to throw down $80 vs. $40 for BOM.   ie. why isn't a 'Yak' a special plane.   It's obviously.

 

I guess I'll have to wait for spring then, $80 is too much for just wanting to fly my favorite aircraft.   Heck, by spring I bet the DCS or even CloD model might be around...

[Matt]

ie. why isn't a 'Yak' a special plane.   It's obviously.

 

Because the Yak-1 was the most common plane during the BoS. And the P-40 was not really the most common plane during the BoM (i don't think it was present there at all, but not sure). And they only really added the P-40, because people asked them to do so.

 

But yes, i agree, i don't see why you can't buy the premium planes seperately and especially why you can't buy the P-40 or Mc.202 in addition to BoS, where they would make more sense anyway.

Edited November 21, 2015 by Matt

[KoN_]

Doesn't matter to me - let's say I enjoy a good challenge.

 

$80 for a p40 is quite steep.   I already spent ~$80 on BOS and feel I haven't really gotten my money's worth yet on it.   I assumed at that time the price was going to be the base price for the game and then we'd be buying aircraft.   

 

I'd rather have the ROF and DCS pricing model vs. what we have for this game.   I have no interested whatsoever on Russian planes - flew them for sooo many years in IL2:1946.  I do enjoy 109's.

 

The game engine is improving, but the 'you have to spend $80 to get a 'special plane'' is BS - as we all know they are trying to get US interested pilots to throw down $80 vs. $40 for BOM.   ie. why isn't a 'Yak' a special plane.   It's obviously.

 

I guess I'll have to wait for spring then, $80 is too much for just wanting to fly my favorite aircraft.   Heck, by spring I bet the DCS or even CloD model might be around...

I hate to say it i agree , i wont pay $80.00 just to fly two aircraft i want , well three , Should of took the ROF way . Man ive spent loads of money on rof that way  .

But it was in small numbers . $2.99 here and there and always the sales and it never upset anyone  . I have most of the plane set  in ROF  and still fly even today .

[indiaciki]

And the DEVs should work for free? I'm not sure they are at break even. I bought some x-plane and DCS modules for about 50 EUR each. Only the DCS choppers Mi-8 and Huey were worth it. The Dora and the 109 K are a lot worse than the E-7. My personal opinion. I know it's a lot of money but it's a great sim. Way better than any other (except ROF)..I won't spend 300 EUR on a HOTAS using it for inferiour flight dynamics. 

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

Money at this stage is a point to consider - on top of that, with such a relatively small plane set it's interesting to sell the full experience because by having it sitting there a pilot can try out new aircraft without cherry-picking the fastest 109 and Yak of the bunch.

 

The good old base+expansions (in this case, premium aircraft) model has worked for decades in all types of games and sims, and I presume the current model also carries on some experience from the RoF model. The future will tell more soon, but as it is now it's a good way to introduce things.

 

Also, don't forget that Rise of Flight initially was sold as a pretty expensive base product with 3 A/C or so and then you still had to buy anything else.

[CheeseGromit]

It's going to be interesting to see if the business model remains the same with plane sets themed around a specific battle being added over time. At some point you're going to start getting duplication of planes. Depending on how you look at it we're already seeing a degree of duplication in BoM with another Bf 109 F, IL-2 and Pe-2.

 

A P-40 may well end up as part of another pack and given a choice I'd prefer it in Commonwealth or US colours anyway. The Bf 110 and Ju 88 were common enough that different variants may be seen in the future as well. With this in mind it makes sense to hang onto my money, see what the future holds and cherry pick the packs that contain the most planes of interest. That seems to be the way the business model is designed. The down side is that I'm not providing financial support to the project as it moves forward. Hopefully the future of the project is certain enough already.

[Recon]

And the DEVs should work for free? I'm not sure they are at break even. I bought some x-plane and DCS modules for about 50 EUR each. Only the DCS choppers Mi-8 and Huey were worth it. The Dora and the 109 K are a lot worse than the E-7. My personal opinion. I know it's a lot of money but it's a great sim. Way better than any other (except ROF)..I won't spend 300 EUR on a HOTAS using it for inferiour flight dynamics. 

 

I paid $80 for BoS and much of my decision to buy as a Founder was to support WW2 sims to keep the genre going.  So I don't think there is any 'make the devs work for free' mentality.   But now the cost is $160 - that is quite a bit.

 

As far as the 'add-on'  - that is fine, but $80 for an addon ?   I would say that is unheard of.

It's going to be interesting to see if the business model remains the same with plane sets themed around a specific battle being added over time. At some point you're going to start getting duplication of planes. Depending on how you look at it we're already seeing a degree of duplication in BoM with another Bf 109 F, IL-2 and Pe-2.

 

A P-40 may well end up as part of another pack and given a choice I'd prefer it in Commonwealth or US colours anyway. The Bf 110 and Ju 88 were common enough that different variants may be seen in the future as well. With this in mind it makes sense to hang onto my money, see what the future holds and cherry pick the packs that contain the most planes of interest. That seems to be the way the business model is designed. The down side is that I'm not providing financial support to the project as it moves forward. Hopefully the future of the project is certain enough already.

 

I would agree, if anything the price of $80 to fly a p40 is going to drastically cut down on sales.

 

If you want a whole market of US pilots flying this game, they should consider making it more like 'if you own BOS or BOM we can offer you a special price'.

 

If not, I don't really think your going to see US pilots spend $80 to fly an inferior plane in a Russian based sim

[indiaciki]

If it's about the nationality of the plane you actually aren't into flying. Those who think in those terms may dowload DSC and fly their p-51 for free. I wouldn't cpmment on this part:

 

US pilots spend $80 to fly an inferior plane in a Russian based sim

 

 

I'd rather stay polite.

Edited November 24, 2015 by indiaciki

[indiaciki]

Ooops, sorry for the DSC recomendation... It's also a Russian based sim... Eagle Dynamics is a software company founded by the Russian Igor Tishin in 1991. Based in Moscow the company develops flight simulators and Oracle-based products. I'd better shut now. I can't believe this.

Edited November 24, 2015 by indiaciki

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

It's going to be interesting to see if the business model remains the same with plane sets themed around a specific battle being added over time. At some point you're going to start getting duplication of planes. Depending on how you look at it we're already seeing a degree of duplication in BoM with another Bf 109 F, IL-2 and Pe-2.

 

A P-40 may well end up as part of another pack and given a choice I'd prefer it in Commonwealth or US colours anyway. The Bf 110 and Ju 88 were common enough that different variants may be seen in the future as well. With this in mind it makes sense to hang onto my money, see what the future holds and cherry pick the packs that contain the most planes of interest. That seems to be the way the business model is designed. The down side is that I'm not providing financial support to the project as it moves forward. Hopefully the future of the project is certain enough already.

I can see you point but it is somewhat of a tenuous proposition at this juncture.

 

If it is a purely financial decision on your part (ie. Money is tight on your end) withholding at this point is completely understandable. On the other hand, if you are both withholding due to planeset AND hoping for the continuing success of the series it may be a self defeating position to take.

 

The developers are doing an excellent job and delivering excellent content. Despite a few minor and couple of serious missteps I have completely gotten my money's worth. If I were an SP guy I'd have a few more gripes but I'd still be throwing cash at them, for their efforts thus far, and consider it monies well spent. In fact I have, at my earliest convenience, for both titles.

 

So, again, if it's for financial reasons - power to ya. If it's for the other thing, I'd hate for both of us to lose the series because, "I didn't get that one plane I wanted that one time."

Edited November 24, 2015 by [LBS]HerrMurf

[indiaciki]

I see your point. I think that some kind of BoB or Pacific might commercially be more succesfull. Have you read the post buy the guy who doesn't want to spend money on some russian sim? He probably wouldn't spend money flying "kraut" planes as well. I don't think he is representative of the the flying community but those statemants are very insulting. I'm neither totally russian, I' serbian with some russian roots - but this is racism and or stupiduty - both go hand in hand and I've spent most of my life in Germany. If a business model has to be based on idividuals like that I'd close my shop for good. I could go on for hours. I won't. And yes. I'd like to fly a Spit or a F4-U but people like this make it very, very unlikely I will.

Edited November 24, 2015 by indiaciki

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

I'm not sure how anyone justifies a statement of "I'm not paying $80 to fly a single plane." It is disingenuous at best and likely trolling.

 

And saying you'd pay $60 for three aircraft (different poster re: cherry picking individual AC which would be $20 or more per pop in the old business model) but not $80 for ten aircraft, new maps, new content and gameplay improvements is a head scratcher. Even if you say some are just model variations of existing aircraft you still have more than enough original AC to justify the purchase.

 

And before you accuse me of being a blind fanboi of the Devs you should review my posts to see my various rants regarding content and direction - as well as screams to move onto other theaters and Western AC.

Edited November 24, 2015 by [LBS]HerrMurf

[indiaciki]

 

 

If not, I don't really think your going to see US pilots spend $80 to fly an inferior plane in a Russian based sim

 

I was refering to this quote and the context 

Edited November 24, 2015 by indiaciki

[Fern]

In a way, I can see this becoming like the Call of Duty of Flight Sims. Same game, same planes, different maps with a new price. When do we get a rank system with prestige mode?