Fallout 4

[6./ZG26_Emil]

Well I thought it was going to be amazing but from the game play I've seen so far it doesn't look very good at all. 

 

 

[6./ZG26_Custard]

It seems the trend these day for the developers of so many "AAA" titles to optimise for the generic console market and to push PC gamers to the back of the queue. The Witcher 3  was a massive let down for me because of just that.

 

The worst offender has to be Arkham Knight. A complete pile of un-optimised cack IMO and as for the combat system oh dear lord! (Glove puppets can win). See WAB review about that.

 

I'll stick to New Vegas till they sort this out. I would highly recommend using Project Nevada and all the other excellent mods that can be found here to transform the base game into something fantastic.

 

http://www.nexusmods.com/newvegas/mods/40040/

[Feathered_IV]

Thanks for the link.  I'm pleased to pass on this one and avoid disappointment. 

[Blooddawn1942]

This was on my radar too. I guess I will wait until the price drops then....

[steppenwolf]

The only thing more troubling than the habit of devs releasing trite bugged mindless games are people's willingness to tout'm like they're something special and new. I'll never understand it. The really sick thing...I want to buy Fallout 4 just so I can explore the world.

[Saurer]

It is a Bethesda Game, so what do you expect?

 

These games are made to mod them untill they are what you want. 

The only Bethesta Game I can stand playing unmoded is Morrowind even if it is old

[Bullets]

I have enjoyed it so far..... With Mods its only going to get better..

[BeastyBaiter]

That reviewer is incredably annoying...

 

His list of issues with the game could just as easily be applied to Skyrim, FO3, FO:NV, Oblivion and Marrowind. They've always had dodgy AI, clipping issues and so on. They've also never had particularly pretty graphics either. Just like flight sims and the ArmA series, they make sacrifices close up to allow for a big map with a long view range. I don't have FO4 but will probably pick it up in a month. As usual, it's best to give Bethesda a month to work out the really glaring issues before diving into it.

 

Most of the other negative reviews I've seen were complaining that FO4 is just like FO3 and Skyrim, to which the obvious question is wtf did they expect? I've seen quite a few complaining about how it isn't like FO1 or FO2. That doesn't mean there aren't real issues with it, but a lot of the negative reviews I've seen come off as unfair.

[unreasonable]

I asked a friend about the game - an experienced adult gamer who has been playing it since release - his comments were almost exactly the same as the reviewer's. 

 

Personally I would be quite happy if it was like FO3 or Skyrim but with some improvements, particularly to the GUI. FO3 was actually OK in this regard, Skyrim was rubbish, fortunately quickly rescued (in part) by extra hotkeys and eventually a whole PC suitable GUI.

It is extremely disappointing to hear that FO4's GUI is actually worse than FO3's - keys with dual assignments ?%#@!

 

While Bethesda will no doubt clear up a number of bugs, they never did anything to improve the PC GUI, IIRC, modders may be able to do this, but that might take a while.

[6./ZG26_Emil]

I asked a friend about the game - an experienced adult gamer who has been playing it since release - his comments were almost exactly the same as the reviewer's. 

 

Personally I would be quite happy if it was like FO3 or Skyrim but with some improvements, particularly to the GUI. FO3 was actually OK in this regard, Skyrim was rubbish, fortunately quickly rescued (in part) by extra hotkeys and eventually a whole PC suitable GUI.

It is extremely disappointing to hear that FO4's GUI is actually worse than FO3's - keys with dual assignments ?%#@!

 

While Bethesda will no doubt clear up a number of bugs, they never did anything to improve the PC GUI, IIRC, modders may be able to do this, but that might take a while.

 

Absolutely!

 

It feels like PC gamers are constantly getting taken for a ride with the console ports being pushed on us and when you hear of games that can only play in 30 fps or like this one where you cannot rebind all the keys it's beyond a joke.

 

I don't mind bugs personally, they tend to get fixed but developers that decide to chase the money and go for the console kiddies are slapping their original customers in the face with a wet fish.

 

I was going to buy this game, I almost pre-ordered until I reminded myself of my pledge to not do so unless it was a flight sim and now it's out I'm not going to buy it unless it's on a sale. I really didn't expect this from Bethesda, the pre release hype was insane and yet the game play footage looks mediocre at best....

 

Gutted

That reviewer is incredably annoying...

 

His list of issues with the game could just as easily be applied to Skyrim, FO3, FO:NV, Oblivion and Marrowind. They've always had dodgy AI, clipping issues and so on. They've also never had particularly pretty graphics either. Just like flight sims and the ArmA series, they make sacrifices close up to allow for a big map with a long view range. I don't have FO4 but will probably pick it up in a month. As usual, it's best to give Bethesda a month to work out the really glaring issues before diving into it.

 

Most of the other negative reviews I've seen were complaining that FO4 is just like FO3 and Skyrim, to which the obvious question is wtf did they expect? I've seen quite a few complaining about how it isn't like FO1 or FO2. That doesn't mean there aren't real issues with it, but a lot of the negative reviews I've seen come off as unfair.

 

It wasn't a negative review if you actually watched it.....he gave it a 'Worth a buy' but would you prefer to only get reviews from the youtube/steam curator in-crowd who are as corrupt as you can get? 

 

I'd rather a reviewer that is honest than one who gives a game like Metal Gear Solid (LOL!!!) a 10 out of 10 which is utterly rediculous. If these AAA games we getting honest reviews then Mac wouldn't have a job.

 

40 or 50 quid is a lot of money and like Mac I expect more for my purchase.

[BeastyBaiter]

I watched it long enough to see him start saying he liked it overall, I think 3/4ths in is where I stopped (couldn't stand him anymore). But he does go through the laundry list of Skyrim and Fallout 3 complaints at the very start. Bethesda isn't likely to change, they've found their niche and are sticking to it. There isn't much point in ranting about it for 10 minutes at the start of an overall positive review.

[Ace_Pilto]

I've been playing it on and off for the last few days, and it's growing on me. It's worth a buy if you're into Fallout but it's a Bethesda game so it still runs (poorly) optimised for 2004. It looks ok, plays ok and there's enough to it to keep me interested for now.

 

RPG lovers beware, lower your expectations. It's an "action" RPG now (marketing term for a dumbed down, gunplay/combat focused RPG) and a hell of a long way from Morrorwind so don't expect much in the way of strict classes or specific character building. You can just keep leveling anything you want until you are god. In fact there doesn't seem to be any consequences to any decision you make beyond occasionally having a potential companion NPC approving or disapproving of what you do. (Which I don't care about as they are typically buggy and annoying to travel with in true Bethesda style.) With that said, it does the action part of action RPG better than in other Fallouts although the AI still moves with janky animations and implausible speed, eg: NPCs that run faster sideways and backwards during combat than I can forwards

 

I can't say much about the story since I haven't bothered pursuing it. To be honest I'm not interested in the story beyond the point where all gameplay mechanics are unlocked and introduced. I have over 1,000 hours in Skyrim and have never completed the main quest because the pacing is ridiculous, the NPCs are bland and the plot is moronic. So what did I do for over 1,000 hours in Skyrim? No, it wasn't sex mods, I just farted about collecting pretty much everything and doing side quests while waiting for interesting mods for even more high res swords to be released. It's all about the mods, if I was on console I would have canned Skyrim after about 100 hours and I imagine I'll be doing much the same in FO4, avoiding entangling conversations with idiot NPCs and building bases everywhere to hoard all the loot I find.

 

The base building is a lot of fun so long as you have level ground to build on, I've spent a good proportion of my time on it so far but it is buggy as hell in many aspects. According to Todd Howard it should "Just work" except that it doesn't. You can place structures anywhere within a base except for where you want them and then you pick things up by accident because two or three functions are bound to the same damn key. The snap is terrible and usually shoe horns you into making structures that are nothing like you had envisaged, are asymmetrical, float in the air or have huge gaps in them which gets my OCD panties in a hell of a bunch. Someone will come along with a mod that will salvage this and get rid of the annoying "Hurr durr, you can't put that wall there, it makes more sense to have it here floating above the ground here, not lined up but slightly clipped through the other wall." and I can't wait. They obviously let the work experience kid play test this one because you can't tell me that someone really tried this and said it works. Still, with infinite patience and console cheats you can make a base that is a marvel to behold and populate it with settlers who will wander around getting in your way, spouting their repetitive dialogue and generally living their idiot lives until you decide to terminate them by using the console to spawn 20 raiders on the outskirts of town to see what happens.

 

Weapon modding is great, there are so many mods for basically everything that allow you to customise your guns and melee weapons. The one problem you will run into is a lack of adhesive, screws and copper but opening the console and typing "help wonderglue 0" and then "player.additem (id for wonderglue here) 100" sorts that problem out for adhesive. If you don't cheat with the console, good luck ever having crafting components when you want to use them. Adhesive and copper are very rare so be prepared to go hunting for items that have contain them if you have an aversion to cheating.

 

Companions are unkillable, not particularly likeable and basically useless. That damn dog is annoying as hell, it likes to wander around in front of your scope while you are taking potshots at enemies and will occasionally bark to tell you that it has discovered something. Then it's pathfinding will usually break before it can lead you to whatever it found and you'll be left wondering "What if I just missed a set of platinum power armour with pink neon lights that played 'Ride of the Valkyries' every time I pulled out my minigun?" and then you'll look back wistfully on the time you spent with D-Dog in MGS V. The AI companion code is a sh%tful abomination as usual and can be disregarded for any purpose other than the hilarity it provides by constantly failing, another one for the modders to fix

 

I was disappointed (but not at all surprised) to discover that the memory handling is basically the same as from Oblivion and as a result I've spent as much time trying to figure out why I just can't seem to get it to play without constant hitching/stuttering as I have playing the game. It has some weird GPU usage (constantly fluctuates between 25% and 99% on my GTX 760) and I don't think the CPU multi-threading really works properly as I was definitely getting bottleneck on my 3.2 GHz i5 (which isn't the best CPU but is an adequate one according to the stated requirements, hell it plays BoS ok). Strangely opening up a little bit of overclock on the CPU was what finally helped me smooth things out after I discovered that changing varoius settings in the launcher and .ini files weren't helping at all. (I'd methodically gone through and lowered everything, disabled V-synch, god rays, mouse acceleration and changed the FoV and tested in fullscreen and borderless.) The main upshot of this is that, with the base vanilla game running so poorly for me I'm not planning on being able to use many mods without upgrading my PC and that is bad news. 

 

This probably sounds like a harsh review but I'm being honest. I always get sucked into this love-hate cycle with Bethesda games like a battered wife with an alcoholic husband. "He treats me so nice when he isn't plastered" sort of thing. It's a good game, you'll have a lot of fun with it but it will constantly piss you off as well.

[Ace_Pilto]

*edit* for above.

 

It turned out that the hitching problem was being caused by the latest nVidia driver (specially made for Fallout 4 by morons who never field test anything they code and assume that everyone in the world is running a 980 or Titan). I investigated further when it became apparent in other games and rolling back got rid of it for me. 

[6./ZG26_Emil]

Nice review Jimmy

 

I think when  the mods come out it will be worth picking up and hopefully when it's cheaper

[Ace_Pilto]

Thanks Emil, I was really surprised when I watched the OP's video after I wrote it and we agreed on so many things. 

[6./ZG26_Emil]

I'm enjoying it. But then I'm of the mentality that I would accept just more of the same as FO3, Vegas, Skyrim,.. quirks/bugs and all. I have enjoyed them all as they are, and it's worth noting I'm not a frame rate counter when it comes to graphics. That's not to say people's critical opinions are not valid, and I'm not going to simply sit and defend Bethesda/fallout, partly because yes there are things they could and should have addressed.

 

But, I have found the more I avoid reading people's criticisms of games, the more I actually enjoy them. What I mean is I find it better to find my own experience, rather than pre-populate a negative view with other people's experience. I may not ever even see someone's issue, or not notice it without my attention being drawn to it first. It's much easier to find fault, than build perfection.

 

Elite Dangerous is a good example, I have given up reading what is wrong, and just look to enjoy what is good.

 

PS. I didn't watch the review for the reasons I've said, but accept FO4 is not perfect or vastly different from previous incarnations.

 

To be honest I watched some gameplay footage first and was a bit underwhelmed especially by the graphics which the hype had me believe was going to be out of this world. What I agree with Mac on though is how games have become more dumbed down over the years partly (mainly?) because of the console market. PC gamers especially those of us who are older expect more from games and to hear that you cannot rebind all the keys was what put me off more than the bugs or graphics. He's actually a great reviewer and his 'rants' are hilarious although I understand why people from other countries might not see the funny side of it. He also gets a lot of stick from fanboys because he doesn't just hand out 10/10s for all the AAA games like the rest of the youtubers....and don't even get me started on game journalists.

 

I think some of the above posters hit the nail on the head though (as did Mac) that exploring the open world and making your own fun (like Elite) is what will make fallout really fun. Having said that I cannot believe anyone in their right mind should have given this game 9 or 10 out of 10 in it's current state.

Just reading your post in full Jimmy, I don't have any of the technical issues you have, but agree with your base building and AI comments.

 

Thing is, I just don't expect perfection, that may be wrong in some eyes, and I know we are paying consumers, but to me it is like watching Terminator or Predator... I can love the film despite Arnie's acting.

 

Sure you don't have to expect perfection but 10/10 should be damn close to perfect otherwise there's no point having a scoring system

[Ace_Pilto]

I hear what you guys are saying and I definitely don't expect technical perfection in an ambitious project like Fallout 4. I'll lay it on the line that I'm a Bethesda veteran. Been at it since Morrowind and I feel as though they have gone backwards in a lot of respects in their attempts to innovate and win over the console market. 

 

But what is perfection or a 10/10 though? Objectively?

 

Warning! I am about to open a can of worms, please stand back, take a deep breath, open an alcoholic beverage and ensure you are wearing the regulation safety gear.

 

Personally I'd give the Witcher 3 a objective 10/10 and it is a comparison that I feel many people will be making. TW3 is definitely not close to perfect but I found the game to be just so darn good that I would give it a 10/10 without hesitation despite its' flaws. I could play it all day and still be entertained (and I have!). To me a 10/10 is a game that transcends the technical limitations of its' platform by providing unfailingly engaging gameplay and world building. CD Projekt Red succeeded in making an open world RPG that makes Bethesda's efforts look almost amteurish in comparison and they are a relatively small player and newcomer to the genre basing their entire work off of obscure medieval Polish folklore. You really can't beat these Eastern European/Russian studios for quality today. (The Czech guys who do the Mafia series are another good example.) The sheer scope of TW3, the story, acting, lack of loading screens and the better graphics and performance (for me anyway) make me wonder exactly what Bethesda do with their budget when I look at their game in direct comparison and I think the source of their problems is not Bethesda themselves as a development team but that it is their marketing and corporate divisions interfering in the development process. The perils of success.

 

Anyway, I'd give FO4 an enjoyable 7.5/10.

[J2_Trupobaw]

 

Most of the other negative reviews I've seen were complaining that FO4 is just like FO3 and Skyrim, to which the obvious question is wtf did they expect? 

A game like Fallout, Fallout 2 and New Vegas;) ?

[BeastyBaiter]

A game like Fallout, Fallout 2 and New Vegas;) ?

 

None of those 3 games were made by Bethesda.

[Chuck_Owl]

Well so far I've played a bit of Fallout 4 and I'm enjoying it. I love it as much as I loved played Fallout 3 and New Vegas when they came out. I don't really get all the hate... for me it's a great game and my expectations were met.

 

Let's be honest here: I wasn't expecting Crysis-like graphics or a revolutionary game. I knew there would be some bugs on release: it's always been like that. The sheer amount of content created makes it pretty hard to release a bug-free game when it goes gold.

 

I think I got my money's worth, even if 90 canadian dollars is atrocious since the canadian dollar value went way down and my salary is still the same... It's sad to see that I could buy a AAA game for 60 bucks a year ago, and now the prices have suddenly been jacked up.

[1PL-Husar-1Esk]

I did know back then when playing Fallout one demo that this game gonna be great. Now i'm glad that i stopped at fallout 2.

[sop]

I'll probably buy for the holidays loved 2/3/vegas  bugs and all im a fanboi I guess.

[J2_Trupobaw]

I did know back then when playing Fallout one demo that this game gonna be great. Now i'm glad that i stopped at fallout 2.

Try New Vegas one day.

[Ace_Pilto]

Try New Vegas one day.

 

I had a lot of fun in New Vegas, unfortunately I also spend a lot of time fixing crashes and buggy mods. It has to be the biggest turd of a game ever for CTD's. Have you played "Obscurum Pandemic"? It's well worth a look if you like a challenge.

 

After playing FO4 more I'm seeing some big improvements over 3 and NV. 

 

I finally got to the bottom of my driver issues and the problem was a conflict between NVidia's HDMI audio driver and my on-board Realcrap sound driver. Deleting and disabling Realcrap (realtek), uninstalling all my NVidia software and drivers and doing a clean re-install FINALLY did the trick and the constant one second hitching is gone totally now. (It turns out that I'm the moron since I'd already fixed this previously but forgot when subsequent drivers didn't have the old conflict). Anyway, I get a nice consistent frame rate, up around 60 most of the time, on conservative medium/high settings with some eye candy.

 

The usefulness of literally acquirable every item in the world is great. I always wondered why they included so much junk in previous titles since it was completely useless but now every item has a purpose. Legendary enemies are fun and drop pretty cool gear. The new power armour system is pretty good (But you get it too early) and the settlement side missions are great if you just like exploring and building. Overall it's more challenging and I'm finding myself actually using chems and other stuff that would have just taken up space in my inventory in FO3 and NV. To be honest I don't miss the old skill system at all either but I really REALLY don't like the bullet sponge enemies on higher difficulty settings. Playing on "Hard" works for me in that I need to use tactics and be thoughtful to win fights. (On survival I have to use all of my ammunition from every gun I have almost to defeat a legendary enemy.)

 

One other thing, the rendering of bare metal surfaces in the game is exquisite, just the right amount of shine and reflection. It's the most convincing rendering of metal I've seen to date and something I wish ED would look at for their DCS P-51 and F-86 which are a disappointing turgid grey.

 

Finally there are the little details and lore that you discover that add a nice touch, they're all around the place.

 

Gonna have to bump my rating up to an 8.5, it's the best vanilla Fallout/Elderscrolls I've played so far. (Since Morrowind) All it needs is a more compelling story to get that emotional investment, improvements to the building system to free up the silly placement logic, better AI (animation, logic and difficulty scaling) and some adjustment of the lore since the environment is completely implausible for 200 years after a nuclear holocaust with a prelude of civil unrest and war.