PWCG for BOS Discussion

[PatrickAWlson]

Hi Pat,

 

Is there currently any way of cutting down the pilot transfer/replacement rate? It would be really cool if loosing squad mates actually caused an attrition effect and it took time for new pilots to transfer in, rather than getting instant replacements and always being at max strength.

 

Cheers 

 

It would be pretty challenging and really would not produce anything noticeable.  Whether you had twelve, ten, or eight pilots available you would still staff your flight of four.  It would not really produce any noticeable impact n your campaign unless your squadron was completely slaughtered in a short period of time.

 

What PWCG already does is replace your lost experienced pilots with inexperienced ones.  You had a pilot that was a veteran, or at least normal.  It took several missions for him to rack up some time in the air and victories.  He is finally at a skill level where he can contribute and then you do something stupid and get him killed.  Now he is replaced by a novice.  That replacement system makes it very much worth your while to care for your AI pilots.

[Yogiflight]

Hi Patrick, I am not sure, this is something you can change, as I also noticed it in Jade_Monkey's 'Butcher Campaign'. I recently started a FW190 career, but what is a little strange, is that AI climbs with a speed of only 270km/h in a quite steep angle. I was flying lately a Bf109 F2 career, and there the AI climbs in a much more shallow angle with 400km/h, which is much more comfortable.

If it is game specific, I will report it in the game's 'Bug Report Section'.

[PatrickAWlson]

Not sure why as I do not have any direct control over rate of climb.  Checked cruise speeds and they are similar - 470 for the FW, 430 440, and 450 for the 109 F2, F4, and G2 respectively.  Maybe I am asking the FW to climb too much from WP to WP?  

[Yogiflight]

 

 

Maybe I am asking the FW to climb too much from WP to WP?

No, I checked that, in a Bf109 F2 mission it was 900m during the 5km between two waypoints, in Fw190 missions, I found numbers between 900m and 1150m, so that is not the issue. AI is simply flying with too low power, somewhere around 1.1 ATA and between 2100 and 2200 RPM, so less than max continuous mode, and they start climbing after they reduced speed to 300km/h, so they start climbing from already low speed.

[TheSNAFU]

I had one of the most interesting and fun missions yet in PWCG, Flying my 45th mission as part ofJG52 15 October 1942. Our target was assaulting Russian troops in clear weather. As we approached the target area the entire place was lighting up with ground fire from both sides. We went in on a concentration of enemy vehicles on the edge of a wooded area. As I got closer I saw T34's and KV1's firing into a line of our panzers who were firing back. AAA bursts filled the sky hitting one of our escorts, Artillery rumbled behind both lines. Our bombs found several Russian tanks and trucks. As I gained altitude the scene was amazing. I have never had a ground attack mission with so much action. There must have been 20 or 30 tanks on each side. It was such a cool mission. All brought courtesy of PWCG!   

[Stlg13/Sgt_Schultz]

 

 

What PWCG already does is replace your lost experienced pilots with inexperienced ones.  You had a pilot that was a veteran, or at least normal.  It took several missions for him to rack up some time in the air and victories.  He is finally at a skill level where he can contribute and then you do something stupid and get him killed.  Now he is replaced by a novice.  That replacement system makes it very much worth your while to care for your AI pilots.

 

Yeah I understand that (I admit I sometimes edit those skill levels to improve survivability when playing a german campaign ). I just mean it would add even more incentive and another dynamic if you're not always able to do offensive missions, sometimes having to take it easy for a while until your sqaudron gets replacements. Especially if you're commanding the sqaudron and having to balance effectiveness with maintaining an adequate number of pilots. 

 

Anyway just a thought, and I know nothing of how difficult it would be to implement so I'll take your word for it Pat   You know best.

 

Can't wait for 3.0, thank god for PWCG, and thank you!.

[Stlg13/Sgt_Schultz]

 

 

I had one of the most interesting and fun missions yet in PWCG, Flying my 45th mission as part ofJG52 15 October 1942. Our target was assaulting Russian troops in clear weather. As we approached the target area the entire place was lighting up with ground fire from both sides. We went in on a concentration of enemy vehicles on the edge of a wooded area. As I got closer I saw T34's and KV1's firing into a line of our panzers who were firing back. AAA bursts filled the sky hitting one of our escorts, Artillery rumbled behind both lines. Our bombs found several Russian tanks and trucks. As I gained altitude the scene was amazing. I have never had a ground attack mission with so much action. There must have been 20 or 30 tanks on each side. It was such a cool mission. All brought courtesy of PWCG! 

 

I'll second that Snafu, ground attack missions are definitely one of my favourite in PWCG and are amazingly immersive. I've started and E7 and P40 campaign just so I can focus on GA cause it's so damn good.

[dburne]

I'll second that Snafu, ground attack missions are definitely one of my favourite in PWCG and are amazingly immersive. I've started and E7 and P40 campaign just so I can focus on GA cause it's so damn good.

 

Yeah I am enjoying some of the ground attack missions even in the Yak-1 in my current campaign. Too bad we don't get credited for kills on these.

I enjoy reading the AAR after a mission and seeing what all I blew up with my two bombs and then following up with cannons.

[Stlg13/Sgt_Schultz]

 

 

Yeah I am enjoying some of the ground attack missions even in the Yak-1 in my current campaign. Too bad we don't get credited for kills on these. I enjoy reading the AAR after a mission and seeing what all I blew up with my two bombs and then following up with cannons.

 

True that, a ground kill tally would be nice so long as it was seperate  .

[TheSNAFU]

Yeah I really enjoy the ground attack missions when they come up. They provide a feeling of real worth and impact when one can complete the mission successfully. Stop that train, slow up the attack, wreck supplies coming up to the front. Each such mission brings a challenge and purpose. While I prefer a desperate PWCG air battle, the ground attack missions have grown on me. 

[Yogiflight]

 

 

Too bad we don't get credited for kills on these.

 

For me it is enough getting it mentioned in the 'Pilot Log' on the page after the air kills. What is a little strange, is that it is not there, before you have your first air kill.

[=SqSq=switch201]

Has anyone else noticed that, when doing ground attack, the ground targets will respawn after you have blown them up? Is this intended? and if it is, is there a way we can turn it off and have the RTB phase of the sortie occur once all the targets are destroyed?

 

Sometimes I will destroy all the targets but the AI will continue to circle the objective for another 5 mins, and then I will notice that the ground units are respawning.

[dburne]

Has anyone else noticed that, when doing ground attack, the ground targets will respawn after you have blown them up? Is this intended? and if it is, is there a way we can turn it off and have the RTB phase of the sortie occur once all the targets are destroyed?

 

Sometimes I will destroy all the targets but the AI will continue to circle the objective for another 5 mins, and then I will notice that the ground units are respawning.

 

Hmm can't say I have notice that, maybe I get out of there sooner before it happens.

[Yogiflight]

Only the AA guns are respawning, AFAIK. And yes it is intended. The circling wouldn't be that strange, if the AI would, instead of just circling, also attack the ground targets, that are still there. From my experience, they circle, either a certain time, or until I destroyed the last target, that should get destroyed.

[PatrickAWlson]

True that, a ground kill tally would be nice so long as it was seperate  .

 

It's there.  It's in the pilot log after air victories.  It does not appear on the chalk board.  That might be an improvement.  Also thought about keeping tank kills as a separate stat and factoring that in more heavily for medals.

Only the AA guns are respawning, AFAIK. And yes it is intended. The circling wouldn't be that strange, if the AI would, instead of just circling, also attack the ground targets, that are still there. From my experience, they circle, either a certain time, or until I destroyed the last target, that should get destroyed.

 

The AI reappear and disappear so I can have lots of AA without killing performance.  It is mostly meant for AA along the front.  I definitely should do something to stop respawn when the gun is destroyed.

[Stlg13/Sgt_Schultz]

 

 

It's there.  It's in the pilot log after air victories.  It does not appear on the chalk board.  That might be an improvement.  Also thought about keeping tank kills as a separate stat and factoring that in more heavily for medals.

 

I can't seem to see it in my pilot log, do all ground targets show up? I've mostly only destroyed trucks and artillery pieces, along with some triple A. That sounds awesome, I think I'll be starting up a stuka/il2 campaign if you added that  .

 

 

 

The AI reappear and disappear so I can have lots of AA without killing performance.  It is mostly meant for AA along the front.  I definitely should do something to stop respawn when the gun is destroyed.

 

I haven't witnessed destroyed guns respawn, but I have seen one disappear as I was going in for a strafe on it, only to look back and see it appear and start firing again. Though it was just my imagination   .

[PopBot]

I can't seem to see it in my pilot log, do all ground targets show up? I've mostly only destroyed trucks and artillery pieces, along with some triple A. That sounds awesome, I think I'll be starting up a stuka/il2 campaign if you added that  .

 

 

 

 

I haven't witnessed destroyed guns respawn, but I have seen one disappear as I was going in for a strafe on it, only to look back and see it appear and start firing again. Though it was just my imagination   .

The soldiers manning the AA MGs run away from the gun as you make a strafing run, then they run back to the gun once you've made the pass.

[Stlg13/Sgt_Schultz]

The soldiers manning the AA MGs run away from the gun as you make a strafing run, then they run back to the gun once you've made the pass.

 

Yes I'm aware of that. I mean the entire gun, crew and all literally wasn't there, and then reappeared as I was climbing away. 

Edited October 12, 2017 by Stlg13/Sgt_Schultz

[PatrickAWlson]

The gun should despawn as you fly away, not as you approach.  It uses a proximity based trigger which activates a proximity based trigger to despawn and back and forth.  Might have something wrong or maybe I need to mess with the trigger ranges, as the distances are probably WWI based and not WWII based.

[PatrickAWlson]

For me it is enough getting it mentioned in the 'Pilot Log' on the page after the air kills. What is a little strange, is that it is not there, before you have your first air kill.

That's a bug.  Thanks for bringing it up.

[PopBot]

Yes I'm aware of that. I mean the entire gun, crew and all literally wasn't there, and then reappeared as I was climbing away. 

Wow. I haven't seen that before. I have noticed with the icons on that when the gunners run from the gun, its icon disappears like it's not a valid target anymore and then the icon comes back once it's remanned. I'll have to keep an eye out for the entire weapon disappearing.

 

I did see one issue like this where I was strafing a flak gun and went down, either from a hit or contacting the ground (I can't remember), but my plane slid into the gun and crew and it seemed to be destroyed and then it reappeared some moments later with its crew and continuing to fire.

[Yogiflight]

 

 

but I have seen one disappear as I was going in for a strafe on it, only to look back and see it appear and start firing again. Though it was just my imagination .

Yes this happened to me, too, quite some times. It was really strange, when it happened the first time. I really asked myself, if PWCG was fooling me.

[Yogiflight]

 

 

I can't seem to see it in my pilot log, do all ground targets show up? I've mostly only destroyed trucks and artillery pieces, along with some triple A.

If you have air and ground kills, there should be on the first pages of your pilot log the air kills, and in the lower right corner you can click on 'Next Page', to turn over to the next page, where your ground kills are shown. And there are all kills mentioned, that you get credited in the AAR.

[Stlg13/Sgt_Schultz]

 

 

Yes this happened to me, too, quite some times. It was really strange, when it happened the first time. I really asked myself, if PWCG was fooling me.

 

Yeah I did a few double takes myself haha.

 

 

 

If you have air and ground kills, there should be on the first pages of your pilot log the air kills, and in the lower right corner you can click on 'Next Page', to turn over to the next page, where your ground kills are shown. And there are all kills mentioned, that you get credited in the AAR.

 

 

I have all the individual AAR air/ground kills listed, but I've scanned through all the pages and can't find an overall 'tally' of ground kills listed anywhere. Is it displayed on the last page or is it just the individual kills that are listed?

[Yogiflight]

I am not quite sure, but I think there is a misunderstanding. We are not talking about the 'Journal' or Squadron Log', which you can find on the left side of your campaign menu. We are talking about the 'Pilot Log', which you can find by clicking on the name of your pilot, in the list at the right side. By clicking on your pilot's name, a page opens, with a wooden box on top, for 'Awards and Citations', and below the 'Pilot Log'. By clicking on 'Pilot Log', you open the book to the first page, with your 'Victories', which means your airkills. If you destroyed ground targets as well, you will have the writing 'Next Page' in the lower right corner of the book, to turn over to the page with the destroyed ground targets.

[Stlg13/Sgt_Schultz]

 

 

I am not quite sure, but I think there is a misunderstanding. We are not talking about the 'Journal' or Squadron Log', which you can find on the left side of your campaign menu. We are talking about the 'Pilot Log', which you can find by clicking on the name of your pilot, in the list at the right side. By clicking on your pilot's name, a page opens, with a wooden box on top, for 'Awards and Citations', and below the 'Pilot Log'. By clicking on 'Pilot Log', you open the book to the first page, with your 'Victories', which means your airkills. If you destroyed ground targets as well, you will have the writing 'Next Page' in the lower right corner of the book, to turn over to the page with the destroyed ground targets.

 

No misunderstanding, that was what I was referring to also  . I have all the ground kills there and that's all fine, the misunderstanding was that I thought you were saying there is an 'overall ground kills score' in the journal somewhere. That's what I was looking around for haha but no worries.

[PatrickAWlson]

There is no summary at this point.  It would be a good addition but it would need some work.  Categorizing ground units by type and awarding medals based on value would be a good start.  Promotions would still be given by a combination of experience and success.

Tier 1: larger ships

Tier 2: tanks and locomotives

Tier 3: everything else (cars, trucks, guns, etc.)

[Yogiflight]

 

 

No misunderstanding, that was what I was referring to also . I have all the ground kills there and that's all fine, the misunderstanding was that I thought you were saying there is an 'overall ground kills score' in the journal somewhere. That's what I was looking around for haha but no worries.

So there was a misunderstanding, but on my side.

[gad11]

Hello all. Wonderful mod. Just excellent!

 

Curious how one obtains a promotion. My flight sgt has 15 missions and more kills then anyone else in the squadron but still a sgt. Figured it would be a lieutenant by now. haha! :D

 

Thanks!

[PatrickAWlson]

Promotions are experience and merit based.  He might not have enough missions flown.

[gad11]

Promotions are experience and merit based.  He might not have enough missions flown.

 

fair enough. thanks Pat! Appreciate the reply.

[dburne]

I have a question on the " Mission AI" tab in the advanced config menu.

 

It has Fighter AI odds, and Recon AI Odds. Each lists Normal , Novice, and Veteran with a value assigned to each.

 

Is this related to friendly AI, Enemy AI, or both?

 

Sometimes it seems those pesky 109's I am up against can shoot and hit me from about any angle quite easily. Trying to see if there is a way I can tone them down a little.

Edited October 21, 2017 by dburne

[Yogiflight]

 

 

Sometimes it seems those pesky 109's I am up against can shoot and hit me from about any angle quite easily.

I have this issue with 'those pesky Yaks' as well. I try to avoid this by, either turning away from them, when they try to do this, or turn harder on them and try to climb additionally. Most times this works, as they simply are not able to go even tighter in their turn and additionally increase their climb angle.

[dburne]

I have this issue with 'those pesky Yaks' as well. I try to avoid this by, either turning away from them, when they try to do this, or turn harder on them and try to climb additionally. Most times this works, as they simply are not able to go even tighter in their turn and additionally increase their climb angle.

 

Thanks for the tip! I have been turning hard but not tried turning/climbing together.

[Yogiflight]

 

 

I have been turning hard

This was the first thing, I tried, too. I think you know how this ended.

[ACG_Wind]

Does PWCG run with Java 9?  Recently upgraded and receive prompt "This application requires a Java Runtime Environment 1.7.0 - 2.0.0."

 

Thus unsure if PWCG is simply not finding java on the box, or it will not work on java v9?  Note, via cmd, java is recogonized on the box via:  java -version

 

thoughts?

 

thx,

wind

[PatrickAWlson]

PWCG required Java 8.  I have not yet moved to Java 9 but Java is pretty good about backwards compatibility, so it should be fine.

[dburne]

I just completed mission number 130 in my campaign. Began this campaign on Dec 1 1942 and am now up to Aug 21 1943. 

Amazing that I have all the details of every mission I flew available for reading in the journal.

 

This one was a ground attack mission. I loaded up the two larger bombs on my Yak-1, and off we went. I grabbed a couple extra wingmen as well to be on the safe side. The target was a locomotive.

 

Made it to the target area with no problem, and I absolutely nailed it on this one. Destroyed the locomotive and several train cars with it. It was a beautiful sight.

 

Which brings me to a couple of thoughts. First on recorded victories, I love flying the occasional ground target mission but so hate that I am not credited with any victories for it in PWCG. It would be nice if it could do so at some point. Now submitting claims would be hard as it would be hard to know beforehand exactly what all ground targets were destroyed, but the AAR does have them from the mission in BoS. Don't know how hard it might be to do, but I would love to see ground victories recorded as well.

 

My second thought, and this may be more a 1CGS thing than a PWCG thing, I wish the airfields were not so deserted. It would be nice to have some other planes and maybe some activity going on at them as well. Granted one does not spend much time there, so maybe not worth it, but they sure are desolate.

 

I sure am having a blast with this program!

Edited November 4, 2017 by dburne

[PatrickAWlson]

You are credited with victories for ground targets destroyed.  If you open your pilot log and go to the page after your air to air victories you will see all of your ground target victories.  Your ground target victories should also appear in your journal and squadron log.  I also verified that ground target victories appear in the AAR report text. 

 

I'm not really sure what happened to your train.  From what I have seen ground targets are firmly assigned in the logs, so I do not go through the claims process or the fuzzy assignment logic that I have to use for air to air.  Figuring it out would require your campaign files and your mission logs.  

 

The airfields: I do put some parked planes around but I could definitely do more.  In RoF I mapped each airfield configuration and designated locations for objects.  In BoX it is more difficult because airfields are not single units.  They are just a collection of objects.  I mapped revetments to hold static planes and AA guns, but I have not yet developed an algorithm to scatter objects on places other than the runway

[dburne]

Yes I see them in the Pilot Log after the air to air victories, I guess I was referring more to the main screen where it shows total number of missions flown and then the total number of Victories beside it, the victories are just planes shot down.

 

There was no issue with the train, I was just bragging on my getting the locomotive and several train cars.   

 

Airfields - can't say that I have ever seen any parked aircraft around an airfield yet. Or maybe I somehow did not notice.

 

Thanks much for the feedback!