Popping yer head out

[dkoor]

...of cockpit at high speeds.

Doesn't sound very healthy to me, yet in last #38 dev.update we can clearly see Sturmo pilot doing that while his machine is in shallow dive.

 

Fill me in, I probably missed it, but is there any info about this somewhere?

I mean people are actually discussing about cannon shell blast radius visibility these days, so I figured something so basic must already be covered.

[Matt]

Watch this video.

 

 

Somewhere in the middle 2:30 or so Loft says something about and i think there have also been talk about it later on during one of the live streams, that it will eventually be impossible to move the head our of the canopy at high speeds.

[1./JG42_SchwarzerPrinz]

2:45: "Of course I can't do this at this speed and altitude, but this is just alpha."

That implies they are about to put restraints on these features. I sure hope they do!

[BeastyBaiter]

Speaking as a motorcycle rider, I can say that sticking your head out at 200km/h isn't a big deal. Buffets your helmet all over the place but it's not like you get pinned back or anything like that. There should be 4x as much force at 400km/h as there is at 200km/h, so I think I could still stick my head out just fine. It wouldn't be pleasant, but I could do it from a pure strength standpoint I think. Beyond that speed I can see it being unsafe but perhaps another rider with better high speed experience can clue us in.

[1./JG42_SchwarzerPrinz]

I assume you're riding a racing bike rather than a chopper? That puts your head in a position where the wind force is channeled right through your neck and spine into the driver's seat, that is your posture gives you a good angle to withstand the wind force.

In a cockpit you have a way more upright seating position plus you will get somewhat out of your seat in order to move the head outside of the cockpit, further destabilizing your posture. So I believe the wind force will be quite a considerable factor for a pilot sticking his head out of the cockpit.

 

Of course that's just me theorizing.

Edited October 25, 2013 by 1./JG42_SchwarzerPrinz

[dkoor]

Guys thanks for input.

[BeastyBaiter]

I assume you're riding a racing bike rather than a chopper? That puts your head in a position where the wind force is channeled right through your neck and spine into the driver's seat, that is your posture gives you a good angle to withstand the wind force.

In a cockpit you have a way more upright seating position plus you will get somewhat out of your seat in order to move the head outside of the cockpit, further destabilizing your posture. So I believe the wind force will be quite a considerable factor for a pilot sticking his head out of the cockpit.

 

Of course that's just me theorizing.

 

Cruiser actually, but it's a Kawasaki not a tractor, err, I mean Harley . In any case, when I said "stick my head out" I meant exactly that. My bike has a windscreen but I can stand up while driving down the highway or lean off to the side to stick my head out into the wind. It's not at all difficult to do, the volume of space protected by the windscreen is pretty small tbh.

[dkoor]

Don't know.

Physics was never my strong point.

 

Anyhow as far as I know, some pilots ended up hitting the tail on their aircraft during the bailouts which in turn sometimes even killed them.

In IL-2 you can't even bail out at very high speeds... only if you bring that speed below certain limit would game allow ya to bail out.

[Finkeren]

This might give you an idea of what high wind speeds feel like:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IU4SDDNXuUA

 

Seems to be highly unpleasant. Not something that would make sticking your head out of the cockpit completely imposible, but you really have to put into question just how much you'd be able to sense, even with a solid pair of goggles.

 

BTW: We also have to keep one thing in mind: In a standard WW2 single engine fighter configuration, a pilot sticking his head out of the cockpit is sticking it right into the  airflow from the propeller. The planes air speed doesn't matter half as much as the power the engine is running at. The plane can be going just 200 km/h in a steep climb, but if the engine is running at full throttle with a course pitch the airflow past the pilots head would be much faster.

[LLv34_Flanker]

S!

 

 I would not pop my head out in speed of excess 400km/h Surely not a pleasant experience. Many pilot memoirs tell how the airflow ripped off their boots or even pockets from the flight suits when bailing out of the doomed plane, so I would expect it not to be a very good idea..

Edited October 26, 2013 by Flanker35M

[dkoor]

Yep it all really boils down to this, people should be limited to exploit opening their cockpit and looking around at higher speeds or penalized while doing so (which would be cooler idea IMO).

[VBF-12_Stick-95]

How about crawling out on the wing of a Lancaster at 20,000 ft to put out a fire?  Not fighter speed but...

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_Cyril_Jackson

[Wind]

Somehow, time after time, I read this thread title as "Pooping yer head out".

Edited October 27, 2013 by Wind

[III/JG11_Tiger]

I assume you're riding a racing bike rather than a chopper? That puts your head in a position where the wind force is channeled right through your neck and spine into the driver's seat, that is your posture gives you a good angle to withstand the wind force.

In a cockpit you have a way more upright seating position plus you will get somewhat out of your seat in order to move the head outside of the cockpit, further destabilizing your posture. So I believe the wind force will be quite a considerable factor for a pilot sticking his head out of the cockpit.

 

Of course that's just me theorizing.

I have to agree, I've been on the back of a mates Triumph Rocket at 240kmh sitting pretty much upright, head into the wind as Im 6' 3" and my helmet and visor etc almost wanted to leave my head, at 400kmh it would be very nasty especially if you go from fairly stable air in the 'pit to suddenly getting hit by 400kmh winds, must be survivable though or else you would never be able to bail out.

[Furio]

Formula One pilots have no problems in "facing" more than 300 Kmh...

[dkoor]

but they have a helmet and their head its firmly hold on the back, even in collision with the hans its easy to get away with it

That's right.

 

WW2 pilots usually faced those winds with their bare skin exposed and with pesky equipment in general.

 

Don't know how that computes out with freezing Stalingrad winter but I suppose result would require excessive use of anti-aging cremes on daily basis.

 

Today's equipment available to amateurs for battling elements are laughably better than anything pro soldiers had in WW2, not to mention some of today's great anti-aging moisturizers for damaged skin. 

[Furio]

At high altitude, there’s not much difference between winter and summer. Italian pilots flying open cockpit CR42 in Battle of Britain, and American waist gunners had electrically heated suits, and were exposed for hours at minus 50 degrees.

AFAIK, Soviet pilots were quite well protected against extreme cold. A thing is certain: poking your head out at high speed, even if possible, was certainly uncomfortable. Moreover, tightened shoulder harness restricted head movement. And, finally, flying with open cockpit had a price in reduced performance.

[dkoor]

Good points.

 

I guess in game, checking your six with little to no nuisance should not really be allowed IMO. Even if it is possible, there should be some kind of penalties to pilot. At least time to actually unharness open pit and look behind, by which time you could easily end up dead if you do no evasive maneuvers.

That would be the bottom of all my semi rant here.

Edited October 28, 2013 by dkoor

[Finkeren]

Good points.

 

I guess in game, checking your six with little to no nuisance should not really be allowed IMO. Even if it is possible, there should be some kind of penalties to pilot. At least time to actually unharness open pit and look behind, by which time you could easily end up dead if you do no evasive maneuvers.

That would be the bottom of all my semi rant here.

Apart from the part about having to loosen your harness (which I also dobt you even be necessary in most cramped WW2 cockpits) All of the things you suggest will be present in some form in BoS. Cockpits will take a bit of time to open (and will create extra drag, when they're opened) you'll have turn your head using mouse, head tracking or whatever while also leaning to the side. All of this can't be done faster, than you could turn your head and lean to the side IRL, unless you specifically map a key to the "check six" head position (which I think should be restricted by having the head move at realistic speeds when using premapped views)

[HagarTheHorrible]

This community really has gone down hill.

 

How can you have a thread title like "Popping your head out" and not rip it to shreds.

 

Surely there must be one of you, amongst the great unwashed, that can't resist the urge to fill the space with humorous anecdotes and innuendo ?

 

I mean, come on, he's talking about "popping his head out", if I did that in public, not only might people laugh (hey, it's cold, it's nearly winter) but the local bobby might get to hear about it and have me locked up in chains (yes please officer).

 

On second thought, your not all girls are you ?  They, famously, never have a sense of humour (or is that just German women ?) especially when it comes to infantile things like willies.

Edited October 29, 2013 by HagarTheHorrible

[Finkeren]

We're a boring, serious lot, aren't we?

 

Most of us can even say the word "cockpit" out loud without giggling.

[Sternjaeger]

the video of the chap in the wind looks like me when wifey is yelling..

[HagarTheHorrible]

Not so much "For you Tommy zee var is over" as "For you Tommy, your end is in sight".

 

I think I remember from somewhere the Germans complaining about the cold affecting their helmets. If they were sticking them out of the window why were they surprised.

[dkoor]

the video of the chap in the wind looks like me when wifey is yelling..

LoooooL

I seriously laughed on this one .