My concerns about IL2 BoM/BoS

[=81FG=HellKitten]

Hello, pilots.

since BoM will be launched this year, i'd like to share some of my concerns with you. 

Before I start the topic,

I want you to know that, I do love BoS a lot and i think it has so much potential even thou im not quite satisfied with a lot things so far (FMs and such, but i wont talk about it here).

And I wish this topic will help devs to improve the game, and successfully launch BoM in the coming up future.

In addition, Im from an non-English speaking country, so my thoughts may not be clearly expressed. Please excuse me if there is going to be some grammar errors and such.

 

 

First, Battle of Moscow happened earlier than Battle of Stalingrad.

Therefore as you all know, IL-2 BoM will provide older planes than BoS. (E.g I16, Bf109E)
The problem is... if BoM players ever happen to be in a combined battle with BoS players, they will have a great disadvantage since BoS players will most likely to fly far advanced planes.
Also, the people who only have BoS or BoM will not have much choice when choosing planes.

 

Second, I hardly find full servers in BoS nowadays, and Im afraid that it will might get worse once BoM launches. I believe BoS needs some more contents to attract more people before BoM comes out. Otherwise both BoS and BoM wont be successful since players will be divded into half.
Some people might say BoS still have enough players (it really depends on time, isnt it?), but I can surely say a lot of people already left BoS and I really believe that this happened due to the lack of contents.
I think adding contents can be done simple.

For example, adding expert dogfghting servers, summer Stalingrad maps, letting users to personalize thier planes by adding pictures into cockpits or putting decals on planes.

These will attract a lot of players.
(I know it can be really hard for devs to work on them, but im just giving you examples.)

 

Third, I think the pirce is too high.. for BoS. (I think BoM will be expensive too)
A lot of people play War Thunder nowadays because it provides a plenty of contents for free, and it is easy to access. I've seen plenty of people (mostly WT sim mod players) not bothering to try out BoS due to the high price, and again, lack of contents.
I think devs can release some free planes so that a lot of people can try out this game before purchasing, or lower the price.
I'm not saying devs arent working hard on this game, but i really wanna say there are a lot cheap/free flight sims out there today and and BoS should find some more creative ways to attract people.

 

 

Thank you.

Edited April 8, 2015 by =81FG=HellKitten

[71st_AH_Mastiff]

Hello, pilots.

since BoM will be launched this year, i'd like to share some of my concerns with you. 

Before I start the topic,

I want you to know that, I do love BoS a lot and i think it has so much potential even thou im not quite satisfied with a lot things so far (FMs and such, but i wont talk about it here).

And I wish this topic will help devs to improve the game, and successfully launch BoM in the coming up future.

In addition, Im from an non-English speaking country, so my thoughts may not be clearly expressed. Please excuse me if there is going to be some grammar errors and such.

 

 

First, Battle of Moscow happened earlier than Battle of Stalingrad.

Therefore as you all know, IL-2 BoM will provide older planes than BoS. (E.g I16, Bf109E)

The problem is... if BoM players ever happen to be in a combined battle with BoS players, they will have a great disadvantage since BoS players will most likely to fly far advanced planes.

Also, the people who only have BoS or BoM will not have much choice when choosing planes.

 

Second, I hardly find full servers in BoS nowadays, and Im afraid that it will might get worse once BoM launches. I believe BoS needs some more contents to attract more people before BoM comes out. Otherwise both BoS and BoM wont be successful since players will be divded into half.

Some people might say BoS still have enough players (it really depends on time, isnt it?), but I can surely say a lot of people already left BoS and I really believe that this happened due to the lack of contents.

I think adding contents can be done simple.

For example, adding expert dogfghting servers, summer Stalingrad maps, letting users to personalize thier planes by adding pictures into cockpits or putting decals on planes.

These will attract a lot of players.

(I know it can be really hard for devs to work on them, but im just giving you examples.)

 

Third, I think the pirce is too high.. for BoS. (I think BoM will be expensive too)

A lot of people play War Thunder nowadays because it provides a plenty of contents for free, and it is easy to access. I've seen plenty of people (mostly WT sim mod players) not bothering to try out BoS due to the high price, and again, lack of contents.

I think devs can release some free planes so that a lot of people can try out this game before purchasing, or lower the price.

I'm not saying devs arent working hard on this game, but i really wanna say there are a lot cheap/free flight sims out there today and and BoS should find some more creative ways to attract people.

 

 

Thank you.

1. Just like in ROF the server will be plane dependent, so the server admin has control of what planes will be there for BOM.
2. When the new textures for summer fall come out you will definitely see an increase in players
3. just like it took ROF 6 years to mature and now has a free to play version, more than likely will see the same 5 to 6 years down the road for BOS and BOM...

don't quote me, as I'm not affiliated with 1CGMS/777Studios just a tester and ROF I bought when it first came out and was a wreak, 777Studios saved that game.

Edited April 8, 2015 by 71st_Mastiff

[Bearcat]

I remember. Look at it now. That is one reason why I have such confidence in this series. When RoF first came out you couldn't even fly it offline IIRC.

[Feathered_IV]

I just wanted to say how apt it was that "member" is written below Hellkitten's avatar...

[=81FG=HellKitten]

I just wanted to say how apt it was that "member" is written below Hellkitten's avatar...

Hahahahahahaha you made my day

I never even noticed

[6./ZG26_Emil]

This has more feel of the old IL2 than anything else. Proper tactics work, the graphics are gorgeous, the DM can be epic and the weather system is really nice. Planes don't fly on rails either which is a big plus.

[pilotpierre]

I just wanted to say how apt it was that "member" is written below Hellkitten's avatar...

Douche - sorry I meant touche.

[C-Bag]

I just wanted to say how apt it was that "member" is written below Hellkitten's avatar...

And "post"

[361fundahl]

I drop sc2500 bomb on enemy runway, much happy. Many game time from this come it will. BOM away into sale, Steam say. Have nice day...

[AvengerSeawolf]

 

 

im not quite satisfied with a lot things so far (FMs and such,

 

I understand your concern but you should have flied the first il-2 where the  Bf 109 was a flying turtle with constant overheat.

 

 

 

I think the pirce is too high.. for BoS

 

 IMO it is a bit high concerning there is only one map , the over all graphics are amazing and the  game has lot of potential , hope the developers do somethign about it, people are giving support.

 

 

 

 

A lot of people play War Thunder nowadays because it provides a plenty of contents for free, and it is easy to access. I've seen plenty of people (mostly WT sim mod players) not bothering to try out BoS due to the high price, and again, lack of contents.

 

 That's also right I agree. In WT there are plenty of planes and you can fly them all in test mode. Appart from that also  top terrain graphics and  joysticks are very easy to program through the game.

 I think the latter ( joystick programing) is what BoS must fix immediatelly
 

[[TWB]80hd]

I for one truly hope that most MP servers (once the BoM/BoS marriage is complete) will allow you to fly older planes.

 

There is no plane in the BoM set that is a far-fetched match-up with any plane from the BoS set.

[ShamrockOneFive]

I'm not really too worried about anything with BoM. I think BoS came fairly close to my expectations and I think I had to adjust those a little bit as compared to the past (and the current realities of producing a modern sim).

 

Games these complex take time to mature and thinks like having non winter maps for BoS and then also having those right from the start with BoM are little ways in which things are moving along.

 

I was expecting FM issues but put in context with the early days of IL-2 Forgotten Battles with the FW190 that couldn't do a gentle turn without stalling, or the impossibly slow roll rate on the P-47, or the uber Hurricane II that barely lost energy in turns... Yeah I think we're doing ok. Again...not a specific FM debate I want to get into but I just wanted to compare/contrast the early days of the past product with that of the current.

 

Single player is the area most lacking. It has a great start and I like the concept - design wise it works very well with my now often limited amounts of play time. What it needs is more depth and variety and that is something that hopefully is implemented over time. I'm hoping development for BoM will trickle down into BoS for issues up to and including single player.

 

But I'm game for a new one. Bring it on. Let's see what they have!

[-NW-ChiefRedCloud]

I understand your concern but you should have flied the first il-2 where the  Bf 109 was a flying turtle with constant overheat.

 

 

 

 

 IMO it is a bit high concerning there is only one map , the over all graphics are amazing and the  game has lot of potential , hope the developers do somethign about it, people are giving support.

 

 

 

 

 

 That's also right I agree. In WT there are plenty of planes and you can fly them all in test mode. Appart from that also  top terrain graphics and  joysticks are very easy to program through the game.

 I think the latter ( joystick programing) is what BoS must fix immediately

 

 

And as stated about Rise of Flight and IL-2 1946 it wasn't this way in the beginning as I recall early builds of WT control setups were a night mare. Things change for the better, or worst, with time. WT is  a "pretty game" and has earned it's place, but it is not in the same ballpark as Sims such as DCS, RoF or BoS. Just an opinion.

 

Chief

[SKG51_robtek]

One thing all the people finding excuses are missing is that BoS is founded on a well known game engine where most problem already had been weeded out in RoF!

 

The sims that were compared were brand new engines, where the finesses still were unknown.

[BraveSirRobin]

One thing all the people finding excuses are missing is that BoS is founded on a well known game engine where most problem already had been weeded out in RoF!

 

The sims that were compared were brand new engines, where the finesses still were unknown.

 

So what?  They still had to change a lot of stuff to make it compatible with WW2 aircraft.

[[TWB]80hd]

One thing all the people finding excuses are missing is that BoS is founded on a well known game engine where most problem already had been weeded out in RoF!

 

The sims that were compared were brand new engines, where the finesses still were unknown.

 

A good point, however, who besides the dev team truly understands just how difficult it was to take an existing engine that was geared for low speed fabric and string and turn it into what we have today?

[Vaxxtx]

A good point, however, who besides the dev team truly understands just how difficult it was to take an existing engine that was geared for low speed fabric and string and turn it into what we have today?

You have to agree from an outsiders view that creating a new engine from scratch is much more difficult and variable than using an existing one that has been worked on for a long time. I don't see it being more difficult to make it work for WWII birds over WWI bird but maybe somebody with more knowledge can help me understand.

 

roboteks point is very much valid from my point of view.

[BraveSirRobin]

roboteks point is very much valid from my point of view.

 

Which brings us back to "So what?"

 

What difference does it make to users what they're using for an engine?

[SKG51_robtek]

Being stuck with dx9 comes to mind.

 

Having already reached the limitations of the engine comes to mind.

 

There might be more points.

[Vaxxtx]

Which brings us back to "So what?"

 

What difference does it make to users what they're using for an engine?

A lot. Limitations, optimization, future-proofing, etc. etc. Has there not been tons of discussions already about it?

[SCG_Space_Ghost]

Being stuck with dx9 comes to mind.

 

Having already reached the limitations of the engine comes to mind.

 

There might be more points.

 

[BraveSirRobin]

Being stuck with dx9 comes to mind.

 

Having already reached the limitations of the engine comes to mind.

 

There might be more points.

 

You know they can change it, right?

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

Yep, it is cost prohibitive for the moment. It won't be in widespread use for a while anyway. If we get three or four years of Il2 development, I can see redoing the game in DX12 down the road.

[Dakpilot]

Could you imagine the backlash if BoS had been created in DX12 and anyone would have had to upgrade all hardware o/s to be able to play...as has been said, it is too expensive to do now,  1CGS/777 is not exactly a giant resource rich   powerhouse of a gaming studio...and mostly all the better for that fact

 

Cheers Dakpilot

[SR-F_Winger]

OP

I agree. For me the game is in the shelf right now for the two most obvious reasons.

Too few MP players on the servers and FAR too small playercount online (48 is just plain unsufficient). Flying around for hours just to have one or two encounters. Meh!

Ufo FMs. Everyone knows what I am talking about.

 

For everyone in my squad and me those are the 2 biggest gamebreakers right now. We just dont play it currently.

Edited April 10, 2015 by VSG1_Winger

[SKG51_robtek]

 

Could you imagine the backlash if BoS had been created in DX12 and anyone would have had to upgrade all hardware o/s to be able to play...as has been said, it is too expensive to do now,  1CGS/777 is not exactly a giant resource rich   powerhouse of a gaming studio...and mostly all the better for that fact

 

Cheers Dakpilot

 

 

DX11 is and would have been futureproof enough.

And anybody expecting to play and enjoy a actual game with yesterdays hardware, weil, I think that person is intellectually challenged.

[6./ZG26_Emil]

   

 

DX11 is and would have been futureproof enough.

And anybody expecting to play and enjoy a actual game with yesterdays hardware, weil, I think that person is intellectually challenged.

 

Since BOS looks nicer and runs better than CLOD I fail to see the point. Just because the number is higher doesn't make it better. When the time comes I'm sure BOS can be ported across to DX12.

[Dakpilot]

Rather skip the outdated DX11 and wait for DX12 to be mainstream, with the seemingly good performance benefits it MAY bring...introduce it when it makes financial sense

 

Cheeers Dakpilot

[6./ZG26_Emil]

Rather skip the outdated DX11 and wait for DX12 to be mainstream, with the seemingly good performance benefits it MAY bring...introduce it when it makes financial sense

 

Cheeers Dakpilot

 

Yep

 

DX12 is getting much hype right now but once games come out we'll see if it's true. Also what happens to people running BOS on older operating systems. One thing I've always admired about 777/ROF/BOS was how well they run on lesser computers.

[MiG21bisFishbedL]

I just wanted to say how apt it was that "member" is written below Hellkitten's avatar...

Ayyyyy lmao.

[sallee]

I just wanted to say how apt it was that "member" is written below Hellkitten's avatar...

I'm just surprised it isn't written under a few more!

[unreasonable]

I'm just surprised it isn't written under a few more!

 

Sometimes your avatar speaks for itself...

[FlatSpinMan]

Knob.

[unreasonable]

Now I can change it back and complain about moderator abuse... mwahahah!

[FlatSpinMan]

Hook, line, and sinker! 

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

I'm no DX expert but after reading numerous threads on the 9 vs 11 debate it seems DX 11 would not have offered significant performance andvantages and no real future proofing. I am in support of DX 12, in a couple of years, if it offers the advantages being anecdotally spoken about on some of the tech websites. Additionally, it seems if you have a moderately robust computer now you will be able to utilize DX 12 and won't need to significantly upgrade hardware to take advantage of it. In three years I'll be ready for a new system anyway and DX 12 will probably be the norm (and have all of the bugs/patches worked out - it is Microsoft afterall). If it can really increase objects/processing speeds as claimed it will be significant. I would be willing to pay for an engine upgrade and/or DX 12 in some fashion down the road. My bets are already placed, I'll let it ride for now.

[SKG51_robtek]

Since BOS looks nicer and runs better than CLOD I fail to see the point. Just because the number is higher doesn't make it better. When the time comes I'm sure BOS can be ported across to DX12.

Thats, well, thats just your opinion.

 

For Oculus Rift, i. e., the 'number' is relevant.

 

Afaik is it cheaper to build a new engine than trying to change a existing one on such a basic level.

[BraveSirRobin]

Afaik is it cheaper to build a new engine than trying to change a existing one on such a basic level.

 

All evidence from the 100 year Storm of War/Cliffs of Dover development death march to the contrary...

Edited April 10, 2015 by BraveSirRobin

[6./ZG26_Emil]

All evidence from the 100 year Storm of War/Cliffs of Dover development death march to the contrary...

 

You know, I wasn't going to mention it but.....

[Vaxxtx]

All evidence from the 100 year Storm of War/Cliffs of Dover development death march to the contrary...

I keep forgetting what company names were on the box of that title.....