SharpeXB Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 I would like to see more of a cooperation between devs and dedicated 3rd party teams like Daedalos.Not some free hack'n'mod anarchy of old sturm.Changing FM/DM? We have been there before and it did not end up well.So many selfproclaimed FM/DM gurus out there.AAA,HSFX,SAS,ultrapak,tetrapak.I know many virtual pilots who quit playing old sturm due to hacks in FM/DM.This There are certain core aspects of the game that should never be modded. Flight Models and Damage Models at the top of that list. There's a difference between the Debelopers incorporating quality 3rd party content which they're doing already. And just allowing the game to be hacked and over modded. The sims out there being heavily modded like Old IL-2 and CoD no longer have any developer support. BoS is not in that category.
II/JG17_HerrMurf Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 (edited) No mods is a huge mistake. It gave the original an extra 5-10 years of life. I understand not having a free for all but there needs to be mods support of some fashion. Part of the community lives more for creating mods than flying. And there are some really talented folks out there as well as new ones that just need a little creative spark, I'm sure. You could collect the best individual work and offer an official mods pack every year or six mos without bogging down your own development schedule. It's those little freebies that create huge amounts of good feelings and good dope on forums. Sure hope Jason chimes in here soon. I understand not having early implementation of mods but this seems really misguided at the moment. Edited February 19, 2015 by HerrMurf 3
ST_ami7b5 Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 .. The sims out there being heavily modded like Old IL-2 and CoD no longer have any developer support. BoS is not in that category. Whaaat? IL-2 and CloD are still alive and kicking thanks to MODS. 10 yro IL-2 has much more immersion than BoS ATM. I know they are here longer, but if BoS/BoM/whatever rejects mods, they are dead soon...
II/JG17_HerrMurf Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 (edited) I'm starting a new thread because the mods topic is threatening to derail multiple threads elsewhere. Please discuss it here. This is my original post in D88 Feathered_IV, on 14 Feb 2015 - 19:33, said: Devs, is there any word on when BoS will receive a Mods-on mode? I'm hoping for an arrangement similar to the one which RoF currently enjoys. Zac's quote: "Feathered, there won't be a mods-on mode in BOS. It didn't bring much content to ROF within the 6 years, so we find it unnecessary in BOS My quote: No mods is a huge mistake. It gave the original an extra 5-10 years of life. I understand not having a free for all but there needs to be mods support of some fashion. Part of the community lives more for creating mods than flying. And there are some really talented folks out there as well as new ones that just need a little creative spark, I'm sure. You could collect the best individual work and offer an official mods pack every year or six mos without bogging down your own development schedule. It's those little freebies that create huge amounts of good feelings and good dope on forums. Sure hope Jason chimes in here soon. I understand not having early implementation of mods but this seems really misguided at the moment. MODERATORS: maybe cut and move the D88 stuff about mods here? Edited February 19, 2015 by HerrMurf 3
Blooddawn1942 Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 Unbelievable, how they manage to kick the communitys expectations and flightsimstandards again and again in its arse... Never raised my voice regarding some of the design decisions I disliked. (unlocks/presets etc) But this is utterly stupid. 2
SharpeXB Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 (edited) It should be pointed out that a lot of the Mods in RoF like the Infantry one will work in the Mods Off mode. Edited February 19, 2015 by SharpeXB
71st_AH_Hooves Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 And the hits just keep on coming. If you guys want a successful game try looking at other.successful games. Look at the ArmA series. They are wildly popular because not only do they provide tools to mod, they encourage it through mod competitions. Now, im not saying you need to do that. But people want a game/sim they can keep coming back to. Always looking for new fresh content, and the ability to make more content. This "WWI era didnt create content so WWII wont either" is so fricken short sighted its sickening. Its like you guys actively look for ways to make your game worse. And to think i just reinstalled this last night. Just to read this today, this is ridiculous.
SharpeXB Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 I can't imagine how modding would not completely kill multiplayer. As it is now there only a dozen or so players online most days. They're already divided up between Normal and Expert servers. If you divide them up further with Mods On and Mods Off and this Mod or that Mod it would basically eliminate Multiplayer altogether.
71st_AH_Hooves Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 (edited) Well,for starter,why dont you make some real contribution to the game,make few 3D models of maybe a house/vehicle/gun and post it here.If you are good and you know what you are doing,you can get somewhere.Of course if it meets standards of the game.In russian forum it was Zeus with his friends who showed talent.Do we have such talent on english forum?Havent seen that yet.Only walls of text. Btw what kind of "mods" would you like to see/use? Without tools no one will even try. There has to be a reason to make a mod, and a way to test it. Just look at arma. They have modding down. As far as mods id like to see. Crewable tanks. Ground troops, sound mods, radio mods, effects mods, the list goes on and on. Edited February 19, 2015 by Hooves_McG
Blooddawn1942 Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 So some admin should put all the other posts from dd88 regarding the mods topic to this threat to provide the whole picture.
Leaf Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 I don't mind not adding the feature immediately, they didn't in RoF either. But within the next year or two I think it's a definite must. Devs, if you don't have the time or resources to develop certain aspects of the game, that's fine, totally understandable, but for heaven's sake, please don't limit the creative possibilities of this community. Because it is willing to make up for a lot of things that you don't have the resources for. Please reconsider your decision...
71st_AH_Hooves Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 Not including tools to mod is insane. Furthermore, basing decisions on what the WWI genre did or did not produce makes zero sense as WWII aviation is FAR more popular. As i said in the other thread. Its as if the team gets together, makes a pros and cons list, then implements EVERYTHING in the con list and trashes everything in the pro list. This is like backwards dev land. 3
Jupp Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 ~S~ Everyone, The knowledge exists to build these "tools" from the ground up if they are not made available. That is a certainty. Paintjobs are mods in fact. The developers decision to not use their resources to address other things is an aside. There are already talented people contributing "outside of the sim" aides, programs, and features as we speak. And in all fairness to us English users, and our wizards of the black arts, the "Russians" had a guidebook to work from.
voncrapenhauser Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 Am I right In believing Mods on In ROF is just missions and Skins? I'm not sure on this subject and need educating please.
voncrapenhauser Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 (edited) No there are objects as well. Cool then I am for mods on in BOS too....Great salesman. Edited February 19, 2015 by voncrapenhauser
71st_AH_Hooves Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 There are quite a few mods that enhance aspects of the game. Flak mods, cloud mods, things of the like. Check out rofs mods.
voncrapenhauser Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 There are quite a few mods that enhance aspects of the game. Flak mods, cloud mods, things of the like. Check out rofs mods. OK thanks I always fly with Mods on In ROF so I guess I just didn't notice any new stuff as it was always there.
Blitzen Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 I guess the developers are trying to keep the missions playable for people with older PCs like mine. When run on my system the BoS/Rof engine has problems to handle large numbers of AI aircraft. I get a noticeable slowdown effect when more than 20 AI aircraft are active in a mission at the same time. The missions by Veteran are only barely playable for me. I don't have this problem in multiplayer missions, so I think it is not so much caused by the plane models, but by the calculation of the AI behaviour and the AI commands. It will be interesting to see with how many AI aircraft newer PCs can cope in a mission. Once the FMB becomes available we will be able to test it. I agree...One solution that Desastersoft (& others)doing missions fo CloD have used is to make available low & high end versions of campaigns & missions.It works pretty well. In RoF Quick missions you can get up to 32 or so planes in the same space at the same time,but rarely are such missions available elsewhere in RoF. Finally I would like to add my vote of disappointment visavis the ongoing Mods issue...I mean of course I vote for Mods - who wouldn't???
dburne Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 I can't imagine how modding would not completely kill multiplayer. As it is now there only a dozen or so players online most days. ROF Multiplayer seems to be alive and well with MODS available. And it does not have near the attraction a WWII sim has... I am not a MP guy, but imagine current MP numbers, or lack of , is due mostly to the fact there is just not that much to do currently in MP.
dburne Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 I too always fly ROF with mods on. For goodness sake devs, please rethink this apparent decision to not allow Mods in BOS. 1
voncrapenhauser Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 (edited) I can't imagine how modding would not completely kill multiplayer. As it is now there only a dozen or so players online most days. They're already divided up between Normal and Expert servers. If you divide them up further with Mods On and Mods Off and this Mod or that Mod it would basically eliminate Multiplayer altogether. You have a good point there. I feel for you on player numbers. I see the US servers seem almost empty most days, But TBH it would probably be a waist of my time joining a US server as the connection quality is always so bad at my end. On the EU and Russian servers I always see players, usually no less than 20 on various servers and some times 20 0n 1 server alone. Edited February 19, 2015 by voncrapenhauser
SharpeXB Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 ROF Multiplayer seems to be alive and well with MODS available. And it does not have near the attraction a WWII sim has... I am not a MP guy, but imagine current MP numbers, or lack of , is due mostly to the fact there is just not that much to do currently in MP. Really? Every time I look at RoF it's totally vacant. And last I looked there was only 1 mods-on server. 1
Yakdriver Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 1946 without user support (TD might be considered as users...?!) + Modder support (individuals+teams) =end of the road after 4.07 (2008?)and the argument that "ROF+mods = meh" we all know that is not the reason. control, marketing, finance, cheats... anything is a reason but not "mods=meh".i would dare to say: stop insulting me and our common intelligence/experience.*pissed off*
=]VLA[=Ravonmith Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 (edited) Yep EU und RU server are always well populated. I am playing every day from 4 o clock to 12. At first only 1-2 server with 20 people, later mostly 2-3 server populated with 30-49 people. I never had the problem of to less people online, Most evenings i cant join my favorite server because there are not enough slots for me and my 3 team mates. Don´t know what some people talking about. As the game had unlocks for all / people were not sure about BoM and its compatibility and several other occasion i heard people crying " THIS will split the community" but 100 of bullshit mods (except 2-3 mods that might be well done) would not? Ahhh.... i agree some people inhere just search for stuff they can complain about. If there is nothing you will not notice them in the forum. They just appear to start pointless or useless or nasty discussion. The developer ARE looking for people to develop some campaign stuff , further content is coming, game is still growing. No need here for MOD on. Maybe later some people who are VERY talented .. indeed they could send their stuff and prove it to the team. But now there is no need since the FMB is not available and some stuff is at the horizon. Lets wait what the development team is delivering. Some people talking about "dead mp , dead game" ... WTF?! the next year is full of content .... IF you made something very special? talk to the dev team they may include it into the game. Not allowing mods just says -> devs controll what will be in the game. Not "you are not allowed to help us" Edited February 19, 2015 by =]VLA[=Ravonmith 1
II/JG17_HerrMurf Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 Thanks moderators for moving the D88 content here.
dburne Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 Some people talking about "dead mp , dead game" ... WTF?! the next year is full of content .... bullshit Umm, ok... 1
dburne Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 Really? Every time I look at RoF it's totally vacant. And last I looked there was only 1 mods-on server. As I mentioned I am not a MP guy, but I do keep up with the ROF forums, and it sure gives the appearance of a thriving MP community, albeit smaller due to the lesser appeal of WWI.
71st_AH_Hooves Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 I can only hope that some mods that work in mods off mode like in RoF will be able to be added. It just boggles my mind how closed minded getting rid of mods would be. Sure content you can buy will make its way out. But what about nagging things you wish to change that the devs will NEVER GET TO. These are what mode are great for.
J2_Trupobaw Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 (edited) Well,for starter,why dont you make some real contribution to the game,make few 3D models of maybe a house/vehicle/gun and post it here.If you are good and you know what you are doing,you can get somewhere.Of course if it meets standards of the game.In russian forum it was Zeus with his friends who showed talent.Do we have such talent on english forum?Havent seen that yet.Only walls of text. Btw what kind of "mods" would you like to see/use? Community career mode integrated into game interface, so we don't have alt-tab to separate career window. That alone is worth having mods on. Am I right In believing Mods on In ROF is just missions and Skins? I'm not sure on this subject and need educating please. Plugin that (sort of) integrates PWCG career mode into game GUI. AI enchancements, letting AI pilots fly their planes closer to full potential and teaching them to BnZ. Gunner fixes, both making them more responsive and adding dead zones so they don't shoot between own wing struts. MG rate of fire, bomb fuse adjustments to make them more historical. Reduced damage to wings and stablisers so you have to damage the plane's essentials to down it rather than sneeze at it and watch it shed wings. Having to hit pilot or engine of AI in mods on SP makes fighting AI worthwile gunnery practice, more accurate fire and habit of going for right parts stays in mods-off MP... Ground fire adjustments. The later mods (not the first one) saved the Beta career for me and helped me decide to buy steam RoF and DLCs for more career slots and plane complement. Guess it did not show up on 1CGS radar... Edited February 19, 2015 by Trupobaw
Urra Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 (edited) If a person like Lupson or zeus-- appears here and shows some impressive skill and dedication, we'll give them a special version that allows to create new quality content (mods). But we're not going to release a public mods-on mode. Would anyone go about spending a dedicated amount of time In creating custom objects if they most likely won't be included in the software? Would you guys be posting very specific instructions on requirements for these objects, rather then having folks aim for meeting the criteria blindly, so that at least those talented enough have a spec to go by? Just some sort of pdf of guidelines or something available in the support section... Edited February 19, 2015 by roaming_gnome 3
=]VLA[=Ravonmith Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 If a person like Lupson or zeus-- appears here and shows some impressive skill and dedication, we'll give them a special version that allows to create new quality content (mods). But we're not going to release a public mods-on mode. This! Come modding community, just give some little example of your ideas ! If you are that talented that it is worth having this discussion then please stop this pointless stuff here. Post some sort of mod worth content and let the developer integrate it into the game. 99% of the people complaining are not even able to write in LaTeX nor can they provide this game with a playable mod. Would love to see people like Zeus.
mort Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 (edited) This! Come modding community, just give some little example of your ideas ! If you are that talented that it is worth having this discussion then please stop this pointless stuff here. Post some sort of mod worth content and let the developer integrate it into the game. 99% of the people complaining are not even able to write in LaTeX nor can they provide this game with a playable mod. Would love to see people like Zeus. I think roaming_gnome answers this succinctly. Would anyone go about spending a dedicated amount of time In creating custom objects if they most likely won't be included in the software? Would you guys be posting very specific instructions on requirements for these objects, rather then having folks aim for meeting the criteria blindly, so that at least those talented enough have a spec to go by? Just some sort of pdf of guidelines or something available in the support section... And, does the BoS engine use LaTex? I can't imagine where that would be a logical choice. Edited February 19, 2015 by mort
SharpeXB Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 (edited) As I mentioned I am not a MP guy, but I do keep up with the ROF forums, and it sure gives the appearance of a thriving MP community, albeit smaller due to the lesser appeal of WWI.My own perception was that RoF had a really active MP, there were regularly full servers on Synticate and others. I play at off peak hours and was able to be MP exclusive. There was always something online. Then after the Career Mode launched MP died. Honestly I like the Career too and it's easier to use because you can pause it. MP was probably popular because that's all there was really. Any time I check now it's empty. Edited February 19, 2015 by SharpeXB
Mick Posted February 19, 2015 Posted February 19, 2015 So if I understand no mods are allowed on BOS ... Ok if "by chance" there is a complete Sound Mod currently No distribution is permitted right ? ... they have no idea what they are going to miss ... May be they never heard about your UV3 ...? ... not surprising, "only" 164526 reads till today ...!
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