OK, so this is a game, not a sim...

[DD_Arthur]

I disagree BC ( regarding the damned if you do and damned if you don't).   I think if they had any plans to do some of the things the community is basically crying out for, ie a true FMB that is more user friendly than ROF, rather than just a single mission generator - consideration of doing something with the unlock system, whether that be tweaking the current system or tweaking any future developments, or just getting rid of them for MP,  consideration of doing away with the graphics presets - any of these that are generating the most grief- sharing any of that with the community would go a long way in generating some hope and excitement that is currently missing from much of the IL-2 base that initially came on board early  to support this sim.

 

I believe it would be met with very  positive feedback ( for the most part) and would help settle things down a lot. Heck just look at the last DD that got locked and now shuffled away, Zak asked for  some community feedback in that diary on some items. It turned into more aggravation being displayed over this crazy unlock system, and Zak not getting any of that feedback he actually requested... to me that kind of says it all.

I certainly do not believe it would be met with any large criticisms from the community.

 

 

Yes, I couldn't agree more.  Communication is the key.  The devs interact with the Russian forum to a degree unknown here.  It builds trust.  Jason's posts on the current situation have put us in the picture again which can only be a good thing.  A rather more planned and regular approach to communicating with this side of the forum should be something our forum manager could perhaps look into?

[OhhhhChihuahua]

I'll add something from myself. Coop campaign, single player content is a must, sure. I agree with you 100%.

 

But also we need more possibilities in online gameplay, it's boring now. Why arent there different Online modes like domination, defend, escort etc? Something like capture the flag ( capture three airfields to achieve domination ). Its 2014 and one mp mode is not enough. Hell, even a simple thing like creating squads or any kind of voice comm is not here. I know we've got TS and shit but how much easier would it be to communicate between players if it was built in ? There should absolutely be something like squad leader and wingmen option with something as simple as issuing orders. It's been developed 15 years ago, wouldn't it add more immersion to the game ?

 

Where are the statistics ? I never thought I'd say this but in 2014 I need the game to be more social, I'd love to get more info about my opponents, a possibility to talk to them directly when not connected to server, to be able to see how good my friends or opponents are, numbers wise.

 

I know this is a flight sim thus flying the craft is main goal here. From reading the topic I get the feeling that both sp and mp feel boring atm for most of us though.

Edited January 25, 2015 by OhhhhChihuahua

[FS_Fenice_1965]

Even if it has nothing to do with the features itselves, one important thing for the fun is the full screen 3d interface. 

Moving around the scenario with the same perspective of the player during gameplay adds not only to the easyness of building missions, but also to "immersion", because the mission builder sees his scenario building in front of himself and istantly feels like he is in the mission he is going to create, anticipating the feelings of the gameplay itself. 

 

 

Where are the statistics ? I never thought I'd say this but in 2014 I need the game to be more social, I'd love to get more info about my opponents, a possibility to talk to them directly when not connected to server, to be able to see how good my friends or opponents are, numbers wise.

 

 

Social element is important, another thing interesting to catch from IL2 experience should be an interface (better internal to the game) similar to Hyperlobby with chat option at the beginning of the multiplayer screen, so that people can meet and find people to organize coop or enter the same server.

 

Next feature releases will be the of the outmost importance to understand where the sim is going and catch the last option to recover the relations with IL2 players base.

Edited January 25, 2015 by FS_Fenice_1965

[wtornado]

The "COOP" of il-2 is plastered* to a point to began dumb, but is very simple and easy to start, what explain his success.

 

 

 

 

For most users dont have problem, maybe for advanced mission/campaign creators due the limitations - e.g no triggers.

 

The secret of il-2'46 FMB and COOP is the easiness use of the two.

You can create some training mission in FMB in 5 minutes, invite some friends and play.

 

* Mandatory simultaneous spawn, no re-fly, no join after mission start, need restart if someone mess the things (usual occurrence).

 

Requests for changes in il-2'46 COOP lead to disastrous CloD "No-COOP" with the damn "take any plane at any moment" that ended used as exploit in MP  - Unfair players under just fire "take another plane.

 

In this topic you notice that some people are referring to RoF/BoS ME (Mission Editor) as "FMB"  - "que es lo mismo, pero no igual".   F

For those who truly knew how to master the Il-2 FMB and make missions it was actually  the UP 3.0 mod and it's FMB that was the richest one and most complete.

 

You could program artillery,mortar and rocket fire, barrages and the distances you wanted them to shoot at.You could send 1 tank,4 tanks to a whole company of

tanks with ease pre program their trajectory and if they fired or not etc overtaking positions you were defending or overtaking as air support.

 

And I didn't even mention recon missions.

 

You had ''dug in'' infantry and AT squads in their proper trenches.You had mobile Infantry and AT squads and they even varied in size like the armor squads..

 

You could set up battles as a ''Zuti's moving dogfight'' that was a hybrid mission between a coop and a dogfight server that the front lines would move with what you

had on the ground and how well you did in your ground attacking.Now think of what I said that is all the tools you had to make missions previously and think of you're

front line moving on you're map when you are in game.

 

You could land reload/refuel your plane in coop style and takeoff again and limit amounts of planes,ammo on base.If the base was attacked and depots ,garages and

fuel supplies were hit it affected you directly ingame when you returned you just didn't have the luxury of attacking you had to defend you're base too.

 

And I am leaving stuff out that the UP 3.0 FMB could do too.Oh I loved using a scout plane Stinson L-5 it was fun and calling in an arty strikes on the sector you were looking at and seeing the shells fall was fun.

 

I mean full arty barrages with the guns you put on the map and the mission you designed with the FMB.

 

Now I made a lot of missions I mean really a lot on every front with every mod.I don't count the time spent in the FMB in hours I count them in months.

 

Don't just think of the regular IL-2 1946 FMB there was much more than that for the devoted mission builders.

 

The UP 3.0 FMB in my opinion was that best FMB ever made.

 

I wrote this for those who never played IL-2 the old game.

 

                                                                                                                        439th_WTornado

[FS_Fenice_1965]

Yep, I was forgetting the UP FMB........you have explained well the essence of what that mission builder was....and even more amazing was the way you could easily handle all of that features....and how rewarding was seeying the effects of your work even without playing the mission.

We probably cannot pretend to have such a variety as a starting point here, but that's sure one of the references to have in mind if BOS wants to attract IL2 1946 base of players (mission builders included). 

[Sokol1]

Talking about COOP: http://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/14246-dear-devs-double-down-campaign-sort/?do=findComment&comment=225120

 

1946'ers need change your minds. 

[Dakpilot]

Talking about COOP: http://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/14246-dear-devs-double-down-campaign-sort/?do=findComment&comment=225120

 

1946'ers need change your minds. 

 

Yep talk about crying wolf, and like a bad tabloid reporter 'someone' has to post "And no 'COOP's   " to grab the headlines elseware

 

Cheers Dakpilot

[Forager]

This is from the CFM Manual, available here: CFM USERS MANUAL FINAL.RAR - 97,144 KB

https://www.mediafire.com/?67toyrhhcajx5x1

Page 30

I am personally looking forward to re-building some older campaigns, along with the new ones,
because FMB is so much better now. There are so many new objects and wonderful new functions taxi to takeoff - how great is that? Anyone capable of using the new 412 FMB to its full potential will
realise, in about 3 seconds, that it is light years beyond the clunky old dead, useless, obsolete 410. -
But then I have never been one to keep quiet about an opinion!

[GOAT-ACEOFACES]

Well well well I guess we won't be arguing in here that HSFX is better than UP.

Is that because UP is all but forgotten and HSFX is used by most if not all?

[76SQN-FatherTed]

All this talk of UP3 and HSFX is irrelevant  - they're mods which came out long after the base game.  If in ten years' time we're still lamenting the lack of content in BoS then the comparison with the older game, coupled with its third-party mods, will be fair.

[LizLemon]

All this talk of UP3 and HSFX is irrelevant  - they're mods which came out long after the base game.  If in ten years' time we're still lamenting the lack of content in BoS then the comparison with the older game, coupled with its third-party mods, will be fair.

 

Guess when Il2 had dserver and fmb available to end users.

[FS_Fenice_1965]

 

 

All this talk of UP3 and HSFX is irrelevant  - they're mods which came out long after the base game.  If in ten years' time we're still lamenting the lack of content in BoS then the comparison with the older game, coupled with its third-party mods, will be fair

 

It is not comparison. The meaning is that there are things that BOS should retrieve from that sim, not to talk that the base of FMB is the same from day 1 in 1946.  

[wtornado]

Is that because UP is all but forgotten and HSFX is used by most if not all?

It evolved to that because of the extraordinary content that was added and what the game had become.

Cliffs of Dover was no different the game was a DUD when I purchased it 2 weeks after it came out.

I shelved it for 1 year and a half until a 3rd party took it over and made it what it is today.Magnificent!

 

I hope the devs don't want BOS to end up like Cliffs of Dover and to be sold on Steam for 10$

 

Guess when Il2 had dserver and fmb available to end users.

My first online COOPS were made as early as 2004 and you would fill a COOP with 30 players in 15 secs

when you put up the COOP with 30 players with the Hyperlobby filled to capacity with 999 players

COOPS and the FMB were the backbone of IL-2 then right up to minimum 2010.

 

It is not comparison. The meaning is that there are things that BOS should retrieve from that sim, not to talk that the base of FMB is the same from day 1 in 1946.  

The Mods on the Eastern front,the Mediterranean front,the Western front and the

Channel maps the Pacific and North Korean fronts and over 120 flyable aircraft made

players coming back for more.There is no comparison

 

Fenice is right it is what it can and should become to sell and reinterest old and new flyers alike

by what the old games evolved into .

 

If it wasn't for mods my Cliffs of Dover DVD would of been recycled into a beverage coaster.

[novicebutdeadly]

Go online

 

Unless you live outside the US/ Europe at which point you don't have the go online option, as no-one is in the low ping servers

 

And playing in the high ping servers end up with people complaining that ti seems to cause server issues.

[GOAT-ACEOFACES]

It evolved to that because of the extraordinary content that was added and what the game had become.

I think you misunderstood what I said, I was not talking about IL2 and how it has evolved, everyone who has been followed and played IL2 for the past 10+ is well aware of that.. My comment about HFSX and UP was in response to your statement of why we can not debate UP vs HSFX.

[Bearcat]

I disagree BC ( regarding the damned if you do and damned if you don't).   I think if they had any plans to do some of the things the community is basically crying out for, ie a true FMB that is more user friendly than ROF, rather than just a single mission generator - consideration of doing something with the unlock system, whether that be tweaking the current system or tweaking any future developments, or just getting rid of them for MP,  consideration of doing away with the graphics presets - any of these that are generating the most grief- sharing any of that with the community would go a long way in generating some hope and excitement that is currently missing from much of the IL-2 base that initially came on board early  to support this sim.

 

I believe it would be met with very  positive feedback ( for the most part) and would help settle things down a lot. Heck just look at the last DD that got locked and now shuffled away, Zak asked for  some community feedback in that diary on some items. It turned into more aggravation being displayed over this crazy unlock system, and Zak not getting any of that feedback he actually requested... to me that kind of says it all.

I certainly do not believe it would be met with any large criticisms from the community.

 

Now of course, if they have no plans to make any adjustments along the lines with what has been met with the most grief from the fan base, then obviously there would be nothing to share.

 

That's fair.. but given the way things have gone where BoS is involved I definitely understand why they would not be as communicative about plans that are not fully actualized yet. You have people dragging them through the mud because "they said ..... by xx/xx/xxx ... " There are people who are still ruining hard and fast with every rumor, in some cases blowing them way out of proportion, every misstep, every missed commitment, suggesting motives "other than" whatever the team says is going on... a classic but by no means solitary case in point being the delay in the ME.

 

This is from the CFM Manual, available here: CFM USERS MANUAL FINAL.RAR - 97,144 KB

https://www.mediafire.com/?67toyrhhcajx5x1

 

Page 30

I am personally looking forward to re-building some older campaigns, along with the new ones,

because FMB is so much better now. There are so many new objects and wonderful new functions taxi to takeoff - how great is that? Anyone capable of using the new 412 FMB to its full potential will

realise, in about 3 seconds, that it is light years beyond the clunky old dead, useless, obsolete 410. -

But then I have never been one to keep quiet about an opinion!

 

CFM and HSFX are claiming the two premier mod spots for IL2..

 

Is that because UP is all but forgotten and HSFX is used by most if not all?

 

Bear in mind that UP has merged with SAS for the most part.. as has DBW...

 

All this talk of UP3 and HSFX is irrelevant  - they're mods which came out long after the base game.  If in ten years' time we're still lamenting the lack of content in BoS then the comparison with the older game, coupled with its third-party mods, will be fair.

 

+1

 

I hope the devs don't want BOS to end up like Cliffs of Dover and to be sold on Steam for 10$

 

My first online COOPS were made as early as 2004 and you would fill a COOP with 30 players in 15 secs when you put up the COOP with 30 players with the Hyperlobby filled to capacity with 999 players COOPS and the FMB were the backbone of IL-2 then right up to minimum 2010.

 

I doubt it...

 

Indeed.. back in the day HL would sometimes be so full you could not get in without a wait.

[-NW-ChiefRedCloud]

Look certain members of this community (meaning the flight sdim community .. not necessarily just the BoS community) have placed the devs in a position where they are damned if they do.. damned if they don't.. damned if they talk about it and damned if they say nothing .. Just about every development over here is instantaneously relayed and scruntinized to the Nth degree, usually with a heaping dose of CC&C (condemnation, criticism and contempt) on other sites that have nothing but negativity for this forum, this team and this product... so it should come as no great surprise that the devs keep things a bit close to the vest at times... unless they have something specific to say

 

I agree with Bear on this .... I'm no goody two shoes and I believe earnestly in everyone being able to express their opinion no matter where it falls. But lately on just about every Flight sim Forum I go to it's like a lynch mob. So much hate and anger. Have any of you ever hunted? Ever backed a bear into a blind wash? Well that bear might under other circumstances be happy to go it's on way. But when it's cornered, it strikes back.

 

I only say this to say that we all make mistakes in things. And that these guys, do need to be cut some slack. As do we.

 

Chief

Edited January 26, 2015 by -NW-ChiefRedCloud

[GOAT-ACEOFACES]

Bear in mind that UP has merged with SAS for the most part.. as has DBW...

Roger, took that into account in my statement, which still stands.

[wtornado]

Imagine if they would of completed UP 3.0 RC 4 to the UP 3.1 Final version.

 

it wasn't even finished.

 

I moved on from the old IL-2 series and they are not even installed on my machine anymore.

 

I do like Cliffs of Dover and Battle of Stalingrad the FM' are so much better than the old

IL-2 series for me anyways.And graphically well if you are running a new machine and

the games in Ultra settings you would never go back.

 

I needed new i got new all I need is the FMB.

[Bearcat]

 

Imagine if they would of completed UP 3.0 RC 4 to the UP 3.1 Final version.

 

it wasn't even finished.

 

I moved on from the old IL-2 series and they are not even installed on my machine anymore.

 

I do like Cliffs of Dover and Battle of Stalingrad the FM' are so much better than the old

IL-2 series for me anyways.And graphically well if you are running a new machine and

the games in Ultra settings you would never go back.

 

 

I hear ya.. I still have fun with IL2.. I think CFM will be great.

[wtornado]

I hear ya.. I still have fun with IL2.. I think CFM will be great.

From what I just read CFM just might be a great offline gaming experience.

 

Pretty well the same purpose and reason the Ultrapacks were made and

that was to play offline

 

I just hope if they add DBW to CFM that it does not bug like it used too.

you ripped you're hair out with that DBW mod but it was a fun to use

when it did not bug.Maybe it was just my machine I don't know.

[wtornado]

Posted Today, 08:30

Jason_Williams, on 25 Jan 2015 - 12:17, said:

Actually I was speaking about more than just a COOP system, but an online war using a COOP generator. These kinds of things might be possible in the future, but they are a good size commitment.

 

Jason

A COOP online war generator is one thing and is great.Being able to have the capability to run you're own COOPs

with friends with just the click of a button would be nice too.

 

I bought ARMA 3 when it came out.There were no servers because the game was hard to run just by itself

let alone starting a server.

 

I never seen such an up cry on their forums or on any forum from such devoted ARMA fans that bought the game.

 

Well the ARMA devs did it.And it is a fun game to play really fun and you have coop server capability.

 

Well there were 5768 servers running last night when I played ARMA 3.

[Forager]

WTornado,

Check pages 14-18 of the CFM Manual, they are Ultrapack credits.

 

Ultra packs have been an integral part of IL2 1946 mod packs.

 

The hassles that we had with DBW installs will be history.

CFM will replace DBW but still have more content.

One of the main guys working on DBW2 has this to say:

 

Found this at SAS:

"CFM is called to be what is going to make all the rest unnecessary.

 

Monty is performing a great job on organizing and cleaning his Full Monty pack into a compressed, very robust and stable pack.

 

It exceeds the contents and the features of pre-DBW2, and he is more dynamic than what we achieved here.

 

So no regrets from my part, I have deceided to catch that other train going by the parallel track.

 

I'm adapting the DBW1916 to work over CFM, so nobody would miss anything of the pre-DBW2.

 

From my point of view I seriously encourage everybody to adapt this new standard by Monty, you will not miss anything.

 

Regards,

Pablo"

 

Pablo is benitomuso who was working on DBW2.

 

When did you move on from 1946?

Between the TD official updates and the modders at SAS and other places, there have major been improvements in all aspects of the game.

It may warrant another look.

 

 

 

 

[wtornado]

WTornado,

Check pages 14-18 of the CFM Manual, they are Ultrapack credits.

 

Ultra packs have been an integral part of IL2 1946 mod packs.

 

The hassles that we had with DBW installs will be history.

CFM will replace DBW but still have more content.

One of the main guys working on DBW2 has this to say:

 

Found this at SAS:

"CFM is called to be what is going to make all the rest unnecessary.

 

Monty is performing a great job on organizing and cleaning his Full Monty pack into a compressed, very robust and stable pack.

 

It exceeds the contents and the features of pre-DBW2, and he is more dynamic than what we achieved here.

 

So no regrets from my part, I have deceided to catch that other train going by the parallel track.

 

I'm adapting the DBW1916 to work over CFM, so nobody would miss anything of the pre-DBW2.

 

From my point of view I seriously encourage everybody to adapt this new standard by Monty, you will not miss anything.

 

Regards,

Pablo"

 

Pablo is benitomuso who was working on DBW2.

 

When did you move on from 1946?

Between the TD official updates and the modders at SAS and other places, there have major been improvements in all aspects of the game.

It may warrant another look.

 

 

 

 

 

I was checking CFM out and it doesn't seem to be a one package installer with alot of JSGME mod options.

It will be another online fiasco with players and their settings.People better just play it offline.

 

I guess I have benn spoiled for well over a year with Steam and World of tanks no hassle installs not sure

I want to screw around with lengthy installations.

 

I do not make missions anymore because I have no patience anymore to do so.I have even less patience

installing games.

 

I can jump in here and fly and here is the important part WE ARE ALL FLYING WITH THE SAME PROGRAM.

 

And World of tanks you just click and play too.

 

Do you know how many times I had to restart a mission because someone clicked on the WRONG JGSME mod?

 

So a one click package installer I am in if not I do not want it.I like playing instead of swearing at installs.

 

Patience=0

 

That line is in my config.ini now

[wtornado]

Oh CFM is going towards a 1 step install.

 

Just read it on Missions4today with ole Sunchaser.

 

That is good news.

[Forager]

Be Sure, WTornado and although I have no way to confirm it, this statement, taken from a more extensive statement by RDDR, a CFM team member could mean that even the 9 required up files may be included in the main content :

 

"The result will be much tidier and more importantly, the very latest updates compressed and ready even for the TD413 patch.  Better still, we can remove all previous dependency so that this is a one stop install with everything in there."

 

I have no direct knowledge that this is the case, I am just speculating based on the above statement.

 

Either way CFM will add some years to our old gal.

 

[dburne]

It is certainly going to be very exciting when it is released!

[Lusekofte]

I would say this is a war simulation myself, same concept as cod. None are flightsims per see . And I do not know any good reason for discuss it either. Some products in DCS are simulator approaching game. other are game approaching simulator. 

If you want to fly offline ww2 the only way to go is IL2 fb modded . It will not be anytime soon playable offline in this game.

The small community cfs represent, and divided in so many fractions, basically working against each other bordering to hate, making the marked even smaller, we aint gonna see too many ww2 sims in the future.

The way Syndicate and other full realism make missions, you got a campaign feel to it. It is only the occasional kamikaze pilot that ruin that feel. Latest experience I had with that was a FW 190 attacking a airbase I spawned in. He damaged a lot of us and runned out of ammo, then he rammed one damage ac in front of me. He said " sorry guys it is the only way to fly a FW 190.

This behavior is why I still prefer cod, Anyway the campaign feel given in these servers and the time needed for doing a mission make it a ideal sim for me. Half hour and you have done a ground attack mission in a IL2 or a JU 87. Perfect for those getting a real life too

Edited January 27, 2015 by LG1.Jaeger

[GOAT-ACEOFACES]

Imagine if they would of completed UP 3.0 RC 4 to the UP 3.1 Final version.

Imagine if I won the lotto

[wtornado]

Imagine if I won the lotto

Looks like CFM is the Il-2 1946 lotto draw.

 

With UP 3.0 ,DBW,DBW2, and SAS content 

it really is

[GOAT-ACEOFACES]

Cool, now lets all click our heals together and say.. 'Theirs no place like home'

[Bearcat]

I still have HSFX as my go to as far as 46 goes... It is a much simpler way to go IMO .. but I installed SAS 5.3 a while back for a different flavor..

[Czar66]

I don't have a problem with that. It's a very pretty, hi fidelity game with lots of "hardcore" elements. PERFECT, I'm all in! I love just flying around in my F4 looking at the scenery and the cockpit, but that's starting to get old. What's the game plan? I've played the campaign, unlocked everything useful. I've played the veteran66 missions, which are beautifully crafted. Now what, what's the plan? I'm relatively satisfied with what I've gotten, but what do I do now?

 

Cloyd

We probably are at the same point into being a consumer of this title: waiting for a career mode like RoF or similar.

 

BoS is great, at least I do have an interest in online, sadly it's not the same for you.

 

Good flying.

[wtornado]

I just played online it is just not the same.

 

Not the same experience as the old game.

 

Just give me a FMB with triggers and time

and I will make myself  some half decent offline

missions and I will be really happy offline.

[Trooper117]

 

Either way CFM will add some years to our old gal.

 

 

Amen to that!